Paid mods and Bethesda announcement on the E3

[t.ara]

New games do nearly always ride on the same ideas of skyrim, even the interieurs and stuff is copied -especially lot of parts of the medieval games do orient on skyrim, also it´s gameplay-possibilities...

better graphics and more quick engine won´t be helping a title to become a legend - this is a rule also for other genres!

Of course, technically,  the most newer games are better looking and have more realistic graphics, but for a game this doesn´t matter. 

 

Building up another possibility for modding a game like skyrim will be depending of a lot of parameters - and if that conditions are not in time with the desired game, the chance for such an outcoming will be quickly passing by. And other game-studios are very often not willed to let a game to be modded.

 

And lot´s of games are announced year by year..

I won´t promise that the success with skyrim´s  modding possibilities  will be repeated with another game ever again.

 

 

 

[winny257]

New games do nearly always ride on the same ideas of skyrim, even the interieurs and stuff is copied -especially lot of parts of the medieval games do orient on skyrim, also it´s gameplay-possibilities...

better graphics and more quick engine won´t be helping a title to become a legend - this is a rule also for other genres!

Of course, technically,  the most newer games are better looking and have more realistic graphics, but for a game this doesn´t matter. 

 

Building up another possibility for modding a game like skyrim will be depending of a lot of parameters - and if that conditions are not in time with the desired game, the chance for such an outcoming will be quickly passing by. And other game-studios are very often not willed to let a game to be modded.

 

And lot´s of games are announced year by year..

I won´t promise that the success with skyrim´s  modding possibilities  will be repeated with another game ever again.

 

I only say one thing thereto, a good game does not need mods!

a game does not have to be a porn, it suffices a little eroticism.

the Dragon Age and The Witcher series I play completely without mods and I am satisfied with it.

of course, it is nice when a naked body is available, but everything else like slavery, rape and torture, I do not need. 

[GrimReaper]

Echo chambers are bad. Case in point: While I do agree that the CC and Bethesda's scheme to make even more money with little effort is reprehensible, they aren't the worst the gaming industry currently has to offer, not by a long shot. With the CC, you get the content you pay for, everyone can decide for himself if a stupid recolor or a meme is worth the money they're charging for and you do, in fact, get what you pay for. Meanwhile, other companies like Warner Brothers, Activision-Blizzard and 2K games either try to hide something you actually may want behind gambling (lootboxes) or sell you boosts or currency to unlock things faster. There's no new content in those monetization methods, there's stuff that's already inside the game and mere numerical values that get tilted in your favor if you pay.

 

So hoping for a new developer to take Bethesda's throne might backfire more than you think, given the current situation and the 'we don't want to make more money, we want ALL the money' attitude that's infesting video games right now.

[Wandering Starspawn]

You really think Bethesda is going to stop here?

 

I don't understand the perpetual optimism when it comes to corporations that have clearly exhibited a pattern of trying to nickle and dime the shit out of its customers. It's not like there's no precedents to look at. Once any corporation gets their foot in the door with some shitty unpopular new thing, they make it the new normal and then force in the next piece of shit they think they can get away with as soon as they can. It never goes backwards either, once they succeed it becomes industry standard.

 

It's a short skip and a hop from Creation Club to lootboxes with random mods inside. Look forward to it.

[GrimReaper]

You really think Bethesda is going to stop here?

 

I don't understand the perpetual optimism when it comes to corporations that have clearly exhibited a pattern of trying to nickle and dime the shit out of its customers. It's not like there's no precedents to look at. Once any corporation gets their foot in the door with some shitty unpopular new thing, they make it the new normal and then force in the next piece of shit they think they can get away with as soon as they can. It never goes backwards either, once they succeed it becomes industry standard.

 

It's a short skip and a hop from Creation Club to lootboxes with random mods inside. Look forward to it.

 

That's certainly a possibility, however, Bethesda hasn't done that yet but they could've easily pulled it off. Many other companies already got away with it so why show any restraint? I don't think it's ever going to stop unless the game industry - or at least the part of it that tries that shit - crashes and crashes hard, preferably without any survivors. But for the time being, Bethesda is somewhat less of a shitmunching dirtbag than the other big players on the field. It's not much, granted, but it could easily be worse. That's not meant as an argument to support them further, though. At least for me they've crossed a line that compels me not to buy their products anymore.

[Guest]

Man people are angry!

Maybe the community should make their own game with one of the free engines out there.

*Hint* *hint* *wink* *wink*

 

No lets assume modders get together and start making a game.

Its free and modabble, so no crappy paywall... How many here would actually support them on kickstarter or Patreon?

 

And before credibility becomes an issue lets also assume its not just talk and they actually get some work done.... like a demo.

What do you guys think?

 

[prinyo]

 

Many other companies already got away with it so why show any restraint? 

 

There were some discussions around this and the result was that Beth is only the 3rd company to do this. 

 

The SIMS and Deus Ex: Mankind Divided are the only fully priced single player only games with microtransactions. 

The trend is obviously getting stronger but now is the time to actually oppose it. If we allow the most brazen and anti-consumer companies to set the standards and use them as the new normal....

 

There are two important aspects of the CC microtransactions - the content can not be acquired by using in-game currency (the only way is spending real money) and FO4 is a single player only game.

Additionally Bethesda is the first one, it seems, to sabotage all of it's future games by selling official lore-breaking content. 

 

So I don't believe CC is part of the new normal, not yet.

[zzz72w3r]

 

 

Many other companies already got away with it so why show any restraint? 

 

There were some discussions around this and the result was that Beth is only the 3rd company to do this. 

 

The SIMS and Deus Ex: Mankind Divided are the only fully priced single player only games with microtransactions. 

The trend is obviously getting stronger but now is the time to actually oppose it. If we allow the most brazen and anti-consumer companies to set the standards and use them as the new normal....

 

There are two important aspects of the CC microtransactions - the content can not be acquired by using in-game currency (the only way is spending real money) and FO4 is a single player only game.

Additionally Bethesda is the first one, it seems, to sabotage all of it's future games by selling official lore-breaking content. 

 

So I don't believe CC is part of the new normal, not yet.

 

 

The problem with this argument is that microtransactions and multiplayer go hand in hand, such that AAA developers/publishers are increasingly less interested in making single player experiences, i.e. single player games without "social engagement".  Skyrim is old when single player was norm and FO4 is just a splash of paint on Skyrim.  CC is gateway for Zenimax to dip into that phat pay-2-advance, pay-2-win, pay-2-complete, pay-4-vanity impulsive spending.

 

[Leyic]

Man people are angry!

Maybe the community should make their own game with one of the free engines out there.

*Hint* *hint* *wink* *wink*

 

No lets assume modders get together and start making a game.

Its free and modabble, so no crappy paywall... How many here would actually support them on kickstarter or Patreon?

 

And before credibility becomes an issue lets also assume its not just talk and they actually get some work done.... like a demo.

What do you guys think?

 

Respectfully, I'd be more comfortable supporting this project if there were more transparency about it. All us non-contributors know is that some people in the contributors' section are trying to make a framework for some kind of game (presumably an RPG per the vote) using Unity. That's far too little to go by to throw money at it blindly. Personally, I'd need to know:

1. Who exactly is working on the project and what their role is.
2. Whether the team is primarily focused on making a framework first and foremost, or if the primary focus is on making a complete game.
3. Some overview of major gameplay systems.

I'm patiently waiting for when we get the info dump promised in the other thread, but posts like this where someone is already exploring financial support make me worry that the project may be more hype than substance.

 

Please don't misunderstand me. LL has a lot of great modders and I appreciate and enjoy much of their work, but those modding projects usually only involve one or two people working on them at a time. From the sound of things, this new game project involves a much larger team than anything done here previously, and I need to know that it isn't likely to suffer from having too many "cooks in the kitchen" before I can feel optimistic enough about it to consider contributing towards it.

[Jazzman]

The problem with this argument is that microtransactions and multiplayer go hand in hand, such that AAA developers/publishers are increasingly less interested in making single player experiences, i.e. single player games without "social engagement".  Skyrim is old when single player was norm and FO4 is just a splash of paint on Skyrim.  CC is gateway for Zenimax to dip into that phat pay-2-advance, pay-2-win, pay-2-complete, pay-4-vanity impulsive spending.

 

The single player RPG is Bethesda's label, it always was, thus ESO has never made it past the level of ridicule. And as in any of these moddable single player RPG's the player develops their own, often sophisticated 'social engagement' with the non-player environment. Whether this silent engagement is less social than a vocal 'muahaha' engagement in a multiplayer environment or not, well, that's open to debate.

 

Besides, Skyrim has just little to do with Fallout 4 but much with Norse mythology for dummies and folks that might or might not have fought alongside Saint Martin in the medieval valleys and prefab woods of Oblivion, whereas the latter is just a parental remake of Fallout 3's juvenile plot - the suffering servant that finally hits the road again to give voice to dutiful futility. War, war never changes.

 

So no, hybrid strategy and tactics used by Bethesda don't aim at a bigger future share in the multiplayer market but the capitalization of the flourishing single player mod market which up to now is based on free sharing of tools, creations and knowledge. And to reach that goal, Bethesda needs a fifth column in the coms, proxies on their payroll...

[D_ManXX2]

So if they are going to do that then i do expect that my games i paying for work without any crashes from out of the box instead of relying on patches/3rd party patches.

[Guest]

 

Respectfully, I'd be more comfortable supporting this project if there were more transparency about it. All us non-contributors know is that some people in the contributors' section are trying to make a framework for some kind of game (presumably an RPG per the vote) using Unity. That's far too little to go by to throw money at it blindly. Personally, I'd need to know:

1. Who exactly is working on the project and what their role is.
2. Whether the team is primarily focused on making a framework first and foremost, or if the primary focus is on making a complete game.
3. Some overview of major gameplay systems.

I'm patiently waiting for when we get the info dump promised in the other thread, but posts like this where someone is already exploring financial support make me worry that the project may be more hype than substance.

 

Please don't misunderstand me. LL has a lot of great modders and I appreciate and enjoy much of their work, but those modding projects usually only involve one or two people working on them at a time. From the sound of things, this new game project involves a much larger team than anything done here previously, and I need to know that it isn't likely to suffer from having too many "cooks in the kitchen" before I can feel optimistic enough about it to consider contributing towards it.

 

 

Completely understandable.

Though exploring financial options is not really out of petty greed but realizing our limitations.

We can't model or make everything hence we have to keep going to asset stores and the cost keeps mounting up. Not to mention those assets have their own integration process and work involved. Nothing works straight out of the box.

You should be more worried if we came out and started claiming we can build everything!

Anyway the funding wont be happening until users get their hands on a demo.

 

As for being secretive its just to avoid looking like this guy. Once we have a working concept it will be released.

We also avoid the too many cooks in the kitchen with hierarchy and already existing concepts set by the much more smaller initial team and their demo.

No one is going to be re-inventing the wheel here or spiral the dev section into a never ending debate when the demo is released and recruiting begins.

Hope I answered your questions

[vinfamy]

 

 

 

Just to clarify, we have no intention to ask for any funding whatsoever until at least a playable tech demo (using placeholder assets to limit expenses, but with decent amount of content) is released. 

 

In fact, we haven't even had a team discussion to decide which funding to go for yet. All efforts are being put into this demo right now. Personally, I'm against paywalls of any kind for something intended to be a free open source community project, and I'm far from being the only person in the team with that view. 

 

It's also not our intention to appear secretive or 'green-exclusive', we simply need some time to come up with something that looks good first before officially announcing the project and opening up development team recruitment to the entirety of LoversLab, whose many members are talented no matter their member status. 

[ralfetas]

For what i can see, the best way is to go to indies, there is a lot of nice games being develop by small studios, and they are the ones that need our support, and for what i can see, all small studios are embracing mods.

 

Is sad to just see bethesda taking this way, to just ignore all community, all the community spoken, they don't listen, why bother? They can go to hell, there is a lot of small devs that would beg to have a topic here, and is just a matter of time.

[Guest]

For what i can see, the best way is to go to indies, there is a lot of nice games being develop by small studios, and they are the ones that need our support, and for what i can see, all small studios are embracing mods.

 

Is sad to just see bethesda taking this way, to just ignore all community, all the community spoken, they don't listen, why bother? They can go to hell, there is a lot of small devs that would beg to have a topic here, and is just a matter of time.

 

IMO the new kings are CDPR.

Bethesda is dead to me.

 

I honestly dont really care about their next Elder Scroll game.

Well maybe a little but its their last shot, I just want to see if this company is capable of changing their BS attitude.

[ToJKa]

For what i can see, the best way is to go to indies, there is a lot of nice games being develop by small studios, and they are the ones that need our support, and for what i can see, all small studios are embracing mods.

Speaking of, go buy Divinity Original Sin 2 right now!

http://store.steampowered.com/app/435150/Divinity_Original_Sin_2/

https://www.gog.com/game/divinity_original_sin_2

 

</shameless_shill>

[swmas]

 

For what i can see, the best way is to go to indies, there is a lot of nice games being develop by small studios, and they are the ones that need our support, and for what i can see, all small studios are embracing mods.

 

Is sad to just see bethesda taking this way, to just ignore all community, all the community spoken, they don't listen, why bother? They can go to hell, there is a lot of small devs that would beg to have a topic here, and is just a matter of time.

 

IMO the new kings are CDPR.

Bethesda is dead to me.

 

I honestly dont really care about their next Elder Scroll game.

Well maybe a little but its their last shot, I just want to see if this company is capable of changing their BS attitude.

 

 

The new slave drivers more like

[bicobus]

Since when do you care about how bethesda handle their people? This is kind of a false equivalency. If people don't want to work for CDPR, they'll go away.

 

As a consumer, I'm very happy with their end product and how they do business.

[swmas]

Since when do you care about how bethesda handle their people? This is kind of a false equivalency. If people don't want to work for CDPR, they'll go away.

 

As a consumer, I'm very happy with their end product and how they do business.

 

They won't be in business for long if that video has any truth or if they don't get their shit together.

[bicobus]

 

Since when do you care about how bethesda handle their people? This is kind of a false equivalency. If people don't want to work for CDPR, they'll go away.

 

As a consumer, I'm very happy with their end product and how they do business.

 

They won't be in business for long if that video has any truth or if they don't get their shit together.

 

 

Yeah... I don't think so.

[Guest]

 

Since when do you care about how bethesda handle their people? This is kind of a false equivalency. If people don't want to work for CDPR, they'll go away.

 

As a consumer, I'm very happy with their end product and how they do business.

 

They won't be in business for long if that video has any truth or if they don't get their shit together.

 

 

its obvious they are having a transition problem because of the rapid growth.

Poor middle management is the number one complaint.

[Darkpig]

 

 

Since when do you care about how bethesda handle their people? This is kind of a false equivalency. If people don't want to work for CDPR, they'll go away.

 

As a consumer, I'm very happy with their end product and how they do business.

 

They won't be in business for long if that video has any truth or if they don't get their shit together.

 

 

its obvious they are having a transition problem because of the rapid growth.

Poor middle management is the number one complaint.

 

 

We cut out the middle man completely. The publisher needs to go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0FI3iUt9H4

So yeah Bethesda Softworks needs to die.

 

Edit: Okay. Whoops! That was a little harsh.

 

[arpaschad]

hmmm...well at least CDPR's office canteens/cafeterias are good... 

 

and they have produced good releases...so far...

 

"Does it really matter if we treat another human being like a slave as long as it has good results for the whole community?"-Anonymous 

[Leyic]

Bethesda just announced that they're making their own survival mod for Skyrim SE. It looks like a lesser version of Frostfall paired with a lesser version of Realistic Needs and Disease. And they're planning on charging for it. Competing with one's own modders, what could possibly ever go wrong....................? (The question is rhetorical. Plenty can go wrong.)

[MadMansGun]