Paid mods and Bethesda announcement on the E3

[vinfamy]

 

"Second Verse,

"Same As The First,

"A Little Louder And A Little Bit Worse"

 

 

Welcome back !

[firebinder]

With F4SE out of action I've been reviewing all my mods to see which ones actually need F4SE. The only major one I've come across is Four-Play, and that one says it needs it only for stripping. So I have to wonder, do we really need F4SE? Could Four-Play be altered to find another way to accomplish stripping? Just a thought.

 

By the way, has anyone heard anything from the Silverlock team members? Do we even know for a fact that they are working on this?

 

[rylasasin]

 

 

It's a zenimax move though, the todd probably had little to do with this.

 

 

I'm almost beginning to wonder at this point if Todd is actually doing everything he can to sink it as some sort of laundering/contract evasion scheme.

 

I mean, terrible E3 unveil. Obviously poor choice of mod picks (especially when they had better stuff to pick for this.) Total silence on modders who tried to join. The fact that it dumps the shit right into your data folder regardless of whether you buy it or not. The fact that paid mods only allow for 4096 records (for reference: automatron has 50000). 

Call me naive, but a small part of me still wants to believe that it's not possible for even Bethesda to fail this hard unless you were trying.

[shadowlord445]

 

 

 

It's a zenimax move though, the todd probably had little to do with this.

 

 

I'm almost beginning to wonder at this point if Todd is actually doing everything he can to sink it as some sort of laundering/contract evasion scheme.

 

I mean, terrible E3 unveil. Obviously poor choice of mod picks (especially when they had better stuff to pick for this.) Total silence on modders who tried to join. The fact that it dumps the shit right into your data folder regardless of whether you buy it or not. The fact that paid mods only allow for 4096 records (for reference: automatron has 50000). 

Call me naive, but a small part of me still wants to believe that it's not possible for even Bethesda to fail this hard unless you were trying.

 

I was beginning to think that, too.  Like you said, all the CC mod's BSAs are in your data folder, and a quick trip to reddit has provided working ESPs/ESMs.  This is either sheer incompetence, a bone to throw PS4 users, or it was designed to fail.

[guk]

With F4SE out of action I've been reviewing all my mods to see which ones actually need F4SE. The only major one I've come across is Four-Play, and that one says it needs it only for stripping. So I have to wonder, do we really need F4SE? Could Four-Play be altered to find another way to accomplish stripping? Just a thought.

 

By the way, has anyone heard anything from the Silverlock team members? Do we even know for a fact that they are working on this?

Just looking into my F4SE folder:

 

- F4EE (LooksMenu)

- ExtendedHairColors (injects new haircolors with 2-tone gradient effects)

- Place Everywhere

- console name fix

- achievements

- survival unlocker

 

Console Name Fix and Hair Colors are expendable. Achievements i don't really care much about, but it also fixes the warning pop-ups with the [M] tag on savegames.

Place Everywhere, i estimate that i spend around 40-75% of my game time with settlement building. This is half the reason why this game is so addictive, but it is terrible without this mod.

Survival Unlocker, having no console and not being able to save at will is just masochism. The only way to get out when stuck behind a wall etc. would be to kill yourself and go back to the last sleep-save. Any CTD will lose hours of progress because the game automatically deletes the "Exitsave". You also could never fix broken quests, like "Emogene Takes A Lover" or various radiant quests that can't be turned in. And so on.

Lastly without F4EE you couldn't even save any face presets at all.

[bicobus]

 

 

 

It's a zenimax move though, the todd probably had little to do with this.

 

 

I'm almost beginning to wonder at this point if Todd is actually doing everything he can to sink it as some sort of laundering/contract evasion scheme.

 

I mean, terrible E3 unveil. Obviously poor choice of mod picks (especially when they had better stuff to pick for this.) Total silence on modders who tried to join. The fact that it dumps the shit right into your data folder regardless of whether you buy it or not. The fact that paid mods only allow for 4096 records (for reference: automatron has 50000). 

Call me naive, but a small part of me still wants to believe that it's not possible for even Bethesda to fail this hard unless you were trying.

 

Todd Howard is an employee of Bethesda Studios, currently working on an undisclosed product. Bethesda Softworks is the publishing side, who handles many other games and all the venture. Todd is probably way too busy with the new project to care whatever Softworks is doing. We only see him when a new product needs announcing. Since we haven't seen him in a while, it is safe to say that this whole thing is a publisher move (marketing, big money, etc).

 

Second thing to know is that there is a second small game dev studio alongside Bethesda Studios (Washington D.C. and Montreal) to help with little things or off shoot projects. They are probably the ones who got tasked to work on the CC.

[Midnight19]

Form now on I will not be paying Bethesda a penny for anything. Including Tes6 or FO5. I wish Obsidion could acquire the rights to the fallout franchise.

[SmedleyDButler]

Man, now I'm worried. Going to turn off Steam auto-updates for Oldrim too. God knows what garbage Beth'll try next.

 

Worst-case scenario, I can go back to the fully-updated torrent version I used two or three years ago to test drive the game before buying a copy. It would break CK, but I that's a way better tradeoff than breaking SKSE.

 

It would be hilarious if the response to Beth's shitty business practices is just to encourage more piracy.

[Midnight19]

Man, now I'm worried. Going to turn off Steam auto-updates for Oldrim too. God knows what garbage Beth'll try next.

 

Worst-case scenario, I can go back to the fully-updated torrent version I used two or three years ago to test drive the game before buying a copy. It would break CK, but I that's a way better tradeoff than breaking SKSE.

 

It would be hilarious if the response to Beth's shitty business practices is just to encourage more piracy.

if they Fuck with the original skyrim I am going to rip my hair out

[tlrd]

I give it 2 weeks for this to blow over and be dead and buried, I mean forcing you to download something you did not want nor payed for...are they trying to kill it on arrival? 

[Vuulgar]

I give it 2 weeks for this to blow over and be dead and buried, I mean forcing you to download something you did not want nor payed for...are they trying to kill it on arrival? 

 

It seems clear they put neither thought or resources into this project. As with many companies that grow to a huge scale they appear to have lost sight of the big picture. The last place I worked was a very large company, literally world wide, and the upper management at my location were totally focused on their own agenda to the point of corrupting data for their departments, literally cheating. There was no cooperation between departments as it did not benefit the grades received by the department heads. Real solutions were evaluated by cost at the moment, not long term savings....these types of things. I can picture this behavior at Beth and its easy to see how such crappy choices are being made...its also difficult to see them being able to fix it.

[ToJKa]

Well drown me in a 100 liter barrel of paint of the color of surprise

 

Oh Bethesda, you never disappoint

 

Except with your games, of course

[ralfetas]

I still don't play fo4 after the release of this cc, but i see some vids on youtube.

 

So, i don't think i understand everything... they upload stuff to your hard drive and them ask money if you want to use it... really??? How big this can become? Could we just delete this "content"???

 

And the mods... everything just appear on your inventory, how creative!

 

I cannot even get angry with this, is like comedy.

[Aria]

Jim invented a new word...Bethetic

[D_ManXX2]

Guess Bethesda really fucked up. where are the pro's who where so happy about Bethesda creation Club now ?? Skins for pip boy is that all the micro DLC can come up with ?? That was pathetic.

[Lexi SubZero]

I really hope Creation/Milking/Microtransaction Club dies a horrible and painful death... And here's YongYea adding more salt to the wound.   

[RUD3DUD3]

he highlighted most of the Bethesda's lies in one really good video. This Creation club is an insult to modding.

[Canaris]

 

 

 

Hahahahaha holy fucking shit xD 

Bethesda dug their own grave with this shit ... 

Its amazing how only developer on the market that is almost exclusively relying on modding to sell their games is trying to kill its own modding community in the futile pursuit of some minor pennies.

[Aria]

Makes you wonder if the Shadow of War devs got their single player microtransactions idea from Bethesda, or perhaps it was the other way around?

 

If this succeeds the whole gaming industry jumps on.

[Canaris]

Oh and yeah, remember when i said that even with 1$ per mod, it will be absurdly expensive to mod F4/Skyrim to something resembling a playable game ? 
Its even better - shitty Power Armour mod costs 500 credits, 750 credits costs EIGHT FUCKING BUCKS !! 

I currently have 217 mods in Fallout 4 and 231 mods for Skyrim - i will leave you to do the math on how much it would cost me to buy that many mods. 

[guk]

I really hope Creation/Milking/Microtransaction Club dies a horrible and painful death... And here's YongYea adding more salt to the wound. 

Thanks for the link. He summarizes exactly my thoughts on the topic. Just two things -

 

 

1. He lists the numbers what these items cost - but he doesn't mention that you have to compare these prices to the amount of content you get with the base game.

So if one of these items costs 5$, then this would be 10% of the full price game for 50$.

 

Notice how insane this is? 10% of an entire game world compared to a backpack?

 

Of course these microtransaction prices are made to look so cheap on purpose, every elementary schooler can afford something ranging from 50 cent to 5 dollars.

This is about emptying the pockets of people who already don't have much money, it's no coincidence that the Creation Club mostly imitates existing free mods that PS4 users can't install. Note that people who bought a PS4 instead of a gaming PC, did so because they are either too poor to buy, or too stupid to operate one. Either way these people are the ideal victims for this business practice.

 

 

 

2. He says that we "can't allow them" to get away with this, but he doesn't make any suggestions on how to do that.

 

Online petitions? Nobody cares about them.

Negative Reviews on Steam? They already sold the game to PC users, this is about milking the sold product with minimum effort.

Camp at Bethesda's offices with "stop paid mods" signs? Uuuhmyeah.

 

Well the thing is, the actual "paid mods" fiasco on the Steam Workshop was SO incredibly bad, that the community is entirely desensitized. Compared to all the drama and following riots, the Creation Club feels like a "lesser evil" so most people have become indifferent on the topic.

[leddis3]

Welp... it's as bad as I said it would be..... no wait, actually it's worse. I didn't think that was possible.

[Jazzman]

I've other fish to fry than to feed a bunch of slack-jawed faggots in high poly Rockville, MD.

[KoolHndLuke]

Well, I will admit that I thought they would do a better job than this. I didn't defend it, but I didn't shoot it down either. But this is just fuckin horrible! Good thing I was done playing FO4 anyway. Oh, and Steam downloading that shit whether you want it or not can suck my dick! Told you I hate Steam and Beth is climbing to join them.

[Gameplayer]

 

The Creation Club is likely the only way to make modding palatable for Sony.

 

However even Microsoft placed a hard cap on just how large a singular mod could be and also the amount of space in mods that could be allocated to a singular game.  That being 900 Megs for one mod and 5 gigs total in mods for a game.

It stands to reason from there that modding is being tightly controlled for the public on consol.

 

From what I understand there are no similar limitations on paid content owned by the publisher.

 

So whats it really about?

 

Well it would be very hard to remain competitive for other companies that don't have modding tools on offer, if modding just showed up totally free on consol to the degree that we enjoy it on the PC it would change the entire financial landscape in ways that could potentially be harmful for a majority of companies that make money on their "dlc swimwear, whatever, etc,...stuff that we take for granted on PC"

 

Consol's need companies to produce games and content to thrive....

Money gotta change hands, if no profit than there is no need to even make consol

 

 

Sadly micro-transactions for pay-to-win, pay-to-progress and pay-to-showoff were all validated as massive money makers on PC first and then mobile.  Consoles are only now starting to catch up in setting up the infrastructures and hardware.  I don't like consoles but it's unfair to put this "innovation" on console players and their wallets.

 

 

Well right, Im just saying that one of the big points that is missed by the PC crowd is that over in Asia the content is pretty much controlled on Sony Playstation, its been a business practice since NES and goes back to basically the founding establishment that started video gaming in earnest.

 

As far as PC a great bulk of the MMORPG base is already very used to paying for costumes everyday for over a decade.

We modders are a small pocket minority even if we have a growing vocal fan base, the size of which pales in consideration to the masses that already vote with their wallet.

In that since people fighting against monetization are fighting an uphill battle, as its already firmly established.

The real moment when it all goes to shit will be when the only way to get content from other users is only pay.  At that moment it'll really suck that we don't get 25%, but a set going rate established by trash mods on the Club.

 

Anyways, I haven't stopped going to school and don't quit your dayjobs guys.

 

An example,

 

Modding competes heavily with a source of revenue that developers on Sony Playstation do in fact take advantage of,

It should come as no surprise just how much money they want for a single outfit on a game, its like $5 to 10 USD.

Now you can get 100's of them free on PC, if that came over to consoles it'd hurt a source of income and potential screw up the whole model of console gaming culture that goes back decades, what'll companies do then is anyones guess.

 

I figure that's why Creation Club.  Now the other developers don't have to be as concerned about the content users post, since those also have price tags.

Its not something that Jives well with modding culture that's for sure.