Deviously Cursed Loot LE 9.0 (2021-03-09)

[Guest]

49 minutes ago, Reesewow said:

Defeat's MCM menu isn't "Sexlab Tools" in its entirety.  Yes, the version included with Defeat will only give you one option in the menu when trying to swap animations while under a filter.  However, the full version of Sexlab Tools allows for searching animations by tag or name to build a full new list - meaning you should be able to open a search for "bound" or "funnybiz" ect if it is installed to bypass this issue.  This also works for situations where a mod may be looking for a particular tag which limits your "0" menu options - searching for a new tag will refresh the list to the tag you entered.

 

I can't really make any recommendations beyond this, because if Cursed Loot is doing any extra filtering I don't notice it because I use the full version of Sexlab Tools to pick a new animation if I am unsatisfied.

Thanks, that was a good tip, and something that solves my issue. I still think Kimy could allow for more bound animations though. If you make the mod look for the bound tag instead of pulling from DD(can we just agree that those animations are bad?) , it would be great. I don't see the point of having this mod override the DD settings. I think people can handle the responsibility of making settings that fit their game and their preferences.

[Guest]

36 minutes ago, Ytheria said:

I don't much mind it.  It's easy to imagine that a temporary binding has been used.  Sexlab does much silllier things than that.  Also, bondage makes everything better!  I agree with NightWolf that it's a minor irritation that DCL chooses from a relatively small pool of bound animations.

 

That said, I'm curious as to how you get this to work in practice.  I just register everything in SexLab.  It seems like it would be very time consuming to go through unregistering all the bound animations, and it would presumably need to be done for each new game.  In general I'm curious to know how other people manage their animations: there are such a huge number and some are better than others, so it would be great if I could just register the good ones, but I really don't care to go through them individually.

First of all I have SLAL, and I have learned what the animations look like from testing by starting several new games, due to mod updates and too many changes to my modlist. So I know what I animations I want in my game. I also knew that I didn't want the guro animations without testing, lol. I also have time to go through the list and make changes to it now and then if I want. It shouldn't take that much time tbh.

 

For people with limited time it's more difficult, but an SLAL pack would make it easier to install the animations at least. Then just play and see what the animations are. If you don't like an animation, change to something else and disable it in SexLab later. At some point you will have a list with only the animations that you want.

[Lupine00]

19 hours ago, sylph_ said:

Thankyou for the help! but it was because there wasn't enough room on the hard drive where NMM's Temp folder was located

Now that's a new one.

[Lupine00]

Until somebody... and I have grand ambitions but no time ... somebody ... sits down and writes a small, simple mod that knows the name of every animation by the popular creators, and the proper accurate information about what is in it, instead of haphazard tags that are easily misconstrued, practically every LL mod will continue to have problems with picking appropriate animations.

 

Once this resource exists, then mods can query it to find correct animations by criteria that allow the gender/humanity of each participant to be specified, along with that specific slot's binding type, type of participation (aggressive, passive, resisting, receptive).

 

Then, finally, SexLab will work with bondage, creatures and rape, in the way you would expect, instead of seeing Bound and Oral tags, and hilariously playing an animation where the rapist is bound and gives cunnilingus.

[valcon767]

@nightwolf @Reesewow @Kimy

ok interesting usage report 

 

Player is naked and bound in an armbinder (Devious Followers IAS "deal" at level 3 produced this)

 

non DCL triggered sex scene # of available animations as per Defeat hotkey = 22 (Sexlab bound animation filter ON, over 100 with filter OFF)

       DF IAS "deal", Sexlab Zzz (matchmaker alternative), and DEC triggered.

 

DCL triggered sex scene (misogyny) = 1 animation available (with Sexlab bound animation filter ON or OFF) and the animation is NOT registered in Sexlab (it is from the
       ZAZ Animation Pack) cannot change animations using Defeat Hotkey at all. 

 

using Sexlab Tools and changing the tag to "bound" i can change the animation, total available under this method = 17 (after changing the tag to only "bound" i can use 

       the Defeat Hotkey to get the same 17 animations).

 

after changing the tag to "bound" with Sexlab Tools and changing the animation playing, the animation started initially by DCL does not show in the list of available

       animations choices using Defeat Hotkey or Sexlab Tools.

 

DCL is choosing animation when bound (in my setup at least) by some list other than Sexlab registered animations (i did not register the ZAZ Animation Pack animations).

 

Solution to have access to more bound animations for DCL triggered scenes (at this time in my setup at least) is to use Sexlab Tools to change the animation tag (i use 

the "bound" tag) then change the animation.  perhaps not the best solution, but it is workable at least (for me anyway).

 

[CGi]

28 minutes ago, nightwolf said:

Thanks, that was a good tip, and something that solves my issue. I still think Kimy could allow for more bound animations though. If you make the mod look for the bound tag instead of pulling from DD(can we just agree that those animations are bad?) , it would be great. I don't see the point of having this mod override the DD settings. I think people can handle the responsibility of making settings that fit their game and their preferences.

DCL doesn't limit anything. All animations are pulled from SL and controlled by your DD and/or ZAP settings and are based on the installed animations.
Since you didn't understand me before and mixed up Sexlab Tools with Defeat, let me repeat: Disable the animation filter in DD and ZAP (only one should be active anyway).

This allows SL to choose freely from the available animations without DD or ZAP enforcing a specific animation type.

if this doesn't fullfill your needs then create your own SLAL JSON file with only the animations and tags you prefer and load only this one.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, CGi said:

DCL doesn't limit anything. All animations are pulled from SL and controlled by your DD and/or ZAP settings and are based on the installed animations.
Since you didn't understand me before and mixed up Sexlab Tools with Defeat, let me repeat: Disable the animation filter in DD and ZAP (only one should be active anyway).

This allows SL to choose freely from the available animations without DD or ZAP enforcing a specific animation type.

if this doesn't fullfill your needs then create your own SLAL JSON file with only the animations and tags you prefer and load only this one.

This is nothing new to me. I am going to use the same language as valcon767 here, because it becomes much clearer.

 

DCL triggered animation(shopping quest or rape): player wearing iron cuffs - filters in DD and ZaZ disabled. 

Number of available animations: 1 of the few that starts with DDZaP.

 

Radiant prostitution triggered animation: player wearing iron cuffs - filters in DD and ZaZ disabled - DCL shut down just in case. 

Number of animations available: all consensual animations from SL.

 

DCL doesn't limit anything? valcon proves(just above your comment) I'm not the only one experiencing this.

[Reesewow]

47 minutes ago, valcon767 said:

after changing the tag to "bound" with Sexlab Tools and changing the animation playing, the animation started initially by DCL does not show in the list of available

       animations choices using Defeat Hotkey or Sexlab Tools.

 

DCL is choosing animation when bound (in my setup at least) by some list other than Sexlab registered animations (i did not register the ZAZ Animation Pack animations).

This behavior is normal - the DD/ZAP animations selected aren't registered in Sexlab as there would be a lot of animations you don't want to see normally (yoke or breast bondage animations without wearing the matching device ect).  Sexlab Tools doesn't look into the DD/ZAP animation files to built its lists, so you won't see the original animation when rebuilding the list using a "bound" tag - instead you'll get whatever SLAL animations you have that include that tag.

 

I do think it could be a cool feature to have a bit more control over specifically which DD/ZAP animation is playing when filtering does happen - but I think it would require a specialized version of Sexlab Tools.... Sexlab Devious Tools?   We have to remember that the whole animation selection thing ect is a 3rd party mod, as Sexlab itself only has the "next/previous" animation hotkeys.

[Kimy]

3 hours ago, Ytheria said:

I don't much mind it.  It's easy to imagine that a temporary binding has been used.  Sexlab does much silllier things than that.  Also, bondage makes everything better!  I agree with NightWolf that it's a minor irritation that DCL chooses from a relatively small pool of bound animations.

It's the opposite of that. If you register bound anims to SexLab, it would randomly use them for scenes when no character is even bound. So e.g. a character would have her arms in the armbinder pose, despite she isn't wearing an armbinder. It really looks silly. Yoke animations without yokes look worse.

 

The other scenario is bound actors performing sex acts impossible to do with the kind of bondage they are wearing. E.g. vaginal sex performed through a chastity belt. That's equally silly.

 

Why people would want either of that to happen is a little bit beyond me, actually. oO

 

But the second scenario can be allowed by disabling the DD animation filter in its MCM, if that's what you want. The first you can get done by registering ZAP's animation to SexLab.

 

DCL however, picks valid animations directly via DD. The MCM toggle won't affect it, because nothing actually gets filtered and the animations will always fit the context. I have honestly no intention to change that, because I don't see the point of intentionally letting a bondage mod pick animations not suitable for bondage.

3 hours ago, Ytheria said:

 

That said, I'm curious as to how you get this to work in practice.  I just register everything in SexLab.  It seems like it would be very time consuming to go through unregistering all the bound animations,

 

There is only a handful of bound animations out there NOT in DD's registry. Namely the ones meant for "girl on creature" by Funnybizness. DD doesn't support creatures, which is why I never added them to DD. The only way to ever see them is disabling DD's filter and play with them registered to SexLab. DCL won't ever pick them either, of course.

 

I talked to Funnybiz a while back and told him I'd gladly add ANY non-creature bound animation to DD he'd throw my way, but he never seemed to be interested in it.

 

I have a bit of good news too, though: More bound animations is -totally- on our radar. The lack of variation of bound animations is one really sore spot in DD we want to tackle sooner rather than later.

3 hours ago, Ytheria said:

In general I'm curious to know how other people manage their animations: there are such a huge number and some are better than others, so it would be great if I could just register the good ones, but I really don't care to go through them individually.

There is no really great way to organize SL animations. The way to do is picking your favorite animators and install their stuff, while skipping on those made by people you know to make stuff you don't care for.

[ereex]

20 hours ago, ereex said:

Would appreciate some help on this, if possible...

I managed to fix this by reinstalling Sexlabs and starting a new save. Looks like a script bugged out and I needed to reinstall it to fix it. Seems fine now. Sorry for bothering anyone.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Kimy said:

It's the opposite of that. If you register bound anims to SexLab, it would randomly use them for scenes when no character is even bound. So e.g. a character would have her arms in the armbinder pose, despite she isn't wearing an armbinder. It really looks silly. Yoke animations without yokes look worse.

 

The other scenario is bound actors performing sex acts impossible to do with the kind of bondage they are wearing. E.g. vaginal sex performed through a chastity belt. That's equally silly.

 

If the first scenario happens I would either add a temporary binding to my character, imagining that they bound her, or I would simply switch to a more proper animation for the situation. It might not be immersive to pick animation yourself when bound, but I prefer that to watching an animation I don't want to see. You can also choose what animations you want available in SexLab, so ticking Yoke animations when you're not in a Yoke would just be stupid. Of course this requires some changes in MCM, but I don't mind adjusting mods to give the result I want, and I don't think other people do either. Most mods doesn't come shipped with settings or features that you like by default.

 

In the second case I wouldn't disable the filter, simply because I agree with you there.

 

With your settings in DCL that seem hardcoded, we are not given a choice and we have to use an extra mod like SexLab Tools to be able to choose bound animations from Sexlab. Why should you decide for other people what animations they get? How can you be satisfied with 4 boring animations when bound? That's what I want to know. Why not let us configure DD as we want instead of forcing a couple of settings that can't be changed?

[Kimy]

I you agree with the second scenario (using unbound animations for bound actors) being undesirable, then let me tell you that you're making a whole lot of fuss over a HANDFUL of bound animations that DD won't use because of its lack of creature support. All other bound animations currently in circulation you can happily register to SexLab via ZAP and have it pick them in situations where they don't make any sense. Even DCL would use them! What DCL prevents (and what I have zero intention changing) is that it will NEVER pick unbound animations for situations requiring bound animations, and that's what you said you agree with getting filtered.

 

Generally: I am pretty sure that the very vast majority of users lets SexLab pick a random animation and sticks with it. My solution has to work for these people, and pick animations that fit the context, WITHOUT basically requiring them to manually override animations using 3rd party tools when the code picked silly ones. Also, you can't add "temporary bindings" to random SexLab animations after the animation all that easily. Most of the ones you would feel compelled to use would trigger code that would break the animation. Just saying.

 

PS: I am not satisfied having only a limited number of bound animations. As I said above, this is on our radar. But the solution isn't allowing misfit animations play in situations where they make zero sense, it's adding a greater choice of animations. And that's what we will do. In the meantime I am not going to waste my time writing code that would let my mod pick nonsensical animations.

[Rynnes Master]

Kimy,

 

Please forgive my ignorance, but the latter part of this thread has me completely confused.  From the perspective of you, the mod author, which settings *should* be used in DD, DCL, ZAP, and Sexlab to make sure that what animations you have intended to be used are actually being used.  I have DD, DCL, Sexlab, ZAP, and SLAL active in my load order and have manually disabled in SLAL and Sexlab those animations I don't care for.  But I have no idea what filtering settings you recommend, a recommendation I would like to follow.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Kimy said:

I you agree with the second scenario (using unbound animations for bound actors) being undesirable, then let me tell you that you're making a whole lot of fuss over a HANDFUL of bound animations that DD won't use because of its lack of creature support. All other bound animations currently in circulation you can happily register to SexLab via ZAP and have it pick them in situations where they don't make any sense. Even DCL would use them! What DCL prevents (and what I have zero intention changing) is that it will NEVER pick unbound animations for situations requiring bound animations, and that's what you said you agree with getting filtered.

 

Generally: I am pretty sure that the very vast majority of users lets SexLab pick a random animation and sticks with it. My solution has to work for these people, and pick animations that fit the context, WITHOUT basically requiring them to manually override animations using 3rd party tools when the code picked silly ones. Also, you can't add "temporary bindings" to random SexLab animations after the animation all that easily. Most of the ones you would feel compelled to use would trigger code that would break the animation. Just saying.

 

Fair enough, but I didn't know you could register SexLab animations to ZAP. How can I do that?

 

PS I don't know of any bound creature animations that would require creature support. The ones I have are for humanoid races.

[Reesewow]

17 minutes ago, nightwolf said:

PS I don't know of any bound creature animations that would require creature support. The ones I have are for humanoid races.

There were a series of doggystyle animations with armbinder arm poses for various non-humanoid creatures (horses ect). 

 

Unfortunately Skyrim considers all non-humans as creatures for the purposes of animations - the fact that some of them are humanoid in shape doesn't really make a difference.  So to support "humanoid" creatures, DD would have to add full creature support.

[Falke36]

What can i do, if my Body is invicible?

[LazyBoot]

22 minutes ago, X303811 said:

What can i do, if my Body is invicible?

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/71481-tutorial-building-dd-items-in-bodyslide-nmmmo/

[tookachinchilla]

8 hours ago, Kimy said:

The other scenario is bound actors performing sex acts impossible to do with the kind of bondage they are wearing. E.g. vaginal sex performed through a chastity belt. That's equally silly.

Agreed. On that topic, are all of the catsuits considered "accessible"? I know some state that in the description, but not all. And I've seen vaginal/anal animations where the recipient is wearing a catsuit.

[Bednarik]

Any1 else have a problem with downloading Deviously Cursed Loot?  I can get to 50% & it stops.

ss

[Lupine00]

There really are a lot more animations that have some kind of bound support than DCL support.

It's not just a handful.

 

And then there's what I saw in the SL debug output from sex launched by <some mod>, where one of the flags being requested was ... quite puzzling ... and was clearly resulting in disappointing outcomes.

 

And then there's the inability for modders in general to tell what is happening in an animation unless they do what DCL does and list them in their mod explicitly.

 

This problem still needs a proper solution, not ad hoc lists in individual mods.

 

The player has bound wrists, bound feet, vaginal chastity, needs to be standing or kneeling, attacker is male, not bound and aggressive. If you could ask a mod for the list of installed animations that support this, and then specify what order to ignore constraints if they can't be met... And when the animation plays, you want to know whether the PC or attacker could orgasm. You might want to know what orifices end up being used for each slot.

 

Currently, impossible to know unless you code your own list.

 

Oh wait. This is the DCL list. Never mind then, I just turn off the filters and hit O until I'm happy.

[LazyBoot]

12 hours ago, tookachinchilla said:

Agreed. On that topic, are all of the catsuits considered "accessible"? I know some state that in the description, but not all. And I've seen vaginal/anal animations where the recipient is wearing a catsuit.

I think the catsuits are assumed to have zippers in the crotch for access.

[Kimy]

5 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

There really are a lot more animations that have some kind of bound support than DCL support.

It's not just a handful.

 

And then there's what I saw in the SL debug output from sex launched by <some mod>, where one of the flags being requested was ... quite puzzling ... and was clearly resulting in disappointing outcomes.

 

And then there's the inability for modders in general to tell what is happening in an animation unless they do what DCL does and list them in their mod explicitly.

 

This problem still needs a proper solution, not ad hoc lists in individual mods.

 

The player has bound wrists, bound feet, vaginal chastity, needs to be standing or kneeling, attacker is male, not bound and aggressive. If you could ask a mod for the list of installed animations that support this, and then specify what order to ignore constraints if they can't be met... And when the animation plays, you want to know whether the PC or attacker could orgasm. You might want to know what orifices end up being used for each slot.

 

Currently, impossible to know unless you code your own list.

 

Oh wait. This is the DCL list. Never mind then, I just turn off the filters and hit O until I'm happy.

The problem will persist unless SexLab's tagging system gets a massive overhaul that makes it much more powerful, including standardized tags and complex expressions. Right now you can either OR or AND the entire query, but not pass more complex expressions, like "MF AND (oral OR anal) AND rape AND armbinder AND NOT (vaginal OR handjob)". There is also no way to define animations that will never get picked randomly unless certain of its tags are called -explicitly-. You can mark an animation as" bound", but as long as you're not passing "bound" in the suppress string, the animation will absolutely get picked by QuickSex() etc. The latter is actually the main problem, and that's what makes random sex scenes pick bound animations in situations when nobody's bound.

 

Short of the above happening, there is absolutely nothing I can do from my end to make this work in a clean way without using a local animation registry, combined with code that lets me do selections like the above (which is essentially what the DD filter is doing)

 

If there are more bound animations around NOT yet included in DD, by all means point me to them, and I will see if I can convince their creator to let me add them to DD. Nobody ever submitted any to me, other than Funnybiz's bound animations for creatures, which I couldn't add because DD does not support bestiality.

 

PS: DCL doesn't have an animation registry. DD does provide one for all DD mods around, together with an API function to allow DD mods pick valid bound animations. That's what DCL is using. The filter will never get triggered if animations are picked by this function, because it triggers only when invalid animations are playing (in which case it replaced them with a valid one).

[Supertin]

6 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

There really are a lot more animations that have some kind of bound support than DCL support.

It's not just a handful.

All the animations you are referring to (I am assuming you mean pretty much any animation out there that has the 'bound' tag in SL) are pretty much useless in the context of what animations DD is looking for.

Basically all of those animations I have seen just have the wrists positioned together in random places, which will look just as broken as a regular sex animations when DD would need your arms to be in an appropriate position for the armbinder the character is wearing. Or the yoke, or elbowbinder, or bbyoke etc.

I have even released an easy way for other animators to adjust their animations to be useable by DD, but the interest so far has been a net zero amongst them.

 

But as Kimy said we have plans on improving the lackof DD animations ourselves now.

[MonkeyShoulder]

Hey Kimy, has there been any updates regarding if there is going to be version 7?

 

 

[JZOBTGUMXJN]

Could anyone tell me where the dollmaker lives, i cannot find her shop.