For the five users that still think the Nexus is your buddy.

[spoonsinger]

16 minutes ago, Hoshii_Miki said:

Not sure what you're trying to say there but I'll reply based on an assumption of what you're trying to say.

That's different to this event. That is a case of an unauthorized entity taking someone's work without permission and uploading on another platform without permissions.

In this current event going on, mod authors have already given nexus their permission to do what nexus is doing when they agreed to the terms of service and joined nexus and uploaded their mod.

 

So... It falls under,

 

"If you give your permission to another author for them and/or others to use your work, then, pending a breach of whatever terms you decided, you cannot take back that permission once the other user(s)'s file has been released." from https://help.nexusmods.com/article/28-file-submission-guidelines

 

 

Which suggests the author could just say "not be be used in a collection bundle thingy in their terms of use", (if they so wished), and everything would be hunky dory? Seems a bit of an administrative burden for the Nexus.

[Kendo 2]

Someone over there pointed out (rightly) that Dark0ne can't relicense things he never had the license for to begin with.  It's called 'theft'.  Uploading to a site doesn't negate creative or intellectual property rights, unless you're using their proprietary software (DAZ/Unreal/Frostbite) to create it, but even then they only have rights to the processes, not the actual content.

 

Another thing; 'Bethesda' doesn't own anything that's not derived from their assets.  So if I made a mod using meshes or textures umbrellaed under an existing license then Dork0ne can't legally hold those mods hostage.  It's not his license.

 

The BEST solution imo is to delete your mods from Nerxus now.

 

If Dork0ne pulls this off he'll have the biggest library of game mods on the planet.  Is anyone really okay with that?  He'll also be the biggest mod thief in the history of modding.  Another thing, just because Dork0ne says he own the mods doesn't mean he really does.  If he tries to upload them anywhere like the Atomic Store or Creation Club he'd be violating their TOS since he's uploading (and trying to cash in) on content he didn't author.  It's be funny to see him get slammed by an army of pissed off modders he stole from.

 

Conspiracy time; Dork0ne is going to amass a huge library of mods and sell them to MicroSoft.

[Distortedrealms]

The amount of people attacking concerned MAs in those threads must have no concept of 'bigger picture'. A LOT of authors are going to leave now. Any future mods will not be as easily found as they would not be be on a site like Nexus. I imagine many MAs will quit entirely after another mess like the paid mods scheme and just have had enough of being stepped on. 

[Kendo 2]

If Dork0ne goes through with this LL will get a whole new crop of shills, fanbois and Communists.  Oh joy.

[KoolHndLuke]

Most of them won't leave I'm betting. As much as they like to bitch about Nexus fucking them over, they know they won't get the same exposure anywhere else. And come to LL? They'd sooner stop modding. The ones that would are already here and have been for years.

[Zor2k13]

I have had a severe lack of interest in releasing any mods on nexus for a very long time. Their patented special form of british BS from the moderator side of things had already grated on me enough to discourage me from making any ad money for them already. Over the last few years they just heaped on a big pile of shit on top of that sort of thing which cemented my position. Why should I help them make money? I don't like them to begin with and if you complain about all the woke shit over there it will get you banned. Why should I help feed and provide for that? many people already view that site as "just a download site" and not something to contribute to. I think if it wasn't for mods like sim settlements 1 and 2 they would be going broke. I've noticed some major mod authors have really gone quiet over there like niero and skibadaa and the maker of true storms. He was making some kind of camping mod with custom tents over a year ago and then just stopped.

 

I have never liked patreon or the whole paying for mods thing, when these major mod authors get to that point of you can pay me or forget it I think I'm going to have to forget it. Things already cost a lot and waaaaay to much like rent and food. I can't justify paying for mods when I have to hear from every place I go how I don't quite qualify to live there even though I just do meet three times the dam rent. I only have a place to live because I don't move but when I try to move it is the same line of bullshit from every place I visit. 

 

This has got to be the worst time for modding communities to fuck around with the mods and money thing and this has to be the worst time for companies like bethesda to pull a wait for another year crap. 

[Guest]

I can't fathom the upcoming headaches from MA's trying to give tech support to their own damn mods.

 

O did you fix a critical error 6 releases ago but now have to deal with some idiot's popularly shilled youtube/twitch/discord/etc modpack insistent on using that broken version, all the while having their users demanding you fix the issue and flooding your page with it doesn't work fix it b.s. Or even demanding compatibility.

 

Yeah the revenue/interactions issues are huge as well but no way I would want to deal with that alone when making more complex mods.

[Captain Cobra]

YOU COULD HAVE IT ALL

MY EMPIRE OF DIRT

[Kendo 2]

34 minutes ago, aghjax said:

O did you fix a critical error 6 releases ago

 

"Ask Dork0ne. If he wants to land-of-make-believe pretend he owns it then he can fucking fix it.'

 

All of this Nerxus stupidity isn't going to 'kill modding' or slow modders down but it's funny as fuck to watch.

[27X]

5 hours ago, Hoshii_Miki said:

If authors actually read the nexus ToS though they’d know that they agreed to allow nexus to do what they’re doing with their mods.

 

Not legally binding in the slightest, and one lawsuit will bring all of that down.

[RitualClarity]

1 hour ago, KoolHndLuke said:

Most of them won't leave I'm betting. As much as they like to bitch about Nexus fucking them over, they know they won't get the same exposure anywhere else. And come to LL? They'd sooner stop modding. The ones that would are already here and have been for years.

 

 

There are many that come and keep on coming here ( and other sites for that matter)  from Nexus. they don't use their main avatar name of course. Only a few people are brave enough to use their same avatar on all the gaming sites.... Your's truly and Kendo for example.

If Nexus mod authors don't want to come to LL then they can come  over to https://nsfwmods.com/   we don't play the games Nexus does.  They can get some piece of mind and respect. True Story. Yes, not as much exposure but sometimes piece of mind is more important that exposure.  Our goal isn't to have the largest collection of mods, members, traffic or whatever other demographic is currently in vogue. So we will likely never get even as big as LL is currently and that is just fine with us.  nsfwmods has some nude models and such but not the more extreme level mods that are present on LL. 

 

Bottom line, there are choices if someone sticks to a site that doesn't treat them right... it is just because they are lazy or don't want change. If they get hassled, they deserve it for not being proactive in their choices. As for exposure.. nowadays, exposure is easy to keep up. You don't need a giant mod to get your name out there. It has been my experience that sometimes being on more popular sites with higher traffic actually causes more headaches than being on smaller ones.

[Alror]

 

That is some very disheartening news... I know nothing about the dynamics of the mod community so I cannot claim to be able to predict how many mods will be removed now forevermore, if any.  The sole possibility of it happening now though is very sad.

There isn't even much room for discussion about this issue, so Ive got no idea how mod authors over there are getting harassed and critiqued by and large by uncontributing mod users. My theory is that the bashing comes majorly  from people who really wanted to download a mod before that had been removed by an author without explanation, or that was eagerly waiting for a mod that was announced to eventually be open to the public once more, only for the mod author to decide against it after a year or something and never do so. They remember that frustration and love Nexus' new idea because it craps all over author rights and ensures mods will never be lost if the author fails to remove them from the site within a month.

However, as much as that frustration stings (and oh, do I know it well....), this is still absolutely wrong. At no point should mod authors lose the rights for distribution of their own work (whether the work is 100% theirs or not well set aside here, lets not complicate ourselves}. The timeframe given is irrelevant, whether itd be 1 month or 3 eons. Its their work and it is within their rights to get to decide when to fully delete its presence from the site.  The rule simply reads as "upload your mod, you get 1 month to decide whether it stays or goes, afterwards we will appropriate it and could use it for mod collections without need of your constent according to our terms." Yeah sure, it makes life easier for people who only download mods, but its utterly bullcrap for mod creators. I'm hoping this just ends up getting scrapped altogether.

I also have an irrational fear that this decision will increase the amount of  would-have been mod creators and sharers who will follow this dynamic:  they only upload pictures of their work on their own site, share them privately with other users who also upload pictures without ever giving credit to the original mod author, the mod author will never outwardly say that he has no intention of ever sharing his work to the public for whatever reason and ultimately disappear one day. This might sounsd oddly specific and have no relevancy to the topic at hand, but Ive seen it happen quite often.

Bottom Line: Nexus should get bit in the ass for this.

 

[Myst42]

JFC I was eating when this whole load of crap fell into my plate.

 

Can we discuss it here?

 

I mean, I actually took the time (yeah, Imagine that) to read through that whole pile of bullshit

 

I couldn't care less about "collections". For all I care, I like it when pple uses my stuff... not that I'm a very popular modder anyway. But if someone wanted to include my stuff on a list, fine, knock yourself out.

 

The problem is when all of this quickly started to degenerate from harmless modlists to "All your mods are belong to us now"

And I like it how the entire fucking post is all just one big "fuck you" to anyone who disagrees. It's "LOL We hear your concerns, but we just give no fucks about it lmao"

Entire pages of that.

 

I have to be honest here... I'm not sure if I'm gonna remove all my stuff before the "grace period" Since I actually like the benefits that site offers, I can't be a hypocrite about that.

But I'm feeling really tempted to do so, simply because this is probably the greatest run-over I've seen in recent modding history, and possible in modding history in general. Never have I seen such blatant middle finger to the modders in order for a site to push their own goals just for the sake of getting away with their whim.

Any contradicting opinions are just simply discarded like the most absolute trash

 

I didn't even want to post this opinion there, and I do it here instead, simply because LL has been a much better site in the past. I'm also pretty sure If I dare to post my opinion there I will just get ignored and discarded like the trash they consider us modders to be. I also can't write swear words there and I needed to say it with feeling.

 

Anyway. Fuck this.

 

[Zor2k13]

I wonder how this will effect distribution of major mods like fallout london or FO4NV or capital wasteland and their upcoming dlc first release? Let nexusmods answer all the support posts for fallout frontier:-)

[XunAmarox]

I am furious. I've literally just spent 11 hours (and change) straight non-stop backing up all my mods, old versions, media, and descriptions from Nexus, setting my mods all to hidden, and requesting a total deletion.

 

I'm so fucking fuming I can't even. "Just" 78 mods took me that long, and I wasn't exactly slacking. Hell, my wrist & hand hurt pretty bad at the moment.

 

Here's what I said 11 hours ago:

Quote

 

I cannot and will not support perpetual ownership and distribution of all my mods by a 3rd party (hell, some of my licenses make that illegal). Frankly it's absurd. I can't believe any mod author would be happy to agree to this. I guess they've decided permissions & copyrights are just a chuckle beneath them at this point. Shame, really.

 

And to add the cherry on top I absolutely hate mod compilations. They are horrible for mod authors. Mod authors no longer get feedback, compilation creators get all the praise and feedback off the hard work of dozens of mod authors who actually did all the work (most the time users may love a part of it and never even know who made it), and in many cases users end up with outdated versions of an author's work. They're inherently terrible all around. Their only value is one of pure laziness.

 

And now I'm going to have to spend hours of my own time making sure the descriptions, media, and file versions are all archived on my end before requesting full deletion. Not exactly what I'd planned to do with my day (maybe weekend)... And I "only" have 78 published mods. For some I imagine it'll take far longer.

 

I'm much angrier now. To put it mildly.

[Guest]

People rhought CDPR was their "friend." Then Cyberjunk 2077 released when it wasn't ready. People thought AMD was their "friend." Then they *tried* to kill 400 series boards with Zen 3 and did kill 300 series. PS fanboys thought Sony was their "friend". Now they're porting to PC. As with Xbox.

 

They're not your "friends". They're like Satan, they take, reach peak gratification then move on to the next target

[MonVert]

22 minutes ago, XunAmarox said:

I'm much angrier now.

 

Sounds like it's time to stop modding if it makes you angry.

[NymphoElf]

This situation has me very conflicted. All I can say is I understand and sympathize with both arguments. I just hope things turn out ok.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, endgame † addiction said:

I'm enjoying the shit show comments over there modders attacking one another like I very much enjoyed the shit show threads here yesterday. If only everyday was this spicy.

Except its users vs modders and modders are outnumbered 1/10, I don't get why anyone would call Nexus a community, I remember when they let ad providers have their fun with the site, they constantly ban anyone that criticize them, and are very anti free speech, aka anti "hate speech". It's really just a place to post mods and that's about it, now when you post them they aren't yours anymore.

[InsolentTedium]

So, I managed to creep through 90% of that wall of text and though I am not a Modder I'm angry. People Mod and share their Mods because they want to, it's not their job, it's their past time, I notice Nexus tries to drop the bait suggesting with this idea there are Modders who could actually make a living off their Mods, if this were to be done I would wager, that would average less than 1% of the Modding community. I will admit until I read further, I thought that perhaps people were over reacting, but hell no! What I see here is Nexus holding Modders to ransom, I would dare to suggest almost an enslavement system, all because some people are just too f*cking god damned lazy to trawl through Mods and build their own games, yes through trial and error, get the f*ck over it, I'm a noob and have crashed or corrupted many a Game through my own trial and error in mixing Mods together, but guess what, I have my little dummy spit (at myself), then get up, brush myself off and start again until I get it right.

 

What Darkone is doing is purely catering to over privileged little snots, at the expense of the Modders (who do their Modding for FREE, I will add)... People need to stop feeling so god damned privileged and not expect everything handed to them on a silver platter and NOT have people like DarkOne catering to them and take the time to search, test and bloody well learn for themselves.

 

I love Nexus, but this news really, thoroughly disappoints and maddens me to no end

[27X]

11 minutes ago, InsolentTedium said:

less than 1% of the Modding community

 

To make 1000 bux you have to have a million downloads. Do not kid yourself.

[Contessa]

So I'll be the devil's advocate here. How does this not benefit me, the user? Too many times I've seen mod authors throw a fit and just delete everything denying access to everyone that may have used their mods or relied on them to make other mods work. 

 

There are examples in this very thread. Punishing users because you got a burr up your butt about something they had nothing to do with.

[Zaflis]

2 hours ago, XunAmarox said:

 I can't believe any mod author would be happy to agree to this.

You will find that at least in Reddit you are in the minority, and i must say i agree with Reddit. This is a good change from Nexus for both mod creators and players.

https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/objs3e/nexus_news_post_an_important_notice_and_our/

 

Do note also Wabbajack admin comment on paywalls in that thread:

Spoiler

One of the Wabbajack admins here just to weigh in on an accusation that has been thrown at us multiple times throughout this drama. We do not in any way, shape or form allow the paywalling of modlists. If you see anything that resembles this ("beta" version for Patreons, etc) then can you please contact one of the mod team so we can stop that being spread through our software.

We take this very seriously and do not want this baseless lie spreading around due to a section of mod authors being annoyed at the changes Nexus has made.

For absolute transparency, many of our modlist developers have entirely optional Patreon accounts under the strict provision that they cannot paywall a modlist in any form. Much like how mod authors can get supported if users wish, modlist developers can get the same.

 

Let me break it down quickly, some pros and cons...

 

Collections:

+ With the collections mods get more exposure, more downloads and feedback. Mainly positive assumably, the premise is that collection creator considered your mod to be so good it fits the collection. Players are likely to agree once they try.

 

+ You might get less tech support requests from players, that is because your mod requirements are already included in the collection. Also support questions will first be made to the collection creator. Of course assuming people that don't use collections now are not likely to use them in the future either, so that userbase is mostly unchanged.

 

+ That leads to the point that new players get a more stable starting point for heavily modded setups. They get to experience what we have been playing with for years. It is very daunting doing all that research from scratch, though i'm sure some collections will still require good instructions to get them working. We shall see how they succeed, but Nexus can also potentially help with that with their new system.

 

- New people are new... Their Skyrim will always be riddled with user-errors and collections won't completely fix that, time is the only thing, and good guides. Installing mods as collections makes them not able to distinct which feature belongs to which mod so easily, but all the more reason to suspect they post to collection's support section first. But as a mod creator i bet you don't really want to do this basic explaining of things so it's also a good thing others can do it for you behind the scenes.

 

Then the mod deletion or hiding:

+ Gaming communities should be as open source and free as possible, this is a step that way. Many mod creators seem to have been living on their high horses for so long they feel players are far beneath them. It's a high time to put them back in place! We are all equal people, content should be for everyone, period. No discrimination, no banning specific people or type of people from your content just because you feel they don't deserve it.

 

+ The new rule reduces mod theft. People kept hiding their mods for numerous invalid reasons, mostly just petty arguments between some commenters or maybe even personal attacks in PM. None of that has anything to do with if someone's mod should be available or not, absolutely nothing at all. I saw mod creators today tell me they actually hid their mod because of a PM... it's real, can you believe it? Anyway, if you hide a popular mod for indefinite period of time it's only a matter time until someone reuploads it somewhere else, Nexus or not. Many many people already have it and its sources downloaded. If your mod is hidden, you have no visible copyright connecting it to yourself so you have no grounds to complain, in fact as far as we see a hidden mod as your mod never existed. Modders shoot themselves heavily on the foot by hiding/deleting their mods. They only do that out of spite to players and they don't deserve respect from any of us. What does content quality matter when you act like a jerk to others?

 

+ No more mod hiding because of ongoing bugfix update! People kept hiding the whole mod page just because newest version had some black face bug on NPCs, they were working on new update for years or whatever the reason. Why do that if the bug didn't exist in old versions, do they think all players are complete idiots who can do nothing but complain? Maybe some do but the silent majority are happily playing in the meantime, endorsing your mods, maybe even making Patreon donations. By hiding your mod you are closing support from all players who were currently using said mod, basically spitting them right in the face. Who would keep supporting you after that? Then creators complain when people look up their account names and spam their inbox with hatemail when mod comment sections are down.

 

+ Speaking of hateful comments, Nexus has full right to ban people who do personal attacks against modders and i might say their rules are from the stricter end out of most sites. Mod creators should report them more often, there would be less toxic people around that way. It doesn't help anyone trying to retreat back into your shell and just pretend the problem people don't exist. If you can't hide anymore, maybe now you will see those options better.

 

+ There are things that can and cannot be compared. Nexus account and Youtube accounts can not be compared. Youtube content are purely creational and nobody will ever truly depend on them. Mods are a bunch of different things, some even almost comparable to Windows10... Say SkyUI, PapyrusUtil, FNIS, BodySlide, HDTExtensions... i could go on. Is it fine that those mods would one day be gone just because some idiot posts a bad PM to the author and he decides "enough is enough"? How can one person determine an outcome that affects everyone? We weren't given a chance to show supportive comments to persuade the Author otherwise. How can we continue Skyrim modding as a whole if any of those pieces go missing? Say, Microsoft one day tells you "We won't sell Windows anymore, it is more profitable to focus on X!". Sure, it's their right, their creation. Every new PC with Linux? You think you can just do what you want in the Internet without caring at all like you owned the place? It doesn't work like that, when you create something and spread it to others, take responsibility.

 

- Of course this is an attack to your rights, it can't be denied. However the implications of this are no further reaching than "on paper, i should be able to delete the mod if i wish". There is no practically good reason for anyone to ever delete his mod (apart from for example personal reasons Nexus already said they can help with, you left personal information in the mod that you want gone or so on.).

 

Also Nexus Terms of Service that's been same from 2016 i hear, so they don't have legal issues with this:

Spoiler

By submitting content of any type to Nexus Mods, you are granting a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free license to: store, distribute, copy or reproduce, edit, translate, reformat, publicly display or perform the submitted content, at our discretion.

 

[27X]

8 minutes ago, Contessa said:

So I'll be the devil's advocate here. How does this not benefit me, the user? Too many times I've seen mod authors throw a fit and just delete everything denying access to everyone that may have used their mods or relied on them to make other mods work. 

 

It's not an inalienable right to have someone's mod. Did you pay them? Did you buy them the time and tools to make said mod? To then recraft the mod to work with your completely retarded insistence that it fit just so with your absurd fetish?

 

No. No, you did not. You are owed nothing. Nada. Zero. They put in the work, they put in the time. Even in a patreon situation, taking a specific commission is 100% voluntary and they are under zero legal or civil obligation to accommodate you in any form or fashion unless a legal contract is drawn and tendered, which is pretty hard to do when using licensed material of third party.

[Contessa]

18 minutes ago, 27X said:

 

It's not an inalienable right to have someone's mod. Did you pay them? Did you buy them the time and tools to make said mod? To then recraft the mod to work with your completely retarded insistence that it fit just so with your absurd fetish?

 

No. No, you did not. You are owed nothing. Nada. Zero. They put in the work, they put in the time. Even in a patreon situation, taking a specific commission is 100% voluntary and they are under zero legal or civil obligation to accommodate you in any form or fashion.

This is exactly the kind of attitude that makes it hard for anyone to sympathize with some creators. You post a mod on a free site, free hosting, free visibility yet you expect to retain 100% control over all things. You seat yourself above the "lesser" masses then balk when they don't take pity on your imagined plights. You expect everyone and everything to cater to you yet flip your lid when it doesn't and people ask why should we? 

 

Not to mention you willingly shared something online effectively giving your creation to the world. Someone somewhere will always have a mod you posted and you will never have control over it once you put it out into the ether.

 

So tell me, what exactly is the problem here beyond denying you an avenue to power trip?

 

Edit: Also I have issues with Nexus and how they run things. There's a lot of nuance to this issue that I understand is there, I'm merely talking surface level here. Don't think I'm not entirely without understanding for your side of things, there are situations where an author having control is something that is necessary but not every single one. Especially if the platform you share your mods on offers all of its services to you for free. That gives them a lot of wiggle room to exercise control whether you like it or not.