Devious Devices - Integration 4.3a (2019-09-10)

[CGi]

5 minutes ago, Kimy said:

All right, I'll talk to the team about it. No promises!

Thanks alot.

[Pfiffy]

20 hours ago, CGi said:

i don't know why, but i find this funny even tho i'm in the same boat.

 

Btw: i'm not using SE so my animation limit maxes out at 12500, depending on the animations.

Well, If you were using SE you would have the same limits with the same mods installed.... Its Funny Buizness... oh... thats messing up the comment, forget that. Its interesting buisness, to give more anims to the ppl, just to tell them that they should remove anims to add anims, because they have to many anims.

[Kimy]

Sort of strange that they overhauled a six year old game just to leave the old constraints in there that made them overhaul the game in the first place.

[CGi]

10 minutes ago, Pfiffy said:

Well, If you were using SE you would have the same limits with the same mods installed.... Its Funny Buizness... oh... thats messing up the comment, forget that. Its interesting buisness, to give more anims to the ppl, just to tell them that they should remove anims to add anims, because they have to many anims.

 

6 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Sort of strange that they overhauled a six year old game just to leave the old constraints in there that made them overhaul the game in the first place.

On LE i can achieve a max of ~12500 but it's very unstable.
On SE i can achieve ~16000 before it becomes unstable.

So in LE i don't use Funnybuizinss animations at all when ZAP8 is running and some of them with ZAP7 while under SE i can enable almost all animations from Funnybuiziness while ZAP8 is running. So there is a benefit of using the SE but the 10400 animations i use now already scratch on SexLabs animation limit which is patched to 750.

So even if i install more, SL wouldn't really see all of them.

[Pfiffy]

5 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Sort of strange that they overhauled a six year old game just to leave the old constraints in there that made them overhaul the game in the first place.

Downward compatibility.... 

[Pfiffy]

1 minute ago, CGi said:

 

On LE i can achieve a max of ~12500 but it's very unstable.
On SE i can achieve ~16000 befroe it becomes unstable.

So in LE i don't use Funnybuizinss animations at all when ZAP8 is running and some of them with ZAP7 while under SE i can enable almost all animations from Funnybuiziness while ZAP8 is running. So there is a benefit of using the SE but the 10400 animations i use now already scratch on SexLabs animation limit which is patched to 750.

So even if i install more, SL wouldn't really see all of them.

Do you have the same mods installed in both skyrims?

[CGi]

2 minutes ago, Pfiffy said:

Do you have the same mods installed in both skyrims?

Animation wise? Yes.

[Pfiffy]

40 minutes ago, CGi said:

Animation wise? Yes.

No I'm talking about the other mods...

 

[CGi]

8 minutes ago, Pfiffy said:

No I'm talking about the other mods...

No. Some LE mods are not available for SE and i'm to lazy to patch some of my own old mods.

[Pfiffy]

7 minutes ago, CGi said:

No. Some LE mods are not available for SE and i'm to lazy to patch some of my own old mods.

If you have similar set up, you have a similar anim count. Or in other words, you can slownly start to make a list of those anims you want to kick out, if you have to...

 

[CGi]

1 minute ago, Pfiffy said:

If you have similar set up, you have a similar anim count. Or in other words, you can slownly start to make a list of those anims you want to kick out, if you have to...

Erm... i know how this works. i have a stable animation count in LE and SE.

[Pfiffy]

6 minutes ago, CGi said:

Erm... i know how this works. i have a stable animation count in LE and SE.

I belive that you know it better than me...

[CGi]

1 hour ago, Pfiffy said:

I belive that you know it better than me...

STOP CONFUSiNG ME! i'M OLD! ?

[Reesewow]

5 minutes ago, CGi said:

STOP CONFUSiNG ME! i'M OLD! ?

I *think* what Pfiffy is talking about is the idea that the instability issues are possibly not 100% based on animation count, so if your SE load order is shorter/lighter than your LE load order (due to mods that are not converted) that might be one of the reasons that SE is able to handle more animations.  Also meaning that if true as more mods are converted and you add them to your SE load order, your 16000 animation cap may shrink even if the mods don't add animation specifically.

 

Of course "hopefully" SE is more stable in general, but if the crashes are caused by an engine-based data limitation that they didn't bother to update that may not be the case.

[CGi]

14 minutes ago, Reesewow said:

I *think* what Pfiffy is talking about is the idea that the instability issues are possibly not 100% based on animation count, so if your SE load order is shorter/lighter than your LE load order (due to mods that are not converted) that might be one of the reasons that SE is able to handle more animations.  Also meaning that if true as more mods are converted and you add them to your SE load order, your 16000 animation cap may shrink even if the mods don't add animation specifically.

 

Of course "hopefully" SE is more stable in general, but if the crashes are caused by an engine-based data limitation that they didn't bother to update that may not be the case.

Oh... i tested that theory already by having only animation mods installed.

Made no difference whatsoever in SE or LE and at this point both used the exact same mod loadout.

[Pfiffy]

8 minutes ago, Reesewow said:

I *think* what Pfiffy is talking about is the idea that the instability issues are possibly not 100% based on animation count, so if your SE load order is shorter/lighter than your LE load order (due to mods that are not converted) that might be one of the reasons that SE is able to handle more animations.  Also meaning that if true as more mods are converted and you add them to your SE load order, your 16000 animation cap may shrink even if the mods don't add animation specifically.

 

Of course "hopefully" SE is more stable in general, but if the crashes are caused by an engine-based data limitation that they didn't bother to update that may not be the case.

No... i simply wanted to reduce expectations...

With all this hassle about crashes on load due to too much anims, CGI comment soundet to me a bit like SE could handle more anims ingame. But thats not really the case. As I mentioned before, when it come to limitations SE, as it is now is fully downward compatible...

[CGi]

10 minutes ago, Pfiffy said:

No... i simply wanted to reduce expectations...

With all this hassle about crashes on load due to too much anims, CGI comment soundet to me a bit like SE could handle more anims ingame. But thats not really the case. As I mentioned before, when it come to limitations SE, as it is now is fully downward compatible...

i actually said my SE installation can take a few thousand animations more because thats what happens.
The numbers i posted with the possible max amount on LE and SE where done with only animation mods and their dependencies installed so LE and SE had the exact same mod loadout.
But those numbers are still not fixed because it depends on which animations i enable and in which combination.
i still suspect the name of the animation files to have an impact and shorter ones allowing more animations to be baked into the HKX files. But only @fore would know if that's just a brain fart or a possibility.

[Nazzzgul666]

9 hours ago, fore said:

 

Ok, I found the problem. NO NEED TO SEND ME ANY DATA for testing.

 

There are indeed many limits for AA, and FNIS is checking for them. Sort of.  Unfortunately in this case FNIS is checking the wrong variable. You hit a hard limit, only that FNIS isn't showing a proper message.

 

Like almost always in these cases, there is this 128 elements array limit. And therefore you can only have 128 Sets defined (with "AAset" in the FNIS list files). PCEA2 usually has 30 to 40, SM only 2, XPMSE 16, the DD version I have 14. So these are about 70. And your successful FNIS log already shows 105. So it'S very likely that you have passed the 128 with your removed mods.

I'm really glad you could figure out what's the limit in this case, now we have a much better clue about which mods to remove or avoid if the limit is hit.

 

 

3 hours ago, CGi said:

 

On LE i can achieve a max of ~12500 but it's very unstable.
On SE i can achieve ~16000 before it becomes unstable.

So in LE i don't use Funnybuizinss animations at all when ZAP8 is running and some of them with ZAP7 while under SE i can enable almost all animations from Funnybuiziness while ZAP8 is running. So there is a benefit of using the SE but the 10400 animations i use now already scratch on SexLabs animation limit which is patched to 750.

So even if i install more, SL wouldn't really see all of them.

See the post i've quoted above.  If it crashes without any warning earlier by FNIS, this is most likely your problem. I.E. removing mods with a lot of AA sets should allow you to install a lot of other animations. For myself i'm currently running around 15k animations on LE and it's still quite stable, only a bit slow (sexlab starting animations etc, not in FPS).

[Pfiffy]

1 minute ago, CGi said:

i actually said my SE installation can take a few thousand animations more because thats what happens.
The numbers i posted with the possible max amount on LE and SE where done with only animation mods and their dependencies installed so LE and SE had the exact same mod loadout.
But those numbers are still not fixed because it depends on which animations i enable and in which combination.
i still suspect the name of the animation files having an impact and shorter ones allowing more animations to be baked into the HKX files.

Results may vary...It might be the Hardware (especially the memory) from a certain point on. But therefore LE was more forgiving.

[CheddarTrauma]

15 hours ago, fore said:

Like almost always in these cases, there is this 128 elements array limit. And therefore you can only have 128 Sets defined (with "AAset" in the FNIS list files). PCEA2 usually has 30 to 40, SM only 2, XPMSE 16, the DD version I have 14. So these are about 70. And your successful FNIS log already shows 105. So it'S very likely that you have passed the 128 with your removed mods.

 

As there are 3 different FNIS DDi 4.1 beta animation lists, would these not also count towards that limit?

14 AAset in FNIS_DD_List.txt

14 AAset in FNIS_DD2_List.txt

14 AAset in FNIS_DD3_List.txt

 

Also, looking at the FNIS_FNISSexyMove_List.txt, there are 3 AAset listed in the file and not the 2 you mentioned. Are there 3 used or is there a special rule that brings it down to 2?

[fore]

19 hours ago, CGi said:

i actually said my SE installation can take a few thousand animations more because thats what happens.
The numbers i posted with the possible max amount on LE and SE where done with only animation mods and their dependencies installed so LE and SE had the exact same mod loadout.
But those numbers are still not fixed because it depends on which animations i enable and in which combination.
i still suspect the name of the animation files to have an impact and shorter ones allowing more animations to be baked into the HKX files. But only @fore would know if that's just a brain fart or a possibility.

 

I have no idea what influences load CTD likelihood, since I can't look into Skyrim. And since I have a Skyrim with not much more than my mods, and some body and outfit meshes, not even an ENB, my limit seems to be much higher than most of yours. Might be interesting if someone could take the time and do some statistics with different types of animations.

 

Also it appears to me that people report CTD more constantly in SE. In LE there where many users who requested FNIS version beyond 20k. With SE I generally see a little higher CTD threshold, but apparently almost everyone has that within 20k now.

 

What should also be considered are background jobs in Windows 10. When not playing, I have Chrome open with about 25 tabs. If I forget to close that, my FPS drops (from 60) to about 20-30. And I also seem to get load CTD every now and then. To seldom however to be a proof.

 

In Windows 7 there was a Windos Virtual Memory configuration, that when set, would reduce the background impact almost completely. However, I can't find this configuration any more under Windows 10. I don't know if I'm blind, or it doesn't exist any more. But since my setting now seems to be default, others could be impacted by that as well.

 

16 hours ago, hylysi said:

 

As there are 3 different FNIS DDi 4.1 beta animation lists, would these not also count towards that limit?

14 AAset in FNIS_DD_List.txt

14 AAset in FNIS_DD2_List.txt

14 AAset in FNIS_DD3_List.txt

 

Also, looking at the FNIS_FNISSexyMove_List.txt, there are 3 AAset listed in the file and not the 2 you mentioned. Are there 3 used or is there a special rule that brings it down to 2?

 

You're right, with SM it is 3 now when you use the 360 pack.

 

And of course all 3 DD versions count. From FNIS point of view these are3 different mods.

[CGi]

12 minutes ago, fore said:

What should also be considered are background jobs in Windows 10. When not playing, I have Chrome open with about 25 tabs. If I forget to close that, my FPS drops (from 60) to about 20-30. And I also seem to get load CTD every now and then. To seldom however to be a proof.

All browsers under WIndows use DirectX for hardware acceleration like rendering a page, smooth scrolling and video acceleration.
i usually disable hardware acceleration because the benefits are minor while video hardware acceleration will always be active if the CPU/GPU is supported by the codec.

12 minutes ago, fore said:

In Windows 7 there was a Windos Virtual Memory configuration, that when set, would reduce the background impact almost completely. However, I can't find this configuration any more under Windows 10. I don't know if I'm blind, or it doesn't exist any more. But since my setting now seems to be default, others could be impacted by that as well.

i guess you mean the Pagefile settings.
it should be set to a fixed size where the min and max value is the amount of installed RAM or double the amount of installed RAM.

On mechanical HD's this reduced stutters because the file would not be this fragmented and in case of SSD's it helps their life time a bit.

[CGi]

21 minutes ago, fore said:

What should also be considered are background jobs in Windows 10. When not playing, I have Chrome open with about 25 tabs. If I forget to close that, my FPS drops (from 60) to about 20-30. And I also seem to get load CTD every now and then. To seldom however to be a proof.

Most browsers under Windows use DirectX (a few OpenGL) for hardware acceleration like rendering a page, smooth scrolling and video acceleration.
i usually disable hardware acceleration because the benefits are minor while video hardware acceleration will always be active if the CPU/GPU is supported by the codec.

21 minutes ago, fore said:

In Windows 7 there was a Windos Virtual Memory configuration, that when set, would reduce the background impact almost completely. However, I can't find this configuration any more under Windows 10. I don't know if I'm blind, or it doesn't exist any more. But since my setting now seems to be default, others could be impacted by that as well.

i guess you mean the Pagefile settings.
it should be set to a fixed size where the min and max value is the amount of installed RAM or double the amount of installed RAM.

On mechanical HD's this reduced stutters because the file would not be this fragmented and in case of SSD's it helps their life time a bit.

21 minutes ago, fore said:

Might be interesting if someone could take the time and do some statistics with different types of animations.

As for doing some testing, i did that (lots of trial&error) and animations that consist of many stages (usually 5 and upwards) reduced the amount of animations i can have more, hence why i thought that animation names might be the possible cause.

[Pfiffy]

31 minutes ago, fore said:

Also it appears to me that people report CTD more constantly in SE. In LE there where many users who requested FNIS version beyond 20k. With SE I generally see a little higher CTD threshold, but apparently almost everyone has that within 20k now.

 

Well, this seems to fit into my experience with SE... Reducing the anims might be the easiest solution, but it seems to me that the anim count is just a little part of the problem. LE is more forgiving. You can crash SE with wrong scaled textures, that worked in LE with out causing trouble.

 

[Sovcomrad]

Hello guys, did anyone face this problem with hands, during wearing the armbinder? Bound cobmat and sprint animations works fine, idle and run animations stop working after i speak with any npc.