Devious Device Helpers

[TurboNerd]

18 hours ago, CyberGox said:

Thanks for the mod, awesome work! However, I encountered an issue that Serana is not counted as follower (Vanilla bug, she hasn't "follower" alias, but even adding it she has to be added manually through mod debug menu) and also because of her custom AI she won't force greet you properly, Dialogue appears but it is not forced. Also after first trigger with Serana timer won't reset, so the second event won't occur.

Use the custom follower toggle on the MCM Debug page.  Serana is one example of a follower who uses hew own custom follower system rather than the standard follower system.

[BreadDain]

 

Use the custom follower toggle on the MCM Debug page.  Serana is one example of a follower who uses hew own custom follower system rather than the standard follower system.

Well, as I previously said I did it, but it was very buggy, so mod wouldn't work properly after first event. So I just switched a follower, that fixed an issue.

[TurboNerd]

On 3/2/2019 at 12:23 PM, CyberGox said:

Well, as I previously said I did it, but it was very buggy, so mod wouldn't work properly after first event. So I just switched a follower, that fixed an issue.

Looks like I need to investigate the conditions on a couple of quests.

[Landon Bablandananavan]

I'm not 100% certain that DD Helpers is to blame for my fun and exciting new problem, but the error I'm getting references [DDH] so that's what I'm basing this on.  If I'm completely wrong - and what at the odds of that - wait, like 80%?  Wow.  Well if I am completely wrong hopefuly someone can point me to the correct thread to pester

 

I let my follower tie me up and she did a swell job of it.  Then we wandered around killing mostly minor things - there was an exciting bit with a bear - until we came across a mine. I can't recall the name of it, but it seemed a little too challenging for us to take with my bound, and since it was well past the minimum play time I asked her to take the restraints off, which she did, except for a pair of hand cuffs which naturally prevents me from doing much but kicking people

 

I checked my inventory but they don't appear.  I tried putting on another set of hand cuffs but get a message that they can't be worn over the existing restraints.  I tried asking Chloe to remove the restraints but that option doesn't appear now.  The closest I came to any thing positive was asking her if she could help me out.  The system recognized that I was wearing cuffs because it gave the proper "Can you free me from these..." message, but when I clicked that I got a message I've not seen before:

 

[DDH] WornDevice is none

 

Judging by my success searching the forums for this, I may be the first person to have this happen to them, so...  Yay I guess?

 

I've tried relogging and asking her again, also visiting a blacksmith and tried the "Can you help me out" option.  He charged me 500 gold but I got the WornDevice is none message and the cuffs remain.

 

We managed to have just enough adventures that I'd rather not go back to a previous save until I've confirmed that there's not a simple fix.

 

Thanks for any help you can give

[TurboNerd]

8 hours ago, akaTwoSheds said:

 

[DDH] WornDevice is none

That means that libs.GetWornDeviceFuzzyMatch when called with the PC and libs.zad_DeviousHeavyBondage returned "None" rather than the worn device.

 

That can be caused by the device having multiple rendered forms or an oversight in the DDi code.  Corsets are an example of a device which has multiple rendered forms (because it joins with a chastity belt, if worn).  I had to write a special version of GetWornDeviceFuzzyMatch to reliably remove corsets.

 

In order to diagnose and fix this I need to examine the devise in question.  From which mod (and version) did it come and what is the device ID?

[Landon Bablandananavan]

16 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

That means that libs.GetWornDeviceFuzzyMatch when called with the PC and libs.zad_DeviousHeavyBondage returned "None" rather than the worn device.

 

That can be caused by the device having multiple rendered forms or an oversight in the DDi code.  Corsets are an example of a device which has multiple rendered forms (because it joins with a chastity belt, if worn).  I had to write a special version of GetWornDeviceFuzzyMatch to reliably remove corsets.

 

In order to diagnose and fix this I need to examine the devise in question.  From which mod (and version) did it come and what is the device ID?

I did some - hah, "some" - trail and error and determined that the offending item is from one of the ZaZ packages - at least I think it is.  The name is Rusty Handcuffs and the ID is 0A03817D.  

 

I went so far as to try a

 

player.removeitem 0A03817D 1

 

On it and got a confirmation message indicating that 1.00 had been removed, but the cuffs didn't go away.  I tried the remove item command again and this time it indicated that there were 0.00 removed.  Then I tried a relog but still the cuffs persisted.

 

My next thought was to try disabling ZaZ and seeing if they'd simply vanish in a puff of missing content messages, but I'll hold my horses in case there's something you'd like me to try.

 

Thanks for your help
 

[TurboNerd]

9 hours ago, akaTwoSheds said:

I went so far as to try a

  

player.removeitem 0A03817D 1

 

On it and got a confirmation message indicating that 1.00 had been removed, but the cuffs didn't go away.  I tried the remove item command again and this time it indicated that there were 0.00 removed.  Then I tried a relog but still the cuffs persisted.

This is normal. ?  A devious device is made of two objects: An inventory object used to manipulate the device and a rendered devices to show on your character and work the devious magic.  You need to remove the rendered device first.  Select the player in the console then use the mouse and shift to view all the equipped items, including those that don't show up in "inv".  Use the "removeitem" command to remove the rendered device.  Then you can unequip the inventory device.

[Landon Bablandananavan]

I've been having trouble with LL lately - CloudFlare thinks that there's a DDoS attck going on and who am I to argue

 

But since patience is NOT my middle name I fiddled around with a bunch of things ultimately reinstalling all of the DD components and things seem to be working fine now.

 

Well except for the frequent CTDs but that's not your problem, is it?  Wait...  Is it

 

Thanks so much for all your help!

[shadowwolf2k7]

@akaTwoSheds

 

easiest way i have found to remove an item that is shown but not actually equipped, is to unequip all worn items, open the console. click on your character and type showinvenoty. you will see every item in your inventory. the one that shows an id number -worn and doesnt end in 40f0c is the item you need to remove. the item you are removing is the visual item. even if you have the original item still in your inventory it will remove only the visual as well as possibly removing the actual item. i get a gag occasionly being equipped visually but no gag is equipped.

[xyzxyz]

On 12/23/2018 at 5:24 PM, TurboNerd said:

This is what I wrote in my idea list today:

For some time I have had this on the list:

 

Add sex to the "play time". Standing around bound is not that exciting. Maybe where you talk about what items you are to wear. And maybe binding the follower after the "play time" would be fun too. Why should the player be the only one playing the binding game? Some dialogues when binding the follower (as opposed to inventory menu.) 
 

I have no idea when I'm going to get around to implementing any of this.

Any news or progress on this ideas?

[TurboNerd]

2 hours ago, xyzxyz said:

Any news or progress on this ideas?

I have not made any progress on this as I have had little time to work on this mod.  I did manage to crank out some bug fixes.

[Arcane Wanderer]

Could DDH be made at least partially compatible with Enderal?

 

Enderal uses the Skyrim engine but is a different game and replaces skyrim.esm and update.esm.  So, some mods work, but not anything that references locations/cells in Skyrim.  Devious Devices work.  In Enderal, you usually don't have followers, but there are blacksmiths.   However, DDH doesn't add anything to Enderal blacksmiths.   I don't know how dialogs work, but I'm wondering if the issue is that Enderal is using factions a bit oddly - there doesn't seem to be a generic blacksmith faction, but instead Enderal has things like this-city-blacksmith faction and that-city-blacksmith faction.  However, DDH doesn't seem to reference factions anyway?

 

Can anyone give me clues on where to look if I want to try to develop a patch?

[TurboNerd]

1 hour ago, MikeWander said:

Could DDH be made at least partially compatible with Enderal?

 

Enderal uses the Skyrim engine but is a different game and replaces skyrim.esm and update.esm.  So, some mods work, but not anything that references locations/cells in Skyrim.  Devious Devices work.  In Enderal, you usually don't have followers, but there are blacksmiths.   However, DDH doesn't add anything to Enderal blacksmiths.   I don't know how dialogs work, but I'm wondering if the issue is that Enderal is using factions a bit oddly - there doesn't seem to be a generic blacksmith faction, but instead Enderal has things like this-city-blacksmith faction and that-city-blacksmith faction.  However, DDH doesn't seem to reference factions anyway?

 

Can anyone give me clues on where to look if I want to try to develop a patch?

DDH uses the standard Skyrim blacksmith faction.  The dialogues uses the standard IsInFaction function      in the Quest Dialogue Conditions for blacksmiths and followers.  It also has it's own faction for custom followers.  I don't have Enderal so I don't know what all the factions would be.  Additional potential confusion comes from the use of location type keywords.

 

I think I could figure out how to use soft dependencies in scripts, but I have no idea how to do so in the Quest Dialogue Conditions or if it is even possible.  I really don't want to maintain two versions.

 

As a partial workaround you could mark a blacksmith as a "custom follower".  This will not cause the blacksmith to follow you but it will (baring other surprises) enable the removal dialogues.  It does mean that the services will be free and that heavy restraints will not be cut off.  Point the cross-hairs at the blacksmith, open the DDH Debug MCM page and toggle on the appropriate option.

 

It is technically possible to create a special blacksmith faction (like the custom follower faction) to mark anyone as a blacksmith.  It will then be necessary to code the MCM support and add it to the appropriate dialogue conditions.  I may do so if I see a lot of "me too's" who want the feature.

[Arcane Wanderer]

32 minutes ago, TurboNerd said:

DDH uses the standard Skyrim blacksmith faction.  The dialogues uses the standard IsInFaction function      in the Quest Dialogue Conditions for blacksmiths and followers.  It also has it's own faction for custom followers.  I don't have Enderal so I don't know what all the factions would be.  Additional potential confusion comes from the use of location type keywords.

 

I think I could figure out how to use soft dependencies in scripts, but I have no idea how to do so in the Quest Dialogue Conditions or if it is even possible.  I really don't want to maintain two versions.

 

As a partial workaround you could mark a blacksmith as a "custom follower".  This will not cause the blacksmith to follow you but it will (baring other surprises) enable the removal dialogues.  It does mean that the services will be free and that heavy restraints will not be cut off.  Point the cross-hairs at the blacksmith, open the DDH Debug MCM page and toggle on the appropriate option.

 

It is technically possible to create a special blacksmith faction (like the custom follower faction) to mark anyone as a blacksmith.  It will then be necessary to code the MCM support and add it to the appropriate dialogue conditions.  I may do so if I see a lot of "me too's" who want the feature.

 

I see that I need to look in the CK.  xEdit doesn't seem to support dialogue info.

[Arcane Wanderer]

8 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

DDH uses the standard Skyrim blacksmith faction.  The dialogues uses the standard IsInFaction function      in the Quest Dialogue Conditions for blacksmiths and followers.  It also has it's own faction for custom followers.  I don't have Enderal so I don't know what all the factions would be.  Additional potential confusion comes from the use of location type keywords.

 

I think I could figure out how to use soft dependencies in scripts, but I have no idea how to do so in the Quest Dialogue Conditions or if it is even possible.  I really don't want to maintain two versions.

 

As a partial workaround you could mark a blacksmith as a "custom follower".  This will not cause the blacksmith to follow you but it will (baring other surprises) enable the removal dialogues.  It does mean that the services will be free and that heavy restraints will not be cut off.  Point the cross-hairs at the blacksmith, open the DDH Debug MCM page and toggle on the appropriate option.

 

It is technically possible to create a special blacksmith faction (like the custom follower faction) to mark anyone as a blacksmith.  It will then be necessary to code the MCM support and add it to the appropriate dialogue conditions.  I may do so if I see a lot of "me too's" who want the feature.

I figured out an easy solution.   I created an small esm that does two things.  First. it adds in the missing JobBlacksmithFaction [FACT:0005091D] faction.  Second, it adds override records for relevant NPCs so that those NPCs are members of the recreated blacksmith faction.   Works for both mods I checked, DDH and Devious Keysmiths.

 

I suppose an alternate approach would be to use a script to scan for blacksmith NPCs and add them to the missing faction.   However, that seems like overkill.

 

My test esm only included an override for one blacksmith NPC.   I'll lookup the other NPCs, add overrides for them, and post the mod.   Better yet, maybe I can get the SureAI team that created Enderal to consider the missing faction info to be a bug.

 

If you wanted DDH to natively support Enderal, you could tie the dialogs to a half dozen factions with names like "ArkDefaultMerchantBlacksmithFaction" (Ark is one of the major cities.)   However, I can't imagine you could do that in a single version of the mod in the CK.

 

[Arcane Wanderer]

Enderal compatibility patch released.  https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/8668-enderal-blacksmiths/

 

Should work for any mod that provides dialog options for blacksmiths.

[TurboNerd]

9 hours ago, Zagzaguel said:

I wonder perhaps you could disable the follower dialoug during playtime ("Mph!!" => "Nah, I still want to see you struggle" => Dialouge end)  and add some other dialouge outside of it? ("I bet you also want to get out of this dangerous place *wink*" => Follower Dialouge)

 

I take this playtime as a sort of "adding a playful, slightly sadistic character trait" which I find really cute and amusing but you only see this "trait" when playtime ends and starts

This is more of a immersion thing than anything else I guess but .. yea

This already exists.  During play time the follower will give one of several excuses not to remove the device.  The player can either say something like "Ok, have your fun" or "We have things to do".  I always wanted play time to be voluntary.  I did, at the request of another player, add a "bondage lover" option to the MCM.  When enabled play time is no longer optional and can not be ended early.

[Zaflis]

I found this case where some of the restraints were not removed after playtime, just the gag was left on. I can perhaps guess why that happened too.

 

So i have MCM settings ON for "no keys consumed", "always gag", "no items locked without key".

 

I didn't have a single restraint key when it started, so she propably didn't lock that sort of restraints on me. But then she noticed i don't have gag on, and because of that rule it was put on. I guess the unlock procedure itself actually requires player to have at least 1 matching key even if it's not consumed.

 

Problem here is that these "no items locked without key" wasn't checked for "always gag" rule. I think it might have done the same with blindfold rule too, it was disabled now though. So i guess the playtime shouldn't have started at all without any keys when that rule is on. And it might have to add some long'ish delay before playtime is attempted again.

 

I notice also that armbinder was put on while no keys and hand tying rule disabled. Somehow she got it unequipped though.

[TurboNerd]

I'm adding the "no items locked without key" wasn't checked for "always gag" rule to the bug list.

 

As far as the armbinder goes, I'm certain that it was in the PC inventory.

 

With "always tie hands" if there is no wrist restraint in the PC's inventory then the follower will "conjure" one and tie her hands with it.

 

If there is one or more wrist restraints in inventory then the follower will use whichever one he finds first regardless of the setting of "always tie hands".

 

It works this way for all types of restraints.  The follower will look through the PC's inventory and will lock on any and all restraints he finds unless some other restraint is already blocking the slot.

[Zaflis]

1 hour ago, TurboNerd said:

As far as the armbinder goes, I'm certain that it was in the PC inventory.

Correct, it was from inventory. But i hadn't manipulated the lock and had no restraint key. How does it work that she could remove armbinder but not gag?

[TurboNerd]

14 hours ago, Zaflis said:

Correct, it was from inventory. But i hadn't manipulated the lock and had no restraint key. How does it work that she could remove armbinder but not gag?

The tags on the armbinder say that it does not require a key.  Presumably it's just laces and buckles even though the model looks like it has locks on the buckles.  Try the "secure armbinder"  

[mkess]

Removal does not work for some items.

 

Items that aren't even visible in the inventory. Even a new game did not help at all.

 

So far this concerns some gags, a hood and a yoke. DDx says these items are "NONE". They are no DD item at all.  At least DD has that oppinion, and who am I to distrust them...

 

This scews up the save game, because there is NO WAY IN HELL to ever remove these invisible, but on the char very much visible and active items ever again. I have no fucking clue which routine causes that desaster, but these items seem to be invisible on the char, until your routine equips them. Don't do this, if they are invisible in the inventory. Just don't. We cannot get rid of them.

 

Even your OWN routine is inacpable of removing them. Imagine that. The routine which equipped them in the first place cannot remove them. Good Job. Even after I told the routine only to use items we have the fucking keys for! So do not equip them in the first place! Never ever.

 

Rant over. I am pretty much annoyed, because I need ages making a new save game. With all the mods I am running. So nothing personal. I am only venting. And to let you know you have a major problem in your script, that makes it even dangerous for a save.

 

P.S. It seems you are not the source of this misbehavior. So I have to apologize.

 

The cursed loot 8.07 self bondage routine runs amok, too, and does exact the same things you do, equipping things that are not visible in the inventory, and not visible for the debug routine to remove regular DD items.  Hell, how on earth can I find that bug. I fear that is a compabilty problem in the devious device routine itself, from V3 to v 4.02. maybe they removed/changed some things from 3, that are still possible to equip in V4.

[donttouchmethere]

41 minutes ago, mkess said:

This scews up the save game, because there is NO WAY IN HELL to ever remove these invisible, but on the char very much visible and active items ever again.

I'm not sure if that is an DH issue.

I have that too even without DH installed.

 

So far DH only equips standart DDs from inventory or by spawning them during NPC interaction

 

If you have an DD equipped that doesn't show up in inventory but is visible on the PC and has effect:

> add the same DD to your inventory via additem or console

> spam click the DD in inventory till it you get the DD message box for device interaction (unlock, examine...)

> after that it should be possible again to remove it via DDe or mods like DH that offer escape from DDs

> or just use a key at that point^^

 

my guess is that the inventory manager is too slow and DD that should be removed don't get removed completely, leaving you with an device that is not listed in inventory anymore

 

my other guess is: bugged mods that don't remove some DDs properly

my otherother guess: script lag

 

I have that issue too a lot on my actual game, seems sometimes if DDs should have been added and didn't will lure and will be added as soon as any mod wants to add new DDs to the PC

 

Mods on my game that regulary want to add items and fail sometimes:

> DEC

> DCL

[mkess]

59 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

I'm not sure if that is an DH issue.

I have that too even without DH installed.

 

So far DH only equips standart DDs from inventory or by spawning them during NPC interaction

 

If you have an DD equipped that doesn't show up in inventory but is visible on the PC and has effect:

> add the same DD to your inventory via additem or console

> spam click the DD in inventory till it you get the DD message box for device interaction (unlock, examine...)

> after that it should be possible again to remove it via DDe or mods like DH that offer escape from DDs

> or just use a key at that point^^

 

my guess is that the inventory manager is too slow and DD that should be removed don't get removed completely, leaving you with an device that is not listed in inventory anymore

 

my other guess is: bugged mods that don't remove some DDs properly

my otherother guess: script lag

 

I have that issue too a lot on my actual game, seems sometimes if DDs should have been added and didn't will lure and will be added as soon as any mod wants to add new DDs to the PC

 

Mods on my game that regulary want to add items and fail sometimes:

> DEC

> DCL

i found something out 10 minutes ago:

 

If I manually equiped the "red ebonite gag" in the inventory he activates the no food effect, BUT he equips a black hood on my character instead. Afterwards the red ebonite gag is NOT equiped in the inventory, and the hood and the no-food effect is not no longer removable any longer. If you save that state, you're scewed. It has nothing to do with delays, it simple uses the wrong items to install.

 

I think it's a DD core problem. I read that they changed the gags in their latest version. But it effects ALL depending mods, making them unusable in the process.

 

P.S: I simple do not know which item or hood he used, so I am unable to get it via console, to replace the model. I do not know all hoods.... And I am stll not able to remove the no-food effect, because the "red ebonite gag" itself that used is bugged. I cannot install it again.,

[donttouchmethere]

On 4/7/2019 at 12:36 AM, mkess said:

i found something out 10 minutes ago:

 

If I manually equiped the "red ebonite gag" in the inventory he activates the no food effect, BUT he equips a black hood on my character instead. Afterwards the red ebonite gag is NOT equiped in the inventory, and the hood and the no-food effect is not no longer removable any longer. If you save that state, you're scewed.

 

I think it's a DD core problem. I read that they changed the gags in their latest version. But it effects ALL depending mods, making them unusable in the process.

I think there is an issue with hoods.

They count as gag and blindfold at the same time.

If a mod removes a blindfold, it will also remove the hood and with that the gag effect of the hood

If a mod removes the gag, it will also remove the hood and with that the blindfold effect of the hood

 

my guess is that the gag or the bildfold effect will stay if the hood doesn't get removed as a hood, instead only one effect gets removed while the whole hood gets removed

 

I can see that effect if mods offer a dialog option to remove a gag or a blindfold, but not the hood.

 

EDIT: I think that the hood issue I described is bogous

still the DDi 4.2 heavy gag harness makes issues if DCL 7.2 and DCL 8.0 is installed

=> 2 message boxes, sometimes only the gag in inventory gets removed and not the visual gag

 

You might be up to something there!