Devious Device Helpers

[user9120975435]

Hopefully I'm in the right thread because two DD events happened at the same time, Cursed Loot devious body trap and DDH tie-up (where the follower doesn't take no for an answer). Anyways, a gag was equipped (plus horse mittens so I can't take it off) and whenever I talk to my follower she calls me her pony and that I should go to the nearest stables and she will take everything off there. I go to Solitude stables and no matter where I position myself and talk to her she repeats the same thing, but never does anything to help. Even if I'm in the wrong thread, does anyone know what to do?

[TurboNerd]

28 minutes ago, user9120975435 said:

Hopefully I'm in the right thread because two DD events happened at the same time, Cursed Loot devious body trap and DDH tie-up (where the follower doesn't take no for an answer). Anyways, a gag was equipped (plus horse mittens so I can't take it off) and whenever I talk to my follower she calls me her pony and that I should go to the nearest stables and she will take everything off there. I go to Solitude stables and no matter where I position myself and talk to her she repeats the same thing, but never does anything to help. Even if I'm in the wrong thread, does anyone know what to do?

The trick in sorting this is finding out which mod is causing the follower to call you a pony and suggest you go to a stables.  I can tell you with certainty that DDH did not cause your follower to call you a pony.  I have yet to see any horse or pony content in DCL.  DDi/DDx have pony boots and some bridles, but no removal dialogue.  What other mod(s) do you have which might be responsible?

[Clockwinding]

43 minutes ago, user9120975435 said:

Hopefully I'm in the right thread because two DD events happened at the same time, Cursed Loot devious body trap and DDH tie-up (where the follower doesn't take no for an answer). Anyways, a gag was equipped (plus horse mittens so I can't take it off) and whenever I talk to my follower she calls me her pony and that I should go to the nearest stables and she will take everything off there. I go to Solitude stables and no matter where I position myself and talk to her she repeats the same thing, but never does anything to help. Even if I'm in the wrong thread, does anyone know what to do?

That pony play is from devious followers. the spot for the game is on the road not in front of the stables, try looking for it.

if you don't find it use the mod reset in the devious followers MCM.

[user9120975435]

2 minutes ago, TurboNerd said:

The trick in sorting this is finding out which mod is causing the follower to call you a pony and suggest you go to a stables.  I can tell you with certainty that DDH did not cause your follower to call you a pony.  I have yet to see any horse or pony content in DCL.  DDi/DDx have pony boots and some bridles, but no removal dialogue.  What other mod(s) do you have which might be responsible?

 

Thanks for your reply and my apologies for posting in wrong thread!

[user9120975435]

26 minutes ago, Clockwinding said:

That pony play is from devious followers. the spot for the game is on the road not in front of the stables, try looking for it.

if you don't find it use the mod reset in the devious followers MCM.

 

Thanks!

[Hanshurtig11]

Thanx for your Mod, its quite nice and helpfull !!

Some points i like to comment. I think it would be nice, when you switch off help from your follower, the option to get help at the blacksmith should still be there.

For me at least, both triggers together. Other thing is, that even when i have "consume key on use" switched on in DD a single key is enough to get complete free through my follower.

Something i would like is, if you dont have to trigger conversation to get tied up by your follower. More like the follower is approaching itself, doing whats to be done , and no way to freak out. (maybe it is like this, i have "force greet" in dialog, when i start conversation?)

And last but not least, why is there still an option to get freed by your follower anytime, just by nagging a bit longer   regards

 

 

[TurboNerd]

4 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

I think it would be nice, when you switch off help from your follower, the option to get help at the blacksmith should still be there.

The follower and blacksmith share some dialogue which is why the option controls both.  However, I think I might be able to separate it by moving the conditions further down.  I'll look into it.

4 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

Other thing is, that even when i have "consume key on use" switched on in DD a single key is enough to get complete free through my follower.

I assume you are not using DDi 3.  "Consume key on use" does not exist in DDi 4.0.  It was added recently in the develpment branch on Github.  I am not using the development branch as a foundation for this mod for obvious reasons.  I may add support later once the next version of DDi stabilizes, but only if there is a public interface to discover whether the feature is turned on and only if I can do it without making this mod incompatible with DDi 4.0.

4 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

Something i would like is, if you dont have to trigger conversation to get tied up by your follower. More like the follower is approaching itself, doing whats to be done , and no way to freak out.

The follower should forcegreet you when adventure time is over and you are in an eligible location (after a delay of up to 20 seconds).  If this is not happening then something may be interfering.  If you enable "Bondage Lover" then the dialogue options to avoid being tied up will disappear.  If you want forced slavery there are a number of mods which will do a better job of that then this one will ever do.  The point of switching off help from the follower was to prevent this mod from interfering while you are enslaved by one of the mods which do that.

[LazyBoot]

1 hour ago, TurboNerd said:

6 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

Other thing is, that even when i have "consume key on use" switched on in DD a single key is enough to get complete free through my follower.

I assume you are not using DDi 3.  "Consume key on use" does not exist in DDi 4.0.  It was added recently in the develpment branch on Github.  I am not using the development branch as a foundation for this mod for obvious reasons.  I may add support later once the next version of DDi stabilizes, but only if there is a public interface to discover whether the feature is turned on and only if I can do it without making this mod incompatible with DDi 4.0.

 

This is how it's implemented in DD4.1, you should be able to do something similar:

If DestroyKey
	libs.PlayerRef.RemoveItem(DeviceKey, NumberOfKeysNeeded, False)
elseif libs.Config.GlobalDestroyKey && DeviceKey.HasKeyword(libs.zad_NonUniqueKey)
	libs.PlayerRef.RemoveItem(DeviceKey, NumberOfKeysNeeded, False)	
EndIf	

"DestroyKey" is a bool property on items (exists in dd4 as well), signalling if the key(s) for a device should be destroyed regardless of global setting. I think you may only need to check this on npcs, since looking at the DD code, I think it may remove the keys from the player even when removed from scripts.

 

EDIT: Also in DD4.1 the setting is called "Consume Keys", so Hanshurtig11 may be referring to the old setting.

[Hanshurtig11]

1 hour ago, TurboNerd said:

I assume you are not using DDi 3.  "Consume key on use" does not exist in DDi 4.0.  It was added recently in the develpment branch on Github.

Yes yes, you are right, forgot about that, using 4.x Dev version

 

1 hour ago, TurboNerd said:

The follower should forcegreet you when adventure time is over and you are in an eligible location (after a delay of up to 20 seconds)

I have all locations and Bondage lover enabled. I see "you notice follower has a devious look" but have to start dialog myself, where i get three options from this mod. "..." , "ForceGreet" and another"..." - one "..." leads to "no fair, you dont have ...etc" other leaeds to "seems we are missing keys" and then to "no fair, you dont have.." and "ForceGreet" leads to "lets celebrate our victory" and choice between "not in the mood" or "ok tie my up" wich ends both in beeing tied up (ok, as i have checked Bondagelover)

To make it short, i wonder if the "ForceGreet" shall be in the dialog , or should be a scriptcommand?

And yes, i dont see this mod for forced slavery, but at least, if you play the "bondagegame" for lets say 2 hours, there shouldnt be a way to get freed by your follower so easy

But thats just my oppinon. Thx for the answers and for your great mod. regards

[valcon767]

33 minutes ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

Yes yes, you are right, forgot about that, using 4.x Dev version

 

I have all locations and Bondage lover enabled. I see "you notice follower has a devious look" but have to start dialog myself, where i get three options from this mod. "..." , "ForceGreet" and another"..." - one "..." leads to "no fair, you dont have ...etc" other leaeds to "seems we are missing keys" and then to "no fair, you dont have.." and "ForceGreet" leads to "lets celebrate our victory" and choice between "not in the mood" or "ok tie my up" wich ends both in beeing tied up (ok, as i have checked Bondagelover)

To make it short, i wonder if the "ForceGreet" shall be in the dialog , or should be a scriptcommand?

And yes, i dont see this mod for forced slavery, but at least, if you play the "bondagegame" for lets say 2 hours, there shouldnt be a way to get freed by your follower so easy

But thats just my oppinon. Thx for the answers and for your great mod. regards

i suspect you have some type of interference happening.  i have the bondage lover setting enabled and when i get the notification "has a devious look" it takes from 1-20

seconds then my follower comes up and actually force greets me. i then get just 2 options (not in the mood, & ok tie me up i think they are) and either response leads

to being tied up for playtime (and i cannot get out early).

 

question which version of this mod are you using? (an earlier version had a issue with the bondage lover option)

edit 

i am also using the DDI dev 4.x version

 

[Hanshurtig11]

33 minutes ago, valcon767 said:

i suspect you have some type of interference happening.  i have the bondage lover setting enabled and when i get the notification "has a devious look" it takes from 1-20

seconds then my follower comes up and actually force greets me. i then get just 2 options (not in the mood, & ok tie me up i think they are) and either response leads

to being tied up for playtime (and i cannot get out early).

 

question which version of this mod are you using? (an earlier version had a issue with the bondage lover option)

edit 

i am also using the DDI dev 4.x version

 

I use latest 0_4_7 . So it seems "ForceGreet" shouldnt not appear as text in the dialog but should be a command in some way.. thats really strange *g*

I have Devious Follower installed (but disabled) as well, might be nothing, but i will try deinstall both, do a saveclean and install Devious Helper alone again. thx

 

ps. might be of intrest. I use a slave from Paradies Halls marked as follower, so not a regular one. I will try with a regular one.

 

pps. Seems it works with a regular follower. So the costom follower from PAH might be the problem. Well, they come with a bunch of dialog.

[TurboNerd]

4 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

I see "you notice follower has a devious look" but have to start dialog myself, where i get three options from this mod. "..." , "ForceGreet" and another"..." - one "..." leads to "no fair, you dont have ...etc" other leaeds to "seems we are missing keys" and then to "no fair, you dont have.." and "ForceGreet" leads to "lets celebrate our victory" and choice between "not in the mood" or "ok tie my up" wich ends both in beeing tied up (ok, as i have checked Bondagelover)

To make it short, i wonder if the "ForceGreet" shall be in the dialog , or should be a scriptcommand?

Edit: I may have misdiagnosed your problem.  See next post but info below is still valid and may help others.

 

What usually happens in my setup is the follower forcegreets (like the courior) with "Let's celebrate our victory..." or one of the other greetings.  I have seen what you describe once or twice during my testing and it appeared at a time when the system was apparently too busy.  What is supposed to happen is the script starts a quest (DDH02) which puts the follower into an alias with a forcegreet AI package which triggers the appropriate "topic".  For some reason the package did not fire properly (or completely).

 

I have found that on my system the more mods I have which do periodic polling and the longer the game goes the more often I have trouble with things not happening when they should.  Try sacrificing some mods you don't need.  Consider those with *.pex files, especially those which update or check something every so often.

[TurboNerd]

3 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

ps. might be of intrest. I use a slave from Paradies Halls marked as follower, so not a regular one. I will try with a regular one.

This is the most likely cause.  Paradise Halls adds a bunch of new dialogue *and a new AI package* which might be stepping on the forcegreet package that DDH adds.  Packages are added in a stack where the package on top wins.  It's very possible that the DDH Forcegreet package is burried.

[TurboNerd]

@LazyBoot Thanks for the pointer; it saves me the time in hunting that down.

I have two concerns though.  A minor concern is whether I can reference libs.Config.GlobalDestroyKey in DDi 4.0 without it blowing up.  I'll use a version check if I need to.

 

A bigger concern is:  If the follower is locking the player in up to a dozen devices every day and a half on average, that's eight keys a day just for play time and I can't help but wonder if there will be enough keys.  Right now the follower unlocks stuff in the order discovered, not necessarily the most debilitating first.  I guess it's up to the player to tune the key distribution, but I suspect that having this work well will take more than an "if" statement.

[LazyBoot]

59 minutes ago, TurboNerd said:

@LazyBoot Thanks for the pointer; it saves me the time in hunting that down.

I have two concerns though.  A minor concern is whether I can reference libs.Config.GlobalDestroyKey in DDi 4.0 without it blowing up.  I'll use a version check if I need to.

 

A bigger concern is:  If the follower is locking the player in up to a dozen devices every day and a half on average, that's eight keys a day just for play time and I can't help but wonder if there will be enough keys.  Right now the follower unlocks stuff in the order discovered, not necessarily the most debilitating first.  I guess it's up to the player to tune the key distribution, but I suspect that having this work well will take more than an "if" statement.

I just did a very quick test trying to reference a setting on libs.config I just made up.

It will return false* if it doesn't exist, so you should in theory not need to check version. (Though I didn't check to see if this causes an error in the papyrus log)

You'd need the 4.1 scripts to compile it though.

 

Either way I'd suggest checking for the "DestroyKey" property on the items, so that this doesn't end up as a workaround for 3rd-party items with the property set.

 

^{* At least that's what Debug.Notification printed when I tried telling it to print it}

[TurboNerd]

1 hour ago, LazyBoot said:

Either way I'd suggest checking for the "DestroyKey" property on the items, so that this doesn't end up as a workaround for 3rd-party items with the property set.

I agree.  I'll put it on the to-do list.

[Loki15kun]

Could you add an option toggle for the blacksmiths to respect uncuttable devices?

Like if the device is 100% uncuttable, the player has to bring keys for help. (It could be similar to the follower check for is cuttable too).

 

I like that they can destroy most of the devices, but I find strange that 100% uncuttable devices are able to be cut.

[TurboNerd]

1 hour ago, Loki15kun said:

Could you add an option toggle for the blacksmiths to respect uncuttable devices?

Like if the device is 100% uncuttable, the player has to bring keys for help. (It could be similar to the follower check for is cuttable too).

 

I like that they can destroy most of the devices, but I find strange that 100% uncuttable devices are able to be cut.

When the player or follower cuts a device, they use a knife or dagger.  When a blacksmith cuts a device they use an anvil, cold chisel and hammer.  Have you seen what those tools can do?

[TurboNerd]

Version 0.4.8 is up!

MCM changes require a clean save.

Please test it out and report problems.

What's New in Version 0.4.8

Fixed:  Dialogue condition which prevented removal of wrist restraints which required exactly one key.

New:  Support "DestroyKey property on items so that this doesn't end up as a workaround for 3rd-party items with the property set.

New:  Separate blacksmith from "Follower assists with devices".  Blacksmiths have their own option.

[Hanshurtig11]

That was quick !! Thanx again for your work.

[El_Duderino]

5 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

New:  Support "DestroyKey property on items so that this doesn't end up as a workaround for 3rd-party items with the property set.

Fantastic, thank you!

 

This reminds of something else: I very much like that the mod respects the Number of Keys setting on a device, even though that seems to be an undocumented feature (or I have just overlooked it in the description). I was testing this with a multi-key standard device that I created in Tes5Edit and when I asked the follower with less than the needed keys in the inventory the "can't find a key" response came up and the device stayed on... as it should.

 

I'm really enjoying this mod. The now removed built-in armbinder removal dialog of DD was too powerful and essentially an instant get out of jail free card, your mod provides a plausible method of escape that the player still has to work for (either earn coin or find keys). And then there's of course the bondage games -- very awesome!

[Hanshurtig11]

Not sure how difficult it is, but is there a possibility to have an option to disable the mod complete ? Or is it save to just disable (and later reenable) extern via NMM ?

[Loki15kun]

15 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

When the player or follower cuts a device, they use a knife or dagger.  When a blacksmith cuts a device they use an anvil, cold chisel and hammer.  Have you seen what those tools can do?

Blacksmith tools are indeed powerful. But Skyrim is the land of magic and dragons, why can a blacksmith cut a 100% uncuttable device?

The device could be a minor magic one, that just is not a quest device.

If it's 0 to 99% uncuttable, I can see them doing it. But 100% should means that you have to find the keys . Be it a custom key or a restraint key.

 

I know that I can avoid this all, by adding the quest keywords. But I just wanted to create some simple magic devices for a quick run and be done with it.

I guess is time to learn how quests and dialog works.

 

Sorry for rambling. And thanks for your time.

[LazyBoot]

3 minutes ago, Loki15kun said:

I guess is time to learn how quests and dialog works.

It doesn't need to be related to a quest in any way. It just needs to have the keyword from DD.

[Loki15kun]

3 minutes ago, LazyBoot said:

It doesn't need to be related to a quest in any way. It just needs to have the keyword from DD.

The thing is I want to be able to ask for help to remove, since I created the device with 100% lock access difficulty too.

I just didn't want it to be destroyed by being cut (100% uncuttable). Since it was a minor 'magic created' device, not warranting a quest item status.

I was testing adding enchatments for the devices, and justified that some of them would have unreachable locks and uncuttable material as a tradeoff for the effects.