Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

[bathoz]

Just a note, as after reading about it, I went to check out DDBeta... there is no way in hell that average folks are going to be dealing with a githhub file source. Not saying everyone, but it'll be a reason not to use your mod.

[Reesewow]

7 minutes ago, bathoz said:

Just a note, as after reading about it, I went to check out DDBeta... there is no way in hell that average folks are going to be dealing with a githhub file source. Not saying everyone, but it'll be a reason not to use your mod.

If you aren't interested in testing bleeding edge versions, just stick with the latest stable/DD4 versions - there are like 3 currently available different versions on the download page that don't use DDBeta. 

 

DD 4.1 is feature-frozen and likely will be released as soon as any current bugs are ironed out, so you probably won't have to wait long for a non-Github version.

[Hanshurtig11]

Testing with the latest Version 1.42, i say i like the new submenu for conversation. Seperates the mod nicely from normal conversation.

Not sure if its intended but stripping naked not working like before (forced strip) but forces you via shocking and breaking conversation. Is that right ?

If so, what happens if you dont have the piercing deal, but the strip deal ? Bound hands still does not happen in any way.

A personal request.... i would so like to have a differnt towncollar. In my eyes the regular is sooo ugly and the chain is flipping around with any movement.

Maybe a nice metal posture collar ? :)  thanx for all the work done on this mod, keep it up !! regards.

 

ps: Did a clean save for update.

[Lupine00]

You can come at this mod a bunch of different ways.

 

Right now, I have DF in my LO, but I keep thinking, if I hire a follower, they'll just leech all my cash and probably enslave me. I'm fine without one for now.

 

I don't want to just do what I did last game and set it up so followers are the main way to get released from DCL. I've done that. I want to try something different.

 

 

I don't like a certain aspect of this mod, which is that it can easily push you to pay a lot of attention to loot and vendors, which can get tedious.

 

So, to avoid that, I think (for now) in this game, I'm going to set my follower costs low, so the follower really isn't much of an expense, and I can even fast travel if I want without finding out that I'm enslaved at the end of the trip (which happens - you don't get a chance to take a deal, you just get enslaved).

 

I'll just let it run like that and see if maybe I end up in a situation where I am broke somehow and have to take a deal.

Or... If I can upgrade my install, maybe I'll end up enslaved via SS ...

 

 

This made me think, it would be handy if you could take deals to restore follower lives.

e.g. You're in the dungeon, follower is cranky and wants to go home. No problem, do a deal, follower cheers up, and you can continue fighting.

I set lives fairly low, was at 3 by the end of the last game. At the default they pretty much never run out.

 

 

Is it possible to safely upgrade from 1.35b to the latest, assuming you have no follower?

 

1 hour ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

A personal request.... i would so like to have a differnt towncollar. In my eyes the regular is sooo ugly and the chain is flipping around with any movement.

Agree. The chain goes crazy too often, and never really looks good. Probably because of my HDT rates, but it seems like it was built for a crawling character, and you don't seem to crawl in DF. I had some similar gripes about SLAV items ... and yet HDT pony tail is fine.

[CGi]

16 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

Right now, I have DF in my LO, but I keep thinking, if I hire a follower, they'll just leech all my cash and probably enslave me. I'm fine without one for now.

That's why i added a min level to DF in my build so it doesn't start before level 5 and it starts with a different dialogue line.

But maybe @Lozeak will add something like this in later versions himself and maybe together with another condition like min gold.

[Snook001]

14 hours ago, Lozeak said:

Enjoyed reading ^^. The amount of work to make something like this would warrant it's own mod and wouldn't fit in how the mod works atm (it's dynamic content reacting to player choices/status rather than scripted content aka a quest)

 

 

Yeah, I was expecting it might be a lot of work.  I just imagined that after a while whoring herself the follower would come back and player.setstage would be use to make the quest progress.  Ho well... It was worth the try.   Thanks for reading and replying ?

[xboronx]

Small idea for another way to generate sudden debt spikes:

 

Follower gets mad at you if you frequently fail at combat with the result that your follower gets knocked out/raped. The mod deviously enslaved has a setting in it which checks if you accidently hit your follower in combat. After that your follower complains with a force greet. So far i could chose the apology answer, but i think if you do it too often something bad will happen.

 

So if it is easy to check if your follower is in bleedout stage due to combat or gets raped (because losing a combat and thus getting raped alongside the player via DCL/Defeat/similiar mods) this would be a good way to add some response afterwards by your follower.

Your follower could then either add debt or enforce deals on you as result, saying something like "If i have to do all the combat work alone i deserve a higher wage" or after you get bound in some toys "This way you are more useful in combat, serving as eye candy distraction for our enemies at last instead of hurting me with your incompetent use of magic".

[MrDP]

Is anyone else getting a bug where you can't see how much you owe your follower, I can still pay it back and it's being tracked but when I ask it just tells me my willpower message and I can't see it the menu. I'm playing with chaos mode on with hidden values and this tends to happen after about 4 days of having a follower. 

 

Also this is easily in my top 5 mods for Skyrim and I was wondering if there was anyway I can support the creator (tip jar or Kofi)? 

 

[Lozeak]

15 minutes ago, MrDP said:

Is anyone else getting a bug where you can't see how much you owe your follower, I can still pay it back and it's being tracked but when I ask it just tells me my willpower message and I can't see it the menu. I'm playing with chaos mode on with hidden values and this tends to happen after about 4 days of having a follower. 

 

Also this is easily in my top 5 mods for Skyrim and I was wondering if there was anyway I can support the creator (tip jar or Kofi)? 

 

 

Thank you for the feedback and kind words :D.

 

So if your lives reach 0, you debt should be concealed until you rest. This should be indicated with a message say I need rest only. I'll check if the msg is showing.

 

(if this is not the case let me know)

 

Basically, it's intended so that you don't know if your over debt or under and by how much and with the miscounting thing the may have to gamble they've paid enough or waste gold to make sure.

 

I have a Patreon (in sig).

[Lozeak]

17 hours ago, bathoz said:

Just a note, as after reading about it, I went to check out DDBeta... there is no way in hell that average folks are going to be dealing with a githhub file source. Not saying everyone, but it'll be a reason not to use your mod.

 

Which is fine, I have a version 1.23a which is stable and well anything after that you risk bugs anyway. DD4.1 is feature frozen so they are ironing out bugs for release so the average person can just wait.

On my side of it, if I'm inspired to make something .... I'm gonna make it basically.

Remember, I mod as a hobby and I made this mod for myself first lol.

I share the mod because people enjoy and i get good feedback to fix/improve it and in return I bug fix and help people use my mod.

 

 

9 hours ago, xboronx said:

Small idea for another way to generate sudden debt spikes:

 

Follower gets mad at you if you frequently fail at combat with the result that your follower gets knocked out/raped. The mod deviously enslaved has a setting in it which checks if you accidently hit your follower in combat. After that your follower complains with a force greet. So far i could chose the apology answer, but i think if you do it too often something bad will happen.

 

So if it is easy to check if your follower is in bleedout stage due to combat or gets raped (because losing a combat and thus getting raped alongside the player via DCL/Defeat/similiar mods) this would be a good way to add some response afterwards by your follower.

Your follower could then either add debt or enforce deals on you as result, saying something like "If i have to do all the combat work alone i deserve a higher wage" or after you get bound in some toys "This way you are more useful in combat, serving as eye candy distraction for our enemies at last instead of hurting me with your incompetent use of magic".

 

When your follower is knocked down they lose a life, if they are at 0 lifes they add debt silently (there is a chance you get a notification). It also means you need to rest more and build more debt. There is a function to see if the follower was raped and they will lose a life (you need to enable this in MCM) but some mods don't flag follower as victim in there content so it won't always work.

 

As for player hitting follower. For now, I'm gonna avoid this because magic hits players like a machine gun and swords every so often and their are werid thing that can go on so I'd rather not bother.

 

10 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

You can come at this mod a bunch of different ways.

 

Right now, I have DF in my LO, but I keep thinking, if I hire a follower, they'll just leech all my cash and probably enslave me. I'm fine without one for now.

 

I don't want to just do what I did last game and set it up so followers are the main way to get released from DCL. I've done that. I want to try something different.

 

 

I don't like a certain aspect of this mod, which is that it can easily push you to pay a lot of attention to loot and vendors, which can get tedious.

 

So, to avoid that, I think (for now) in this game, I'm going to set my follower costs low, so the follower really isn't much of an expense, and I can even fast travel if I want without finding out that I'm enslaved at the end of the trip (which happens - you don't get a chance to take a deal, you just get enslaved).

 

I'll just let it run like that and see if maybe I end up in a situation where I am broke somehow and have to take a deal.

Or... If I can upgrade my install, maybe I'll end up enslaved via SS ...

 

 

This made me think, it would be handy if you could take deals to restore follower lives.

e.g. You're in the dungeon, follower is cranky and wants to go home. No problem, do a deal, follower cheers up, and you can continue fighting.

I set lives fairly low, was at 3 by the end of the last game. At the default they pretty much never run out.

 

 

Is it possible to safely upgrade from 1.35b to the latest, assuming you have no follower?

 

Agree. The chain goes crazy too often, and never really looks good. Probably because of my HDT rates, but it seems like it was built for a crawling character, and you don't seem to crawl in DF. I had some similar gripes about SLAV items ... and yet HDT pony tail is fine.

Deal for lives is something I'll consider.

Deal for keys I'll consider.

 

So based on feedback I've come to the conclusion the follower needs to provide keys in a consistent way (I have a fun idea for it) it will give the player a random set of keys once per rest for a cost ^^. - I think this is what I'll add next.

 

Next thing after that is a tidy up of SS function with a way to preselect your Slaver

Then, a way to add a faction to followers you want DF to ignore.

[valcon767]

11 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

 

Is it possible to safely upgrade from 1.35b to the latest, assuming you have no follower?

 

i did upgrade from 1.35b to latest recently without problems and at start i had a follower (YMMV). what i did was:

 

1 - travel to player home (which was previously set to Followers default location by MHIYH).

2 - paid off follower

3 - dismissed follower

4 - accessed Devious Follower MCM and noted current Willpower and Resist stats (so i could set them back to it later)

5 - checked and verified i was not wearing any DD items

6 - reset mod

7 - made a hard save (in a new slot)

8 - exited to desktop 

9 - removed old version of mod (i use MO btw)

10 - installed new version of mod in the exact same spot

11 - entered game and loaded save made in step 7

12 - waited until after notification of new MCM being loaded, then just to be safe give it 2 rl minutes more

13 - made a new hard save

14 - loaded save made in step 13

15 - reset mod by MCM again

16 - used console to set Willpower and Resist back to what they were at step 4

17 - played game with no problems noted yet (you do have to turn of Blocking Dialogue setting in the debug page though).

 

[Wyrade]

Might not be the best place to ask, but:

 

Where can I find a list of changes between DD 4.1 and 4.0?

I do know there is a DD Development/Beta thread with links to github repositories, which I do know how to download, but I didn't find any comprehensive list of features or the like on github or in that forum topic in an obvious place. Does such a list exist at all, or am I supposed to scour that topic for small posts with fragments of changes and ideas?

 

If there is no such list or the like, could someone please list some of the main changes so I can decide whether to switch to the development version right now or wait for a stable one?

 

Thanks!

[steelmagpie]

Oh well it was fun while it lasted...   Not quite as I had envisioned but could become consequencial to functionaliry of this mod, there seems to be a growing issue between Kimy (DD and DCL) and T'ara (ZAP8/8+). It seems to revolve around the use of furnitures in futures DD packs.. Without taking sides on the issues I can see the consequences of the two mods becoming incompatible with each other in the future..  At the moment this is only a possibility but it will probably be worth keeping a close watch on developements as it may well affect not only this but many other mods functionality.. 

[Lozeak]

2 hours ago, Wyrade said:

Might not be the best place to ask, but:

 

Where can I find a list of changes between DD 4.1 and 4.0?

I do know there is a DD Development/Beta thread with links to github repositories, which I do know how to download, but I didn't find any comprehensive list of features or the like on github or in that forum topic in an obvious place. Does such a list exist at all, or am I supposed to scour that topic for small posts with fragments of changes and ideas?

 

If there is no such list or the like, could someone please list some of the main changes so I can decide whether to switch to the development version right now or wait for a stable one?

 

Thanks!

 

It's probably in the github somewhere and it is in the post if you follow it, like atm just wait unless you have content that uses it (mine works with 4.0 and there is nothing to miss)

 

 

43 minutes ago, steelmagpie said:

Oh well it was fun while it lasted...   Not quite as I had envisioned but could become consequencial to functionaliry of this mod, there seems to be a growing issue between Kimy (DD and DCL) and T'ara (ZAP8/8+). It seems to revolve around the use of furnitures in futures DD packs.. Without taking sides on the issues I can see the consequences of the two mods becoming incompatible with each other in the future..  At the moment this is only a possibility but it will probably be worth keeping a close watch on developements as it may well affect not only this but many other mods functionality.. 

 

From what I can tell....

Basically Zap was abandoned so DD decides to drop it as a requirement (good choice)

This ment some mods couldn't detect DD restraints meaning some mod become unusable with DD4

For old mods that is kinda sad but you can still just get DD3 and use them but thinking DD should add cool new devices because they don't support there mod is backward

Newer mod should just make DD a requirement (I do not get the argument of having Zap as a requirement but not having DD as requirement)

 

For my mods DF won't use Zap

DW will for bondage funiture only 

If Zap makes it self 100% incompatible with all DDs then I'll just not use it.

Atm, Zap furniture does work fine with all but heavybondage and I can error catch.

 

As for sides there aren't any DD can do what it wants and Zap what it wants. If people don't think that just download the old versions because the new ones wouldn't exsist without peoples effort.

[Fruktoza]

Hey. Mod destroys quest  "A Daedra's Best Friend", namely: after cleanup the cave of vampires, when you activate the statue of Сlavicus Vile - stable flight (there is an Devious Sputnik). When you disable the mod - everything is fine.

[Corsayr]

10 hours ago, Fruktoza said:

Hey. Mod destroys quest  "A Daedra's Best Friend", namely: after cleanup the cave of vampires, when you activate the statue of Сlavicus Vile - stable flight (there is an Devious Sputnik). When you disable the mod - everything is fine.

known issue, the Augur in the College of Winterhold has the same error. 

 

 

[Lozeak]

So yea another update!!!!!!

 

Now there is a way to get keys from your follower and it's super devious . I know some of you will enjoy this!

[CGi]

@Lozeak What exactly is experimental about the last 2 versions?
i treat experimental like an alpha version hence why there's no translation for them.

[Lozeak]

Basically, it's not using (as much) blocking dialog so it's likly fine but I want feedback and to know if anything is broken (unlikly). 

 

The benefit if it does work the compatibly with other mods will be amazing  if it doesn't /shrug.

 

If there are no problems found in a few days I'll tidy it up a little and move forward.

[El_Duderino]

3 hours ago, Lozeak said:

5 hours ago, Wyrade said:

Might not be the best place to ask, but:

 

Where can I find a list of changes between DD 4.1 and 4.0?

I do know there is a DD Development/Beta thread with links to github repositories, which I do know how to download, but I didn't find any comprehensive list of features (...)

It's probably in the github somewhere and it is in the post if you follow it, like atm just wait unless you have content that uses it (mine works with 4.0 and there is nothing to miss)

Hi,

 

I don't think there is a proper changelog (yet) for DD 4.1, though with some (well, a lot) of patience you can find new additions by looking through the announcements in the DD beta thread here on LL. There have been numerous new beta builds since DD4.0 went live, each with bugfixes and/or new items added.

 

Some key additions are:

- petsuit with new alternate animnation set (crawl on your knees & elbows)

- many new rope bondage items

- transparent rubber items

- new struggle animations for several devices

- new pony walk (high stepping) alternate animation set

- sounds for rubber catsuits/dresses and gasmasks

- changed MCM with now three difficulty sliders to tinker around with
- and more...

[CGi]

8 minutes ago, Lozeak said:

If there are no problems found in a few days I'll tidy it up a little and move forward.

in this case i'll wait for the upcoming non-experimental release.

[BigOnes69]

1 hour ago, Lozeak said:

Basically, it's not using (as much) blocking dialog so it's likly fine but I want feedback and to know if anything is broken (unlikly). 

 

The benefit if it does work the compatibly with other mods will be amazing  if it doesn't /shrug.

 

If there are no problems found in a few days I'll tidy it up a little and move forward.

I really like what you did with the conversations putting them in one location. Good job.

[Lupine00]

8 hours ago, Lozeak said:

(I have a fun idea for it) it will give the player a random set of keys once per rest for a cost ^^. - I think this is what I'll add next.

 

Random key handouts is what DCL does. Yes, there's "Prefer useful keys" but it's never worked, and often denies you the exact keys you need completely.

 

The key percentages in DCL are one of the less effective parts of it. People ask for it, people expect it, but it's very cumbersome to adjust it to get what you want out of it, and it simply can't deliver complex or interesting scenarios. The only choices I ever use are the equivalent of NEVER, RARELY, and LOTS. DD is trying to edge away from keys as a core mechanic anyway.

 

As for the key-holder feature, it's had a lot of problems, often leaving players with no recourse but FREE ME!!!, because it stole a quest (restraint) key. Please, don't go down that particular path. I've never used keyholder, and will never use it, because it's a mass of problematic unforeseen consequences.

 

 

I see a strong case for fixing the "exploit" where you give the follower keys to look after, so they can't be stolen...

But followers don't need to hand out keys, followers already remove items directly. Why would you want keys?

 

IMHO, followers just need a way to remove rare key items for a much higher price - and perhaps only in restricted locations, such as inns.

[Lupine00]

3 hours ago, El_Duderino said:

I don't think there is a proper changelog (yet) for DD 4.1, though with some (well, a lot) of patience you can find new additions by looking through the announcements in the DD beta thread here on LL. There have been numerous new beta builds since DD4.0 went live, each with bugfixes and/or new items added.

When I looked at the DD? githubs, neither the master, nor the development branch seemed to have any/many commits since Christmas, worth mentioning.

Am I looking at the wrong githubs?

 

Let me clarify... In the development branches, DDa hasn't been touched in two years. Fair enough.

DDi has basically one commit "Fixed borked array length check" and DDx has three, but they are all "Improved robe binders!"

The master branches are even more barren, with nothing for 5+ months.

 

I can't see anything like the 4.1 features here, so where are they all?

[Lupine00]

8 hours ago, valcon767 said:

1 - travel to player home (which was previously set to Followers default location by MHIYH).

2 - paid off follower

3 - dismissed follower

4 - accessed Devious Follower MCM and noted current Willpower and Resist stats (so i could set them back to it later)

5 - checked and verified i was not wearing any DD items

6 - reset mod

7 - made a hard save (in a new slot)

8 - exited to desktop 

9 - removed old version of mod (i use MO btw)

10 - installed new version of mod in the exact same spot

11 - entered game and loaded save made in step 7

12 - waited until after notification of new MCM being loaded, then just to be safe give it 2 rl minutes more

13 - made a new hard save

14 - loaded save made in step 13

15 - reset mod by MCM again

So, you did this without a clean save? Just a swap-in-place...

 

It sounds a bit risky. I'm not sure whether to clean save or not now.