Submissive Lola: The Resubmission LE/SE

[Hex Bolt]

Some players appreciate the power of suggestion; others do not.  That's okay, but very literal-minded players are likely to be disappointed with a fantasy mod like this one.

[lcewolf]

Hello @HexBolt8,

 

Year after year i must say i still enjoy playing with the mod you make.

Over the time.I have play and even edited your version for my personnal taste and use.

Let me show you some exemple. If you are interrested. They are not request or suggestion. You could use it if you want or not i don't mind.

Spoiler

I made various change over the time. I wanted to make the Pc more polite and submissive.

At vkjsubmissionscore to 50 when my pc has the nudity rule.

 

vkjArmorRestrictionWearArmor

About the clothing rule. Please I beg you, could-you reconsider it and allow me to wear clothes in those areas you told me not to?

 

I add various answer depending of the situation and block some. I change the condition for going back to normal. The Setpoint was at 50 I change it for 0.

When your PC is a slave with the forever option. You master never allow you to step back.

 

In my case when she is fully naked and the condition «keptforever» She/he has a special text:

 

-No! They are off limit for you. Slaves like you stay naked it's help them to remember their place.

-Don't get any illusion. This is a permanent rule. There is no come back. You will be fully nude for the rest of your live.

 

Add another answer for variety

 

-No like I have already told you! Listen Slave you are not now or ever allow to wear anything! Get use to this. It's your place in the natural order.

-That's how your life should always have been and the opposite has always been abnormal and unnatural.

-If you don't want to be cover of whipmark you will drop the matter.

 

I did add other answer when the option Keptforever is not selected.

 

vkjArmorRestrictionCheck1 (XXX4b66E)

-I don't want you wearing clothing.  From now on I expect you to remain nude at all times.

-Until now you have live in a lie. You have always be a slave but you didn't know it.

-My pet, no more denial, deception or foolish idea about your role. I will not let you step back. It’s time to embrace who you really are and accept your reality.

-It won't change and you will remain completely nude. You are forbidden to wear anything ever again. This is not temporary but permanently.

-It doesn't matter if we are in a public square full of strangers or a dangerous dungeon.  My slave should be naked.  You'd better get used to that.

 

Since i modify your mod all the time i was wondering the reason why you did it like this in the first place.

 

When we get at Vkjsubmissionscore to 50 depending of your choice you can be fully nude at all time

( Personnally it's the one i pick ) or other option. My question is why your Master/Mistress when you go

under 50 he can let you go back to normal? It's kind of a «big step forward» If we can call it like this and you can nearly immediatly return back to normal.

 

Personnally i always change this for 0 but i was wondering why you set it at 50 in the first place?

After all the Mistress/Master want you to shape you the way he/she want. It give no time for adaptation.

Personnally it think if i was at the place of the PC i would resist. (Put a nudity rule) It remove all illusion about what he/she are. He/She cannot hide anymore and personnally i would panic.

 

If i can sugest you maybe you could add in the section About be your slave. An option where the PC panic when the nudity rule at 50 is in effect. It's more intense step and probably

one of the most difficult step to do for the PC. If you need suggestion i could make few if you are interrested.

Edited April 28, 2023 by lcewolf

[Hex Bolt]

2 hours ago, lcewolf said:

Year after year i must say i still enjoy playing with the mod you make.

That's great!

 

1 hour ago, lcewolf said:

... fully nude at all time ( Personnally it's the one i pick )

There's nothing wrong with that, but you do miss out on events where Lola is stripped or ordered to perform a task naked.  When clothing is permanently removed, you don't get to experience having it taken away at the owner's whim.

 

47 minutes ago, lcewolf said:

When we get at Vkjsubmissionscore to 50 depending of your choice you can be fully nude at all time....  My question is why your Master/Mistress when you go under 50 he can let you go back to normal?

All of the content that has a score requirement works that way.  The owner gives Lola more challenging things to do when she's ready; her readiness is determined by her score.  For a considerate owner, readiness might be what the owner thinks Lola can handle.  For a harsher owner, readiness might be the level of Lola's slave training that lets her obey more difficult orders without balking.

 

Whether it's a coach training an athlete or a trainer working with horses, it does no good to push the trainee too hard and then resort to punishment when the trainee fails.  The trainer just looks incompetent.

 

1 hour ago, lcewolf said:

He/She cannot hide anymore and personnally i would panic.

The owner will want to avoid that.  People might fault a misbehaving slave to some degree, but the owner gets most of the blame.  If the owner has to punish Lola in public, the owner looks bad.  If it happens enough that the owner looks weak, someone might decide that the owner should be wearing a collar.

 

So, if Lola's readiness takes a step backwards, the challenges are reduced.  However, if Lola's gold share is determined by her score, she has a good reason to improve.

 

At the Very Submissive level, a high degree of readiness, Lola can no longer even ask to wear clothes in prohibited areas.

 

1 hour ago, lcewolf said:

Personnally i always change this for 0 but i was wondering why you set it at 50 in the first place?

To allow Lola to become ready for nakedness (for reasons discussed just above) and to provide a sense of progression, gradually having harder rules & restrictions.

 

2 hours ago, lcewolf said:

An option where the PC panic when the nudity rule at 50 is in effect. It's more intense step and probably one of the most difficult step to do for the PC.

That's a good idea, though it would have to be based on the rule setting, since only having to be naked inside the home is not very scary.

[lcewolf]

3 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

 

Thank you for a very complete answer.

 

It's help me to understand better. I didn't see submission score as a readiness point before you explain it.

I will now use your feature about gold share. Thank you for this suggestion.

 

My PC start her submission for gold.

 

I do play with a strict owner and I always see the nudity rule like a point of No Return close to a final step. But you are right be naked at home it not very scary.

3 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

There's nothing wrong with that, but you do miss out on events where Lola is stripped or ordered to perform a task naked.  When clothing is permanently removed, you don't get to experience having it taken away at the owner's whim.

The way you talk i guess i miss few event staying naked most of the time.

 

But when you come in Solitude or any capital city completly naked. The level of shame and humiliation is so high and scary.

A playfull owner will do that eventually to corrupt the PC and make your PC aroused.

A strict owner don't care about how willing you are. He own you and he will impose his/her will. He will impose constant remember of his power over you. The collar is an important step. But i can be hide it can be discrete. A butt plug is not for excitement but breaking your will. You cannot ignore it or forget is presence when you walk around.Be naked is so mush worse.

 

3 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

Whether it's a coach training an athlete or a trainer working with horses, it does no good to push the trainee too hard and then resort to punishment when the trainee fails.  The trainer just looks incompetent.

 

In town there is few person but in capital city there is so many people. Every set of eyes look at your naked body juging you. People will touch you, insult you, fuck and even rape you (Depending of your mod list). Before the score at 50. Your owner play with you(Playfull) or try to break you (Strict), The PC know he/she will get is clothing eventually. Hope make the PC tolerating without panicking because he/she know it will end eventually. She/He won't panic but will tolerate it.

 

3 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

For a harsher owner, readiness might be the level of Lola's slave training that lets her obey more difficult orders without balking.

This rule strip your PC from that hope.(The way i see it) Even if your (Playfull) Master/Mistress allow you to hide your body part with your hand and Strict one won't. It strip you from your humanity. Your former status is a mirage. You can see important people well clothed, regular and even beggard with clothing.

You are no longer at the same status as everyone. Animal have better right then you. You are a pet and you have pass a point of no return. It's why i think i will panic and go beg my owner to let me have this hope.

 

The PC must mourn all her rights and status, which are now inaccessible to her, and move on.

 

Edited April 29, 2023 by lcewolf

[Hex Bolt]

1 hour ago, lcewolf said:

The way you talk i guess i miss few event staying naked most of the time.

Yes.  The Whiterun walk is not much of an event if you're already naked.  But if you suddenly have to strip naked in front of an entire town, it's a big deal.

 

1 hour ago, lcewolf said:

The PC must mourn all her rights and status, which are now inaccessible to her, and move on.

Which is more difficult, to be naked all the time, or to be allowed clothes sometimes, then suddenly have to be naked at your owner's whim?  If you have no hope of keeping your dignity, you accept that.  But if your ability to wear clothes is taken away whenever it pleases the owner, you experience the loss over and over.  It's true for the human player too.  If your character is always naked, after a while you become desensitized; it's just normal.  If the owner says, "This time I want you to do it naked", that has no meaning if "this time" is every time.

 

I'm not telling anyone how to play.  The setting to always be naked exists to be used.  But I am offering a different perspective, some things to think about.

[Hex Bolt]

Players who use vampire owners

 

I'm looking at making a modest expansion of the feeding dialog.

 

"It's feeding time.  I need your blood, slave." seems fine as the one starting line, just as other events like "dance for me" only have one starting line.  However, if someone has a really good suggestion for an alternate, I could probably fit that in.

 

Like some of the other events, feeding will have a standard agreement ("Of course, Master") plus an enthusiastic one that I haven't yet written (suggestions?).  For simplicity, I'm hoping to avoid different responses for mortal and vampiric Lolas, unless someone has something really good.

 

The main place where I'd like to add a few new lines is the owner's final line.  "Such a tasty one" is from the original mod.  I'm guessing it's fine to keep that one.  I could use suggestions for the new alternate last lines.  They might vary between the standard and enthusiastic responses, or not.

[dnoah]

Well, I don't have anything "really good", but -

 

Starter's fine, but the first phrase is a bit redundant, IMO. Something like "I need your blood, slave. Now." would work better. For "strict" personality, at least. Playful could use, dunno, something like "I'll have some of that delicious blood of yours, now". "That really hit the spot" could be an alternate goodbye for enthusiastic; normal could be dismissive, something like "Off you go, now.", or "That'll suffice. For now"; or reprimanding, "Being chosen to sate me is an honor. You'd do well to remember that next time, slave". Maybe it's too cringe, not sure (not an English speaker): "A bit salty today, are we? How about a little more devotion, next time?"

[dnoah]

A little suggestion concerning vampires, btw: how about increasing the upper bound for feeding cooldown? IMO, it's reasonable to assume that vampires wouldn't want to use the same source of blood all the time, if only for variety's sake.

[Jappa123]

Careless Hands still end a few seconds after it started for me  

[just_Gina]

2 hours ago, dnoah said:

A little suggestion concerning vampires, btw: how about increasing the upper bound for feeding cooldown? IMO, it's reasonable to assume that vampires wouldn't want to use the same source of blood all the time, if only for variety's sake.

Gives me an idea... Vampire master sends you for different food items to change the taste of your blood; sweet rolls for sweeter, spiced wine, etc...

 

For slave's response to feeding time "Please don't take so much this time!", "Last time left me so weak i could hardly move for hours.", or how about that old reliable

from R.P., "Please be gentle." Then there's " i live to serve you, Master.", or "As you desire Master, it is my pleasure to serve you."

 

 

 

[Hex Bolt]

5 hours ago, Jappa123 said:

Careless Hands still end a few seconds after it started for me

The mechanism that was inadvertently causing the early termination is completely removed in the latest version.  If it happens again, open the console and check the message there that states the punishment duration.

[Hex Bolt]

6 hours ago, dnoah said:

A little suggestion concerning vampires, btw: how about increasing the upper bound for feeding cooldown? IMO, it's reasonable to assume that vampires wouldn't want to use the same source of blood all the time, if only for variety's sake.

I'll increase the limit from 24 hours to 100.

[Jappa123]

1 hour ago, HexBolt8 said:

The mechanism that was inadvertently causing the early termination is completely removed in the latest version.  If it happens again, open the console and check the message there that states the punishment duration.

it says 0 hours, although I start quest through console, never get this quest during gameplay I've tried to attack master many times and never worked for me. Any guide how to fix it?

[trellouk]

15 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

Players who use vampire owners

 

I'm looking at making a modest expansion of the feeding dialog.

 

"It's feeding time.  I need your blood, slave." seems fine as the one starting line, just as other events like "dance for me" only have one starting line.  However, if someone has a really good suggestion for an alternate, I could probably fit that in.

 

Like some of the other events, feeding will have a standard agreement ("Of course, Master") plus an enthusiastic one that I haven't yet written (suggestions?).  For simplicity, I'm hoping to avoid different responses for mortal and vampiric Lolas, unless someone has something really good.

 

The main place where I'd like to add a few new lines is the owner's final line.  "Such a tasty one" is from the original mod.  I'm guessing it's fine to keep that one.  I could use suggestions for the new alternate last lines.  They might vary between the standard and enthusiastic responses, or not.

 

Do most vampire feeding animations use the classic "vampire feeding from the neck"?

How about "I hunger, present your neck slave".

 

On another note i like Icewolf's idea of the player character panicking when asked to stop wearing clothing.

 

 

[Hex Bolt]

17 minutes ago, Jappa123 said:

never get this quest during gameplay I've tried to attack master many times and never worked for me.

If you're using a game setting, follower framework setting, or mod that prevents friendly fire, this event won't trigger.  It detects hits on the owner, so if you're using something that prevents that, there's nothing to detect.

 

20 minutes ago, Jappa123 said:

it says 0 hours, although I start quest through console...

That's not a valid way to test the event.  If you just start the quest through the console, the punishment duration will be zero, so it will end right away.  No offense, but if you're testing a feature artificially, it's really important to say that.  I could have avoided spending part of my day trying to reproduce a problem that doesn't exist.

[Antiope_Apollonia]

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

"It's feeding time.  I need your blood, slave." seems fine as the one starting line, just as other events like "dance for me" only have one starting line. 

I know it's not completely apples-to-apples since all SLTR users experience events like dancing, and only a subset thereof experience vampire content.  But for players who are playing the content, I would say that this particular event is a lot more significant than things like dancing, so you really notice the repetition a lot more.  Dancing has variety in that it's one of many little things you might do for Mistress, but feeding is much more central—rather than being just one of many minor events, it effectively defines the relationship—and depending on one's settings, probably a fair bit more frequent, too.  These dialogues are a cornerstone of the vampire Mistress experience—all the more so if my dream of a little pre-feeding collar/cuff-removal ritual becomes reality.

 

I can say from experience that, after one long playthrough with a vampire Mistress, I was way more fatigued with that particular dialogue—and the corresponding, "Such a tasty one"—than I have ever been with anything in SLTR.  Although I loved the experience of playing with a vampire overall—more than I expected to, honestly—if I hadn't had an unplanned half-year hiatus, I would have declined to use a vampire Mistress in my next playthrough solely to recover from burnout on that dialogue. 

 

But I don't think you need to be super ambitious here.  A little bit will go a long way.  

 

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

However, if someone has a really good suggestion for an alternate, I could probably fit that in.

• Come, Lola!  Your Mistress is hungry.
• Let's get that collar off, Lola.  It's time for me to eat. / Let's get those cuffs off, Lola.  It's time for me to eat.
• You could also do something conditioned on time of day, which could be cool.  e.g., Breakfast time!  Bring me that pretty neck, slave.
• Come, Snack!  It's feeding time!
  • Could be a fun idea for a vampire Mistress to use "Snack" as a pet name for Lola, not just here, but sprinkled in throughout the mod's dialogue.
• I'll make configuration files for @Herowynne's animations and for Sexual Vampire Feeding to add Neck and Wrist tags and share them.  With that, you can also call specific animations and tweak the dialogue accordingly.  e.g., Feeding time!  Come present your neck for me, slave, or .  (If you go this route, keep in mind that, if I recall correctly, there's more variety for neck animations than for wrist.)

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

Like some of the other events, feeding will have a standard agreement ("Of course, Master") plus an enthusiastic one that I haven't yet written (suggestions?). 

Hmm.  Tough one.  Perhaps, It's such an honour to nourish You, Mistress?  

 

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

The main place where I'd like to add a few new lines is the owner's final line.  "Such a tasty one" is from the original mod.  I'm guessing it's fine to keep that one. 

It's fine, although it might be better with a bit of a tweak to make it feel more communicative and less like Mistress's internal monologue.  Maybe something along the lines of, "You're such a tasty one, Lola," or "Mmmm!  You're such a tasty one!"

 

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

I could use suggestions for the new alternate last lines.

• You're so delicious, pet.
• You're a lovely meal, Lola.
• Mmmm!  What a yummy slave I have!
• You know you're my favourite snack, Lola.  Maybe, once kept forever, alternatively, You know you'll always be my favourite snack, Lola. 
  • Just as a general observation, I think it'd be neat to have more little acknowledgements of your kept forever status sprinkled throughout the mod's dialogue.
• Maybe some options only for higher scores:
  • Yum!  I love the taste of your devotion, Lola.
  • Yum!  Your submission makes your blood so much sweeter, Lola.
• Correspondingly, it'd be neat if, at low scores, to foreshadow that one, you did something along the lines of, Meh.  Well, you'll taste better once I've broken you of your wilful ways.  Would have to be used sparingly, though, or it could wear out its welcome rather quickly; I think you can give individual dialogue lines a cooldown, right?  It'd probably need at least a couple days.
  • You could additionally have something simpler that wouldn't need the cooldown like, Meh.  Well, at least I'm not hungry anymore.
  • You could even have one for negative scores like, Yuck!  I can taste your disobedience, Lola.  Disgusting!

21 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

They might vary between the standard and enthusiastic responses, or not.

Not sure what you mean here.  And aren't we talking about Mistress's lines, and isn't differentiating between standard and enthusiastic a Lola thing?  Or were you just referring to something like the high/low score responses I was talking about above?

Edited April 30, 2023 by Antiope_Apollonia

[Hex Bolt]

3 hours ago, Antiope_Apollonia said:

I think you can give individual dialogue lines a cooldown, right?

Skyrim's dialog cooldown setting only works for up to 23 game hours.  One could build a cooldown system to support longer times, of course, but that's overkill for this.

 

Thank you (and the others) for the suggestions.  I have enough material to make this conversation less repetitive.  I'd like to get the additions into the next update.  They can always be refined or expanded later.

 

3 hours ago, Antiope_Apollonia said:

Not sure what you mean here.  And aren't we talking about Mistress's lines, and isn't differentiating between standard and enthusiastic a Lola thing?

Yes, and yes.

[Antiope_Apollonia]

45 minutes ago, HexBolt8 said:

Thank you (and the others) for the suggestions.

Bien sûr, Monsieur.  

  

45 minutes ago, HexBolt8 said:

Skyrim's dialog cooldown setting only works for up to 23 game hours.  One could build a cooldown system to support longer times, of course, but that's overkill for this.

Unfortunate limitation.  Maybe set that one a one-time dialogue, then?  I would say 23 hours is too short a cooldown for that one unless the pool of possibilities is quite large to make repetition unlikely.  You can have dialogues that are in a randomised list flagged for non-repetition, right?

 

45 minutes ago, HexBolt8 said:

I have enough material to make this conversation less repetitive.  I'd like to get the additions into the next update.  They can always be refined or expanded later.

Can't wait to see what you come up with!

 

45 minutes ago, HexBolt8 said:

Yes, and yes.

So I'm well confused, then.  Or wait, was the second "yes" referring to the part that you cut from the quote?

Edited April 30, 2023 by Antiope_Apollonia

[CaptainJ03]

12 hours ago, Jappa123 said:

(careless hands)

never get this quest during gameplay I've tried to attack master many times and never worked for me. Any guide how to fix it?

Hexbolt already answered this.

Another from experience: I found it difficult to get this when attacking Mistress with a sword, because you need to hit her twice during a short timespan. Using fire always worked, it seems to count hits differently.

[Antiope_Apollonia]

11 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Another from experience: I found it difficult to get this when attacking Mistress with a sword, because you need to hit her twice during a short timespan. Using fire always worked, it seems to count hits differently.

I think the time window is supposed to be like half a minute, no?

 

I've always had the opposite problem.  I usually use bound weapon spells with the Ordinator perk tree, which includes a DoT-on-hit effect.  So if I hit Mistress once, the DoT will get me punished every time, even if I immediately heal her.

[Jappa123]

7 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Hexbolt already answered this.

Another from experience: I found it difficult to get this when attacking Mistress with a sword, because you need to hit her twice during a short timespan. Using fire always worked, it seems to count hits differently.

Hmm tried with fire and nothing worked  friendly fire detection in Deviously Enslaved work always but never in lola.. kinda out of ideas how to fix it

[Talesien]

9 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Using fire always worked, it seems to count hits differently.

Probably two things that might cause this. One is continuing spells like the basic flames pulse, so it's technically a hit every second or so (whatever the pulsing rate is). Second there is the DoT part, fire keeps burning for a few seconds again basically causing a hit every second or so. I'm not 100% certain the game counts the DoT effect as something done by the original caster, but I wouldn't be surprised if it does. Easy to test though, use a fireball or similar one hit fire effect, if that triggers it, then the DoT part counts, otherwise it likely does not.

[Hex Bolt]

14 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

I found it difficult to get this when attacking Mistress with a sword, because you need to hit her twice during a short timespan. Using fire always worked, it seems to count hits differently.

The timespan is 30 seconds.  Two hits within that period count as one strike on the owner (the first one doesn't count).  Healing the owner wipes away the last hit.  Multiple hits within 30 seconds add up; 4 hits without any healing in between is 3 strikes.  The number of strikes determines the punishment period.

 

The process is intended to measure carelessness rather than simple unluckiness.  You're allowed one unpunished hit every half minute (for most types of combat, that's actually a pretty long time).  However, the process has to work with the game mechanisms, and it must not be too complex because script load should be kept light during combat.  Some hits can be an automatic strike because the game registers more than one hostile effect.  (This mod tries to ignore multiple effects from the same hit, but that might not always be effective.)  A hit with an enchanted weapon applies damage twice.  Battle Cry has 3 hostile effects:  voice, explosion, and stagger (although this mod ignores stagger as an "attack").

Edited April 30, 2023 by HexBolt8

[Lenore]

2 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

The timespan is 30 seconds.  Two hits within that period count as one strike on the owner (the first one doesn't count).  Healing the owner wipes away the last hit.  Multiple hits within 30 seconds add up; 4 hits without any healing in between is 3 strikes.  The number of strikes determines the punishment period.

 

The process is intended to measure carelessness rather than simple unluckiness.  You're allowed one unpunished hit every half minute (for most types of combat, that's actually a pretty long time).  However, the process has to work with the game mechanisms, and it must not be too complex because script load should be kept light during combat.  Some hits are an automatic strike because the game registers more than one hostile effect.  A hit with an enchanted weapon applies damage twice, and Battle Cry has 3 hostile effects:  voice, explosion, and stagger.

 

That didn't work for me either, or nothing happens when I hit them twice or more, within 30 seconds. What actually is supposed to happen? Everything else with the mod works great. To be honest, I like the rest of the mod so much, I just don't care that this tiny part didn't do anything.

[Hex Bolt]

34 minutes ago, Lenore said:

That didn't work for me either, or nothing happens when I hit them twice or more, within 30 seconds.

As I mentioned earlier, if you have anything in your game that disables friendly fire, this feature can't work.

 

38 minutes ago, Lenore said:

What actually is supposed to happen?

Your hands will be bound.