Wartimes - a daughter's tale LE (Alternate start scenario)

[Will55]

1 hour ago, kapibar said:

Thank you for the detailed and interesting reply

 

@1 - Wartimes doesn't have anything to do with animal genitals, you have an issue with Creature Framework most probably.

 

It is not in SSE generally and another char did animals mansions plus with NO such problem while aroused creatures (mostly dogs and horses) humped every female in every city/town village of Skyrim for every run I have had of it once installed until I just locked it out

@2 - after the supply run father should remove the mask. If it's still on (failed removal happens from time to time) - there's a dialogue option that removes devices for favours.

Yes i noticed that he offered to do so when I asked once after i posted but the cost was far more than just favourite points so I reloaded..

@3 - if you have no fertility mod, then fuck yeah getting pregnant will be difficult. If you ever manage to be impregnated without a mod - let us know, it means Bethesda actually did something right for once.

 

I asked as pregnancy itself in game is no big deal as if you are not obsessed with body changes a child just needs to appear= end of pregnancy and my question was based upon the impression that the fertility mod was a soft addon and therefore unless you want body changes it should be possible. In F4 I have no body change mods and the children pour out.  So maybe Beth did learn.

@4 - you were a very cool person that day, so congrats. But all emotions aside - those guys didn't owe the girl anything. Sex does not equal any form of commitment, she certainly didn't see it that way. She had sex with some dudes of her own free will and she got the pleasure out of it. So did they. As far as I can tell, both parties got their fair share out of the deal and that's all there is to it. Any of them could drive her home, they chose not to - which is their right. You shouldn't feel bad about it and you shouldn't view these guys as immoral. They were uncool, sure, but did nothing strictly wrong. At least IMHO.

 

It is typical of many males. I see sex from a woman as a favour to be shared and a gift to be appreciated, not a right or rite of power as it is for so many. Most males with low esteem see a woman who screws them as inferior as if he is garbage then they must be worse to even bother coming near them. Then there is the hypocrisy point of: it is okay for me but not for you etc.' They stick objects up them, piss and spit on them, kick them out naked etc. and this IS not hearsay but observed fact.

No I wasn't "cool" I just felt for her and was disgusted with them and told her her to leave the area and move to a new city and begin afresh with no track record. IIRC she moved to and married  in the state capitol  and is now quite affluent. How do i know? she sent me a postcard of her children 10 years later with a thank you and my wife read it which made it "interesting".

 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by Will55

[kapibar]

@Will55

>It is not in SSE generally and another char did animals mansions plus with NO such problem

 

If I'm not mistaken, the framework is responsible for adding genitals to an animal NPC. Wartimes doesn't do that on its own, it requires creature sex framework to operate.

 

>Yes i noticed that he offered to do so when I asked once after i posted but the cost was far more than just favourite points so I reloaded

 

On default he should remove the hood after a supply run. You can actually hear item removal sound being played on attempt. It sometimes happens that unequipment is unsuccessful, my guess is that it happened to you. Just bad luck, mate.

 

>my question was based upon the impression that the fertility mod was a soft addon

 

It's not. Wartimes requires outside pregnancy mod, like Fertility Mode or Beeing Female.

 

>It is typical of many males.

 

I wouldn't say that, no. There are some shitty dudes that treat women like an object. But there are just as many crappy chicks, doing all sort of toxic shit. I think this is a cognitive error on your part - overexposure to a male company and halo effect projected on women in general.

 

>I see sex from a woman as a favour to be shared and a gift to be appreciated, not a right or rite of power as it is for so many.

 

I see sex as a mutual gift. Both sexes have something to offer each other, it's not like a woman gives a man something more valuable than he gives her.

 

>Most males with low esteem see a woman who screws them as inferior

 

I would say it's actually the opposite - guys with a low self esteem feel lucky they got laid. It's the pathological narcissits who tend to view women as inferior. At least in my experience. And this sentiment actually has some weight behind it. See, women tend to see men as less attractive than they actually are (there are studies that confirm this), so those dudes who are popular with women are usually very attractive. And the thing about chicks is that they prefer being a mistress to an extremely handsome man to being a sole love interest of average Joe. This is dictated by biology - more attractive male provides better genes, so so the prospect of giving birth to genetically superior offspring is more profitable in the short term than a relationship with a less valuable male.

 

>Then there is the hypocrisy point of: it is okay for me but not for you etc.'

 

Yes, well. This too can be easily explained by our biology. If a man procreates with a promiscuous woman there is no guarantee that the offspring will come from him. In Jewish nation, for example, ethnicity passes down exclusively from the mother. DNA testing is still a young invention, so fidelity is a premium in women. In men, on the other hand, the opposite is true - women assume that a man successful with ladies is more valuable (has a better set of genes), so rich sex life is an asset.

 

>They stick objects up them, piss and spit on them, kick them out naked etc.

 

If rough sex is an arrangement to which both parties agree - I don't see a problem. People have some weird kinks. Seeing as you're on LL it should come as no surprise to you.

 

>No I wasn't "cool" I just felt for her and was disgusted with them

 

Which was very cool of you. Accept it, be proud. You stood up for someone in a bad spot, that is a mighty decent thing to do.

 

>she moved to and married  in the state capitol

 

Good for her. We all did stupid crap when we were young, it's very good that she took this lesson to heart and turned her life around.

[lcewolf]

2 hours ago, Will55 said:

 

 

 

1 hour ago, kapibar said:

@Will55

>It is not in SSE generally and another char did animals mansions plus with NO such problem

 

If I'm not mistaken, the framework is responsible for adding genitals to an animal NPC. Wartimes doesn't do that on its own, it requires creature sex framework to operate.

 

>Yes i noticed that he offered to do so when I asked once after i posted but the cost was far more than just favourite points so I reloaded

 

On default he should remove the hood after a supply run. You can actually hear item removal sound being played on attempt. It sometimes happens that unequipment is unsuccessful, my guess is that it happened to you. Just bad luck, mate.

 

>my question was based upon the impression that the fertility mod was a soft addon

 

It's not. Wartimes requires outside pregnancy mod, like Fertility Mode or Beeing Female.

 

>It is typical of many males.

 

I wouldn't say that, no. There are some shitty dudes that treat women like an object. But there are just as many crappy chicks, doing all sort of toxic shit. I think this is a cognitive error on your part - overexposure to a male company and halo effect projected on women in general.

 

>I see sex from a woman as a favour to be shared and a gift to be appreciated, not a right or rite of power as it is for so many.

 

I see sex as a mutual gift. Both sexes have something to offer each other, it's not like a woman gives a man something more valuable than he gives her.

 

>Most males with low esteem see a woman who screws them as inferior

 

I would say it's actually the opposite - guys with a low self esteem feel lucky they got laid. It's the pathological narcissits who tend to view women as inferior. At least in my experience. And this sentiment actually has some weight behind it. See, women tend to see men as less attractive than they actually are (there are studies that confirm this), so those dudes who are popular with women are usually very attractive. And the thing about chicks is that they prefer being a mistress to an extremely handsome man to being a sole love interest of average Joe. This is dictated by biology - more attractive male provides better genes, so so the prospect of giving birth to genetically superior offspring is more profitable in the short term than a relationship with a less valuable male.

 

>Then there is the hypocrisy point of: it is okay for me but not for you etc.'

 

Yes, well. This too can be easily explained by our biology. If a man procreates with a promiscuous woman there is no guarantee that the offspring will come from him. In Jewish nation, for example, ethnicity passes down exclusively from the mother. DNA testing is still a young invention, so fidelity is a premium in women. In men, on the other hand, the opposite is true - women assume that a man successful with ladies is more valuable (has a better set of genes), so rich sex life is an asset.

 

>They stick objects up them, piss and spit on them, kick them out naked etc.

 

If rough sex is an arrangement to which both parties agree - I don't see a problem. People have some weird kinks. Seeing as you're on LL it should come as no surprise to you.

 

>No I wasn't "cool" I just felt for her and was disgusted with them

 

Which was very cool of you. Accept it, be proud. You stood up for someone in a bad spot, that is a mighty decent thing to do.

 

>she moved to and married  in the state capitol

 

Good for her. We all did stupid crap when we were young, it's very good that she took this lesson to heart and turned her life around.

 

Very good explain by @kapibar but i don't think it's the good place for that kind of discution or debate. 

 

My opinion.

[safado]

3 hours ago, Will55 said:

@1 - Wartimes doesn't have anything to do with animal genitals, you have an issue with Creature Framework most probably.

 

It is not in SSE generally and another char did animals mansions plus with NO such problem while aroused creatures (mostly dogs and horses) humped every female in every city/town village of Skyrim for every run I have had of it once installed until I just locked it out

 

Creature Framework is the one that replace normal creature meshes with custom version with genitals.  But it is a framework and do not have any meshes.  It use as a trigger for the change, the arousal(if mod installed) value defined in the MCM or the sexlab sex with creature event.

 

The meshes are normally packages in a different mod called More Nasty Critters (creatures).  MnC has custom skeletons for the creature's NPC, and it needs to overwrite XP32 Maximum Skeleton Extended ALWAYS.  There's enhancement to the skeleton from MnC called "Animals SOS" and "Animated Beast Cocks", these need to overwrite MnC Always, and it's need special care to combine them, better to choose only one.  I use ABC.

 

Your issue is likely a failure to protect MnC skeleton meshes from other mods.  Without the skeleton node added by MnC, that part of the mesh gets glitched.  Be aware that the framework replace normal original mesh (not aroused) with custom aroused mesh (dick attached).  If you have a custom creature mesh like a nice looking dog, it will be replaced by the aroused version available to the framework, likely from MnC unless you installed a patch for it. Use the CF MCM to disable or change behavior to the specific creature NPC you do not want replaced.

 

Skyrim SE: MnC and Creature Framework 3 in the download section.  Remember to let MnC overwrite everything else and nothing overwrite MnC unless it is an add-on.

 

 

3 hours ago, Will55 said:

@2 - after the supply run father should remove the mask. If it's still on (failed removal happens from time to time) - there's a dialogue option that removes devices for favours.

Yes i noticed that he offered to do so when I asked once after i posted but the cost was far more than just favourite points so I reloaded..

 

 

Because DD is a WIP, I always have the "Enable Lock Manipulation" enabled in DD MCM.  When Wartimes equips or tell you to equip a DD scripted devices like the Mask, the action will give you the option to do it unlocked (manipulated locks).  No problem removing it later.  You can also use the DD debug "Terminate DD quest", it will terminate the script that forced the device and remove it from the inventory.   Always create a save before trying an alternative method.

 

3 hours ago, Will55 said:

@3 - if you have no fertility mod, then fuck yeah getting pregnant will be difficult. If you ever manage to be impregnated without a mod - let us know, it means Bethesda actually did something right for once.

 

I asked as pregnancy itself in game is no big deal as if you are not obsessed with body changes a child just needs to appear= end of pregnancy and my question was based upon the impression that the fertility mod was a soft addon and therefore unless you want body changes it should be possible. In F4 I have no body change mods and the children pour out.  So maybe Beth did learn.

 

 

Monoman1 is using the Fertility mod framework to detect and track the preg state and if it is "Father's" baby.   (I think)

No framework, no option.    Morph body is for immersiveness, optional.

 

 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by safado

[kapibar]

8 hours ago, safado said:

CThe meshes are normally packages in a different mod called More Nasty Critters (creatures).

Thank you for this correction. I wasn't exactly sure about the source of meshes.

 

8 hours ago, lcewolf said:

i don't think it's the good place for that kind of discution or debate.

And you would be right, it's not. Fortunately, this little offtopic was included in a more on-topic discussion, so no harm done I guess.

[AlphaAndOmega]

Hello. I think I've broken something. The MCM is suddenly gone. I've started the game with it existing and can't find it now after several dozen hours. I've tried forcing mcm update via console but wartimes just does not come up along all others. I did rearrange the load order somewhere along the way, but I don't understand what was the trigger. Is putting the mod almost at the very end a good idea or is there a more elegant solution?

[kapibar]

43 minutes ago, AlphaAndOmega said:

I did rearrange the load order somewhere along the way

Here's your answer. You don't do that if you don't know what you're doing. Sorry, your save is fucked. The only thing you can do is to remove WT completely from your save and hope it won't fuck up everything at some point. My suggestion - restart the game.

[AlphaAndOmega]

4 minutes ago, kapibar said:

Here's your answer. You don't do that if you don't know what you're doing. Sorry, your save is fucked. The only thing you can do is to remove WT completely from your save and hope it won't fuck up everything at some point. My suggestion - restart the game.

Well, that's unfortunate. Guess I'll keep going without the mcm, everything else functions just fine. And there is console to change stuff.

[Monoman1]

5 hours ago, AlphaAndOmega said:

Hello. I think I've broken something. The MCM is suddenly gone. I've started the game with it existing and can't find it now after several dozen hours. I've tried forcing mcm update via console but wartimes just does not come up along all others. I did rearrange the load order somewhere along the way, but I don't understand what was the trigger. Is putting the mod almost at the very end a good idea or is there a more elegant solution?

If it were me I'd check the save in Falrim tools to see what I could see. I've never seen the Mcm disappearing myself. 

 

You could try StopQuest pchsWartimes, StartQuest pchsWartimes

but that will reset all script variables back to default and there's more than the mcm script attached to that quest.... (very risky)

[kapibar]

10 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

If it were me I'd check the save in Falrim tools to see what I could see. I've never seen the Mcm disappearing myself.

I've seen it. After few hours of gameplay I encountered multiple random CTD's, some stuff just wouldn't work and auto save took forever. So I'd say the save is fubar, fallrim might help only if you remove all WT scripts.

[Monoman1]

5 hours ago, kapibar said:

I've seen it. After few hours of gameplay I encountered multiple random CTD's, some stuff just wouldn't work and auto save took forever. So I'd say the save is fubar, fallrim might help only if you remove all WT scripts.

Right. But there's nothing to stop it happening again without investigative/corrective action...

Burying your head in the sand aint gonna help. 

[kapibar]

13 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Right. But there's nothing to stop it happening again without investigative/corrective action...

Burying your head in the sand aint gonna help. 

@AlphaAndOmega said it himself - he messed with the load order. Mid-game rearrengements are usually considered unsafe. Like I said - I did something very similar and broke my save in the process. Honestly, I don't know how we could help without knowing the load order before and after the changes, other than the usual set of advices (clean the save).

[kapibar]

@Monoman1 I've been braining about a key moment in the WT storyline, and I think you could spice it up a bit in the new version. I am referring to the first rape that PC experiences. This is the moment when any sane person would run as far away as possible and then go to the police. Meanwhile, in WT, it is simply an event like any other, and if it weren't for the information boxes, there would be nothing particularly groundbreaking about it. And it's a cool moment where certain threads can be pulled nicely. The idea is as follows - after the rape the PC gets a quest in which she has to tell what happened to a guard. As a result of the denunciation, she is escorted back home, her father thanks the guard for his help, and PC is locked in the basement for a re-education course. This would give the player a sense of the utter hopelessness of the situation, and in the process expand the father's influence.

Edited July 25, 2022 by kapibar

[Monoman1]

2 hours ago, kapibar said:

@Monoman1 I've been braining about a key moment in the WT storyline, and I think you could spice it up a bit in the new version. I am referring to the first rape that PC experiences. This is the moment when any sane person would run as far away as possible and then go to the police. Meanwhile, in WT, it is simply an event like any other, and if it weren't for the information boxes, there would be nothing particularly groundbreaking about it. And it's a cool moment where certain threads can be pulled nicely. The idea is as follows - after the rape the PC gets a quest in which she has to tell what happened to a guard. As a result of the denunciation, she is escorted back home, her father thanks the guard for his help, and PC is locked in the basement for a re-education course. This would give the player a sense of the utter hopelessness of the situation, and in the process expand the father's influence.

I wonder has anyone ever noticed that when you get a beating from father and go to a guard they have some extra dialogue...

 

I add little things like this some times and wonder if anyone will ever notice. 

[kapibar]

14 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

I wonder has anyone ever noticed that when you get a beating from father and go to a guard they have some extra dialogue...

 

I add little things like this some times and wonder if anyone will ever notice. 

Fuck, really?!? I had no idea about this ?. But then again, beating is not something extremely unusual, the game itself consists of combat mostly, so having your ass handed to you is not exactly something that would make you go cry to a guard.

I don't want to come off as an ass kisser, but I really appreciate your remarkable attention to the detail. This is the second time you've surprised me with such small things that someone else would have simply ignored, or done in a headlong way (first time was with the virginity check).

[lcewolf]

I think i find a bug with the se version.

I don't know if someone else want to test it but,

 

When i receive a beating my speed increase drasticly.

I can run like the Flash! In the magic effect It suppose to be -105 but i am running so fast since i receive the beating.

[Monoman1]

11 minutes ago, lcewolf said:

I think i find a bug with the se version.

I don't know if someone else want to test it but,

 

When i receive a beating my speed increase drasticly.

I can run like the Flash! In the magic effect It suppose to be -105 but i am running so fast since i receive the beating.

SLS Min AV?

Equip/Unequip something

Draw weapon/Sheathe weapon

[MalibuBattleBarbie]

12 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

I wonder has anyone ever noticed that when you get a beating from father and go to a guard they have some extra dialogue...

 

I add little things like this some times and wonder if anyone will ever notice. 

I thought it was a nice touch,  added more depth and color outside of the "home" cell. I came across it when I was checking my crime/bounty level with a guard, (Hey, wait, I know you.) and noticed the new dialog option.

[kapibar]

3 hours ago, tamai said:

 

i havent noticed honestly because i just dont like talking to the guards they're mean x_x

Correct! If you saw a crime - you saw nothing. AGAB.

[numen13]

On 7/25/2022 at 4:23 PM, Monoman1 said:

I wonder has anyone ever noticed that when you get a beating from father and go to a guard they have some extra dialogue...

 

I add little things like this some times and wonder if anyone will ever notice. 

I found it

It was a pleasent suprise

[Anrakis]

Thank you very much for this wonderful mod. It took me ages to discover it and what a pleasent surprise it was. I thought this is just another quick alternative start thing.... and now after countless hours I am still discovering new things. One of the best mods on loverslab and works great in SE. Thanks again!

[manafalls]

Personally, I'd love to see the whiterun market public scene with the dog followed up, next time with a horse.

 

Thanks for all the work on this!

[kapibar]

@Monoman1

A number of suggestions for consideration. Some functional, others purely aesthetic.

-> Vanilla dogs look rather pathetic. Aldo looks more like a flea bag than a defender of the household. I suggest changing him into something more exotic and dangerous - a very (very!) friendly Death Hound.

-> Since you've already introduced locking the door, I suggest going a step further. A 5h time limit outside the house. In addition (I don't know how complicated it would be), I propose that Aldo should follow the PC every time she leaves the house (for protection of course). He wouldn't be a follower, just a creepy stalker. If the 5h limit is exceeded - an information window pops up saying that Aldo has dragged you back home, in the process destroying your clothes. This would force the player to ask the father for a new outfit.

-> Regarding outfits. I propose that when handed a second (more revealing) dress, the player should have the option to refuse to wear it, which would result in the following dialogue:
- Father, I refuse to wear this outfit. It is too skimpy. What will people think?
- So you refuse to accept a generous gift from your own father?

 

At this instant, the father rips off PC's clothes (I think you even have the sound of ripping off clothes in Milk Addict) and takes away her clothing license.

 

- Since you don't want to dress scantily, you won't dress at all and will serve me like a naked pet. If you want to cover your body from lewd glances ever again, you will have to beg me for this skimpy dress.

 

At this point, the player will have a new dialogue option available - beg to get the clothes back (-5 favors):

 

- Father, I beg you to give me back my clothes.

- Kneel before me.

 

PC goes on all fours.

 

- So now you *want* to wear this skimpy outfit? To dress like a little slut? Say it. I want to hear it coming from your mouth.
- Yes, father. I... I want to dress like a little slut.
- Because that's what you are, daughter. Don't forget this lesson.
 

-> I'm testing DD 5.2 and noticed an interesting novelty - not every harness acts as a chastity belt. The slave harness allows penetration, meanwhile there is a separate chastity harness. This would allow adding another level of devices required by the father - slave harness normally, which for a breeding bitch would be changed to chastity harness.

-> Wearing the devices is actually a favour goldmine. I think it should be more 0/1. You either meet the requirements, which means +1 favour, or you don't. The same goes for fashion requirements. It's far too easy to farm favours this way.

-> Above level 50 submission I suggest that the father requirea the PC to wear blindfold at home. At this stage, she should know the household like the back of her hand, and it would represent another level of dependence on father's grace to remove the blindfold only when allowing the daughter to leave the house. Otherwise, she would remain blind and completely helpless. Outside of the house, she would be controlled by Aldo and the time limit, so the player would have no freedom whatsoever.

-> Skin tinting, optional. Father would give PC a special cream, which she would have to apply at least once a day. Each application would change the color of her skin toward that defined in the MCM (by 10%, giving a total of 10 days in-game for a full transformation). Each tinting would result in an information box saying "my skin has become more moisturized and is taking on a lovely color." Thus, the daughter would lose control over even such an elementary part of her body as her skin and gradually transform into her new form of submissive toy. The final application would result in the following message: "My skin has changed forever. I look like a beautiful, ripe fruit, but... By the gods, what am I becoming?"

Edited July 31, 2022 by kapibar

[KittenPen]

On 5/5/2022 at 10:23 AM, Monoman1 said:

Currently slowly retrofitting the party guests with the new food system. Slow work. Any suggestions for:

 

1. Extra party tasks. I was thinking maybe dog sex and/or cum shower (Kneel the PC and play masturbation anims on party guests. Alignment's going to be an issue though...). Maybe put on a particularly revealing outfit... or maybe just asked to put on an outfit that's one level up on the outfit lists. 

 

2. Have noticed that the guest 'hello' comments are fairly limited and they're all pretty severe - "aren't you a nice fuck toy" etc. Looking for snide/sneaky comments that are a little less... direct for early mod parties. Or more nasty ones for later. Knock yourself out. 

Personally it bugs me that father would let his breeder be fucked by his guests. He wants the kid to be his. I think if she's recognized as breeder and not yet recognized as preggers By Father then he either shouldn't be throwing parties or they shouldn't be asking for sex. I can kinda tell how much of a struggle the system is having at keeping things firing at the right times - at least when one is foolishly using AE like I am, but if it could be done, it'd help with immersion - especially since sexlab doesn't seem to like to play along with the rules with filtering lol.

[kapibar]

1 hour ago, KittenPen said:

Personally it bugs me that father would let his breeder be fucked by his guests.

I think it's covered. I never had a situation when one of the guests wanted to shish kebab my PC unless she was already a breeder (which means chastity gear), or pregnant already - in this case they use other holes.