Sexlab Survival

[Monoman1]

31 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

But what is cum addiction actually for?

Basically creature fondling is too convenient (another reason maybe to gate it behind creature corruption) and there's is no 'beg for cock'. I've stalled on that front. Can't seem to come up with anything better than:

"Hey. Want your dick sucked?"

"Sure"

Cue blowjob.

 

Surely there's a prostitution mod that allows you to decide sex type? Gold + cum = win win => no need to 'beg for cock'?

 

1 hour ago, mercplatypus said:

I have 2 ideas for alternatives to curing addiction.

Well the heavy BDSM route is probably out straight off the bat. No DD dependency makes it more difficult. 
If I've learned one thing modding is that people hate dependencies. No shits given for the extra effort needed neither

[mercplatypus]

True enough as far as hard dependencies go I suppose.  I guess it could also work if you can create some sort of deferred payment angle where you have x number of days to pay for your treatment or end up with a bounty on your head.  Either way my thoughts are that it should be something that takes less time than waiting it out and is less beneficial than simply paying a priest to cure you due to being more readily available.

[Lupine00]

4 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Surely there's a prostitution mod that allows you to decide sex type? Gold + cum = win win => no need to 'beg for cock'?

Usually, the customer requests a service: RP, SW, DCL.

 

I'm fuzzy on SWL, it might let you offer a specific type of service. I forget now ... been too long since I last used it.

 

Then, it's typical for the prostitution mod to play some barely correlated animation, unless it's ME or SWL where you have control over the animations if you want.

It's pretty common for the customer to ask for a blowjob, you agree, then you get a vanilla sex animation that got picked for some odd reason.

 

I know that in the SLD rape code, if it's trying to play oral only because you're belted, it has to jump through some extreme hoops to try and locate oral animations, because the tagging of them is shockingly poor. It may be that I had to search for some explicitly by name.

 

This comes back to prostitution mods being a bad fit, which is why they remain a big problem.

They are trying to solve their own problems and don't have the emphasis that SLS, or DF, or any slavery mod needs.

 

I've summed them up before, and I'll do it again  

• Radiant Prostitution - earn money easily but inn-keeper takes a lot of it, get destroyed by your Wear+Tear mod at the big parties.
• Sex Worker's Life - grind and grind your level up so you can actually make any money, you can choose animations, but there's really nothing but the same endless grind.
• Marie Eden - incompatible with almost every other mod you would ever want it to work with
• Deviously Cursed Loot - you are put in an arm binder. It is not removed. Everyone rapes you and steals your money. Can also be configured to be very easy cash, but there's neither progression, nor special events. None of the distinguishing features of RP or SWL are present.
• TDF Aggressive Prostitution - recruit whores and make them serve you, prostitution is even more basic than DCL.
• Skooma Whore - if you aren't an addict, you get paid a pittance. If you are an addict you get paid in crack. Either way, you'll never make any money.

 

IMHO, prostitution that worked well with SLS would be about trying to avoid acts that addict you without upsetting the customers too much.

You would offer a service, and the NPC would agree or counter-offer.

 

e.g.

 

Excuse me sir, would you like to plow my cunt? It's the best bargain in all of The Rift.

How much will it cost me slut?

100 gold sir. If it please you?

Too rich for your dirty hole. But I fancy a blowjob.

I'll swallow for 50, or you may cum on my face for 40. If you wish?

I think it's worth that much to see you gulping gown my jizz, whore.

As you say sir.

 

Then, for bonus fun, the customer may try to make you swallow anyway, and you can choose to resist or accept.

If you refuse, there's more chance they won't be satisfied with the service, which could lead to other problems.

 

I find that with prostitution, what you usually want most is to avoid is getting pregnant, as that means that later you will be stuck in down for days, unfit to fight.

Secondly, you want to avoid accumulating wear+tear.

Thus, oral is usually preferable, but with SLS it comes with drawbacks.

With the right prostitution mechanics you could offset the SLS drawbacks, by not swallowing, which comes at a different cost.

[bubba999]

2 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

 

Excuse me sir, would you like to plow my cunt? It's the best bargain in all of The Rift.

How much will it cost me slut?

100 gold sir. If it please you?

Too rich for your dirty hole. But I fancy a blowjob.

I'll swallow for 50, or you may cum on my face for 40. If you wish?

I think it's worth that much to see you gulping gown my jizz, whore.

As you say sir.

 

Then, for bonus fun, the customer may try to make you swallow anyway, and you can choose to resist or accept.

If you refuse, there's more chance they won't be satisfied with the service, which could lead to other problems.

 

 

Ok, get to work!

[Lupine00]

1 hour ago, bubba999 said:

Ok, get to work!

Sorry, wasted all the time I was going to spend on DF work tonight looking at bugs perfect beautiful features in DD.

 

Actually, I like the customer "memory" idea in SWL, that's a nice idea.

[deadlydawn]

I've got Milk Addict installed and have noticed that _SLS_HalfNakedCoverArmor is getting ripped in combat.
I took a look at Milk Addict's rip check, and all it does is check for the ArmorClothing keyword.
Is it safe to remove this keyword from _SLS_HalfNakedCoverArmor?
Or is it safe to check for the _SLS_HalfNakedCoverKw in the MA IsOkToRip function?

[Monoman1]

8 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

I've summed them up before, and I'll do it again

My point was kind of more that IF we were to get a really good prostitution mod that had all the bells and whistles you're looking for. And IF I was to add a highly elaborate 'begging for cock' feature with more bells and whistles. 

Why would you choose begging for cock like a disgusting slut willing to do anything for some cum versus a prostitute getting your fill of cum with a bit of gold to boot?

 

You'd have to maybe disallow prostitution if you become a cum slut. "I'm not paying for your worn out mouth"

3 hours ago, deadlydawn said:

I've got Milk Addict installed and have noticed that _SLS_HalfNakedCoverArmor is getting ripped in combat.

I'll probably take a look... soonish. There's some other things that need fixing with it anyway due to other mods getting updates and breaking stuff in MA. 

There should really be a check for SexLabNoStrip keyword. 

[EagleFive]

I've noticed a few times during my games that the guards simply stop enforcing the rules. I can walk into city with weapons equipped, draw weapons right in front of the guards, and no response. The times this has happened seems to be related to a guard getting activated and trying to catch me, but was unable to actually catch me. It doesn't happen every time, but it seems to be what causes them to "break" and no longer respond to rules violations. And once they are broke, they are broke for good as far as I can tell. The only way I get them to enforce rules again is to revert to previous save.

 

Is there a way I can "reset" that behavior without reverting to a previous save?

 

Side note: All the Quartermasters disappeared on one of my characters. Thought it was just the Riften one, went all the way yo Whiterun just to buy licenses, he was gone too. They all were. Had to disable the license system for rest of that character.

[Monoman1]

1 hour ago, EagleFive said:

I've noticed a few times during my games that the guards simply stop enforcing the rules. I can walk into city with weapons equipped, draw weapons right in front of the guards, and no response. The times this has happened seems to be related to a guard getting activated and trying to catch me, but was unable to actually catch me. It doesn't happen every time, but it seems to be what causes them to "break" and no longer respond to rules violations. And once they are broke, they are broke for good as far as I can tell. The only way I get them to enforce rules again is to revert to previous save.

 

Is there a way I can "reset" that behavior without reverting to a previous save?

Not something I've noticed myself. I'll keep an eye out for it.

Try disabling all the rules. EXIT the mcm. Wait 2/3 seconds. Go back in and turn them on. 

 

Certain rule sets are only enforced in walled cities. Npcs in scenes won't respond as scenes take priority over everything. 

1 hour ago, EagleFive said:

Side note: All the Quartermasters disappeared on one of my characters. Thought it was just the Riften one, went all the way yo Whiterun just to buy licenses, he was gone too. They all were. Had to disable the license system for rest of that character.

SLS does not do this. Another mod is doing it. If you're using the beta use wheel->Misc->Debug -> Teleport To

Enforcers are set in SLS to sandbox in their editor location. They will never leave their cell by default. 

[Lupine00]

10 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

"I'm not paying for your worn out mouth"

This made be laugh.

I would never enable a feature that turns off a mod I installed to do something I want.

 

 

 

Disabling prostitution is up there with the sub-text of chastity mods:

 

Step 1: spend hours setting up and configuring an elaborate system for displaying sex in skyrim. Add high resolution nude bodies and textures Add fancy new shaders.

Step 2: install and configure hundreds of sex animations

Step 3: install numerous mods that use sex

Step 4: put PC in full set of chastity items so sex impossible

 

 

Or in the SLS case:

 

Step 1: Build a mod that drives the player into poverty and traps them in towns unless they pay to leave, so adventuring will be more challenging

Step 2: Build a complex prostitution mod that adds choices and dangers to prostitution, allowing for interesting game play

Step 3: Force PC into prostitution and thievery as the only way to finance their attempt to adventure and save the world, making 2 more useful

Step 4: Punish thievery by making guards ignore the relevant stealth skills and harassing PC for anything that looks like it might lead to theft, making 2 more useful.

Step 5: Disable prostitution, invalidating all work put into 2 and making it completely useless.

Step 6: Only means of survival is begging NPCs for sex, money impossible to obtain, if you do get money you spend it on alcohol/skooma/milk/whatever

Step 7: Enjoy the thrills of homeless drug addict simulator as the PC rots into complete uselessness. Presumably world destroyed by Alduin.

 

 

MME was quicker:

 

Step 1: Install MME

Step 2: Become milk maid - this is basically inevitable if you install anything that feeds lactacid or gets you pregnant

Step 3: Crippled by unmilked boobs

Step 4: Get milked

Step 5: Boobs get bigger

Step 6: Go to 3 until PC can no longer function due to size of boobs.

Step 7: Abandon game

 

MME seems to have slowed this down a lot now, but it's still a race to finish the game before MME makes you into a stationary cow.

 

 

But I'm just joking around, don't take this too seriously.

[donttouchmethere]

On 7/13/2020 at 4:16 PM, Monoman1 said:

Notes:

The tongues are at a set height and so Female Facial Animations is sort of needed because otherwise the mouth doesn't open to the right height.

SLSbeta 0.594

 

IIIKs!

Female Facial Animation conflicts with the facial expression from DDi ballgags.

On my Setup the mouth on PC/NPC doesn't open wide enough anymore as long as FFA is installed.

Might be just my setup, but I drop it here in case someone else sees some odd ball gag expression behavior.

 

Guess now I have to test the the SLS tongue again ^^

[Corsec]

I have a suggestion for SLS users to better balance their LOs with the SLS misogyny feature.

 

Some playable race NPCs (including the PC) get a 50 increase to their attributes, called offsets. This is in addition the the base racial attributes, which are 50 on average. It is not applied consistently to all NPCs. Usually it's just the PC, friendly combatants and enemies who get it. This is problematic because it means there can be a significant but arbitrary difference in attributes between NPCs, especially at low levels. If you look at low-level NPCs in towns, for example, they will have attributes of about 50 at level 1, while the PC or bandits have attributes of around 100 at level 1. It also bothered me, the PC shouldn't have a special boost, they should be in line with NPCs at the same level.

 

This is very noticeable in brawls at low levels with town NPCs who don't have offsets. It became intolerable for me after my level 1 female PC easily defended herself in a brawl againt a level 1 male DEC rapist, even though she wore an armbinder and had to use the DD kick combat animations.

 

When you take offsets into account with the SLS misogyny feature, it means some NPCs will have attribute gains of up to 90 points (offsets plus misogyny attribute changes), while at the other extreme some females will have no offsets and overall lose 40 points. This was unsatisfactory to me, I wanted a way to apply attribute gains or losses in a systematic and rational way across all NPCs, male or female. This meant integrating the offset system with SLS misogyny attribute changes.

 

I used a patcher (True Unlevelled Skyrim) to remove all offsets from NPCs, and made a custom patch to remove the PC offsets. Then I manually added 25 points to all attributes of all playable races. The SLS misogyny atribute change will be set to 25 ingame, adding 25 points to males and removing 25 from females. This means that all males get the equivalent of the full 50 point offset in all attributes, females just get basic racial attributes.

 

This integrates the vanilla offset system with the SLS misogyny feature. Basically the effect of the rebalance is to remove attribute offsets from all NPCs but to compensate by providing an equivalent attribute gain consistently to all male NPCs. This also has the effect of spreading out the distribution of attribute gains, they are applied systematically now rather than the semi-random way they are usually assigned. you won't find that random NPCs are underpowered and too easy to beat, especially in brawls with a weak female PC.

 

True Unlevelled Skyrim has a zEdit patcher that can be run to remove NPC offsets. Removing PC offsets requires a special patch, I can upload one if anyone wants. Adding 25 points to racial attributes requires a cusotm patch, which will differ depending on what mods you have affecting races.

 

Logical Health Limits is a mod that also removes the extra 5 health points per level that is given to NPCs, it works well with this approach. After removing offsets, it will keep PC attributes consistent with NPC attributes at all levels.

 

So, to summarise-

 

1). Remove all attribute offsets from NPCs (True Unlevelled Skyrim or Grimy Combat Patcher can do this).

2). Custom patch to remove PC offsets

3). Manually add 25 points to the attributes of all playable races

4). (Optional but recommended) Use Logical Health Limits mod to remove NPC extra health

5). Ingame, set SLS misogyny feature to only 25 points

[Lupine00]

4 hours ago, donttouchmethere said:

Might be just my setup, but I drop it here in case someone else sees some odd ball gag expression behavior.

May be that Better Blowjobs fixes it again?

[Silvain]

On 7/23/2020 at 12:09 PM, Monoman1 said:

I'm also open to unique ideas on how to reduce addiction besides the usual go to a priest and pay some gold. 

I don't know how unique this is, but many people I know battle their addictions with substitutes. Honestly it's been a while since I've been playing skyrim so I don't exactly remember how cum addiction works, but I imagine it would go something like this:

Get addicted -> gameplay impact -> withdrawal -> side effects through withdrawal -> instead of cum consume substitute -> alleviate withdrawal effects for X amount of time -> cum addiction goes down with time -> repeat till clean or out of money to buy substitute

 

The "substitute" could be "milk", "sweets", "expensive stuff" (buying things above a certain threshold) aaand... dunno doing manual labor till exhaustion?

 

 

The other thing that comes to mind is distraction. There is only so much you can in skyrim and it overlaps a bit with the substitution approach but it would go something like this.

Get addicted -> gameplay impact -> withdrawal -> do certain things successfully -> reduce withdrawal effects for X amount of time -> repeat till clean

 

This would directly tie into the milestones the vanilla gameplay offers. Here the things I can think of of the top of my head: 

- learning a new (challenging) spell (i.e. corresponding to your skill level or above)

- cleaning a dungeon

- beating a mighty foe in combat (dragons and/or dungeon bosses, quest bosses, or simply an NPC with a much higher level -> maybe with a cooldown to prevent abuse)

- earning a certain amount of gold during a single merchant visit

- completing quests (more for major quests, less for radiant/misc quests)

[donttouchmethere]

1 hour ago, Lupine00 said:

May be that Better Blowjobs fixes it again?

Arghs, need to try that one again. ?

 

On my list:

> Better Blowjobs (works with DDi gags and works well with oversized schlongs)

> Female Facial Animation (doesn't open mouth far enough with DDi gags if non of the other mouth size mods overwrites sexlab, doesn't open the mouth enough during blowjobs)

> KziitXXXToolset (if files from sexlab overwritten) (works with DDi gags too) => stopped using it, because all females ran around with overstretched mouths if certain facial expressions got played (or was that caused by SLS?) => alternative to Better Blowjobs => creates a very nice O ?

 

Now I'm a bit confused (as always), should I combine Female Facial Animation with one other the other two? (why didn't I try that yet ?)

[Lupine00]

23 minutes ago, Silvain said:

The other thing that comes to mind is distraction. There is only so much you can in skyrim and it overlaps a bit with the substitution approach but it would go something like this.

That's a relatively fresh idea.

 

The problem with addiction generally, is that it comes from a lot of mods.

 

SLS has addictions,

SLD has addictions,

SW has its own addiction, and a mod that modifies that addiction so it's different,

Milk Addict adds new addiction, 

SLSO adds sex addiction,

DiD has modified addictions for SW and sex, and adds several addictions of its own.

 

I've got too many of these going on in my game right now, and it's a bit harsh, but it's SW that's really doing the damage.

SLS drugging features make it quite easy to get severely addicted.

SW + SW Addicted makes it almost impossible to quit, and the symptoms are harsh.

 

It may be possible to quit via Herb Tea, but first you need to stack up enough of it to cure yourself from a massive addiction value to near zero all in one go.

If you lose your house, it's really hard to do, because your Herb Tea gets stolen, or lost, or taken when you're enslaved again - which happens often because you're a broken junkie that can't really fight unless you're skooma'd up.

 

DiD is sort of a master-mod for addictions, but it's clearly not ... finished. So there are problems, and conflicts with other addiction mods.

I may have to give up using DiD addictions as the complexities it adds along with all the others is too much to cope with.

[Silvain]

6 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

That's a relatively fresh idea.

 

The problem with addiction generally, is that it comes from a lot of mods.

 

I've got too many of these going on in my game right now, and it's a bit harsh, but it's SW that's really doing the damage.

I also really dislike much of the debuff massacre that too many different mods tend to cause. While I love the MM idea it's just too much. For me these mods should be "light" additions that come into play once every few hours or alter the regular gameplay in ways that make it more interesting without adding tons of sex/cutscenes.

 

Basically the way I would love to see addictions in general done is: 

- get addicted because of your choices, being forced into it is also fine to some degree but it should never single handedly cause the addiction. I like to have agency in that.

- being high should have advantages as an incentive to indulge. Then come the side effects and addiction settles in.

- withdrawal should modify regular gameplay and not prevent it. Let's see... This could be one way to do it:

 

Spoiler

Get addicted. Now withdrawal sets in. You have the choice to either go high again, go cold turkey (is that actually the phrase used for doing hard withdrawal?) or go clean with the help of something.

 

Doing drugs again has the benefit of being stronger to deal with the challenges ahead. Fine, nothing to do here.

 

Going cold turkey rewards your suffering with a very quick recovery. Maybe add a + experience buff after it to make it worthwhile and replicate the "seeing the world as is for the very first time in a long while" effect.

 

Doing stuff while on withdrawal with the help of substitution/distraction makes stuff still more difficult but not as hard as going cold turkey. The debuffs are reduced but the recovery time is also not as fast. You purchase the substitution and reduce the debuff and go adventuring. If you fail to achieve something you have at least reduced your addiction somewhat. But if you did achieve something then a buff comes into play that only lasts for a certain amount of time and makes it easier to achieve something else. Like a stamina/speed buff to quickly go to the next dungeon, or a price reduction on the next spell you purchase, or additional damage. The remaining debuff of withdrawal makes it so that with those buffs a somewhat +/- 0 is reached.

This is kind of a gamble. Do great with a difficulty increase and be rewarded. But if you fail you wasted your money (and maybe suffer an addiction setback).

 

- be cured or go on being addicted.

 

I honestly don't know how doable all this is. Just ideas on how to tie addiction into the vanilla gameplay.

[Lupine00]

15 minutes ago, Silvain said:

- being high should have advantages as an incentive to indulge. Then come the side effects and addiction settles in.

In my seemingly abandoned Skooma Whore replacer, the drugs were genuinely beneficial, and available in bulk.

You would be fine if you only used them in emergencies, but if you started to use them regularly, then you would get addicted.

There was a reasonable degree of control.

There was also a difference between getting a high addiction and losing it and getting a moderate addiction and losing it in terms of consequence.

Getting high addiction levels would lead to easier and easier re-addiction.

 

In my current game, skooma addiction was forced by Treasure Hunter Whore, which was a slavery outcome.

It has a scenario with a skooma clit injector that injects you with skooma all the time. By the time you get free you're deep into addiction.

Without that, skooma addiction probably wouldn't be the dominant factor in my game right now.

I guess it's exciting to have such a nasty outcome as a possibility, but when it comes up, if you don't at least try and deal with it, it feels like a cheat.

 

It's ... interesting ... but may not be sustainable.

[Monoman1]

Our protagonist seems to have something on her mind. Can't quite put my finger on what it is.

 

Cum hunger: Peckish:

Spoiler

 

Cum hunger: Hungry:

Spoiler

 

Talking to Lucan:

Spoiler

 

Talking to Camilla:

Spoiler

 

Our hero while talking to them:

Spoiler

 

Note that Lucan is not normally naked. He's dressed normally when you're not talking to him. Nor is Camilla's face covered in cum normally. 

This is just your PC getting distracted and daydreaming. 

[Monoman1]

@donttouchmethere

For me open mouths look like: 

 

Without anything except DDs. (Does that have morphs?)

Spoiler

Ain't gonna fit a lot in there. 

 

Better blowjobs:

Spoiler

More like scary blowjobs....

Don't know about you but I'm not putting anything in there

 

Female Facial animations:

Spoiler

Seems to strike a balance between not open enough and scary face. 

 

[Monoman1]

Regarding cum addiction effects. I'm not a huge fan of debuffs either. But debuffs are straightforward and predictable. You learn what they are and how to mitigate them and that's that. When you start adding a whole pile of abstract conditions you complicate things and people won't understand what's going on, how the mechanics work or why, which will lead to people just turning it off completely. I know I did that for DiD. Couldn't understand what was happening or why. Left bewildered I uninstalled it. 

 

Practical effects are better but they need to be intuitive. I like the addiction effects in milk addict generally speaking even though they need a way to block them from happening. Addicted to lactacid? Then there's a chance your PC will auto drink lactacid wherever she finds it - as loot/in shops etc. Makes sense.

Got your left arm cut off? Can't equip that arm. Makes sense. 

 

Addicted to cum? Well then if you do x you'll get a 50% increase in addiction recovery rate for 12 hours (or something like that) but if you do Y then you get an 80% increase in recover rate for 6 hours but only while travelling west!

This isn't all that intuitive. People won't care really. 

 

Not trying to put anyone down here. This is a discussion after all. I'm all for practical effects. 

[Monoman1]

@Corsec

Good luck getting people to do all that! I have a hard enough time getting people to use a merged patch. Mod users are a lazy bunch generally. Sorry folks but it's true

[Bane Master]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

SW + SW Addicted makes it almost impossible to quit, and the symptoms are harsh.

I find it is possible to get out of addiction if forced drugging is disabled and addiction rate is set to slow. I agree that symptoms are harsh but equally you can remove them entirely with just a little Skooma - after all just one more won't hurt.... 

[jfraser]

9 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

@Corsec

Good luck getting people to do all that! I have a hard enough time getting people to use a merged patch. Mod users are a lazy bunch generally. Sorry folks but it's true

Yeah, I'm not going through all that. XD you should make a mod for it, @Corsec 

[donttouchmethere]

58 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

Better blowjobs:

Looks the same on my setup. I always fear those teeth fall out any moment.

 

58 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

Without anything except DDs. (Does that have morphs?)

That's how it looks for me with Female Facial animations if wearing a ballgag

 

58 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

Seems to strike a balance between not open enough and scary face. 

That's my target now ?

 

Thanks for the picture references. Makes my Quest for the best blowjob face a bit easier.

If I can resist to get sidetracked all the time ?