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Kimy

Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

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Minor bug report, in case the problem isn't just on my end: one of the animation substitutions with yokes 'DDZapYokeForeplay01' does not seem to be animating the female toon (she continues the normal standing idle, while the male does his thing).  The other yoke animations seem to be working fine.

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For bound combat I like the MCM slider idea because different people had different ideas on how effective bound combat should be. I do not believe it would be possible to balance bound combat in a way that makes most people happy so the easiest solution proposed so far would be an MCM slider for bound combat damage.

 

In my opinion a bound person should not be able to win a fight against a dragon, a powerful enemy or a large group of lower level enemies. There would be no point to putting a person in bondage if they could still kill everyone around them.  A lone naked person wearing nothing but an armbinder should not pose much of a threat to someone with armor and a sword.  However this is a game based around combat so some leeway has to be granted to account for that. In my opinion only a person who has trained for or is experienced in bound combat should be effective with it. This is why I like the idea of a devious skill tree but I accept that due to technical limitations of the game, that may not ever happen.

 

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The damage output will scale in some fashion. I haven't thought about the actual system much yet.

 

No, you will not win against a dragon. What I have in mind is making bound dungeon runs more feasible than they are now, but I have no intention to trivialize being restrained to the degree that people do not want to escape their bindings anymore.

 

Yes, you will have to train bound combat to be effective at it!

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This might be better suited for it's own mod, but one solution to bound combat would be playing the damsel in distress, and prompting others to do the fighting for you.

 

For example; if your character is being chased by wolves across the plains of Whiterun, a nearby traveller or guard may come to your rescue and will start escorting you, like a temporary follower. In more dangerous places like bandit outposts, one of them might turn on the others in an attempt to claim you.

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On 11.4.2018 at 7:56 PM, Reesewow said:

I think one thing that might help a lot is consolidating all of the groups in Cursed Loot under one obvious Bodyslide group - right now if you have a lot of Bodyslide items installed Cursed Loot's groups get scattered all over the list (DeviouslyCursedLoot UUNP/Dress/ExperimentalLatexUUNP/Latex/Pink Zebra/SpikeBall/Tentacle Parasite ect). 

So much this! Aren't the slider files plain xml?

 

On 11.4.2018 at 7:00 PM, Kimy said:

Agreed, but that's some grunt work I am probably continuing finding good excuses for not doing. :smiley:

Oh, who could have guessed. Programmers don't want to do chores... That's why they develop programs to to the chores for them, never mind that doing it by hand would be faster... And now excuse me I have 10 pages of documentation to write... at least. *sigh*

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12 hours ago, IronDusk33 said:

This might be better suited for it's own mod, but one solution to bound combat would be playing the damsel in distress, and prompting others to do the fighting for you.

 

For example; if your character is being chased by wolves across the plains of Whiterun, a nearby traveller or guard may come to your rescue and will start escorting you, like a temporary follower. In more dangerous places like bandit outposts, one of them might turn on the others in an attempt to claim you.

I prefer the have viable bound combat.

I want to be able to keep going while wearing an armbinder.

Also because legs and feet are effective weapons and not using the them in that situation would be silly.

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3 minutes ago, Comrade Laura 'Lokomootje' said:

I prefer the have viable bound combat.

I want to be able to keep going while wearing an armbinder.

Also because legs and feet are effective weapons and not using the them in that situation would be silly.

I was thinking this could be a system that works on top of bound combat. As it stands currently, unless your character is a reincarnation of Chun Li, getting through dungeons or bandit-infested wilderness would be near impossible with just your legs. It would be completely impossible if she gets stuck in a tight dress or ankle chains. Tricking or persuading nearby NPCs to fight for you would be one way for your character to survive.

 

However, I think if your character could learn to do some knock-back or staggering kicks that could stun-lock enemies, it might become an interesting and viable combat style.

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18 minutes ago, IronDusk33 said:

I was thinking this could be a system that works on top of bound combat. As it stands currently, unless your character is a reincarnation of Chun Li, getting through dungeons or bandit-infested wilderness would be near impossible with just your legs. It would be completely impossible if she gets stuck in a tight dress or ankle chains. Tricking or persuading nearby NPCs to fight for you would be one way for your character to survive.

 

However, I think if your character could learn to do some knock-back or staggering kicks that could stun-lock enemies, it might become an interesting and viable combat style.

It's not up-to-date and i didn't test long enough to figure out where exactly it works and where not, but deviously helpless still does a good job for most devices if the goal is surviving while bound.

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2 hours ago, IronDusk33 said:

I was thinking this could be a system that works on top of bound combat. As it stands currently, unless your character is a reincarnation of Chun Li, getting through dungeons or bandit-infested wilderness would be near impossible with just your legs. It would be completely impossible if she gets stuck in a tight dress or ankle chains. Tricking or persuading nearby NPCs to fight for you would be one way for your character to survive.

 

However, I think if your character could learn to do some knock-back or staggering kicks that could stun-lock enemies, it might become an interesting and viable combat style.

Bound combat should obviously not be too strong. It shouldn't be an alternative to using normal weapons.

But a highly trained half dragon should still be able to kick herself out of a wolf attack.

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9 minutes ago, Comrade Laura 'Lokomootje' said:

Bound combat should obviously not be too strong. It shouldn't be an alternative to using normal weapons.

But a highly trained half dragon should still be able to kick herself out of a wolf attack.

Only issue I see is that the question of what is "too powerful" or "too weak" is completely dependent on the user's mods and difficulty settings.  Some people basically run vanilla games, where wolves are a low-level pest and bandits stop levelling at 30 and probably don't need very strong bound combat to fight their way out of a bandit camp.  Others use many difficulty boosting mods that add new enemies to the level lists and enemies with high armor/health - they may need extremely powerful bound combat to even kill a few bandits before being overwhelmed.

 

Basically my concern is that without some form of user control behind the damage done, bound combat will still either be too weak or too strong for most users's gameplay preference.  For me personally my bandit camps are full of level 80 bandit duellist and deadly wenches - I don't think I'd be able to win a fight with any of them one-on-one without at least a daedric weapon level kick (since there is no blocking or magic use while bound).

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33 minutes ago, Reesewow said:

Only issue I see is that the question of what is "too powerful" or "too weak" is completely dependent on the user's mods and difficulty settings.  Some people basically run vanilla games, where wolves are a low-level pest and bandits stop levelling at 30 and probably don't need very strong bound combat to fight their way out of a bandit camp.  Others use many difficulty boosting mods that add new enemies to the level lists and enemies with high armor/health - they may need extremely powerful bound combat to even kill a few bandits before being overwhelmed.

 

Basically my concern is that without some form of user control behind the damage done, bound combat will still either be too weak or too strong for most users's gameplay preference.  For me personally my bandit camps are full of level 80 bandit duellist and deadly wenches - I don't think I'd be able to win a fight with any of them one-on-one without at least a daedric weapon level kick (since there is no blocking or magic use while bound).

True, customisation is key here.

People have very different games.

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On 28.3.2018 at 4:43 PM, Hanshurtig11 said:

I am still have problems with some of the devices. For me, the chains and bells/signs from both vaginal and anal pears dont show. The pears themself DO show.

And i can hear the rattle from the chain and the jingle of the bell. Other chains work well, and when using signs and bells from original Heretical they show up as well.

I dont have the "pears of anguish sign/bell" in Bodyslide, thou i dont think they are needed there ?  Its since i first used any DDdev/DD4. Any help would be appreciated.

regards

No one any idea? It continues with the new develpment versions. sighs..

Some other thing, not sure if said before, so i guess its just a lack of ready animations. The breastbound yoke uses the normal yoke animation during most not running /idle animations.

Thx for all your work, hope you keep it up :smile: .. regards

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15 hours ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

No one any idea? It continues with the new develpment versions. sighs..

Some other thing, not sure if said before, so i guess its just a lack of ready animations. The breastbound yoke uses the normal yoke animation during most not running /idle animations.

Thx for all your work, hope you keep it up :smile: .. regards

Mine show up normally and I didn't have to build them in Bodyslide.

Not sure how to solve it though.

Have you tried downloading the latest meshes and textures for it and overwriting it, just to be sure?

 

 

I found something small.

My character had a leather straitjacket+legbinder combo.

I tried to make her mastrubate using SexLab Aroused (Redux I think).

The animation for when she is belted played, meaning she separated her legs.

The arms were still in the correct position for the straitjacket. But I think that that is because the arms are invisible while wearing the straitjacket.

 

By the way, the arms can clip through an armbinder when we're not using CBBE Curvy.

Is it possible to make the arms invisible to prevent the clipping?

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5 minutes ago, Comrade Laura 'Lokomootje' said:

By the way, the arms can clip through an armbinder when we're not using CBBE Curvy.

Is it possible to make the arms invisible to prevent the clipping?

The most an armbinder can make invisible is the hands - this is because armbinders are not body-slot items that replace your body mesh.  Straitjackets replace the body slot which is how they can pull off the "invisible" arms effect.

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Just now, Reesewow said:

The most an armbinder can make invisible is the hands - this is because armbinders are not body-slot items that replace your body mesh.  Straitjackets replace the body slot which is how they can pull of the "invisible" arms effect.

Ok, that makes sense.

But could they make the armbinders scale in Bodyslide?

You can build them, but I don't think it makes a difference what body you use.

You always seem to get the CBBE Curvy one.

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11 minutes ago, Comrade Laura 'Lokomootje' said:

Ok, that makes sense.

But could they make the armbinders scale in Bodyslide?

You can build them, but I don't think it makes a difference what body you use.

You always seem to get the CBBE Curvy one.

Yea, I'd assume that's something to address with adding proper CBBE bodyslide support for that particular item - I personally use UUNP so I don't have that issue.

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On 10/17/2017 at 6:54 PM, Kimy said:

 

I don't actively follow SKSE64 development. If it ever reaches a state that allows SexLab to run, there is a certain chance that DD will run as well, with no/minimal changes.

 

In the unlikely event nobody‘s told you yet: skse64 is out of beta (and apparently there’s a sksevr in the works too). 

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8 hours ago, Comrade Laura 'Lokomootje' said:

Mine show up normally and I didn't have to build them in Bodyslide.

Not sure how to solve it though.

Have you tried downloading the latest meshes and textures for it and overwriting it, just to be sure?

Thx for the answer. Yes, anything is there in Skyrim\data\meshes\devious\heretic\plugs. 15 Files from latest devbuild. They show up in Nifscope fine.

Same for the textures. I am quite desperate ^^..... Silly question.. the HDT invisibility fix isnt needed for this, isnt it ? As far as i can remember it was for NPCs becoming invisible.

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1 hour ago, Hanshurtig11 said:

Silly question.. the HDT invisibility fix isnt needed for this, isnt it ? As far as i can remember it was for NPCs becoming invisible.

The original HDT invisibility fix is outdated (AFAIK), the current best practice solution for invisible NPCs with HDT items seems to be in this post (the very first post when you follow this link):

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/34345-breasts-stretch-really-far-then-said-npc-sometimes-goes-invisible/?page=3&tab=comments#comment-1621615

That requires a bit more work by the user but the results are well worth the effort in my experience.

 

However, that said, I really don't think this would explain the issue you're experiencing with your player character and the plugs. What I find most puzzling is that the same items work for you in the HR mod but not in DD. Also, I take it other HDT enabled items show up and work fine (like the ankle cuffs with chains)?

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1 hour ago, El_Duderino said:

The original HDT invisibility fix is outdated (AFAIK), the current best practice solution for invisible NPCs with HDT items seems to be in this post (the very first post when you follow this link):

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/34345-breasts-stretch-really-far-then-said-npc-sometimes-goes-invisible/?page=3&tab=comments#comment-1621615

That requires a bit more work by the user but the results are well worth the effort in my experience.

 

However, that said, I really don't think this would explain the issue you're experiencing with your player character and the plugs. What I find most puzzling is that the same items work for you in the HR mod but not in DD. Also, I take it other HDT enabled items show up and work fine (like the ankle cuffs with chains)?

Hm, just testet more and its getting even more complicatet ^^ First, yes, Ball&chain, Prisonercuffs, Anklechain, anything works fine. Pear anal shows only pear in any versions (with or without chain/sign/bell). Pear vaginal shows only in "pear only" version, as soon as any version with chain/signBell is used, nothing shows up at all, not even the pear this time.

In old heretic Mod signs/bells are seperated from the pears, not sure if that count in somehow. Unfortunatly there is no locked version in that. regards

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Have you perhaps got some loose meshes with the same name as ones packaged in DDx?  I've seen some truly weird interactions when loose files override the ones in a BSA.

 

I mean, they're supposed to override, that's normal.  But if they're from a different mod or even an old version of the same mod, it can make weird and hard to reproduce problems.

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7 minutes ago, stobor said:

Have you perhaps got some loose meshes with the same name as ones packaged in DDx?  I've seen some truly weird interactions when loose files override the ones in a BSA.

 

I mean, they're supposed to override, that's normal.  But if they're from a different mod or even an old version of the same mod, it can make weird and hard to reproduce problems.

DDx isn't packaged as a bsa though, so that shouldn't be an issue.

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