Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

[Darkpig]

I prefer being able to escape from everthing even if unrealistic. Having to run back to civilization for help is tedious after the 3rd time in a row it happens in the same play session.

I can deal with returning back for help once for about 2 hours of playing.

I like the ability to find escape methods or ways to escape in dungeon/wilderness. (Risk vs Reward mechanics)

 

 

In general 10 to 15 min of play time is more than enough when a armbinder/yoke/heavy bondage/ball gags/blindfolds devices are worn.

As soon as I get one of those I drop everthing and start pursuing a method of escape (So I prefer a short but good diversion in those cases)

I can put up with the heavy restraints for more time but in those cases I prefer having quests (Cursed Loot, cursed collar is a good example of a quest with good duration in my case).

 

I agree. Perhaps it would be best just to let other mods use the framework for questing and leaving the escape method relatively simple like we have now.

 

 

For other devices it's about the same time but I normally proceeed playing and pursuing my current objective, so they stay for longer times.

Piercings and pumps can stay for really long times, since I like their design space in general.

I prefer shorter attempts with good escape chances for heavy bondage devices.  For the others a longer attempt with a good chance is ok.

 

The only effect I truly despise is the mittens drop item effect. So i'd like to be able to disable it. The no weapon/no spell/no equip is fun.

 

The mitten drop effect can be disabled in the McM under Hardcore Mittens option. I do agree that the mitten drop item effect is pointless since being unable to defend yourself (unless you are a boxing heavyweight) is plenty of a challenge. I think leaving the Hardcore Mittens off by default would be the best option but maybe leaving it for those that want it.

 

That is my opinion/preferences when I play with devious devices.

 

Extra Suggestions:

I'd like more added effects for pumps/piercings, similar to plugs we have today.

 

Today like in the real world in this day and age or what do you mean by today?

 

I'd like enchantments/effects that tempts the player to keep the item equiped and/or have them sacrifice keys for some "benefit", but I don't know if this should be added directly to the framework.

 

I can imagine a 10% chance of summoning the Mysterious Stranger to fight for you when bound. Wait this isn't Fallout.

 

Can we have devices/effect that adds a single keyword filter to the animation selection, in order to direct for specific group of animations?

A consumable magic item that summon a helper that can use keys you have to unequip unreacheable locks in case you decide to go for realism on device unequipping.

 

Bloody brilliant! Maybe have sex as payment.

 

 

[screennamebob]

After poking at the latest builds for the last couple of days as well as looking at the scripts to understand the actual chance calculations, here are my thoughts:

 

1) I feel like the difficulty modifier itself could be even a little more extreme, perhaps up to .85 or .95 maximum.  That will allow slightly more variation to the default values and let users better dial in their ideal experience when dealing with the framework devices.

 

2) In general (I haven't gone through and looked at every device), I think the best option for the default values in most cases would be somewhat higher (easier) than "realistic" values.  In my opinion, users playing with only the framework or some of the older/smaller DD mods that utilize the generic devices are probably using DD as a novelty or fun distraction in Skyrim rather than have it be a significant part of their playtime.  There will likely be many mods that customize the devices to be more difficult to escape, I think the framework should be more lenient with the default device difficulty and be more of a showcase of the models/textures, animations and device system itself.

 

3) I also don't feel like the cooldowns, lock shields, key breaking or catastrophic failures shouldn't be enabled for any of the framework devices by default.  While the features themselves are fantastic, again I feel like the device difficulty should be more lenient and easy with the framework devices, with the options for modders to make the devices much more difficult and punishing (or even easier for that matter) within their own mods.

 

Other Issues:

 

- MCM Menu difficulty defaults to 'Handcuff Girl' instead of 'Kinky [Default]'

- In DisplayDifficultyMsg function in zadEquipScript, lines 953 and 971 are using the Struggle variable instead of the LockPick and Cut escape chance variables for the >= 15 condition.

- The bondage mittens perform their 20% key drop check before checking to see if the locks were manipulated.  Not sure if this is intended or the mitten script just hasn't been updated yet.

[Lokikun]

 

Extra Suggestions:

I'd like more added effects for pumps/piercings, similar to plugs we have today.

 

Today like in the real world in this day and age or what do you mean by today?

 

 

The today I was talking about was: The effects that exist in the Devious Devices as of version 3.0

Some plugs are lively and react to magic, others edge the wearer, some keep the arousal above or below a certain threshold.

 

For piercings most of them react together with the soulgem plugs. But there is no reaction if you have a pump plug event.

The pumps only react to being physically manipulated by yourself or NPC's. (I only saw these events when playing)

 

My suggestions would be: 

- A set of pumps that will inflate when it detects a certain use of magic. (By school type? Or by spell level determining the chance of inflation? Or even by player skill in casting in certain schools)

- For piercings something like reacting together with a pump press (vibrating/shocking).

- Maybe every time the pump deflates we could have a type of piercing event.

- Magical piercings keeping the pumps inflated above a certain limit while equipped.

- Certain piercings that could deflate the pumps state by one but apply a serious arousal buff.

- Or even a piercing that can only be unequiped if the pump plug is totally deflated.

[Nazzzgul666]

About the struggling discussion: not really favoring anything, for me yokes happen seldom enough, but i had the idea that certain actions would alert everything in the area. That may even happen for armbinders sometimes if you fail and let out a frustrated moan, or some noise you make if struggling with the yoke. As a reward if you manage to kill (bound fight) upcoming animals you might get a sharp event with (wolve/cat) teeth for armbinders.

Playing on legendary even on low levels i'd most likely just reload in most cases i try to struggle out of a yoke, but... that way the game difficulty would also influence DD for those who prefer easier options. Or you might even be lucky.

 

I thought that might be a good compromise to make it playable but exciting?

[Kimy]

Other Issues:

 

- MCM Menu difficulty defaults to 'Handcuff Girl' instead of 'Kinky [Default]'

- In DisplayDifficultyMsg function in zadEquipScript, lines 953 and 971 are using the Struggle variable instead of the LockPick and Cut escape chance variables for the >= 15 condition.

- The bondage mittens perform their 20% key drop check before checking to see if the locks were manipulated.  Not sure if this is intended or the mitten script just hasn't been updated yet.

 

Fixed that, thank you!

 

As for the bondage mittens - that's intended. Restraints still behave normally, except that you can remove them at any time you wish, provided they are not blocked by other items, if applicable.

 

[bhenny]

Hi, i have a problem, everything work good except for the armbinder, no animation load, like this user: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/65507-armbinder-animation-not-working-for-devious-devices/

I tried run FNIS again but no work, other animation, like struggle, work.

How can i fix it?

Thanks in advance

[naaitsab]

Since one of the earlier versions of DDi when a scene or animation is playing DD events start and will imidiatly stop, but the sound triggers and there is a message in the top left. So there is some kind of check for this.

Would it be possible to halt DD events when a scene or animation is playing instead of the start-stop? It would be neat to also do this while in dialogue as things like struggling and cumming/edging tab out of dialogue.

 

Both of course nitpicky things and would fit the "if we have time" list

[Content Consumer]

I'm doing something wrong here. If I do this:

int DDEquip
DDEquip = ModEvent.Create("DDI_EquipDevice")   
if (DDEquip)     
    ModEvent.PushForm(DDEquip, playerref)		
    ModEvent.PushString(DDEquip, "blindfold")   	
    ModEvent.Send(DDEquip)
Endif

It works just fine, for pretty much anything I put in the string. However, if I want to add other parameters, like a leather collar instead of just a collar, it fails. I think I'm just passing in strings incorrectly. What is the proper method for passing in modifiers, like a padded belt instead of just a belt, or a metal collar, or a red ebonite harness, etc?

[qawsedrftg765]

Hey there, so I have been testing out the new struggle system (cutting, struggle, pick) and I just don't feel like the system itself "fits" with DD at the moment, for a start is a bugger to use.

 

5 clicks to just to start an attempt is really annoying and pretty unimersive. Though I do appreciate that the different materials and restraint type effect the success rate (armbinder > leg cuffs and metal > leather) 

 

I feel it would just be better to have the system be a keybinding similar to how sexlab handles arousal notifications, where if you press the button for a second you get a notification of your SL arousal level and if you hold it you play one of the SL masturbation animations. 

 

Perhaps we could use a similar system where if you press "X" you get a notification such as

 

"Your arms and feet are bound tight"

 

and if you hold the key you attempt to struggle out of them or cut the restraint. I think that would be better than playing RNG with dialog boxes. Then if you try again immidiatly after failing you could get something like 

 

"you are too tired and frustrated to attempt an escape" 

 

As for number of attempts to escape, honestly I don't know how it should be balanced, If the player is given the option to just spend time trying to get out of something and time is the only gate then I don't see how there is a difference between attempting it 100 times or 3. The same effort is required on the players behalf, just pressing 5 buttons over and over. Unless a player has iNeed or Frostfall there is almost no imperative to actually have to have your hands free or your 'real' armor worn. 

 

 

Moreover, unless a harness/armbinder has been manipulated previously there is no way that thing should come off on its own, ever, I understand that it is a game. But if a person has wound up in an armbinder, they did it to themselves through DCL or CD or something to that effect... they knew what they were getting into. 

 

And what they were getting into is not getting out of what they were getting into; because that is what they are into. You feel me?

 

Even though I am being a little negative here I still view the 4.0 updates as a massive improvement and look forward to seeing what modders come up with in regards to the new fantastic devices. 

[Nazzzgul666]

I agree that a hotkey for trying to get out would be nice, since most of my keys on the whole board are more or less in active use i think it should be only one for all, not one for every item each, though. Would require an order which item will be tried first if you press the key and wearing mustliple stuff, something like

 armbinder>leg cuffs>arm cuffs>harness>belt>boots>gloves>bra>collar... just a first thought, and probably i forgot something, not even sure if you can "struggle" out of all of them, it's been a while since i even started Skyrim.

 

If you want a different order you still could go through inventory and the 5 clicks.

[El_Duderino]

Hi,

 

I've got a possible bug to report about the device events:

 

It seems that the belt events can trigger while the player is riding on a horse, which causes major issues. This was actually the first time ever I owned a horse in Skyrim, so I don't know if this a known issue or not. Reporting it just in case. I've got it three times in one game session now, can anybody else verify this? Also, I'm using Immersive Horses which I don't think interfered, but I'm not quite sure about this.

 

My char was wearing a belt from CD, no plugs. What happened is that when the event fired (in this case, the "belt tucking" thing), the animation played while the player was still mounted. The horse then stops, the player stands up on the horse's back, the animation plays and then gets stuck in a loop. No reaction to mouse or key commands, only way out seems to be to reload an older savegame. This happened with default MCM settings for all the events.

 

I have since set the "mounted" event to 0 (was 100 by default) and the event didn't fire again, but I don't know if this by design or chance.

[an awkward situation]

How does the lockpicking works? It seems to always succeed in my save, no matter the difficulty level set in the settings.

[Kimy]

Hey there, so I have been testing out the new struggle system (cutting, struggle, pick) and I just don't feel like the system itself "fits" with DD at the moment, for a start is a bugger to use.

 

5 clicks to just to start an attempt is really annoying and pretty unimersive. Though I do appreciate that the different materials and restraint type effect the success rate (armbinder > leg cuffs and metal > leather) 

 

I feel it would just be better to have the system be a keybinding similar to how sexlab handles arousal notifications, where if you press the button for a second you get a notification of your SL arousal level and if you hold it you play one of the SL masturbation animations. 

 

Perhaps we could use a similar system where if you press "X" you get a notification such as

 

"Your arms and feet are bound tight"

 

and if you hold the key you attempt to struggle out of them or cut the restraint. I think that would be better than playing RNG with dialog boxes. Then if you try again immidiatly after failing you could get something like 

 

"you are too tired and frustrated to attempt an escape" 

 

As for number of attempts to escape, honestly I don't know how it should be balanced, If the player is given the option to just spend time trying to get out of something and time is the only gate then I don't see how there is a difference between attempting it 100 times or 3. The same effort is required on the players behalf, just pressing 5 buttons over and over. Unless a player has iNeed or Frostfall there is almost no imperative to actually have to have your hands free or your 'real' armor worn. 

 

 

Moreover, unless a harness/armbinder has been manipulated previously there is no way that thing should come off on its own, ever, I understand that it is a game. But if a person has wound up in an armbinder, they did it to themselves through DCL or CD or something to that effect... they knew what they were getting into. 

 

And what they were getting into is not getting out of what they were getting into; because that is what they are into. You feel me?

 

Even though I am being a little negative here I still view the 4.0 updates as a massive improvement and look forward to seeing what modders come up with in regards to the new fantastic devices. 

 

The problem with using keybinds is that every Tom, Dick and Harry mod is using them. My load order is fairly small compared to what some people use, and even I have difficulties where to assign all these keys to mods want me to assign (much less remember what keys I assigned all these features to).

Then, even with a keybind, I don't think it would take much less effort to start the desired action. The X key would probably start a UIExtension wheel, making you select what restraint to process, then you -still- would have to pick what exactly to do with it. The charm of the existing method is that it works exactly like manipulating regular gear - you open the inventory and click it.

[Kimy]

Hi,

 

I've got a possible bug to report about the device events:

 

It seems that the belt events can trigger while the player is riding on a horse, which causes major issues. This was actually the first time ever I owned a horse in Skyrim, so I don't know if this a known issue or not. Reporting it just in case. I've got it three times in one game session now, can anybody else verify this? Also, I'm using Immersive Horses which I don't think interfered, but I'm not quite sure about this.

 

My char was wearing a belt from CD, no plugs. What happened is that when the event fired (in this case, the "belt tucking" thing), the animation played while the player was still mounted. The horse then stops, the player stands up on the horse's back, the animation plays and then gets stuck in a loop. No reaction to mouse or key commands, only way out seems to be to reload an older savegame. This happened with default MCM settings for all the events.

 

I have since set the "mounted" event to 0 (was 100 by default) and the event didn't fire again, but I don't know if this by design or chance.

 

Fixed it.

[bhenny]

Hi, i have a problem, everything work good except for the armbinder, no animation load, like this user: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/65507-armbinder-animation-not-working-for-devious-devices/

 

I tried run FNIS again but no work, other animation, like struggle, work.

 

How can i fix it?

 

Thanks in advance

I fixed my problem using non beta DD, so the problem can be in this version

[dnoah]

 

 

Hey there, so I have been testing out the new struggle system (cutting, struggle, pick) and I just don't feel like the system itself "fits" with DD at the moment, for a start is a bugger to use.

 

5 clicks to just to start an attempt is really annoying and pretty unimersive. Though I do appreciate that the different materials and restraint type effect the success rate (armbinder > leg cuffs and metal > leather) 

 

I feel it would just be better to have the system be a keybinding similar to how sexlab handles arousal notifications, where if you press the button for a second you get a notification of your SL arousal level and if you hold it you play one of the SL masturbation animations. 

 

Perhaps we could use a similar system where if you press "X" you get a notification such as

 

"Your arms and feet are bound tight"

 

and if you hold the key you attempt to struggle out of them or cut the restraint. I think that would be better than playing RNG with dialog boxes. Then if you try again immidiatly after failing you could get something like 

 

"you are too tired and frustrated to attempt an escape" 

 

As for number of attempts to escape, honestly I don't know how it should be balanced, If the player is given the option to just spend time trying to get out of something and time is the only gate then I don't see how there is a difference between attempting it 100 times or 3. The same effort is required on the players behalf, just pressing 5 buttons over and over. Unless a player has iNeed or Frostfall there is almost no imperative to actually have to have your hands free or your 'real' armor worn. 

 

 

Moreover, unless a harness/armbinder has been manipulated previously there is no way that thing should come off on its own, ever, I understand that it is a game. But if a person has wound up in an armbinder, they did it to themselves through DCL or CD or something to that effect... they knew what they were getting into. 

 

And what they were getting into is not getting out of what they were getting into; because that is what they are into. You feel me?

 

Even though I am being a little negative here I still view the 4.0 updates as a massive improvement and look forward to seeing what modders come up with in regards to the new fantastic devices. 

 

 

The problem with using keybinds is that every Tom, Dick and Harry mod is using them. My load order is fairly small compared to what some people use, and even I have difficulties where to assign all these keys to mods want me to assign (much less remember what keys I assigned all these features to).

Then, even with a keybind, I don't think it would take much less effort to start the desired action. The X key would probably start a UIExtension wheel, making you select what restraint to process, then you -still- would have to pick what exactly to do with it. The charm of the existing method is that it works exactly like manipulating regular gear - you open the inventory and click it.

 

Could you hook struggle event to when an equipped item is being dropped from inventory?

[Princessity]

 

Hi, i have a problem, everything work good except for the armbinder, no animation load, like this user: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/65507-armbinder-animation-not-working-for-devious-devices/

 

I tried run FNIS again but no work, other animation, like struggle, work.

 

How can i fix it?

 

Thanks in advance

I fixed my problem using non beta DD, so the problem can be in this version

 

 

Could you provide more details? Which armbinder exactly are you testing?

[LazyBoot]

It looks like the CBBE version of the mesh for catsuit ballet boots are missing.

At least I'm going to go with missing rather than misnamed, since the file that is there (but with the wrong name) is also missing the nio heel offset.

 

Also, "DDX Rubbersuits CBBE.xml" in the bodyslide files are broken...

line 2 has an extra <

<   <Group name="CB++">

[valcon767]

broken....must be a new update in the last day or so ..the one I got 2 days ago has the file

 

CalienteTools/Bodyslide/SliderGroups/DDX Rubbersuits CBBE.XML

 

is there but is blank (which means the catsuit ballet boots do not get built.

 

the UNP bodyslide file in the same path ( DDX Rubbersuits UNP.XML) is there and does work.

 

sigh time to try to get it off Github yet again it has a newer version than the one I have (by a day but that is enough to make it worth getting again when I get home).

 

anyway if one of the development team would check the version in the CBBE bodyslide files (just to confirm it is not blank anymore) it would be appreciated.

 

[LazyBoot]

broken....must be a new update in the last day or so ..the one I got 2 days ago has the file

 

CalienteTools/Bodyslide/SliderGroups/DDX Rubbersuits CBBE.XML

 

is there but is blank (which means the catsuit ballet boots do not get built.

 

the UNP bodyslide file in the same path ( DDX Rubbersuits UNP.XML) is there and does work.

 

sigh time to try to get it off Github yet again it has a newer version than the one I have (by a day but that is enough to make it worth getting again when I get home).

 

anyway if one of the development team would check the version in the CBBE bodyslide files (just to confirm it is not blank anymore) it would be appreciated.

Are you sure it's blank? according to github the file hasn't been touched in 23 days, keep in mind that windows may want to try and open it with a web-browser and that will not show anything. You need to open it with a normal text-editor.

[Verstort]

DDi: 241d124

DDx: c39458c

 

Bug: If you enter your followers inventory and squeeze their plug, while the player is wearing an inflatable plug as well, the player is the one who feels the inflation, not the follower.

 

Edit: I know the inflation system cannot work for followers, although I wish it could, that is not the bug. The bug is that we squeeze a plug on an NPC and it transfers to the player, or at least the messagebox seems to think it did.

 

For followers: Can we just have a quick event that bumps arousal like the old system? No NPC interaction at all is rather unimmersive.

[Mirabo]

It looks like the CBBE version of the mesh for catsuit ballet boots are missing.

 

 

Catsuit long gloves aren't working for me, either. Same problem?

[bhenny]

 

 

 

Could you provide more details? Which armbinder exactly are you testing?

 

Every base armbinder. I'll try again and post here more details

[1815]

 

broken....must be a new update in the last day or so ..the one I got 2 days ago has the file

 

CalienteTools/Bodyslide/SliderGroups/DDX Rubbersuits CBBE.XML

 

is there but is blank (which means the catsuit ballet boots do not get built.

 

the UNP bodyslide file in the same path ( DDX Rubbersuits UNP.XML) is there and does work.

 

sigh time to try to get it off Github yet again it has a newer version than the one I have (by a day but that is enough to make it worth getting again when I get home).

 

anyway if one of the development team would check the version in the CBBE bodyslide files (just to confirm it is not blank anymore) it would be appreciated.

Are you sure it's blank? according to github the file hasn't been touched in 23 days, keep in mind that windows may want to try and open it with a web-browser and that will not show anything. You need to open it with a normal text-editor.

 

 

I can confirm that Issue by installing the CBBE Datas. The Boots are definetly not included.  I was taking a look at the Datas on GitHub.

 

 

[WaxenFigure]

Regarding the struggle attempts, I would sort the list from easy to difficut in the follwing order. I know that it is already discussed differently, but since you ask for opinions ... well here is mine:

• Handcuffs (front) - easy, maybe even as low as 5 attempts without any modifiers
• Prisoner Chains - same, maybe a slight bit more difficult, 5-10  feels okay for me
• Breast Yoke - same
• Yoke - slighty more, should be around 10-15 now, roughly double as difficult as handcuffs
• Elbowbinder - again slightly more 15-20,
• Armbinder - almost hardest, around 4-5 times as difficult as handcuffs, so in my sorting we should need at least 20 attempts, maybe even more...
• Straightjacket - hardest - at least 25

In fact I feel even higher numbers should be used to reflect reality. But as always with all those rising numbers, the problem is that is too easily on a boring path for the player.

• *excited* "I am bound in an armbinder, how exciting, let's try to escape!"
• *irritated* "I can struggle out of it, that'all? OK, let's try"
• *frustated* "10th attempt... boooring, but I feel it will work, go on"
• *yaaaaawn* "19th attempt .... one more,  I know it... boooooooring"
• *tilt* - not exciting any more

But still "only" 10 attempts for an armbinder without any modifier ... again this would also feel utterly wrong..

 

EDIT:

Nevertheless, if my character is captured by evil villains and bound in an armbinder... I go for the struggling, even with 40 attempts! I've done worse in skyrim

An idea for my rising numbers could be to randomly cap the attempts at a certain number and internally declare the equipped device inescapable-by-struggling... AND leave the player in the dark. Consequence (at least for me) would be to try 10 escape attempts and if the don't work, I still have the thrill to try more (in futile hope) or to watch out for a different escape route

 

The number of attempts is probably less important than some feedback that lets you know that the attempts have an effect. No one who doesn't know it's going to take a lot of attempts to escape is going to keep trying without some feedback indicating that progress is being made and that escape will eventually be possible.

 

Likewise a single "number of attempts" or "percent chance of escape" value is too predictable. Try instead a percent loose value, when the percent reaches 100 you are free. Then you can have a minimum and maximum percent value you get for each escape attempt or you could go with a percent escape plus a percent chance of getting lucky and escaping completely on that attempt (just don't tell people they got lucky on the attempt that would have freed them anyway).