Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

[Guest]

I have a suggestion ><

 

The suggestion is that there are always constantly situations that when wearing items like the hobble skirt or any kind of devious heel devices its a constant balancing act depending

on what boon is affecting my character. What I mean by that is that I think there should be a threshold that when wearing those devices your speed shouldn't go below  a certain threshold basically

leaving you too a crawl.

 

I don't really know scripting so this is just a concept

 

PlayerRef.ForceActorValue("SpeedMult", 20.0)  ; basically this will be the minimum speed it will set on the player so it doesn't stop you completely if you go below it will reset it too that

PlayerRef.ModActorValue("CarryWeight", 0.1)  ;  This is a trick ive seen used modyfying carry weight so speed changes taked effect immediately 

PlayerRef.ModActorValue("CarryWeight", -0.1) ; and back again.

 

basically so you can at least still retain movement because if anything is affecting your speed you will be come a living anchor. 

 

[Princessity]

It already works like this. Only the most severe speed penalty is applied. If forexamplish you're wearing both boots and hobble dress, only the hobble dress will apply its speed penalty. Speed modifiers from multiple devices do not stack.

[El_Duderino]

Some further wrist restraints escape testing.

 

Attempting to use the "Can you help me?" command on all known (to me) DD wrist restraints. In addition to the testing results yesterday, I have now discovered that the "help me" dialog doesn't show up for all types of wrist restraints.

 

NPCs show the dialog when player is wearing:

- any of the standard armbinders (DDi, DDx colors+materials)

- the High Security Armbinder (DDi)

- the yoke (DDi)

 

The dialog doesn't show up on any NPC for

- Handcuffs

- Elbowbinder

- Prisoner Chain (though not sure if they're classified as wrist restraints internally)

 

I hope this isn't making this even weirder.

[Princessity]

Nuh this is actually the only normal thing about it. Each heavy restraint has its own dialogue, we simply haven't added dialogues for the new restraints yet.

[HyperonicX]

With the latest update, I've noticed that the polling events have finally reappeared!

 

That right there has been one of the biggest things that, when they had disappeared, made things so much more unfun.

 

Without the polling events, no vibrating plugs would work, and the other events like the horny animation playing randomly (kinda annoying but fun too), and the others wouldn't work.

 

But now that they're back, I've got one thing to ask:

 

Just a bit of customization on the locks jamming/breaking and the timer on how long you have to wait. Sliders and whatnot is what I'm trying to purvey. Can you please add them so that it's as hard or easy as we want them to be instead of being forced to do it that way? (It'll also prevent me from having to spend HOURS trying to modify each device to remove the timers, etc. each time a new update for the beta is out.)

 

Otherwise, things are looking good, save for what I just asked, and the zbfworngag in the scriptinstance parts of the gags not being there. (I put the keywords in manually for all gags, not just the ebonite ones.)

[El_Duderino]

Nuh this is actually the only normal thing about it. Each heavy restraint has its own dialogue, we simply haven't added dialogues for the new restraints yet.

 

Excellent! Glad this wasn't a bug.

 

...

Just a bit of customization on the locks jamming/breaking and the timer on how long you have to wait. Sliders and whatnot is what I'm trying to purvey. Can you please add them so that it's as hard or easy as we want them to be instead of being forced to do it that way? (It'll also prevent me from having to spend HOURS trying to modify each device to remove the timers, etc. each time a new update for the beta is out.)

...

 

Check the DD MCM, first page. There's a new "Device Difficulty" pulldown menu that does pretty much what you're asking for, I think, in a convenient one-click fashion. Set it to "vanilla" and you won't be struggling much to get out of the normal (basic DD, not other mods') restraints, keys will hardly ever break and so on, though dice rolling still happens and you may be less lucky with one device, lucky with others. (See the log after struggling for a more verbose description of what the system does with the modifiers.)

 

For it to properly work, the last beta's MCM needs a new game. To adjust the device difficulty on an updated game, you can still use the setPQV (setPapyrusQuestValue) console command:

setPQV zadconfigquest devicedifficulty_var #

where # ranges from 0 to 8 with 0 being the hardest difficulty modifier, 8 the easiest.

[Nazzzgul666]

Something i thought a long time it would be nice to have, but not sure if it should be done on a framework lvl, or if that's even possible the way i hope. Maybe you like it enough, though.

 

Would it be possible to interact with plugs on NPCs while sneaking (without the pickpocket perk)?

Maybe even devices in general?

I'm not entirely sure if that's possible with current versions even with the perk, the last time one of my characters had it was when DDi 2.9x was up-to-date... if it's too much work i guess i could just add the per via console, but if it's something you could easily add i'd prefer that.

 

[El_Duderino]

Another wrist restraints test, this time with the Yoke (DDi) and DD's "Can you help me" dialog.

 

Basically the same happens as with the armbinders, the dialog and ensuing SL scene play fine but the unequipping of the yoke fails (in the log on line 17 onwards I think).

 

Papyrus_DD-Armbinders3.log

[El_Duderino]

I see that a new build is up, here's a repeat of the "Can you help me?" test, this time only with the DDi armbinder and yoke though. Sadly still yields the same results as before (scene plays but armbinder/yoke does not get removed from char), both on a brand new game and one where I used an existing save. For the record, I'm always using the "replace" function, never "merge", in MO when installing new versions of mods.

 

Papyrus_DD-Armbinders4.log

[Princessity]

The DDi update didn't have anything to do with that, I just added a few animations to our FNIS behaviour file.

 

Speaking of which, new builds up on DDi and DDx repos:

• Prototype BBYoke device available for testing. Name: "(Prototype) Breast Yoke" (should be listed first in AddItemMenu)
• Remaining struggle animations added to the FNIS list, not implemented in game yet
• Prisoner Chains now act as compound wrist restraint + collar + ankle shackles set. Utilises handcuffs animations.

Princess to-dos:

• Assign more appropriate equip message to prisoner chains (forgot, quick fix)
• Finalise BBYoke implementation (pending test results)
• Investigate the possibility of more efficient struggle animation handling (conceptualisation finished, ready for implementation)
• Implement struggling animations for everything (on hold, pending evaluation of the new struggle anim system)
• Rework gag dialogue (conceptualisation finished, ready for implementation)
• Standardise AA application methods across hobble dresses and wrist restraints
• Clean up instances of redundancy and overcomplicated interactions between the wrist restraints mechanics and the AA system (optional, optimisation and polishing phase)
• Implement pony AAs (pushed back, pending the resolution of higher priority issues)

[Princessity]

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

[incrediblysecure]

Sliders and whatnot is what I'm trying to purvey. Can you please add them so that it's as hard or easy as we want them to be instead of being forced to do it that way? (It'll also prevent me from having to spend HOURS trying to modify each device to remove the timers, etc. each time a new update for the beta is out.)

 

i wrote a proof-of-concept xedit script the last time this discussion came up:

 

https://pastebin.com/XssS63ip

 

change like two lines and it should take about ten seconds. if you want i'll add some tickey boxes so you don't have to change any lines

[Seph64]

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

TESV 2017-07-19 19-39-03-05.png

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

 

That does not look comfortable. My first impressions just by looking at the picture alone is that the mod could do without it. But that's just me.

[Mr. Guyinco-Gnito]

the device is pretty nice. not my taste but it could be also used for something like this.

with a timed lock and struggle animations 

[Darkpig]

 

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

TESV 2017-07-19 19-39-03-05.png

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

 

That does not look comfortable. My first impressions just by looking at the picture alone is that the mod could do without it. But that's just me.

 

 

I think we went past that point ever since we introduced the pear of anguish.

 

[atasly]

-I don't know if it's a recent problem but there is some clipping for bound combat animation (with Feuertin's animations at least) for armbinder/elbowbinder (didn't test every arm restraints, only those two) pictures below

-For Prisoner chains it seems there is a second chain (highlighted in red) between the two handcuffs, is it intended ? picture below

-I do not love nor hate the breast yoke, but having more devices is always a plus ! (It must give you tons of work though)

[El_Duderino]

 

 

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

TESV 2017-07-19 19-39-03-05.png

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

 

That does not look comfortable. My first impressions just by looking at the picture alone is that the mod could do without it. But that's just me.

 

 

I think we went past that point ever since we introduced the pear of anguish.

 

I entirely agree with that, Darkpig. There are indeed quite a few other items in DD already that your doctor wouldn't consider healthy -- and why not, with a mod like this. Why limit it to one certain aspect or type or material of restraints?

 

(Come to think of it, as painful as that new yoke undeniably looks, I can't quite imagine that having a pair of ballet heels locked onto your feet for hours or even days is a lot more, uhm, comfortable than that thing. But what do I know, I'm just looking at pixels here )

[Princessity]

-I don't know if it's a recent problem but there is some clipping for bound combat animation (with Feuertin's animations at least) for armbinder/elbowbinder (didn't test every arm restraints, only those two) pictures below

-For Prisoner chains it seems there is a second chain (highlighted in red) between the two handcuffs, is it intended ? picture below

-I do not love nor hate the breast yoke, but having more devices is always a plus ! (It must give you tons of work though)

I already reported the clipping issue to Tin in the dev conversation. He'll fix it.

 

And the prisoner chain is going to be weird, it wasn't really designed for with this animation in mind and Heretic is currently busy with other things so this won't be getting fixed for the time being.

 

 

 

 

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

TESV 2017-07-19 19-39-03-05.png

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

 

That does not look comfortable. My first impressions just by looking at the picture alone is that the mod could do without it. But that's just me.

 

 

I think we went past that point ever since we introduced the pear of anguish.

 

I entirely agree with that, Darkpig. There are indeed quite a few other items in DD already that your doctor wouldn't consider healthy -- and why not, with a mod like this. Why limit it to one certain aspect or type or material of restraints?

 

(Come to think of it, as painful as that new yoke undeniably looks, I can't quite imagine that having a pair of ballet heels locked onto your feet for hours or even days is a lot more, uhm, comfortable than that thing. But what do I know, I'm just looking at pixels here )

 

 

I'm not talking about the nature of the item. What I mean is that it doesn't look appealing at all. None of the other items cause ugly bodily deformations so I'm fine with them (well, I did object to the pear at first but I warmed to it while working on its mechanics)

 

Aesthetics aside, I think it's technically questionable as well, bodyslide was clearly not designed for this sort of thing so the quality of output leaves much to be desired.

[dnoah]

On a personal note, I'm not the biggest fan of the breast yoke. It looks... mhm... I'm not sure if body horror belongs in DD. And its implementation as a body slot blocking device feels somewhat jarring.

 

TESV 2017-07-19 19-39-03-05.png

 

I'm tempted to appeal for reevaluation of its addition but I'll wait for test results and user feedback first.

 

I think it's lacking a lockable back strap. Additional security, as well as don't want 'em end up sagging below her waistline. Otherwise looks nice.

[Guest]

My personal opinion is it doesn't look pretty but it isn't supposed too. Its a humiliation item and for that aspect I would like it too stay tbh. I mean if mods don't want to make use of these types of items they really don't need too but for those that want them I think it should stay.

 

and I second the back-strap for this item

[HyperonicX]

 

Sliders and whatnot is what I'm trying to purvey. Can you please add them so that it's as hard or easy as we want them to be instead of being forced to do it that way? (It'll also prevent me from having to spend HOURS trying to modify each device to remove the timers, etc. each time a new update for the beta is out.)

 

i wrote a proof-of-concept xedit script the last time this discussion came up:

 

https://pastebin.com/XssS63ip

 

change like two lines and it should take about ten seconds. if you want i'll add some tickey boxes so you don't have to change any lines

 

 

I'm sorry, but I don't understand Papyrus script. Changing two lines is like asking me to create a program without any programming knowledge.

[El_Duderino]

 

I'm not talking about the nature of the item. What I mean is that it doesn't look appealing at all. None of the other items cause ugly bodily deformations so I'm fine with them (well, I did object to the pear at first but I warmed to it while working on its mechanics)

 

Aesthetics aside, I think it's technically questionable as well, bodyslide was clearly not designed for this sort of thing so the quality of output leaves much to be desired.

 

Ah, I misunderstood you then, sorry. However... now you've raised my curiosity and I went looking for pictures of something like that in the depths of the internet. Needless to say that I found some plenty!

 

What Haeretic did with the body model there isn't actually very far off from what happens to the body in reality it seems. I'm not such a huge fan of the aesthetics either, particularly after seeing some of those pictures just now, but I'd say the model Haeretic built is pretty realistic.

 

Probably depends quite a lot on how the body preset and morphs are being used by the player and after looking at it in-game briefly it seems to work better with larger and "standard UNP shaped" breasts. But that's also true for other clothing and devices models that cover the chest (like how the chastity bra can look a bit weird when one is using Racemenu Morphs to come up with realistically non-round breasts).

[dnoah]

My personal opinion is it doesn't look pretty but it isn't supposed too. Its a humiliation item and for that aspect I would like it too stay tbh. I mean if mods don't want to make use of these types of items they really don't need too but for those that want them I think it should stay.

 

and I second the back-strap for this item

 

More like mild torture device. Can't comfortably lie down in it, as in case of a yoke. It's just that most mods likely won't have the level of sophistication to apply it properly (first offense - demonstration only, etc.), and just slap it all on a character and leave her to stew.

 

Another thing: there's a slight mismatch of bone weights in UNP version, most visible when adjusting shoulder width slider in Bodyslide:

[Guest]

 

More like mild torture device. Can't comfortably lie down in it, as in case of a yoke. It's just that most mods likely won't have the level of sophistication to apply it properly (first offense - demonstration only, etc.), and just slap it all on a character and leave her to stew.

 

Do you really want to debate whether its more of a torture device or a humiliation device or do you just like correcting people?

It's both humiliating and a torture device its not 1 or the other or more of one category. I am sorry I hate when people do that

Well actually *pushed glasses closer to face* its this instead of this blah blah.... anyway.

 

Also I am pretty sure people will test out items before they add them to their mod willy nilly, I am just in favor of having options.

 

 

 

[Princessity]

I guess there's technically no harm in letting it stay. I'm not sure about having it as the flagship item of this device type, but maybe we'll come up some good fits for this animation set in the future. The animation could probably work with something less problematic like a yoke+chastity bra hybrid but that's a bit beyond the scope of this release cycle.

 

Maybe it just looks ugly in my specific use case. Let's find out: I'd like to ask testers to take some screenshots of how the item looks with their bodyslide preset applied (and please mention whether it's the UUNP or CBBE version). If the overall results look satisfactory I'll let it go. This test will also be a good way to identify bugs.