Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

bathoz · September 2, 2017

Haven't played it, but as someone who's lapsed his Skyriming after too many module save collapses and other distractions, this one feels like it might be the one to suck me back into the pain of Mod Organiser.

Though I'm interested to see what else you allegedly have planned.

Falvnar · September 2, 2017

Enslavement failure, I have plans on it but atm what happens is more of a placeholder till I get round to it, imo it's harsh enough so doesn't need tweaking until I get to the rework. If I get the time I have some really fun ideas that could work.

My favourite idea is you follower just walks away. Then once a day a group of debt collector come and take all your stuff and take off like 20% of what it's worth off the debt. Of course they'll use your body and may leave you with a few devious presents (this is a long way off and just an idea so far)

I did figure that the enslavement failure situation was in a bit of a WiP state. I definitely like your current idea for it; it's much more engaging than my suggestion.

There is one thing I do wonder with peoples items flying off into the abyss. Is your framerate capped at 60 cause the physics of the game falls apart if you go over that, I may change how cause going into followers inventory to get your gear back will have the same effect as putting them on the floor, it's just annoying enough to stop the player reequipping them asap.

I currently have my framerate capped at 100 and am using the 'fMaxTime=' ini tweak set to 0.0100 to prevent the crazy physics. I'd like go higher than that to match my refresh rate, but it makes looking up and down nigh impossible because of the whole vertical sensitivity inversely linked to framerate thing. I've been using this tweak for months and have not noticed any physics issues that I didn't have before.

I believe what is happening with the items being dropped from the player's inventory is that they're occasionally being placed inside eachother, and the clipping causes the physics engine to get confused and launch them at an absurd velocity, sometimes through the displacement mesh that makes up the ground. Other times, the player just accidentally kicks the items, as the player is usually moving when the force drop occurs. That's usually less of an issue, but it still can be irritating when you're near tall grass.

Min time for deals isn't needed for deals because of how they work and make the player feel.

So like you said, you could make a deal and pay out in a few mins of farming, that makes you feel in control and it's manageable.

The loss of control starts happening has your follower starts upgrading the deal because if you making deals you lack the gold for it so getting a level 2 deal is going to take a while to payoff because you need to pay it off in full not in stages. You might get to like 800 gold but then have to pay off debt instead meaning you get a little stuck.

Then of course you get to a level 3 deal which has some effect on the game and abuses the player now that control you so sure you had is gone you need to try and save 1500 gold while paying off your follower.

Then of course you have no more deals to make, you get enslaved and as soon as your free .... your deals will still be there waiting for you .

I think that you may have misunderstood my statement. The situation that inspired that comment is this: I have two sets of deals completely agreed to for a total of 3,000 gold to pay off. I have 1,500 gold in my inventory, and a total debt of just below the enslavement threshold. My follower won't let me actually pay the debt because of the deals, but I can make a new deal to reduce debt if I choose. Paying off one of my current deals doesn't make sense, as I'm mere hours away from enslavement. Instead what I do is make three new deals, and then seconds later, pay them off. This effectively reduces my debt back to 0 while not agreeing to any new deals, but it does mean that I paid 1,500 gold for 1,200 debt reduction. My complaint is that this feels overly game-like and breaks immersion for me, yet I feel greatly compelled to do it due to the mod's mechanics. It's not wholly necessary to add a time restriction; I can always pretend that there is one. Ideally though, something would happen if I tried to do this.

Perhaps your follower could still allow you to pay off your debt, but punish you for having the on-going deals by giving less debt reduction than your actual payments. It could potentially even scale with the amount you owe on deals. For example, if you've got 500 gold to pay on deals, have the follower only reduce debt by 95% of your payments. 1,000 gold owed on deals would change the modifier to 90%, 1,500 to 85%, and so on until the player only receives 55% of their paid gold in debt reduction. Actual amounts could vary, of course. This would give the benefit of presenting the player with the choice of agreeing to a deal that reduces debt by more than a simple payment towards the debt, thus incentivising the taking of deals in a similar manner that the current implementation does. Of course, you then end up with the same issue of taking a deal and immediately paying it off again to avoid the reduced return punishment.

I do understand the combining of deals to require the player to have a significant chunk of change to pay one set off and the final stage of the deal set being particularly punishing. It's quite an excellent design that subtly shifts control away from the player without them noticing. Kudos on that one.

Fast travel and things, it should activate it will just be delayed since it works on idle line and the game kinda has a fit working things out idle line wise bit after a little your follower should be striping you down and tieing you up. To be honest, I like this it gives the player time to react on arriving and if they forget it's there fault. If it doesn't happen at all that is a problem though.

I guess that it's just being unreliable for some reason, then. I did have my follower suddenly trigger it once when I fast travelled to the Nightgate Inn (the one in the center of the wilderness) to rest for the night. I've never had it trigger when I fast travel to cities, not even when I spend several real-life minutes there.

Dialogue stuff

I understand the need to prevent repetitious dialogue from being monotonous and drawn-out, and I'm not sure of how many characters that Skyrim allows for a single dialogue line. I know I have a problem with being overly ambitious, but I would personally try to work around this by having two dialogue options that lead to the same thing, with the second replacing the first after it has been used. The inital one would give the drawn-out explanation, and the second one would be more brief. For example:

Dialogue option 1: "Is there any other way which I could reduce my debt?"

"Sure. I think that we could work something out. In fact, let's make this fun. I'll suggest a deal, and if you agree to it, I'll reduce your debt by 400 septims. If you refuse, I'll increase your debt by 200 septims instead. Okay?"

Dialogue option 2, which replaces option 1: "Could we talk about making a deal to reduce my debt to you?"

"Alright. Same arrangement as before: I'll offer a deal to reduce your debt, but if you refuse, I'll increase your debt instead. Okay?"

This allows for giving the full explanation of game mechanics in a natural manner while also preventing the monotony of being forced to endure multiple lines of the same dialogue over and over again.

Any chance of changing "huni" to "sweetie" or "cutie"? To me huni sounds more like something my husband would call me. Even doll, woman, lass, lady, or boss would be better, this is just my opinion though.

I agree that calling the player 'honey' is a bit odd. It's too intimate for something that you would call a stranger, though after some time, it does start to make sense. Personally, I would like if the greeting could change over time. Start off with something like 'pal', progress to 'friend', and bring 'honey' in later. Words like 'woman' or 'lady' should probably be avoided in favour of remaining gender-neutral. If willpower has dropped low enough and/or some deals have been made, then your follower could call you 'pet' or 'play-thing'.

steelmagpie · September 2, 2017

Dialogue stuff

So, I'm not a writer or that good at writing so I'm sure there will always be issues with how the dialogue is within the mod.

In the case of deal dialogue though it needs to be short and straight to the point because the player will be looking at it a lot and going through menu after menu, basically if you have a lot of dialogue on something like that, (opinion) the player will enjoy it the first few times but then the extra lines just mean the user needs to spam more to get through it.

The other problem about writing dialogue is that this mod needs to work on any follower which means I'll always be limited it what I can say or how I can say it.

That said, I'm sure it could be improved and if I can think of a better way of writing it I will.

===========================

I'll talk about my vision of storytelling in a game and In my mod.

You can act like a book and tell a player how they feel and how other feel or act, the strength of this is there is little confusion and if done well everyone can enjoy it. The problem here for me is I can't write well enough to achieve this. When I was a kid I wanted to write a book but I know it would be and then this, then this and then that lol.

There is a trick you can use that is exclusive to games though, as a player makes choices and takes actions if you make events that react to that the player the imagination will write the story. For example, like you building a story of hiring followers to rescue captives but you didn't count on your follower not liking being not payed so you started making deals trying to work things out but things didn't work out as planed and ect ect. Can I write a fun tale like that? no, but I can make a mod that allows you to create tale like that ^^.

This story is only something you can create for yourself and by exploiting that I can use your imagination to make my shitty writing skill create amazing stories and that's my vision on when I make this mod.

That's the reason for dialogue changing a little when your willpower is low plays on this because you can see it 2 ways, your follower is becoming more dominate and taking control or you feel your too weak to convince your follower to do things now because of the things that happened to you. Which is true, neither but your imagination will choose the most appealing and build your story from that.

So, yea my dialogue isn't gonna be the best but as long as it creates the scene I can just exploit your imagination this imo is art ^^.

All this is why, I'm so focused on you making choices that screw yourself over because you create the reason to make the choices and you are the one reasonable for crawling naked trough town. How it happened or why will mostly be in your imagination ^^.

With all that said, I will always try to write better and I will likely go over a lot of the dialogue when the mood take me to try and improve it. I have no issue with people taking this mod and rewriting the dialogue and releasing as there own mod I would say wait until the complete version before ya start tho lol.

(I wrote a lot this while tired so it will probably be a bit messy)

ll follower you should of hired yourself it the getting rid of em my mod handles it might have something to do with my mod (a bug) , I'll look into it.

I am enjoying the looser style of writting, as you say the converstions trigger the imagination. The same simple comment like "I am glad to see you like playing games" will be read different way depending on the build up to the comment was.. It is used so far as a confirmation of submission to the dominant follower in one scene but could also be taken as the follower accepting the player is up for fun in the same scene depending on the "real" persons interpritation of how it occured. This is just of many examples of simple comments being able to carry on multi[ple "imagined "tales which always form in the players mind to help "mush" some of our favourite mods into some kind of Immersive playing..

An expert writer could create a tale which takes you from 'A' to 'B' with massive immersion, such as Maids II. Great if you want the same story over and over with very little in the way of altering the "tale" in your mind.

A clever writer knows when to leave details out and just have enough hints and hooks to draw the tale from within the player. This way you have a mod with can be played again and again and dependant on the events the tales can be wildly different or similar with unexpected surprises.

I like the clever writer apporach you are using here (never underestimate the skill in creating just enough narative to draw us all in and have us creating our stories), Too much and you risk events not fitting certain scenes in the players mind, too little and you lose the atmosphere of the follower gaining the upper hand both mentaly and physically with restraints.. So far this mod has an excellent balance between the two and I have a lot of confidence in its continuing to keep us on the edge of seats while playing and checking before each playing (yes i am that addicted) for any update with new and unexpected content..

Balance, the art of flailing your arms madly whilst not falling off a rolling ball blindfold over a narrow path over a lava pool on a windy day with a sneeze building.. Clever if you can do it

Corsayr · September 2, 2017

A couple of thoughts

#1 Should your follower be taking all your money at slavery and applying none of it to debt? I understand a penalty for not paying on time, but it feels a little too much for them to take everything and not apply any of it to debt. To me it loses the "it my fault this is happening" and gains a "my follow just stole from me" feel. (it shouldn't come up very often, but it happened once when I had enough to pay off my follower, but didn't notice I was in slavery range as a result of sleeping. I must of hit the follower recalculation triggers just right and went from fairly safe before bed to way over the line after I woke up. I got the dialog that it was about to happen, but my follower was downstairs and I couldn't get to her in time.)

#2 Also it might be nice if the slavery debt trigger could be a scaling point like the daily follower rate except based on number of days behind in payments.

Something like this

Not super huge, but just a thought to make MCM settings something that can dynamically change without intervention during a run through.

Notes on play through:

So far everything appears to be running normal. The new MCM settings tend to reset on their own, as has been pointed out by others.

If you need any help with dialog, I can help! Do you have like a spread sheet with a layout of dialog needs?

Sample Dialog (for when your follower finally gives up on you {Slavery Failure})

"Look Huni, you're just not making it. I tried to help you get your act together but you're a bum, and I need to cut my loses on this. Good luck getting home."

Okay not my best stuff! But it's generic and would fit any follower!

*jbezorg* · September 2, 2017

Running into an issue where summoned followers are triggering the "*puts hand on shoulder*" message.

Lozeak · September 3, 2017

Dialogue stuff

I understand the need to prevent repetitious dialogue from being monotonous and drawn-out, and I'm not sure of how many characters that Skyrim allows for a single dialogue line. I know I have a problem with being overly ambitious, but I would personally try to work around this by having two dialogue options that lead to the same thing, with the second replacing the first after it has been used. The inital one would give the drawn-out explanation, and the second one would be more brief. For example:

Dialogue option 1: "Is there any other way which I could reduce my debt?"

"Sure. I think that we could work something out. In fact, let's make this fun. I'll suggest a deal, and if you agree to it, I'll reduce your debt by 400 septims. If you refuse, I'll increase your debt by 200 septims instead. Okay?"

Dialogue option 2, which replaces option 1: "Could we talk about making a deal to reduce my debt to you?"

"Alright. Same arrangement as before: I'll offer a deal to reduce your debt, but if you refuse, I'll increase your debt instead. Okay?"

This allows for giving the full explanation of game mechanics in a natural manner while also preventing the monotony of being forced to endure multiple lines of the same dialogue over and over again.

Any chance of changing "huni" to "sweetie" or "cutie"? To me huni sounds more like something my husband would call me. Even doll, woman, lass, lady, or boss would be better, this is just my opinion though.

I agree that calling the player 'honey' is a bit odd. It's too intimate for something that you would call a stranger, though after some time, it does start to make sense. Personally, I would like if the greeting could change over time. Start off with something like 'pal', progress to 'friend', and bring 'honey' in later. Words like 'woman' or 'lady' should probably be avoided in favour of remaining gender-neutral. If willpower has dropped low enough and/or some deals have been made, then your follower could call you 'pet' or 'play-thing'.

It's something, I'll consider more when I'm at a more complete state cause having dialogue change means I have to deal with variables or say once stuff then on top of that when I do an update it's 2 pieces of dialogue to update if it effects it.

Huni, stuff it's more I guess perception and local dialect because I have had plenty of people hey huni/hun to friends and stuff, I consider it a friendly greeting. I may change it in the future to be a little more neutral.

Dialogue changing over time won't happen for a few reasons. It just doesn't add much content wise and means I have more dialogue trees to construct it's just feels like a lot of work.

I will look into putting a string variable for what the follower refers to you as so you could choose that. (I have no idea if this is possible and from my experience so far I think it would be buggy)

I am enjoying the looser style of writting, as you say the converstions trigger the imagination. The same simple comment like "I am glad to see you like playing games" will be read different way depending on the build up to the comment was.. It is used so far as a confirmation of submission to the dominant follower in one scene but could also be taken as the follower accepting the player is up for fun in the same scene depending on the "real" persons interpritation of how it occured. This is just of many examples of simple comments being able to carry on multi[ple "imagined "tales which always form in the players mind to help "mush" some of our favourite mods into some kind of Immersive playing..

An expert writer could create a tale which takes you from 'A' to 'B' with massive immersion, such as Maids II. Great if you want the same story over and over with very little in the way of altering the "tale" in your mind.

A clever writer knows when to leave details out and just have enough hints and hooks to draw the tale from within the player. This way you have a mod with can be played again and again and dependant on the events the tales can be wildly different or similar with unexpected surprises.

I like the clever writer apporach you are using here (never underestimate the skill in creating just enough narative to draw us all in and have us creating our stories), Too much and you risk events not fitting certain scenes in the players mind, too little and you lose the atmosphere of the follower gaining the upper hand both mentaly and physically with restraints.. So far this mod has an excellent balance between the two and I have a lot of confidence in its continuing to keep us on the edge of seats while playing and checking before each playing (yes i am that addicted) for any update with new and unexpected content..

Balance, the art of flailing your arms madly whilst not falling off a rolling ball blindfold over a narrow path over a lava pool on a windy day with a sneeze building.. Clever if you can do it

I know the feeling of checking everyday, done it with a lot of games/content I really love it's always exciting to see more stuff of the things you enjoy ^^.

No plans for an update for a little atm though, I have time to work on it this week and the things I want to do are tough there may be a bug fix and stuff.

A couple of thoughts

#1 Should your follower be taking all your money at slavery and applying none of it to debt? I understand a penalty for not paying on time, but it feels a little too much for them to take everything and not apply any of it to debt. To me it loses the "it my fault this is happening" and gains a "my follow just stole from me" feel. (it shouldn't come up very often, but it happened once when I had enough to pay off my follower, but didn't notice I was in slavery range as a result of sleeping. I must of hit the follower recalculation triggers just right and went from fairly safe before bed to way over the line after I woke up. I got the dialog that it was about to happen, but my follower was downstairs and I couldn't get to her in time.)

#2 Also it might be nice if the slavery debt trigger could be a scaling point like the daily follower rate except based on number of days behind in payments.

Something like this

debt MCM thoughts.jpg

Not super huge, but just a thought to make MCM settings something that can dynamically change without intervention during a run through.

Notes on play through:

So far everything appears to be running normal. The new MCM settings tend to reset on their own, as has been pointed out by others.

If you need any help with dialog, I can help! Do you have like a spread sheet with a layout of dialog needs?

Sample Dialog (for when your follower finally gives up on you {Slavery Failure})

"Look Huni, you're just not making it. I tried to help you get your act together but you're a bum, and I need to cut my loses on this. Good luck getting home."

Okay not my best stuff! But it's generic and would fit any follower!

1. It is intentional because it stops the player hording gold and just buying out of slavery.

On the story side of it I see it as you ow your follower 1k and they enslave you then find you hording gold they could of paid so just take it without removing debt as a punishment for that.

I do like that idea of if you break enslavement debt you have a period of time to try and get it back below that and it would be better time for the games to kick in. I may use the idea but atm it will stay as it is until I have the rest of the 1.0/1.5 content done.

I have no organisation for anything lol. I have a mental image that is a simple structure of how the mod works and I build it round that.

Rather than fix dialog as I go, I want to do it more when I've finished though and I will be open to suggestions from anyone ^^ but that's not now.

Running into an issue where summoned followers are triggering the "*puts hand on shoulder*" message.

Yea, I need to fix that ;;. I think I'm going to rework it when I get a chance cause I don't know why it's happening.

*jbezorg* · September 3, 2017

Death Alternative seems to have a pretty good system for tracking followers.

Think this is also causing a CTD when using the statue of Mara in Live Another Life.

jaberwocky · September 3, 2017

Confession, I have not yet tested this mod and I am only halfway through reading the already 18 pages of this topic.

Anyway, I might have a suggestion to force the dragonborn to use a follower (instead of gold):

When you kill a dragon, you gain vanity (nine points per dragon-soul). When vanity reaches level 25 or more, you will experience negative effects (Like increased weakness to physical and magical damage as your vanity dangerously increases your foolish bravery). To cure you from your silly vanity, you need to as a follower to help you bring your feed back to the ground. You can be forced to wear a 'cursed necklace' that allows your follower more direct control over you (Like ordering you to jump or make a pose from time to time). Each time this happens, a little bit of your vanity is removed (let's say 0.5 points). Once your vanity hits zero again, you can ask to be let free.

What you call a decrease in willpower, might perhaps be an increase in submissiveness instead. When nothing goes wrong and you fight enough evil together, you will be fine. But in the devious Skyrim, you might end up forced to walk around naked for a while. At that point you might at random see the message 'NameFollower is looking at your naked body', which will increase your submissiveness a little (let's say 0.03 points) while 'NameFollower is looking at your naked bound body' will increase your submissiveness a bit more (let's say 0.06 points).

As your submissiveness grows, the follower will slowly add additional conditions before releasing you. Like "do an additional bounty quest", or dance in a tavern in the evening (which will also increase your submissiveness, especially when there is a change one you getting raped). As the dragonborn' submissiveness grows, it might be even the dragonborn asking her follower/master if he/she could make her earn her release after helping her with her vanity.

Of course, as submissiveness grown, other things will happen. Like your follower taking all the restraint-keys you find, together with all the other things you have already implemented. (As submissiveness will increase faster and faster, it might be wise to have more space between the thresholds increase with higher submissiveness). (Note: it will also become harder and harder to get free, as at some point you might be forced to dance naked in 7 different taverns in the evening first)

The only thing that remains is perhaps something like a reputation system in each hold. By dancing naked in taverns or crawling around naked or whoring, you get a harlot-reputation in a hold. And when that reputation gets high enough, the town people will start to treat you as a harlot. When not being controlled by your follower, the town folk will start with making degrading remarks once a while that might become 'better' over time. Next perhaps are the butt-slap and boob-grab animations that might occur. And finally the town folk might give you 3 to 13 septims, which will force you to strip naked (and either dance or crawl, depending on the sex of the town person). Doing things that earn you money (even if it is not completely voluntarily) will increase your reputation a bit further.

On the bright side, when your reputation in a hold gets high enough, you get one vanity point less each time you slay a dragon. Meaning that if you are considered a complete whore in each hold, you become immune to vanity (each hold will protect you for one vanity point).

Two additional notes:
When your harlot-reputation is high enough, jarls and certain vendors and trainers might decide not to talk to you unless your master/mistress is around. Meaning that you might have to ask a follower to take accept you as their plaything.

And the follower is aware of the reputations in different holds, and might send the dragonborn to dance in a tavern where your reputation is still low.

Short version:

Absorbing dragon-souls increases vanity-level which is bad.

Having a follower who can control you will cure your from your vanity.

But while walking around with a follower, things can happen that will increase your submissiveness (or decrease your willpower).

When submissiveness is high enough, the follower could force the dragonborn to do things that give you a harlot-reputation in a hold.

Having a harlot-reputation in a hold has some negative side-effects, but also protects you from future vanity.

Conclusion:

And as I write this down, I realize that I have created something that perhaps is well-balanced, but also rather large and complex....

When I can think of a simpler reason as to why the dragonborn should risk having a follower that could enslave her, I'll let you know.

donttouchmethere · September 3, 2017

well thats strange, i didnt had any problem with 0.89v (and lower) and LAL,

but with 0.895v i get a CTD as soon as i click on the LAL mara statue

will test a fallback to 0.89, maybe something else causes this in combination with DF

EDIT01: (not using death alternative)

EDIT02: i had the same problem with the "not crawling with town collar"

my solution was to change the load order to fit it to the masters of deviousfollowers.esp:

skyrim.esm

update.esm

sexlab.esm

ZaZAnimationPack.esm

SexLabAroused.esm

Heretical Resources.esm

Devious Devices - Assests.esm

ZazExtensionPack.esm

Devious Devices - Integration.esm

Devious Devices - Expansion.esm

it works now on every version or load order change

guess its important where heretical and zazextension is located in the load order

EDIT03: fallback to 0.89 sloved the issue (with same load order), i am able to use LAL mara statue.

seems something went wrong after 0.89+

Leeeeeroy · September 3, 2017

It crashes when interacting with any statue, not only mara's statue added by LAL, i was doing clavicus vile quest and the game crashes when i try to interact with it.

Leeyds4LLTS · September 4, 2017

Hello =) This mod has my interest peeked. I found a follower and played around for awhile... watched things develop. I found I was unable to dismiss my follower, even after paying off debt.

I even tried starting a brand new game, and just walking up and recruiting and dismissing a follower... still no luck dismissing a follower (even after paying debt). After dismissing and paying debt, follower still follows you around, and the "showfollowercount" console command shows I still have 1 follower.

This seems like a pretty fundamental issue. At some point followers should be able to be dismissed.

GeorgiaCav · September 4, 2017

Ok, I'm an idiot, but:

Are the DD Betas the ones in the Github links on the first page of the DD development thread?

Because those are dated from before the latest releases. Are there other links I should be following?

bahamut2195 · September 4, 2017

Ok, I'm an idiot, but:

Are the DD Betas the ones in the Github links on the first page of the DD development thread?

Because those are dated from before the latest releases. Are there other links I should be following?

That's them, the second list of three in the first post of the development thread.

steelmagpie · September 4, 2017

Ok, I'm an idiot, but:

Are the DD Betas the ones in the Github links on the first page of the DD development thread?

Because those are dated from before the latest releases. Are there other links I should be following?

the DD files you need are on the Github pages linked in the second block of three links on the page. Then on the left hand side quite near the top is a hard to see at first drop down menu with "Master" on it. click this and select "development" and it should then change to the needed development files (approx 15 day old last time I looked but can be updated at any time). On the top right hand side is the down load menu and you need the "save to zip" option and once downloaded instal as normal.. Hopefully this helps if not just ask and I will see if I can clear up any problems...

steelmagpie · September 4, 2017

Hello =) This mod has my interest peeked. I found a follower and played around for awhile... watched things develop. I found I was unable to dismiss my follower, even after paying off debt.

I even tried starting a brand new game, and just walking up and recruiting and dismissing a follower... still no luck dismissing a follower (even after paying debt). After dismissing and paying debt, follower still follows you around, and the "showfollowercount" console command shows I still have 1 follower.

This seems like a pretty fundamental issue. At some point followers should be able to be dismissed.

Have you tried to "reset" the debt in MCM and then dismiss the follower? also are you using any multifollower mods such as EFF or AFT as these can affect how some things work from my earlier testing.. Immersive AFT was the least affect of the multifollower mods when I used it if you need more followers.. It could also be fixed with the disable follower chat thing in MCM as that can block some things too but if they follow you after being dismissed this amy not be any help...

Leeyds4LLTS · September 4, 2017

Hello =) This mod has my interest peeked. I found a follower and played around for awhile... watched things develop. I found I was unable to dismiss my follower, even after paying off debt.

I even tried starting a brand new game, and just walking up and recruiting and dismissing a follower... still no luck dismissing a follower (even after paying debt). After dismissing and paying debt, follower still follows you around, and the "showfollowercount" console command shows I still have 1 follower.

This seems like a pretty fundamental issue. At some point followers should be able to be dismissed.

Have you tried to "reset" the debt in MCM and then dismiss the follower? also are you using any multifollower mods such as EFF or AFT as these can affect how some things work from my earlier testing.. Immersive AFT was the least affect of the multifollower mods when I used it if you need more followers.. It could also be fixed with the disable follower chat thing in MCM as that can block some things too but if they follow you after being dismissed this amy not be any help...

I have tried the reset button in the mcm menu. I do have eff. I could try uninstalling eff and see what happens. Thx for your reply =)

Corsayr · September 4, 2017

Hello =) This mod has my interest peeked. I found a follower and played around for awhile... watched things develop. I found I was unable to dismiss my follower, even after paying off debt.

I even tried starting a brand new game, and just walking up and recruiting and dismissing a follower... still no luck dismissing a follower (even after paying debt). After dismissing and paying debt, follower still follows you around, and the "showfollowercount" console command shows I still have 1 follower.

This seems like a pretty fundamental issue. At some point followers should be able to be dismissed.

Have you tried to "reset" the debt in MCM and then dismiss the follower? also are you using any multifollower mods such as EFF or AFT as these can affect how some things work from my earlier testing.. Immersive AFT was the least affect of the multifollower mods when I used it if you need more followers.. It could also be fixed with the disable follower chat thing in MCM as that can block some things too but if they follow you after being dismissed this amy not be any help...

I have tried the reset button in the mcm menu. I do have eff. I could try uninstalling eff and see what happens. Thx for your reply =)

Which Follower?

Leeyds4LLTS · September 4, 2017

Hello =) This mod has my interest peeked. I found a follower and played around for awhile... watched things develop. I found I was unable to dismiss my follower, even after paying off debt.

I even tried starting a brand new game, and just walking up and recruiting and dismissing a follower... still no luck dismissing a follower (even after paying debt). After dismissing and paying debt, follower still follows you around, and the "showfollowercount" console command shows I still have 1 follower.

This seems like a pretty fundamental issue. At some point followers should be able to be dismissed.

Have you tried to "reset" the debt in MCM and then dismiss the follower? also are you using any multifollower mods such as EFF or AFT as these can affect how some things work from my earlier testing.. Immersive AFT was the least affect of the multifollower mods when I used it if you need more followers.. It could also be fixed with the disable follower chat thing in MCM as that can block some things too but if they follow you after being dismissed this amy not be any help...

I have tried the reset button in the mcm menu. I do have eff. I could try uninstalling eff and see what happens. Thx for your reply =)

Which Follower?

It doesn't seem to matter which follower, I originally tried it with a follower mod named Amy, then I tried it with Jenassa in Whiterun.....

valcon767 · September 5, 2017

well thats strange, i didnt had any problem with 0.89v (and lower) and LAL,

but with 0.895v i get a CTD as soon as i click on the LAL mara statue

will test a fallback to 0.89, maybe something else causes this in combination with DF

EDIT01: (not using death alternative)

EDIT02: i had the same problem with the "not crawling with town collar"

my solution was to change the load order to fit it to the masters of deviousfollowers.esp:

skyrim.esm

update.esm

sexlab.esm

ZaZAnimationPack.esm

SexLabAroused.esm

Heretical Resources.esm

Devious Devices - Assests.esm

ZazExtensionPack.esm

Devious Devices - Integration.esm

Devious Devices - Expansion.esm

it works now on every version or load order change

guess its important where heretical and zazextension is located in the load order

EDIT03: fallback to 0.89 sloved the issue (with same load order), i am able to use LAL mara statue.

seems something went wrong after 0.89+

i get the AS-LAL crash also on version 0.895 but not any other version

fallback to any previous version fixes this for me.

note that I get the ctd with other statues, but only sometimes (Clavicus Vile statue crashed 1 of 3 times i used it).

the not crawling in town issue is solved by using the load order you posted as modified below (because I use TUFP)

Skyrim.esm

Update.esm

TaraUltimateFurniturePack.esm

Sexlab.esm

ZAZAnimationpack.esm

SexLabAroused.esm

Heretical Resources.esm

Devious Devices - Assets.esm

ZazExtensionpPack.esm

Devious Devices - integration.esm

Devious Devices - expansion.esm

with the added step of having to start a new game (NOT a game from the AS-LAL cell but a whole NEW game from main menu).

the new version (0.895) however does fix all issues I previously had with custom raced followers though.

Custom Raced Followers (followers with non vanilla race names such as Half Argonian etc.) all get the Dialogues for Follower system,

events (which do complete if you do them right), enslavement, and all deal dialogue. basically everything I could find to test works the same

now with any follower, regardless of race.

not sure about the debt per day, and debt per follower, and per level stuff yet (forgot to test that part).

overall a very nice update that fixed quite a few issues (but did seem to trigger a new one).

please keep up the good work Lozeak.

Corsayr · September 5, 2017

Which Follower?

It doesn't seem to matter which follower, I originally tried it with a follower mod named Amy, then I tried it with Jenassa in Whiterun.....

A couple of people have had issues with Jenassa not releasing. (which is why me to ask)

Amy I do not know that follower. which mod? is she a mercenary type follower (like you have to pay her before she will follow you?)

Need to compare how they are set up to see if there is a common theme to followers that don't release.

deviant51 · September 5, 2017

I really really really really really like this mod <3
thanks

Leeyds4LLTS · September 5, 2017

Which Follower?

It doesn't seem to matter which follower, I originally tried it with a follower mod named Amy, then I tried it with Jenassa in Whiterun.....

A couple of people have had issues with Jenassa not releasing. (which is why me to ask)

Amy I do not know that follower. which mod? is she a mercenary type follower (like you have to pay her before she will follow you?)

Need to compare how they are set up to see if there is a common theme to followers that don't release.

I must have had this sexy Amy follower mod for awhile. I can't seem to find it listed anywhere now. I do have the original files I downloaded, but can't locate them on line. (I am really happy to still have her in my files!)

Anyway, she is not a mercenary. She is just a follower you can find in the tavern in Morthal.

I will try another follower of your choice if you want to make a suggestion, to see if I have the same problems.

Corsayr · September 5, 2017

A couple of people have had issues with Jenassa not releasing. (which is why me to ask)

Amy I do not know that follower. which mod? is she a mercenary type follower (like you have to pay her before she will follow you?)

Need to compare how they are set up to see if there is a common theme to followers that don't release.

I must have had this sexy Amy follower mod for awhile. I can't seem to find it listed anywhere now. I do have the original files I downloaded, but can't locate them on line. (I am really happy to still have her in my files!)

Anyway, she is not a mercenary. She is just a follower you can find in the tavern in Morthal.

I will try another follower of your choice if you want to make a suggestion, to see if I have the same problems.

see if Lydia has trouble. if you can't get her to unfollow you, then you have something else going on.

So far I have only ever found Jenassa to be a problem. I never really ever used her before, and only took her on testing this mod because she was handy. But so far every other follower has been ok.

None of these have been an issue:

Lydia

any of the ones from Apachiisky Companions

Ria

Uthgar the Unbroken (might not be her first name I can never remember it, she is the one you have to fight in WR tavern to get to follow you)

The Mercenary guy in the Winking Skeaver

*jbezorg* · September 6, 2017

Lets see if this works.

Corsayr · September 6, 2017

Lets see if this works.

actorTypeNPC.png

Whats that do?

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