Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

[WhatRules]

On 11/16/2020 at 10:47 AM, Nymra said:

That sounds like you break your mod for half of the users to fix that a handful of people is using it wrong. 

I really really understand that there is an effort to make a mod smooth and easier to use and understand, but especially with a framework like DD I think this is basically mod armageddon. 

The DD filter built in DCL, DD, even Sexlab Adventures is one of the single most annyoing features I am facing in kinky Skyrim and I went on to just dont use mods anymore that have it. 
DD has too little animation variety and no chance to change them or manipulate them, so it makes Sex very repetetive. I am spending hours on hours to increase the amount of Animations in Sexlab so I dont see the same animations over and over. With DD now forcing the same 12 animations on me now would be a nightmare. 
 

Especially since there are now concerted efforts of @osmelmc to improve the animation filter in Sexlab I think it is a really bad decision to remove the Filter Toggle from a Framework mod like DD5. 
 

Kimy, I really understand your reasoning for the Filter in DCL (while I do not necessarily understand the necessity of it having no toggle), but with DD5 I think it is something entirely different. 

 

You seem to be a professional in terms of software, well, I am a professional in terms of concept and useabilty. Skyrim mods need MCM toggles to improve compatibility with other mods and increase user experience. Fetishes, gameplay approaches and mod builds are so different and all over the place (which is very good and necessary for the community to even exist). 
Forcing a single way to play on the users cant be your goal, no? I mean DD framework is a must have mod these days, you cannot really play without since many important (and old) mods need it. Having an easier time to support the mod alone seems not a very good trade off here, at least in my eyes

Just my example of using DDs:

- I control VERY strict which mod is allowed to put a yoke or an armbinder on my char, so I can control when I see the like a dozen yoke or armbinder animations. 
- I allow DD mods to only equip Steel Manacles and Prisoner Chains most of the time because those are compatible with MOST of the animations out there that are non-DD. 
- I am not allowing plugs to restrict sex scene types because I hate chastity play
- for the same reason I never allow mods to equip chastity items. 

So as user experience from many games and modding Skyrim-> Options, Options, Options, Options -> gaming paradise. 

I even would suggeste MORE Filters and more elaborate ones.
Like the ability to toggle the filter for several device types:

- filter for Yoke yes/no
- filter for Armbinder yes/no
- filter for plugs yes/no
- filter for gags...

etc.

Like in Windows 10 you could hide all cool options in a "Developer" mode or "advanced user options" MCM toggle. I ve seen that with other mods.
That way "normal" users might not find the toggle easily. 
Also, description of features could be improved, issuing also a "WARNING: Toggling this filter might prevent DD from working as intended"

Ok, sorry for the wall of text, but this really is a very big issue and I have to say that I am not alone with this, not even close. 
ALOT of people are using DD and have the same problem. Of course its hard to get statistics here and I dont know if we can make surveys in this board or if DD development would respect them. 

I really would hate to see the community split between old DD 4 and new DD 5. There are already so few mods that really work well and reducing that amount more seems not desireable

Just on a sidenote: I am really looking forward to DD 5 and its content, but the filter alone would be a big no-no for using it sadly and sticking with DD 4.X (hoping that at least other mods with DD as dependency can maintain backwards compatibility with DD 4. 

 

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This person has a very valid point. Everything here makes perfect sense and is what the players want. If someone is stupid enough to report animations that look weird with certain devices after disabling the filter, you can just ignore them.

 

I'm not saying every single device needs a filter option. Gags for example needs to block oral. There is no question about that. Chastity belts don't need options because flesh can't penetrate metal. It's a black and white scenario. But what about straightjackets? Do they really need to block ALL kinds of animations? I'm pretty sure they don't. Don't let a few ignorant users restrict the possibilities for people who know what they are doing.

 

Or maybe we should have it removed before sex and equip it in the middle of the animation? It's a workaround but hardly immersive. Are there any scripts that makes them more "flexible"?

[Zaflis]

1 hour ago, saltshade said:

Do they really need to block ALL kinds of animations?

To my understanding, the bound filter should fall back to non-filtered animations if none are found. That it doesn't is a bug right? That sex animation ends up with no animations or both partners doing solo animations is far more frustrating than any device clipping.

[oldestman]

@saltshade
Looks like you haven't seen this:

On 12/13/2020 at 1:25 AM, Kimy said:

The "Use Bound Animations" toggle in MCM is supposed to leave the full range of animations available for a scene, if people don't like the limited choice of DD bound animations. The only reason why it currently doesn't, it's because it apparently bugged.

 

 

[WhatRules]

6 hours ago, oldestman said:

@saltshade
Looks like you haven't seen this:

 

Okay, is Kimy working on fixing this bug? I read somewhere that a fix would come in v9.0, but we will probably have to wait a long time for that.

[oldestman]

Don't know, but it's a DD bug, not DCL. So hopefully it's a matter of a quick hotfix.

[OsmelMC]

@Kimy Is bit late for this version and probably too soon for the next one but there is one Big issue still to solve.

 

When the Player got transformed on Werewolf and probably also with the Vampire Lord's transformation, the Quest Type Rendered Devices got unequipped and keeping on inventory so when the actor return to his humanoid form the deviceRendered is still on inventory but unequipped and for that reason you can't equip the device again preventing the quest for continuing.

 

I noticed this on Quest items.

 

 

[markdf]

On 12/14/2020 at 9:43 PM, saltshade said:

--------------------------------------------------------

 

This person has a very valid point. Everything here makes perfect sense and is what the players want. If someone is stupid enough to report animations that look weird with certain devices after disabling the filter, you can just ignore them.

 

I'm not saying every single device needs a filter option. Gags for example needs to block oral. There is no question about that. Chastity belts don't need options because flesh can't penetrate metal. It's a black and white scenario. But what about straightjackets? Do they really need to block ALL kinds of animations? I'm pretty sure they don't. Don't let a few ignorant users restrict the possibilities for people who know what they are doing.

 

Or maybe we should have it removed before sex and equip it in the middle of the animation? It's a workaround but hardly immersive. Are there any scripts that makes them more "flexible"?

 

Why does this need to be a part of DD itself? If someone wants to make a "Developer Mode" patch for DD5, that's their prerogative.

 

Having the option to disable the filter as a core feature of DD5 just seems like it will create problems -- because it implies that users should expect things to still work sensibly when the filter is disabled. But if users have to download someone's patch in order to disable the filter, then they KNOW they are messing with how DD5 works and they know where to look if things start going wrong.

[zarantha]

9 hours ago, markdf said:

then they KNOW they are messing with how DD5 works and they know where to look if things start going wrong.

Assuming they remember installing the patch when they notice the issue months down the line.

[DeepBlueFrog]

I have a question about the Device Hider. 

 

Is there an example somewhere I can look to see how to use it in practice?

 

In Parasites, I would like to hide the parasites (devices) manually with a spell or after some trigger like going outside instead of indoors.

 

Could I use the Device Hider for that? or is that something I should implement myself?

[CGI_Models]

Hi and Merry Christmas -
Unsure if I am asking in the right place. 

Is there a developers guide, if so please provide a link?

 

Thank you

[El_Duderino]

On 12/24/2020 at 2:17 AM, DeepBlueFrog said:

I have a question about the Device Hider. 

 

Is there an example somewhere I can look to see how to use it in practice?

 

In Parasites, I would like to hide the parasites (devices) manually with a spell or after some trigger like going outside instead of indoors.

 

Could I use the Device Hider for that? or is that something I should implement myself?

Hi, I'm not aware of any mod that does (or even can?) manipulate the Device Hider like how you've described. A further complication might be that users can disable the hider in the MCM which could cause issues or break the intended parasite functionality.

 

However, a very similar temporary device hiding mechanic is part of the new (DD-5) bound animation filter -- there are some conditions (incl. that new MCM toggle) on which the filter hides (unequips) the restraint during the SL scene. This sounds close to what you have mind for the parasites if I understood you correctly. Maybe you can borrow some ideas or code from the DD filter? I believe the function in question is StoreHeavyBondage in zadBQ00.psc

 

17 hours ago, CyberInfluencer said:

Is there a developers guide, if so please provide a link?

I don't think that there's a complete guide, but the script sources are commented in great detail (of interest should be especially zabEquipScript.psc and zadLibs.psc).

There's also a GitHub Wiki, but I think it hasn't been updated in a while and may be outdated in parts. Still, probably a good read: https://github.com/DeviousDevices/Docs/wiki

[CGI_Models]

3 hours ago, El_Duderino said:

I don't think that there's a complete guide, but the script sources are commented in great detail (of interest should be especially zabEquipScript.psc and zadLibs.psc).

There's also a GitHub Wiki, but I think it hasn't been updated in a while and may be outdated in parts. Still, probably a good read: https://github.com/DeviousDevices/Docs/wiki

I'll check it out, Thank you

[DeepBlueFrog]

I created three custom organic devices for SexLab Parasites - full body, harness type devices.

I based them on the Tentacle Armor I already have in parasites and which is working well.

 

However, the new devices make the script instance device appear in the inventory instead of being invisible.

 

Any idea what could be causing it?

 

I checked that the inventory copies have the zad_InventoryDevice keyword and that the other two (script and rendered) do not.

[OsmelMC]

3 minutes ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

I created three custom organic devices for SexLab Parasites - full body, harness type devices.

I based them on the Tentacle Armor I already have in parasites and which is working well.

 

However, the new devices make the script instance device appear in the inventory instead of being invisible.

 

Any idea what could be causing it?

 

I checked that the inventory copies have the zad_InventoryDevice keyword and that the other two (script and rendered) do not.

to any item/armor be invisible on the inventory need the NoPlayable flag.

[DeepBlueFrog]

1 hour ago, osmelmc said:

to any item/armor be invisible on the inventory need the NoPlayable flag.

Where is that flag set?

 

I found a solution to my problem by the way... the script instance items had a name set. Leaving the name blank removed them from the inventory once equipped.

[chaimhewast]

1 minute ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

Where is that flag set?

If you're using the CK, it's in the Armor dialog in the bottom left (the "Playable" checkbox). In xEdit, it's in the general flags of "BODT - Body Template".

[NIND (jimmyyu)]

On 11/10/2020 at 11:48 AM, Kimy said:

Here are the resources for the Elbowbinder. The CBBE and the UUNP versions look identical to me, but they'd probably need a separate Bodyslide version? If someone wants to tackle it, it would be awesome!

FT_ArmbinderElbowUUNP.7z 385.75 kB · 4 downloads FT_ArmbinderElbowCBBE.7z 386.17 kB · 6 downloads

Does this still need doing?  I have time to tackle it now if so!

[QueenAlpaca]

I realized that while you are sneaking and tied up, your sneak attack will become using your head to attack your enemies. Is that possible to add this kind of animation to hobble dresses / full body rope? Like you just stand there and use your head to attack your enemies. I want to play this game while full body tied up. 

[naaitsab]

Small bug report. If you are wearing a petsuit some periotic DD animations (like from plugs) kick in. This instantly breaks the stance of the petsuit. Perhaps a check that disables the animation if a petsuit is worn could remedy this. As there are sadly no petsuit animations.

[Kimy]

On 1/1/2021 at 10:27 AM, NIND (jimmyyu) said:

Does this still need doing?  I have time to tackle it now if so!

Yes, it would. At least I can't remember anyone sending me new meshes already. With all that stuff going on around DD lately, I might or might not have overlooked it...  :S

[Guest]

On 1/1/2021 at 7:27 PM, NIND (jimmyyu) said:

Does this still need doing?  I have time to tackle it now if so!

 

4 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Yes, it would. At least I can't remember anyone sending me new meshes already. With all that stuff going on around DD lately, I might or might not have overlooked it...  :S

I was thinking to do that too, but if you can manage it on your own, there's no problem, then. ?

?

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Racoonity said:

 

I was thinking to do that too, but if you can manage it on your own, there's no problem, then. ?

?

Unless you want to do just the CBBE version and leave the UUNP one to me. ?

?

[NIND (jimmyyu)]

53 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Yes, it would. At least I can't remember anyone sending me new meshes already. With all that stuff going on around DD lately, I might or might not have overlooked it...  :S

Awesome. Can I have the path to these two files starting from /data ?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Racoonity said:

Unless you want to do just the CBBE version and leave the UUNP one to me. ?

?

 

37 minutes ago, NIND (jimmyyu) said:

Awesome. Can I have the path to these two files starting from /data ?

I guess it's a no, then... ?

?

[Kimy]

1 hour ago, NIND (jimmyyu) said:

Awesome. Can I have the path to these two files starting from /data ?

Bodyslide should put the output mesh into /data/meshes/devious/devices. That's where the armbinder mesh is currently residing and mods are expecting it to be. The textures are in /data/textures/devious/devices for the standard leather variant, and /data/textures/devious/expansion for the ebonite variants, respectively.

 

Need any other info, just ask!