A little warning to mod creators of non adult mods....

[BruceWayne]

I think it's a disgrace what the modders have to face at the moment, without any help or assurance from Bethesda or Valve. They get most of the shit with people brigading their pages and whatnot. This fucking outrage culture that is going on at the moment is shameful and not helpful at all. Be angry at Valve and Beth, not the guy who thought he can make a dev-sanctioned buck with his mod and who was probably reassured by their legal team that all is well.

 

The only thing that makes Beth and Valve understand that this whole thing is a disaster, is money. Namely none of it. Don't buy stuff on the workshop, don't encourage their greed and exploitative business practices. The modders that went for this are probably not without blame, but if I were approached to be one of the selected few to get my mods up in a "new and exciting" business model without knowing much about it beforehand, I don't know how I would have reacted. I can't say I've never fallen and been blinded by marketing, so I don't hold others to a higher standard. Something a lot of people that are crying the loudest might want to consider as well.

 

With all that being said, this is a fucking joke on behalf of Bethesda and Valve. If they wanted to divide the modding community and put a wedge in between premium and non-premium modders, they have succeeded. If they want to destroy what the modding community built since Morrowind, this is how you'd go about it.

 

As a final word on this matter: If we see anyone uploading premium content on this site again, we will hand out hefty warnings. If you want to "destroy" premium mods by uploading them here, you damage us, not them. 

[Guest endgameaddiction]

Steam is just taking over our gaming by controling how we play it and by modding it.

 

Just picture it. Steam retail stores now available near you and gamestop gets shafted.

 

Now that they have many gamers at their finger tips, who cares about sales. We'll open up retail shops and sell them retail price and flood the market.

 

 

They will control how you mod your game. they...will... be... watching... you... o.O monitoring your every move. You have a nude mod, they will track you down and fine you because they want more $$$

[WaxenFigure]

 

Looked at some of the mods behind this new pay wall and there are some ringers in there like the mod for $2.99 that dumps a huge amount of gold into the middle of Whiterun for you to pick up, the author says why not just use the console to do the same thing? Well that would be cheating.

 

There's another mod that adds 9999 of each type of ingot to a chest next to a blacksmith forge.

 

Obviously some people have put up mods there to just point out the ridiculousness of the pay system they have created.

[Damicles]

Looked at some of the mods behind this new pay wall and there are some ringers in there like the mod for $2.99 that dumps a huge amount of gold into the middle of Whiterun for you to pick up, the author says why not just use the console to do the same thing? Well that would be cheating.

 

There's another mod that adds 9999 of each type of ingot to a chest next to a blacksmith forge.

 

Obviously some people have put up mods there to just point out the ridiculousness of the pay system they have created.

 

Good I hope the mod community takes the complete piss out of this cynical money grab.

[Jaravaya]

What about bug fixes, retextures ?

 

Beth creates bugs, ugly textures.

Modders correct bugs, create better textures.

Beth sells bug fixes and better textures.

 

I mean... arrf !

[Penfold187]

Steam is just taking over our gaming by controling how we play it and by modding it.

 

Just picture it. Steam retail stores now available near you and gamestop gets shafted.

 

Now that they have many gamers at their finger tips, who cares about sales. We'll open up retail shops and sell them retail price and flood the market.

 

 

They will control how you mod your game. they...will... be... watching... you... o.O monitoring your every move. You have a nude mod, they will track you down and fine you because they want more $$$

 

Seriously? Steam's effectiveness stems from it's non-dependence on brick and mortar shopfront's, as to controlling how you mod your game and fining you for doing it. That is next level tin foil hattedness. Congrats.

 

Lets be clear. The model currently being trailed is exploitative and open to gross abuses. That does not mean mod author's, should not have a manner to reasonably monetize their WORK. If they so choose. No one should be expected to work for free, that is tantamount to indentured servitude. This debacle has already forced Chesko to take a step back from the community and possibly give up on modding. Something I view as a loss to us all. (You may disagree, that is your right.)

 

You have the choice not to utilize any mod and where a mod such as SKYUI becomes a "requirement", people will find workarounds such as alternate versions. Or piracy. I do not condone the latter, but can understand it.

[Redflyingmonkey]

I think it's a disgrace what the modders have to face at the moment, without any help or assurance from Bethesda or Valve. They get most of the shit with people brigading their pages and whatnot. This fucking outrage culture that is going on at the moment is shameful and not helpful at all. Be angry at Valve and Beth, not the guy who thought he can make a dev-sanctioned buck with his mod and who was probably reassured by their legal team that all is well.

 

The only thing that makes Beth and Valve understand that this whole thing is a disaster, is money. Namely none of it. Don't buy stuff on the workshop, don't encourage their greed and exploitative business practices. The modders that went for this are probably not without blame, but if I were approached to be one of the selected few to get my mods up in a "new and exciting" business model without knowing much about it beforehand, I don't know how I would have reacted. I can't say I've never fallen and been blinded by marketing, so I don't hold others to a higher standard. Something a lot of people that are crying the loudest might want to consider as well.

 

With all that being said, this is a fucking joke on behalf of Bethesda and Valve. If they wanted to divide the modding community and put a wedge in between premium and non-premium modders, they have succeeded. If they want to destroy what the modding community built since Morrowind, this is how you'd go about it.

 

As a final word on this matter: If we see anyone uploading premium content on this site again, we will hand out hefty warnings. If you want to "destroy" premium mods by uploading them here, you damage us, not them. 

 

Not only this, but those modders who were approached with their invitations to this bullshit are freaking human thermometers. If Valve wanted this to be an "honest" business venture, they would have talked about it instead of spawning it from whatever hell it was born in. Instead they invite a circle of known modders like Shezrie and Chesko, all smiles, and tell them to go be cannon fodder. Just thinking about how this thing could stop modders from modding altogether like Chesko's thinking of right now is enraging me. You don't fuck up a community as selfless as the modding scene only to get easy coin off of their asses, it's just evil man. 

 

I also don't believe the modders are completely to blame even if one could say they're the ones promoting this bullshit by selling their mods on Steam right now. It's first class manipulation, made by taking advantage of some dudes who took on a hobby some years ago and made a name for themselves, it's a fucking pyramid scheme if I've ever seen one. 

[Buddy Christ]

Funny sidenote: Since I got the 7 day hammer on Steam for voicing against this shit, I can not even edit my wishlist, because it is part of the Steam Community for which I currently lost my privileges   Same goes for my profile, where I can not change my privacy settings

 

(And before someone asks: I wanted to empty my extensive wishlist, because I do not wish to buy from Steam/Valve in the forseeable future)

 

I never thought I would say it, but I will gladly pay more money at Uplay or on Origin from now on. Gaah, I feel like I have to wash my mouth with soap after saying that...

Or.... well, buying games on GoG and adding them as non-Steam products to at least keep the overlay to chat with friends.

[windu190]

Yeah same here, suspended for a week. But I think it's a fair price for saying what needed to be said. 

[Swiggity1234]

Guys, steam just banned the word stEAm xD try to name yourself "fuck stEAm" in steam. It will be censored. But not "fuck", just stEAm is censored :'D

[Nixea]

I simply dropped my negative review on the game arguing that I fear we'll have to end up paying for patches. If they silence every voice that shows perfectly valid concern, then they'll have put moderators on extra hours.

[Coopervane]

Alright, i'm going to attempt to do something constructive with this. If Valve and Beth wants to pull this stunt, then perhabs a system could be found that might have some chance of working and maybe even be of some form of benifit. Well, here goes, my feeble attempt at it:

 

 

 

• First up, the 25% cut to authors and the $400 monthly quota needs to die. That's just completely unacceptable terms. If you want modders getting paid, then damn well pay them! The author should get atleast a 50% cut, and the quota needs to go.

 

•  Set up a robust donation system for free mods. One of the reasons authors don't get donations is that it's a hassle for the enduser to donate. If there was an easy way to do it via Steam, then i am very confident that more people would (not everyone, but definately more).

 

• Mods would need to earn the right to become DLC. Sorry gals and lads, but making a single sword or outfit and selling that? That's bloomin' Horse-Armor DLC. An entire store filled with 500 Horse-Armor DLC's and only a few big mods of note is a disaster waiting to happen, and that is precisely where things are headed right now. If anything good is to come of this, it would be that modders might be incentivised to make bigger and better mods. So there needs to be requirements, mods need to transcend the "look i made a thing!" stage and get into the "holy crap, that's a ton of high quality content!" stage before they are a worthy product for sale. A single armor? No! 25 armors, complete with male/female versions, full set of features, support for multiple bodytypes, matching shields and weapons? Now that might actually be a product worthy of peoples time and money, that would actually be a worthy DLC.

 

• No selling patches. Sorry, but that's the lowest of the low, and it should never be done. In an ideal world, we woulden't need community-made patches because Bugthesda would actually deliver us a working and properly ported game to begin with, and make any needed patches themselves. But we all know by now that this will not happen. So, either community patches need to remain free (but now with an easy donate option), or it's actually Bugthesda who should be taken to task and pay those authors for fixing their messes for them (and by all rights they should, though we all know they will refuse to do so).

 

• No Mod-DRM, and no forced Steamworks participation. Killing off the indie modding scene (places like this, but, also things like the nude Body-replacers that we're all using and which woulden't fly on the workshop) would be an absolute disaster, and would only beckon piracy, as people would turn to pirated copies of the game(s) to get access to the underground modding-scene that would spring up, and which would only work with hacked copies of the game(s). Just don't do it. Let people mod.

 

• Police and curate your shit, Valve, it's not our fucking job to do it for you. Simple as.

 

• There needs to be a profitsharing system for mod teams. IE, all registered team-members for the mod gets their cut automatically, unlike now where only one person can, and that person then has to wire their cuts to the other team-members. That's trouble just waiting to happen.

 

 

 

 

Well, there's my stab at it. I could maybe see that working.. maybe..

[Guest endgameaddiction]

 

Steam is just taking over our gaming by controling how we play it and by modding it.

 

Just picture it. Steam retail stores now available near you and gamestop gets shafted.

 

Now that they have many gamers at their finger tips, who cares about sales. We'll open up retail shops and sell them retail price and flood the market.

 

 

They will control how you mod your game. they...will... be... watching... you... o.O monitoring your every move. You have a nude mod, they will track you down and fine you because they want more $$$

 

Seriously? Steam's effectiveness stems from it's non-dependence on brick and mortar shopfront's, as to controlling how you mod your game and fining you for doing it. That is next level tin foil hattedness. Congrats.

 

Lets be clear. The model currently being trailed is exploitative and open to gross abuses. That does not mean mod author's, should not have a manner to reasonably monetize their WORK. If they so choose. No one should be expected to work for free, that is tantamount to indentured servitude. This debacle has already forced Chesko to take a step back from the community and possibly give up on modding. Something I view as a loss to us all. (You may disagree, that is your right.)

 

You have the choice not to utilize any mod and where a mod such as SKYUI becomes a "requirement", people will find workarounds such as alternate versions. Or piracy. I do not condone the latter, but can understand it.

 

 

Without any doubt it doesn't surprise me. Nothing does coming from Beth nor Valve. If they pulled this dirty trick up the other day, they are capable of condoning other types of acts in favor for their pockets. And perhaps act like they are being ethical in terms of doing the right thing by not allowing nude content into new titles such as Fallout 4, or The Elders Scroll VI.

 

Chesko's impulsive actions and choices did not help him in the short and long run. He's lost a great deal of reputation and perhaps may quit modding for good. I feel bad for the guy even though what he did was dumb. perhaps he will get bypass it and recover from his mistake. Support the community as he has before this incident and regain trust and respect from the one's who have turned their backs.

 

The only way I would approve of mods being sold is if you are getting a better cut out of the deal and the assets being used are from your own or perhaps bought material from beth. Such as lets say, we'll sell you GECK. We'll sell you Creation Kit, as 3dsmax and other powerful tools are sold, and in return you are liable to make money off what ever you make so long as we still get a cut out of it. But since way back when, mod thievery has been going on for many years. It's hard to put control over this situation because it tends to float around the internet and it cannot all be tracked down.

Valve isn't concerned about this because they have lawyers ready to fight for them. Worst case (and I wouldn't doubt it's somewhere in the fine prints) you give up your rights to any custom meshes and textures you have made for your mod and it turns around and belongs to Beth/Valve day moment you sign that contract.

 

There will be an uprising to this. So long as mod communities do not get shafted by the corporations. I don't think this will be the case. Not for Skyrim. Too many mods in many forums and sites. However, this implementation could and more than likely will take place Fallout 4 is released. There is no way on earth Valve is going to permit any money making mods become free in other places for Fallout 4 and beyond. Or atleast the one's that are up for sale on Steam. But an uprising will be. There are plenty of masterminds in LL that can create such mods that have been moved to Steam. The question is, will they? LL is focused on sexified mods. And programs to better function this aspect. however, it could change. After this crisis, we could be seeing more people shift here and are willing to focus on the non-adult mods and provide us the tools such as MCM to function mods like SexLab.

 

It will happen because having mods that require you to use SkyUI and mods that still run on SkyUi 4.1 (which are too many) is going to be a burden. It's painful to see them sellout and destroy/divide the rest of the mod community. I would love to be wrong. I'm certain the vast majority would love to be wrong on this account. I hope that he reflects like Chesko and takes a step back, but once you participate you have given up your rights to the mod.

[ragnric22]

Huh, so Bethesda and Valve are the first to truly create DLC Version 2.0?

 

Corporation features:

 

No Work, no support and maintanance requirement, free workforce.

 

Customer features:

 

Less game, more pay.

 

 

Whoop-dii-doo...

[azoth1267]

After having a good sleep on all of this drama, ive come to the conclusion that modding as we knew it is now over and there is no going back to the "good old days".

 

Whats going to happen to mods is the same thing that is happening to games in general.

Inflated prices, cheap/shitty knockoffs, accusations of piracy/theft, piracy, drm and so on and so on...

Inevitably, we will be left with nothing but 10$ rainbow retextures of daggers and scripts plastering advertisements for mountain dew and doritos.

 

Its never going to stop, valve has already made money of this whole deal, and everyone else wants a cut as well... its only human nature i suppose, cant really blame them.

[DocClox]

Guys, steam just banned the word stEAm xD try to name yourself "fuck stEAm" in steam. It will be censored. But not "fuck", just stEAm is censored :'D

I now have the urge to create a trivial companion mod featuring a dunmer called Vuck Falve...

[BruceWayne]

 

Guys, steam just banned the word stEAm xD try to name yourself "fuck stEAm" in steam. It will be censored. But not "fuck", just stEAm is censored :'D

I now have the urge to create a trivial companion mod featuring a dunmer called Vuck Falve...

 

 

Only 4.99$! I hope LL members get a special discount.

 

 

 

Too soon?

 

 

[thingwhatsqueaks]

The only thing that makes Beth and Valve understand that this whole thing is a disaster, is money. Namely none of it. Don't buy stuff on the workshop, don't encourage their greed and exploitative business practices. The modders that went for this are probably not without blame, but if I were approached to be one of the selected few to get my mods up in a "new and exciting" business model without knowing much about it beforehand, I don't know how I would have reacted. I can't say I've never fallen and been blinded by marketing, so I don't hold others to a higher standard. Something a lot of people that are crying the loudest might want to consider as well.

 

Eh...I don't know about that.  I feel like anyone with their head on strait (i.e. not completely blinded by greed) should've taken one look at the shitshow that is the Steam workshop* and at the very least thought "Imma let someone else step on this landmine to see if it's safe" if not peaced out on the idea entirely.  When I first heard that the idea of paid mods was being floated my first thought was that it wasn't going to work out especially well.  That said I've been surprised, even by internet outrage standards, at the speed at which it's gone to hell.

 

 

*In terms of how much of a disaster trying to search through it is which is largely due to the lack of proper filtering because the tagging system has been abused like a cheap whore.  The seeming ease with which stolen content can be posted.  The fact that almost every decent mod there has dependencies that aren't (SKSE, FNIS, etc.).

[Nixea]

Guys, stop being so agreeable, I can't agree with so many people at once since I've run out of likes!

[Alva]

After having a good sleep on all of this drama, ive come to the conclusion that modding as we knew it is now over and there is no going back to the "good old days".

 

Whats going to happen to mods is the same thing that is happening to games in general.

Inflated prices, cheap/shitty knockoffs, accusations of piracy/theft, piracy, drm and so on and so on...

Inevitably, we will be left with nothing but 10$ rainbow retextures of daggers and scripts plastering advertisements for mountain dew and doritos.

 

Its never going to stop, valve has already made money of this whole deal, and everyone else wants a cut as well... its only human nature i suppose, cant really blame them.

 

Not only that - but now users are customers to the modders and with customer-supplier relationship comes not only expectations in regards of the product, but also potentially legislative issues. Sure it might be a few buck, but customers are even more fickle than "free-loading" mod-users. If modders thought users were a problem previously - then imagine customers. Build up a reputation to only have it pulled down by review storms, and twitter campaigns and so on - sure you just change "screen name" because then reputation is lost anyway, but expect to not be able to use it professionally any more..

 

Also the "experience sharing" amongst modders will be limited leaving users again with worse mod material.

Why help out the competition with your experiences? He might make money of your work.

 

Outside that in longer term - the next step for gaming will then be pirating the mods and cracking of games, which will leads to more DRM in the games and less quality because that armsrace the game developers will never win and especially not the mod-developers and it will only drain their money.

And that will lead to games not being moddable - and then consumers will loose and mod developers will loose.

 

It's a loose-loose from all aspects for gaming communities. The only winner here is and will always be the game-developers who now do not need to worry about making that console-port.

 

The modders who actually support this are naïve at best, or downright ignorant at worst. I understand the desire to be paid for something, especially if good at it, but to ruin your own market is never a good plan.

[...0...]

After having a good sleep on all of this drama, ive come to the conclusion that modding as we knew it is now over and there is no going back to the "good old days".

 

Whats going to happen to mods is the same thing that is happening to games in general.

Inflated prices, cheap/shitty knockoffs, accusations of piracy/theft, piracy, drm and so on and so on...

Inevitably, we will be left with nothing but 10$ rainbow retextures of daggers and scripts plastering advertisements for mountain dew and doritos.

 

Its never going to stop, valve has already made money of this whole deal, and everyone else wants a cut as well... its only human nature i suppose, cant really blame them.

 

I for one stop buying games on steam and boycot bethesda so in the LONG RUN i win nomatter what.

 

Already bought almost no games anymore on steam last 2 years 2 games.

 

I buy most on GOG.COM 100% DRM FREE.

 

The Witcher 3 fuck Bethesda, valve/st(EA)m and rest of the greedy bastards.

 

Guys, steam just banned the word stEAm xD try to name yourself "fuck stEAm" in steam. It will be censored. But not "fuck", just stEAm is censored :'D

I now have the urge to create a trivial companion mod featuring a dunmer called Vuck Falve...

 

 

What about Vuck GabeN

[Youwish1]

I think it's a disgrace what the modders have to face at the moment, without any help or assurance from Bethesda or Valve. They get most of the shit with people brigading their pages and whatnot. This fucking outrage culture that is going on at the moment is shameful and not helpful at all. Be angry at Valve and Beth, not the guy who thought he can make a dev-sanctioned buck with his mod and who was probably reassured by their legal team that all is well.

 

The only thing that makes Beth and Valve understand that this whole thing is a disaster, is money. Namely none of it. Don't buy stuff on the workshop, don't encourage their greed and exploitative business practices. The modders that went for this are probably not without blame, but if I were approached to be one of the selected few to get my mods up in a "new and exciting" business model without knowing much about it beforehand, I don't know how I would have reacted. I can't say I've never fallen and been blinded by marketing, so I don't hold others to a higher standard. Something a lot of people that are crying the loudest might want to consider as well.

 

With all that being said, this is a fucking joke on behalf of Bethesda and Valve. If they wanted to divide the modding community and put a wedge in between premium and non-premium modders, they have succeeded. If they want to destroy what the modding community built since Morrowind, this is how you'd go about it.

 

As a final word on this matter: If we see anyone uploading premium content on this site again, we will hand out hefty warnings. If you want to "destroy" premium mods by uploading them here, you damage us, not them.

you know how I'd handle it?. I'd tell them to straight up blow out their ass!!. Because I've been in the community long enough to know that associating anything of the like to the modding community would be absolutely detrimental to the community as a whole. Especially if they mentioned money, I'm not that fucking retarded LMAO.

 

For people that feel sympathy for those modders that were crucified, I say yeah it can be harsh with the internet and what not, but fuck them!. They knew damn fucking well what they were getting themselves into, ANYBODY with a smidgen of common sense would have known.

 

And I don't know how much suger coating valvthesda did/said to the mod authors but I can say it wouldn't have been much, once again any mention of money and you know to say NO!. You want to pay me? Hire me, I'm not your piggy bank. I don't store coins up for you through my work so I can empty myself out at the end of the day, it'd be like putting coins into a broken money box with a hole in it while not all the coins fall out, most will.

 

Sigh I'm going to bed soon LMAO, hopefully we will all have some good news tomorrow, good night lovers lab!.

[LidiaSun]

Guys, stop being so agreeable, I can't agree with so many people at once since I've run out of likes!

 

Ooooo just now noticed that you can like comments

[Zor2k13]

Dick0ne posted another article on nexus trying to shoot down the service provider accusations chesko made against him. I really hate that guy he is such an overbearing ass and goes out of his way to rub people the wrong way when something comes up. Maybe vampire dante is his alter ego same person?

[Penfold187]

The most telling aspect of this debacle is the 2 mods, I might have considered purchasing had I the inclination were pulled. I have no objection to the principle of paying for someone's work. What I object to vehemently and therefore means I cannot utilize Steam Workshop, is blatant exploitation. No matter how one breaks it down, the model proffered by Valve/Bethesda is grossly one sided and weighted to unfairly and unreasonably disadvantage the modding community. The TOS put forward in this scheme are just blatantly open to abuse by Valve/Bethesda and I would argue breach many local laws. Because Valve offers it's services in multiple jurisdictions, it potentially is open to challenges in those countries courts.