For the five users that still think the Nexus is your buddy.

[Seijin8]

1 hour ago, SouprizeAttack said:

I'm not trying to say mod authors have to see it from the platform's perspective, but I do wonder if it's possible to have a mutually beneficial relationship regardless of the new deletion restrictions?

 

Possible, yes, if Nexus were doing it for the benefit of everyone (as they state), which is patently not the case.  Nexus is doing this principally to drive profit for themselves, modders be damned.  In my mind, the biggest real issue at play here is the breach of trust.

 

The issues here come from the simultaneous move of A) You ,the modder, whose output Nexus is fully reliant upon for its existence, now abdicates control of your mod to Nexus so that, B) Nexus can create a new program that feeds your work directly to others in bundles while Nexus' new mechanism for this bottlenecks use for anyone who isn't paying Nexus for a Premium membership.

 

Nexus needs to lock down control of the mods for this venture to be profitable for them.

 

Other options that might have significantly decreased the problems we are seeing:

1. Longer window for removal of the mods, and partial deletion instead of the all-or-nothing that was offered.  The slightly over a month window is arbitrary and unnecessarily heavy-handed as their collections tool is not just a couple months out.  The argument that their staff will have trouble parsing this is a problem they created for themselves with this timeframe.  It doesn't hold water.
2. Opt-in/opt-out mechanism for having a mod included in collections (and it would not be unreasonable that the opt-in created the situation where Nexus would be able to lock out deletion to preserve the integrity of a collection, so long as it was a choice made by the modder -- as an aside, this might also require locking mod versions into place as well, something I highly doubt Nexus' collection system is going to handle well, prior software releases being Exhibit A).
3. A broader discussion on how best to handle this, as opposed to the "this is how it is, live with it" approach that they took.  Had they discussed this a year ago (by their own words, still a year into the project at that point) and gone over what would be needed to make this work, and maybe solicited opinions on it, they might've navigated to a more beneficial system all-around.
4. Linking donation points directly to the opt-in, while turning it off for those who do not want their work in the collections.  It would've ruffled feathers, sure, but it is not unreasonable that they would channel that money towards those playing ball, and therefore increase the relative amount going to those modders who are participating.
5. Institute a new type of Endorsement that indicates how much a given mod is used in packs.  The ratio of Endorsements to unique downloads is around 10-15% for the highest-visibility mods, and much lower for most.  Those modders who collect internet points would have a new currency to trade in.
6. Make the new collections system identical in UI for those with/without premium memberships with the only difference being download speeds -- as it is today.  Adding the extra hurdles only benefits their bottom line.

I'm sure many other options would be available, but if I can come up with these (based mainly on reading this thread and thinking on it for five minutes), then Nexus had ample opportunity to develop far better options than what I listed here.  Instead, they chose the tyrannical approach of all stick, no carrot.

 

The oversimplified version is: Modders don't like being told they will be losing some of their content control so that the hosting company can make more money on it, with nothing offered as a reasonable exchange.  They especially don't like it when the offered alternative is GTFO.  It didn't need to be adversarial, but Nexus made it that way.  It can be argued as simple greed, evil shenanigans, or pure incompetence, but none of those is a good look.  More than a few modders are backing away from it just because of the optics, even though they wouldn't care one way or the other about the mod collections themselves.

Edited July 5, 2021 by Seijin8

[Wolfstorm321]

6 hours ago, dxw said:

The tone of this argument would be entirely different if it wasn't for Patreon. I hope that website dies unceremoniously. It is making too many people believe that piecemeal piecework completed in a vacuum is an acceptable substitute for earning a livelihood.

 

 

People like to blame Bethesda and the Creation Club, but only a tiny fraction of mod authors use it. I read that you need approval from Bethesda to release stuff there, and also need to grant exclusive rights of distribution to them. 

The only one to blame is Patreon. Patreon fucked everything. It was not Bethesda, it was not the Nexus. It was Patreon. Now every weekend artsy hipster thinks he is a developer and that this is a job. This created this culture of entitlement and arrogance where there is no communication between user and mod author.

Did I said entitlement for the 200th time? Yes, entitlement. That's why now there is a middleman between user and mod author, called the curator. Someone could make a sociological study here, on how centralization works and makes possible the figure of the middleman. 

[DoneBye]

So, guys... news from today.

 

A new script is making the rounds on the site. According to a thread on the feedback, anyone who doesn't have a self-published, visible mod with more than 1000 downloads, every single time that script runs (no matter if you are co-author, had mods with more than 1000 downloads, etc), they get kicked from the GMAD.

 

So now, only "profitable" modders that post "supermods" all the time, are allowed to be "modders". Small modders/co-authors will lose access to a forum with a lot of knowledge and help.

 

This is turning into a shit show of massive proportions.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, DoneBye said:

So, guys... news from today.

 

A new script is making the rounds on the site. According to a thread on the feedback, anyone who doesn't have a self-published, visible mod with more than 1000 downloads, every single time that script runs (no matter if you are co-author, had mods with more than 1000 downloads, etc), they get kicked from the GMAD.

 

So now, only "profitable" modders that post "supermods" all the time, are allowed to be "modders". Small modders/co-authors will lose access to a forum with a lot of knowledge and help.

 

This is turning into a shit show of massive proportions.

 

Nexus Author Discord has always been like this.

And you get the "verified author" automatically as soon your mod (also a single one) gets some downloads.

The 1000 is for "all mods together", and you have to be the maintainer of a mod to have it.

 

There were some complains from guys that hide all their mods and got kicked out from the authors forums.

In my opinion it is 100% legitimate that you lose access if you do not have mods anymore.

[Seijin8]

17 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

Did I said entitlement for the 200th time? Yes, entitlement.

 

It is clearly the word you live by.

[Grey Cloud]

7 minutes ago, DoneBye said:

According to a thread on the feedback, anyone who doesn't have a self-published, visible mod with more than 1000 downloads, every single time that script runs (no matter if you are co-author, had mods with more than 1000 downloads, etc), they get kicked from the GMAD.

As I understand from posts on Nexus, the 1000 downloads was the criterion for GMAD anyway (or one of the criteria at least). I think booting modders who no longer meet* the criterion is a foolish move as they are removing a wealth of modding knowledge and experience.

 

* no longer meet because the modder has removed their mod(s).

[Wolfstorm321]

3 minutes ago, Seijin8 said:

 

It is clearly the word you live by.

 

 

Wrong. 

[Seijin8]

13 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

 

 

Wrong. 

 

Your entire argument boils down to:

 

1) everyone should reap the rewards of a select few who are contributing

 

2) people who want something for their efforts are "evil divas"

 

Sorry that the people who filled your empty head with that buzzword never bothered to tell you what it meant.

[DoneBye]

38 minutes ago, CPU said:

 

Nexus Author Discord has always been like this.

And you get the "verified author" automatically as soon your mod (also a single one) gets some downloads.

The 1000 is for "all mods together", and you have to be the maintainer of a mod to have it.

 

There were some complains from guys that hide all their mods and got kicked out from the authors forums.

In my opinion it is 100% legitimate that you lose access if you do not have mods anymore.

Hide =! Deletion

 

You shouldn't lose access because your mods are hidden. They're still there.

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, DoneBye said:

Hide =! Deletion

 

You shouldn't lose access because your mods are hidden. They're still there.

They are there just for you.

As soon you "un-hide" them you get back your "mod author" privileges.

(Discord is on request, it is not automatic)

[Guest]

@Wolfstorm321, @Seijin8 please stop.

Continue the discussion, it is normal to disagree.

Just don't start to attack each other.

[DoneBye]

11 minutes ago, CPU said:

They are there just for you.

As soon you "un-hide" them you get back your "mod author" privileges.

(Discord is on request, it is not automatic)

He just admitted that they made changes to the script to include hidden mods (and who knows what else. He says the script takes 40 mins to run).

 

It doesn't affect me, but it will affect a lot of co-authors, like it's being argued. Have you thought about that?

Edited July 5, 2021 by DoneBye

[Wolfstorm321]

1 hour ago, Seijin8 said:

 

Your entire argument boils down to:

 

1) everyone should reap the rewards of a select few who are contributing

 

2) people who want something for their efforts are "evil divas"

 

Sorry that the people who filled your empty head with that buzzword never bothered to tell you what it meant.

 

 

It is a hobby, not a job. 

If you want a job, make a portfolio and submit it to some game studio. Don't make it public. 

If you don't play the game, then don't mod. Download UE and make a new game. Release it in the indie market and make a reputation there. 

 

You see, here is the difference of mentality: if I make a mod, I reap benefits because I play the game. If I dont play the game, there is no benefit. 

If I release the mod to the public, other players benefit from it. And if another mod author improve and expand it, creating new plugins, and I see it fits on my game, I will have ever increasing benefits from my own work. This is called mod diffusion. 

With a parlor modder, it's quite the opposite. He don't play the game, he only take screenshots. Both the mod and the screenshots are used solely for social validation (endorsements) so that he can call attention to himself (hence the term "diva") and then hope some developer from a studio can pick him up for a job. So if another mod author uses his work to make a improved version, he gets angry and order a takedown. 

 

Patreon is the reason why parlor modding is so popular. Add to this the Nexus rules for "permissions" and we have this toxic scene, where mod authors are isolated in small parlor cliques. You are not entitled to take down other people's works because they used yours as a base. It is a hobby, and it is on public domain. If you want otherwise, you have to make it private, so that only you and your friends have access to it. Creation Club is a example of private domain, as people have to pay to use it. You dont see materials from CC in the Nexus, because the Nexus is public domain. Want a private artsy gallery? Rent a server and make it yourself, and gate it behind a login, so that only you and your friends have access to it. Then invite some developers from game studios to it, show them your gallery. You will be better noticed that way. 

 

Edited July 5, 2021 by Wolfstorm321

[Reginald_001]

Nexus is not public domain. Nothing in the EULA states it is public domain. The copyrighted songs in my mods aren't public domain. The voice actors wave files are not public domain. You are living in a dreamworld.

 

And there is only one toxic element in this thread.

Edited July 5, 2021 by Reginald_001

[Wolfstorm321]

5 minutes ago, Reginald_001 said:

Nexus is not public domain. Nothing in the EULA states it is public domain. The copyrighted songs in my mods aren't public domain. The voice actors wave files are not public domain. You are living in a dreamworld.

 

And there is only one toxic element in this thread.

 

 

The EULA is not important here. What matters is the end-user access. If it is free and anyone can download and use it, it's over. Do you think your work might not be in some russian server? Think again. 

But the Nexus had these rules on permissions for years, and hence why there is a lack of content, but plenty of assets to work with. Every time someone wants to lay down a foundation to expand the game, his work is destroyed by takedowns. Hence why you are called "entitled divas" by the players, and now you are taking the other end of the stick, because the Nexus turned against you and inserted a middleman in the end-user access. And this middleman will make money from donations, while you will be screaming from a corner. 

[DoneBye]

13 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

Clueless stuff

You clearly don't know the first thing about Copyright. I don't know why people even entertain your drivel.

By the way, don't bother trying to answer me.

Edited July 5, 2021 by DoneBye

[Wolfstorm321]

2 minutes ago, DoneBye said:

You clearly don't know the first thing about Copyright. I don't know why people even entertain your drivel.

By the way, don't bother trying to answer me.

 

 

I know that every takedown of a big mod in the Nexus is a violation of copyright, done by parlor modders. 

You entitled divas could just talk with the other author and have him remove the shrub he used from your Whiterun Overhaul #948384938, but you don't because you think you are important, so you take his entire work down, violating his own copyright over all the other stuff he have done in his mod. 

[Kendo 2]

The 'greater good' mentality I see swarming around Dork0ne STEALING mods is fucking hilarious.

[DoneBye]

14 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

 

 

I know that every takedown of a big mod in the Nexus is a violation of copyright, done by parlor modders. 

You entitled divas could just talk with the other author and have him remove the shrub he used from your Whiterun Overhaul #948384938, but you don't because you think you are important, so you take his entire work down, violating his own copyright over all the other stuff he have done in his mod. 

You posted before I blocked you, so I'll deign you with an answer: LEARN HOW TO READ!

Edited July 5, 2021 by DoneBye

[Vader666]

57 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

It is a hobby, and it is on public domain. If you want otherwise, you have to make it private

 

So i have to choose between a company denying me control over my mods and a community denying me control over my mods ?

What a time to be alive...

[Pamatronic]

By now I´m pretty sure that Wolfstorm guy is just a troll, we really should just stop entertaining his nonsense.

[Grey Cloud]

4 minutes ago, Wolfstorm321 said:

I know that every takedown of a big mod in the Nexus is a violation of copyright, done by parlor modders. 

You entitled divas could just talk with the other author and have him remove the shrub he used from your Whiterun Overhaul #948384938, but you don't because you think you are important, so you take his entire work down, violating his own copyright over all the other stuff he have done in his mod. 

Okay, so an 'entitled diva/parlour modder' complains to Nexus that her/his shrub is being used in an inappropriate manner (?). The Nexus staff remove the offending mod by this otherwise fine and upstanding paragon of the modding community. Does not that mean that the Nexus staff agree with the entitled diva/parlour modder and not with you?

[DoctaSax]

It's been years of people trying to redefine 'cathedralism' and free open software to mean 'bend over'. It was always about voluntarily giving other creators a leg up to see more stuff get made, not slaving away for the masses without having a say. "We love the modders! We love the mods so much the modders shouldn't have control over them!"

 

[Grey Cloud]

5 minutes ago, Pamatronic said:

By now I´m pretty sure that Wolfstorm guy is just a troll, we really should just stop entertaining his nonsense.

Either that or he once had his wrist smacked on Nexus for misusing somebody else's shrub.

[Wolfstorm321]

Just now, Grey Cloud said:

Okay, so an 'entitled diva/parlour modder' complains to Nexus that her/his shrub is being used in an inappropriate manner (?). The Nexus staff remove the offending mod by this otherwise fine and upstanding paragon of the modding community. Does not that mean that the Nexus staff agree with the entitled diva/parlour modder and not with you?

 

 

Yes, and they created rules for it, as a way of legitimizing it. In this way, you can violate other people's rights while claiming yours. 

This could be avoided if there was communication, but you cut it both with the playerbase and other mod authors. Eventually you cut communications with the Nexus admins and WJ developers as well. You like to ghost people, and think this will have no consequences. 

What you are seeing now is the result of years of entitlement and arrogance.