Wartimes - a daughter's tale LE (Alternate start scenario)

[kapibar]

13 hours ago, Tildetyper said:

 it might be interesting to know what Father would think of the idea that you are the only thing that can save the world, now running amock by near invincible dragons.

Knowing him? It would just mean his personal whore's value just went through the roof (stonks), so he would allow everyone with enough coin to fuck dragonwhore's ass. Probably would also strongarm every faction in Skyrim into paying him a hefty sum for dragonborn's services. The guy is nothing if not predictable.

Also - one of the reasons why I think Wartimes is limited in its storytelling potential. At some point someone would just whack the fucker, as he probably couldn't stop himself from taking advantage of this new development, thus putting a huge target on his back.

[117xxx]

hello!In my save the father will not hungry,so i cant cook, other task such as milk are normal, that may means time is runing but hungry are stoped.Thank you.

[117xxx]

On 8/22/2022 at 1:12 AM, Monoman1 said:

Good bug report, thanks.

 

This sound like your bug @kapibar

I'll look when I can get a chance. 

 

Regarding the time discrepancy, I remember erring on the side of caution for fear of... something. 

about that , I have to say I have same bug.Not one save,all of my save ,I played this mod 4-5 times ,every time the supply task is not normal

[Monoman1]

1 hour ago, kapibar said:

At some point someone would just whack the fucker, as he probably couldn't stop himself from taking advantage of this new development, thus putting a huge target on his back.

That's one take. Another is that the whole world wants to fuck the dragonborn and having a nice submissive one is to the benefit of everyone. Father is now a loved legend

39 minutes ago, 117xxx said:

hello!In my save the father will not hungry,so i cant cook, other task such as milk are normal, that may means time is runing but hungry are stoped.Thank you.

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/149018-wartimes-a-daughters-tale-le-alternate-start-scenario/?do=findComment&comment=4064685

 

[kapibar]

44 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

That's one take. Another is that the whole world wants to fuck the dragonborn and having a nice submissive one is to the benefit of everyone. Father is now a loved legend

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/149018-wartimes-a-daughters-tale-le-alternate-start-scenario/?do=findComment&comment=4064685

 

We're talking about the world with countless bandits, criminals, warlords, guilds, factions and whatnot. You think the Thalmor would allow some petty con man to control the Dragonborn? Or even the Blades? It would be more beneficial to actually wrestle control of the submissive Dragonborn from his hands. Or - more efficiently - whack him. So PC being the Dragonborn is actually a delayed death sentence to any individual that puts their hands on her. She's the person of interest to any and all factions, and there are many.

Of course you can always take the Slaverun route and throw any logic out of the window, but this too has a cost - immersion takes a dive as well. For now at least WT is pretty grounded, the only thing that is a little over the top is the naked supply run. But other than that? All the shit happens behind closed doors. Even if you turn home into a brothel (and you will), it is still a little, local whorehouse. When the Dragonborn is involved, it becomes a matter of global security. Unless Father is secretly a Daedric Prince, someone would hire the Dark Brotherhood to put him under ground, no matter how well connected he is. And with this scenario, we are actually dangerously close to Slaverun. And its biggest problem was that events on this scale could never feasibly coexist with established world of Skyrim. Not even suspension of disbelief can hold this whole thing together. Disbelief would have to hang itself in a barn.

Edited May 11, 2023 by kapibar

[Monoman1]

17 minutes ago, kapibar said:

You think the Thalmor

I think you're overthinking it I think. 

 

I don't like getting into semantics in a world of dragons/magic/bad plots, dialogue and character motivations but it's possible that whatever ill intending faction would decide that controlling father is all it'd take to control the dragonborn. And all he's interested in is gold and getting his dick wet so it shouldn't be that hard. 

 

Or. Just install a 'I'm not the chosen one' mod. Problem solved more or less. 

 

Slave mods never will work well with the 'chosen one' narrative of any game. 

Edited May 11, 2023 by Monoman1

[kapibar]

1 hour ago, 117xxx said:

about that , I have to say I have same bug.Not one save,all of my save ,I played this mod 4-5 times ,every time the supply task is not normal

The solution is;: don't fuck with Supply Run's settings. Leave it at default values and it'll work just fine.

  

14 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

I think you're overthinking it I think.

Probably, yeah. But what's really great about WT - besides its mechanics - is how dark and grounded it is. We have a lot of mods that heavily abuse suspension of disbelief, WT is not one of them. It would be a shame to loose the anchor that keeps it on the ground.

  

13 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

I don't like getting into semantics in a world of dragons/magic/bad plots, dialogue and character motivations but it's possible that whatever ill intending faction would decide that controlling father is all it'd take to control the dragonborn. And all he's interested in is gold and getting his dick wet so it shouldn't be that hard.

Still, I would eliminate the middle man. The middle man is always a moving part that requires attention and maintenance. Good mechanisms are simple. If the Dragonborn is submissive and easily manageable - why would I bother with Father? I just need whatever he has on her and he's redundant.

Edited May 11, 2023 by kapibar

[117xxx]

8 minutes ago, kapibar said:

The solution is;: don't fuck with Supply Run's settings. Leave it at default values and it'll work just fine.

  

Probably, yeah. But what's really great about WT - besides its mechanics - is how dark and grounded it is. We have a lot of mods that heavily abuse suspension of disbelief, WT is not one of them. It would be a shame to loose the anchor that keeps it on the ground.

well,I have to say I dont think so.Such as "Our supply run out , you need to go to city" have come a lot of times, but the one task I get was the first time.

[Balgin]

42 minutes ago, kapibar said:

The solution is;: don't fuck with Supply Run's settings. Leave it at default values and it'll work just fine.

No it won't. It will just run out of time halfway back between the Whiterun gates and the homestead. Again.

[Tildetyper]

30 minutes ago, kapibar said:

The solution is;: don't fuck with Supply Run's settings. Leave it at default values and it'll work just fine.

  

Probably, yeah. But what's really great about WT - besides its mechanics - is how dark and grounded it is. We have a lot of mods that heavily abuse suspension of disbelief, WT is not one of them. It would be a shame to loose the anchor that keeps it on the ground.

  

Still, I would eliminate the middle man. The middle man is always a moving part that requires attention and maintenance. Good mechanisms are simple. If the Dragonborn is submissive and easily manageable - why would I bother with Father? I just need whatever he has on her and he's redundant.

I love overthinking things!

 

I didn't really want to say Father wasn't a bright man, but I guess that is probably the reality as he waited 18 years for someone to die of poisoning - he's not a very effective individual - he just has more effective individuals around him.  

 

In the end, the most logical thing for him to do is cash out while he can.  He thinks nothing of trading you into slavery for his payday to bring Mother back - so if things got over his head it would be an Ego versus Money situation. 

 

He might keep you long enough to tame you, and live the rest of his days potentially rich - with just as much young nubile things to keep him entertained as he pleased - and the legend that he tamed the Dragonborn. That's probably his best ending considering the pressures of the world. 

 

As soon as the world found out the next dragon born was malleable - they'd potentially go to war to control her.  That would probably be the path forward for the story where you are sold to one of the factions who will mold you into a very controllable weapon. 

 

For added benefit, Father could visit you once and while for a freebee, and talk about his amazing new life is.  

 

His potential bad endings are numerous, if you're looking to make it feed back onto itself - he ends up in his Wifes position used as a tool to make the dragonborn compliant enough to be trained to the new cause.    In the end, the Karma of his actions come around and devour him, but at least he had some good times until it came crashing down. 

 

Maybe he'd be repentent when you see him last, or maybe he'd blame you for being the Dragonborn and ruining the family.  Either way, it would certainly put a bow on things.

[Monoman1]

4 minutes ago, Balgin said:

No it won't. It will just run out of time halfway back between the Whiterun gates and the homestead. Again.

?

How long does it take you to run into whiterun and back out again?

[kapibar]

18 minutes ago, Balgin said:

No it won't. It will just run out of time halfway back between the Whiterun gates and the homestead. Again.

Something tells me you messed with the time scale. I have large speed debuffs from SLS on top of YPS's high heels debuffs and more times than not 0 problems with doing the run in time.

[Balgin]

31 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

?

How long does it take you to run into whiterun and back out again?

Well high heel training slows down the supply run and of course I walk. You only run when you need to. I honestly hate the automatic running in Skyrim. You need to press an actual button to walk. Walking takes much elss effort and concentration than running. Walking is more natural. The controls should have defaulted to walk with running being the thing that required some extra input from the user.

 

That being said, if you walk all the way to the town gates then up past Warmaidens to Belethor's shop, into Belethors, get the stuf, go to the Sky Forge, get the stuff, walk back past the temple (or down through the marketplace) and out through the town gates all in the High Heels that you only recently started wearing a day or two ago then you'll generally get an out of time notification somewhere between the first drawbridge under the first wall and the Whiterun stables.

 

If you use Fast Travel to get back home it automatically times out whereas sometimes you can make it home just on time (very rarely). From this I learned that Fast Travel is somewhat slower than walking (or there's a minimum time involved).

 

Now I know I could go and mess with the Timescale but that would involve knowing which characters are using which timescales on which saves and also, while it allows me to do a lot more, it also trivialises distance by allowing me to traverse great journeys in but a single day (or much less) so, while a slower timescale is more immersive, it's also less immersive where long distance travel is involved.

 

Also I don't know if the timescale settings are just for that one save or if it would affect all the other saves as well.

 

Quote

Something tells me you messed with the time scale.

Actually nope. See above. That's on default time settings. Adjusting timescale to 5 or 10 or whatever Monoman wants people to do makes it much more acheiveable but causes cross save dissonance. And, more importantly, Monoman's post about which timescale settings to use isn't easy to find in this massive thread (it's not mentioned in the mod tweaks posts to the best of my memory) and I can never remember the console commands for timescale settings and it's a pain to go and look them up every time I play a Wartimes save and want to check if I'm on the correct timescale from the last time that I played it and having to go and look up the controls to display the timescale, let alone change it, because those aren't something I can easily tweak in an options menu.

[Monoman1]

15 minutes ago, Balgin said:

That being said, if you walk all the way

Supply RUN! Not Supply Saunter

 

  

1 hour ago, Tildetyper said:

That would probably be the path forward for the story where you are sold to one of the factions who will mold you into a very controllable weapon

That's a cool angle. 
If only I could write mods 100x times faster...

Edited May 11, 2023 by Monoman1

[kinkeag]

4 hours ago, Tildetyper said:

As soon as the world found out the next dragon born was malleable - they'd potentially go to war to control her.  That would probably be the path forward for the story where you are sold to one of the factions who will mold you into a very controllable weapon. 

Shiiit i really like that idea too, idk, maybe like a bad ending text box describing this, as the bare minimum implementation, hahaha

[Anunya]

So on the whole "she's the dragon born, molded into a malleable weapon" I think one simple solution is that father is an agent whose whole job was to mold the PC into a pliable dragonborn weapon slave. So at some point the Thalmor / Blades / whoever show up and ask father "is she done her training?" Then the PC is handed over naked, gagged and on her knees with a "yes... she's broken in now. She'll serve you well." [which then is a text box ending, or maybe a SubLola master, or a whole new mod that someone could make for being an already broken in Dragonborn slave being used as a weapon].

[Tildetyper]

Whisperings of a Dragonborn were spreading like wildfire, ever dark and dingy corner of Skyrim now spoke of a tamed little shrew of a daughter with unbelievable potential.   

 

Belethor, Father's close friend had advised him if he wanted to make coin, now was the time to cash in.  He also was more than happy to broker the deal, for a taste of the outcome - of course.

 

"You've worked so hard this last while, been a very good servant for me - and my friends of course.  Unfortunately, this will be our last fucking, it's like your goodbye gift to me" The home would definitely be quiet, at least until he could acquire something new. 

 

"Belethor said it's probably best I don't know where you're off to - if I want to be able to spend all the money we're getting" If only he didn't have to share, but shop keeper had assured him his involvement would mean the difference between a payday and an unmarked grave "I'll just have to imagine your being a good daughter - even if it's for someone else"  He smoothed his hand through your hair, and toyed with the collar around your neck for a moment "Come on now, one more time - I'll even let you choose - no massages though"

 

After Father had saited himself, he had you drink a familiar potion - something that had started this whole ordeal.  He said it would help make the transportation less complicated and as if on cue, Belethor entered with a pair of cloaked figures pointing you out to them. There was no time for fear, sorrow, confusion,  as a sudden rush of weakness overtook your body and unconsciousness followed soon behind. 

[kinkeag]

1 hour ago, Tildetyper said:

Whisperings of a Dragonborn were spreading like wildfire, ever dark and dingy corner of Skyrim now spoke of a tamed little shrew of a daughter with unbelievable potential.   

 

Belethor, Father's close friend had advised him if he wanted to make coin, now was the time to cash in.  He also was more than happy to broker the deal, for a taste of the outcome - of course.

 

"You've worked so hard this last while, been a very good servant for me - and my friends of course.  Unfortunately, this will be our last fucking, it's like your goodbye gift to me" The home would definitely be quiet, at least until he could acquire something new. 

 

"Belethor said it's probably best I don't know where you're off to - if I want to be able to spend all the money we're getting" If only he didn't have to share, but shop keeper had assured him his involvement would mean the difference between a payday and an unmarked grave "I'll just have to imagine your being a good daughter - even if it's for someone else"  He smoothed his hand through your hair, and toyed with the collar around your neck for a moment "Come on now, one more time - I'll even let you choose - no massages though"

 

After Father had saited himself, he had you drink a familiar potion - something that had started this whole ordeal.  He said it would help make the transportation less complicated and as if on cue, Belethor entered with a pair of cloaked figures pointing you out to them. There was no time for fear, sorrow, confusion,  as a sudden rush of weakness overtook your body and unconsciousness followed soon behind. 

???

[117xxx]

On 8/15/2022 at 10:31 PM, Monoman1 said:

Hmm I see. Was convinced you were SE. If so then it's got to be something specific to your set up I would think. 

They can't be. They're a part of the same dialogue block. Same as all the 'new' tasks that are added via FG. Unless I've broken skyrim (not beyond the realm of possibility). Any one of the dialogues on that block could have been said if the conditions are met. 

 

Since you're LE if you can get a save just before things go wrong I can take a look at it. But it'd need to be a very minimal load order. Probably tricky though because there's a large element of randomness. You can FORCE force greets via the debug menu and firewood and supply run are two tasks that don't really have any prerequisite conditions. Supply run needs to be at game hours 7AM - 4PM. Also you can disable the firewood job. Also, Also, you can quick test supply run simply by starting the quest (after getting the initial FG). I think: 

StartQuest   pchsSupplyRunQuest

 

The implementation of talking to invisible objects (talking activators) is a bit shit anyway. Talking to the door used to work... ok for me. But after some change it stopped working like it did before and I could never get it to work the same again. I don't know what it is. There's some fail safes built into the dialogue anyway because of this. 

 

What happens for me is

A) the dialogue is unskippable (this is 'normal' for talking activators)

B) the dialogue just gets stuck on the first line (not normal)

I search this topic in order to save my bug of supply task.It seems like a bug in 10.3 version,And I see mono you upload a lot of new thing about house or something,And 10.3 was last year version,So can we download a new version?This bug is very annoying,thank you

[kinkeag]

3 hours ago, 117xxx said:

I search this topic in order to save my bug of supply task.It seems like a bug in 10.3 version,And I see mono you upload a lot of new thing about house or something,And 10.3 was last year version,So can we download a new version?This bug is very annoying,thank you

It'll be ready when its ready, problem with cobbling together a release now to fix your very specific issue is that I could open up more bugs, chill out for now, relax, check back every so often 

[kapibar]

12 hours ago, Tildetyper said:

Whisperings of a Dragonborn were spreading like wildfire, ever dark and dingy corner of Skyrim now spoke of a tamed little shrew of a daughter with unbelievable potential.   

 

Belethor, Father's close friend had advised him if he wanted to make coin, now was the time to cash in.  He also was more than happy to broker the deal, for a taste of the outcome - of course.

 

"You've worked so hard this last while, been a very good servant for me - and my friends of course.  Unfortunately, this will be our last fucking, it's like your goodbye gift to me" The home would definitely be quiet, at least until he could acquire something new. 

 

"Belethor said it's probably best I don't know where you're off to - if I want to be able to spend all the money we're getting" If only he didn't have to share, but shop keeper had assured him his involvement would mean the difference between a payday and an unmarked grave "I'll just have to imagine your being a good daughter - even if it's for someone else"  He smoothed his hand through your hair, and toyed with the collar around your neck for a moment "Come on now, one more time - I'll even let you choose - no massages though"

 

After Father had saited himself, he had you drink a familiar potion - something that had started this whole ordeal.  He said it would help make the transportation less complicated and as if on cue, Belethor entered with a pair of cloaked figures pointing you out to them. There was no time for fear, sorrow, confusion,  as a sudden rush of weakness overtook your body and unconsciousness followed soon behind. 

Is fine and all, but what about the means of control?

The thing is, Father can actually control PC because he knows her intimately and has several hooks:
1) Mother
2) House
3) Pregnancy
And later on 4) the child, which replaces 1).

The other party - if it wrestles control - would have to acquire those hooks as well. And Father will not give away the child willingly, as it was his goal all along.

Taking possession of the Dragonborn will do you no good without the means to actually control her. Without the hooks, she's completely unpredictable and we're talking about a single person that is actually an army buster. Father's plan works because he knows exactly a) what to do, b) has the means of control, c) has a defined endgame. He's not stupid, nor is his execution sloppy. He controls the situation and the entire environment, a 3rd party wouldn't have that luxury.

Now, IF Father gives PC away, keeps the child AND mother is dead, Dragonborn is a loose cannon pure and simple, having absolutely nothing to loose, with the power to shake the whole world.

If I was - say - a high ranking officer in the Thalmor Embassy tasked with making a weapon out of the Dragonborn, the first thing I would do would be to acquire means of control. Hooks. The most obvious one is the child. Alternatively, there's Mother, but this is not a perfect option. Other than that, there's absolutely nothing. So, I would whack the father and kidnapped the kid.

Logically, there's no feasible scenario in which Father walks away safely AND a 3rd party has the means to control the Dragonborn. At this point she's broken, unstable, has nothing to loose and depraved to the core.

 

Also - there is a chaos factor - Lilith. She's not in the story yet, but she's a twin sister, which creates a whole set of different complications.

[Monoman1]

52 minutes ago, kapibar said:

Without the hooks, she's completely unpredictable

Perhaps the PC should be well trained (broken) by then?

 

Or use Lilith. 

"We've given your sister a powerful poison."
"She'll need an antidote every week."

"Be a good girl and do as you're told and maybe we'll take care of her."

 

Or some such.

Though I'd rather if sister could accompany you around the place at this point. 

While discussing this is fun. The odds of me actually making it that far are pretty slim...

 

[kapibar]

1 hour ago, Monoman1 said:

Perhaps the PC should be well trained (broken) by then?

I always perceived the submission/depravity as Father's perception, not my actual mental state. Even in the end, while being completely "broken,"(stat-wise) you are left with the option to stand your ground against him. Forcing the player into the role of a broken slave IMO removes the roleplaying element.
 

Quote

 

Or use Lilith. 

"We've given your sister a powerful poison."
"She'll need an antidote every week."

"Be a good girl and do as you're told and maybe we'll take care of her."

 

This does sound better, but pushes Lilith into a role of a victim.
 

Quote

Though I'd rather if sister could accompany you around the place at this point. 

Exactly. So, how about this: Lilith does indeed get poisoned. But the taarget of blackmail isn't the PC but her. She functionally takes over Father's role as PC's handler - has nothing to gain, but much to loose, so she'd be properly motivated. You can't exactly kill her, because she's your actual sister.
 

Quote

While discussing this is fun. The odds of me actually making it that far are pretty slim...

I see it only as a fun excercise, honestly. No pressure, mate.

[Balgin]

2 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Or use Lilith. 

"We've given your sister a powerful poison."
"She'll need an antidote every week."

"Be a good girl and do as you're told and maybe we'll take care of her."

 

Does the sister have a name now or are we going for a biblical reference here?

[Monoman1]

23 minutes ago, Balgin said:

Does the sister have a name now or are we going for a biblical reference here?

Lilith is her current placeholder name. 
The plan is to be able to configure it though I don't know at this point. It's possible for the player to use a dynamic name but not Npcs.

 

EG:

Npc: "You better start cooperating or your sister's going to get it"

Player: "Please don't hurt Lilith!"