Wartimes - a daughter's tale LE (Alternate start scenario)

[Anunya]

2 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Looks good. Needs a new, less harsh, scrubbing sound though. 

 

Yes , yes it does!

[audhol]

1 hour ago, naaitsab said:

If only we had someone around who can make a mesh or 2 for it

 

57 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

Due to the custom outfits system it'd have to be dynamic which seems impossible

If you remember MM1 we had discussed using the base of the alicia outfit to make a maids costume you could bundle with wartimes. IIRC you had made a stripping pole dancer game that required an outfit with multiple pieces to be thrown to the partygoers. Now it wouldnt be too hard to add an alpha value to said outfit thats controlled using an niextradatacontroller on the nif so the alpha value is manipulated each time daughter is on her knees scrubbing (yes I think it would also be possible to add transparency based on cum stains if she doesnt swallow!)

[Anunya]

1 hour ago, Monoman1 said:

Would need a good animation to carry it tbh. 

 

I totally want someone to make a full on "clothes get dirty over time, do the laundry" mod one day. Basically Bathing in Skyrim/ Keep it Clean/ Dirt & Blood but for outfits. And of course you'll have to take the clothes off to wash it, and while it dries... so you better have a spare set (or go naked, I suppose).

 

But yeah, it'd need a few appropriate animations to carry it. 

 

 

[Monoman1]

17 minutes ago, Anunya said:

 

I totally want someone to make a full on "clothes get dirty over time, do the laundry" mod one day. Basically Bathing in Skyrim/ Keep it Clean/ Dirt & Blood but for outfits. And of course you'll have to take the clothes off to wash it, and while it dries... so you better have a spare set (or go naked, I suppose).

 

But yeah, it'd need a few appropriate animations to carry it. 

Mwa could do it. If the tech existed to apply overlays to armors. Its already tracking individual references.

19 minutes ago, audhol said:

 

If you remember MM1 we had discussed using the base of the alicia outfit to make a maids costume you could bundle with wartimes. IIRC you had made a stripping pole dancer game that required an outfit with multiple pieces to be thrown to the partygoers. Now it wouldnt be too hard to add an alpha value to said outfit thats controlled using an niextradatacontroller on the nif so the alpha value is manipulated each time daughter is on her knees scrubbing (yes I think it would also be possible to add transparency based on cum stains if she doesnt swallow!)

Ah yes. I need to get back to that. I had some problem with the outfit IIRC. I'll find out what that was. 

 

But outfits for stripping can be user defined like the current outfit system. Anything with a top + bottom and any other parts would be fine. 

 

But hard setting outfits to ones that have a normal texture and a wet texture narrows the list of available outfits too much I think? No? I'm sure many are fond of the customuzability of the outfit system

[GeorgiaCav]

3 hours ago, Anunya said:

 

I totally want someone to make a full on "clothes get dirty over time, do the laundry" mod one day. Basically Bathing in Skyrim/ Keep it Clean/ Dirt & Blood but for outfits. And of course you'll have to take the clothes off to wash it, and while it dries... so you better have a spare set (or go naked, I suppose).

 

I've always wanted a mod that would let your PC be a maid to any home-owning NPC, depositing dirt in the NPC home for you to clean up, having you cook their meals, etc, for gold and, later, sex (or not, could just be a means of making gold in a SLS-friendly way). Basically an employment mod that lets you be a maid instead of a blacksmith or whatever the actual job mods. And having to wash clothes for your employer would be awesome -- you have to take them from the dresser, wash them, and put them back in the dresser, or get accused of stealing, with consequences...

[audhol]

9 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Ah yes. I need to get back to that. I had some problem with the outfit IIRC. I'll find out what that was. 

 

But outfits for stripping can be user defined like the current outfit system. Anything with a top + bottom and any other parts would be fine. 

 

But hard setting outfits to ones that have a normal texture and a wet texture narrows the list of available outfits too much I think? No? I'm sure many are fond of the customuzability of the outfit system

If you prefer the way its currently set up then I dont think its going to be that simple to apply a wet texture. The _d.dds needs to have an alpha channel in it and the nif needs to be flagged for alpha blend. Even then the results would be very hit'n'miss depending on the level of transparency in the base texture.

 

There is a possibility of using a membrane effects shader on the body like dragon holes, However this would only work if the equipped piece isnt using slot 32 and providing its own body contained in the nif.

 

Just let me know if its something you want to look at, you could give a base maids uniform with all these effects (could shrink when it dries ?) then let users add custom outfits for delivery jobs and party outfits. Daughter has to wear her uniform for housework and farmwork then change out of it for other tasks?

 

[Monoman1]

10 hours ago, GeorgiaCav said:

 

I've always wanted a mod that would let your PC be a maid to any home-owning NPC, depositing dirt in the NPC home for you to clean up, having you cook their meals, etc, for gold and, later, sex (or not, could just be a means of making gold in a SLS-friendly way). Basically an employment mod that lets you be a maid instead of a blacksmith or whatever the actual job mods. And having to wash clothes for your employer would be awesome -- you have to take them from the dresser, wash them, and put them back in the dresser, or get accused of stealing, with consequences...

There is a plan. And I mean a LONG term plan to try to add something like this into SLS. The idea being to add a favour system that's more general than WT. Favour gained for tasks etc + increasing sexual demands ala WT. Favour can then be cashed out for gold or for special favours. Like for example, getting your armor repaired without an armor licence (Smith). Or buying something you don't have a licence for etc (Merchant). Or a free room (Innkeeper). 

 

Should go without saying but this is a really long way off. And getting basic tasks to work well in dynamic places is going to be a little more than tricky...

4 hours ago, audhol said:

If you prefer the way its currently set up then I dont think its going to be that simple to apply a wet texture.

Well let's start with the basic outfit for the moment. I'm guessing the file you sent me is based on: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/64596?tab=files&file_id=269701

 

I ask this because there's no esp with the file. So the file will have to be made for LE practically from scratch as far as I can tell? Not too familiar with backporting. Not a major job but it'll take some time. So I've created a basic file with just the top for now but something's not right. Weights don't seem to match my preset. Weight slider is enabled in the esp. Ran files through CAO and built meshes in bodyslide. 

Spoiler

 

Also, don't think a lot of these sliders exist for CBBE though I'm no expert. 

Spoiler

 

Here's a vanilla outfit at low weight and Alicia top at low weight also:

Spoiler

 

Edited May 9, 2023 by Monoman1

[audhol]

15 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

So the file will have to be made for LE practically from scratch as far as I can tell? Not too familiar with backporting.

The base body for cbbe is different in le and se whereas bhunp and uunp feature the same base shape. I do have a copy of le so if its something you really want to do then I can give you a proper le version of the outfit with appropriate le bodyslides.

 

I got some projects of my own going on at the moment if you havent seen but I can find time to do it if you make a definite decision to use it?

 

In my current project the LE guys have the extended cbbe version featuring the 3 brest bones and thigh\belly jiggle, is this the version you are using?

[Monoman1]

4 minutes ago, audhol said:

The base body for cbbe is different in le and se whereas bhunp and uunp feature the same base shape. I do have a copy of le so if its something you really want to do then I can give you a proper le version of the outfit with appropriate le bodyslides.

 

I got some projects of my own going on at the moment if you havent seen but I can find time to do it if you make a definite decision to use it?

 

In my current project the LE guys have the extended cbbe version featuring the 3 brest bones and thigh\belly jiggle, is this the version you are using?

Didn't even know there was an extended version for LE... Haven't got a link by any chance? I can't find anything. 

 

Well look, there's no panic for now. I'm currently playing my way slowly through a game and fixing issues as they come up. It'll be a while before I get back to the party bit. Currently need to decide how to handle food confiscations (cum diet)...

[manafalls]

These changes are all amazing (it's now confirmed Monoman's a wizard). And yet, all I keep thinking is I hope there's also some new adult content ?

 

Extending the party scene progression further with the horse was one of the better suggestions, imo, and would parallel quite nicely with the supply run progression.

[audhol]

7 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

Didn't even know there was an extended version for LE... Haven't got a link by any chance? I can't find anything

I would guess its this one,

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/110546

 

I'll have a look at making an le version with bodyslides, if nothing else I can release it on nexus for some donotion points! 

 

If you want to continue we can look at making it into a proper maids outfit and posiibly play with some wet and shrunken stuff.

[GeorgiaCav]

13 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

There is a plan. And I mean a LONG term plan to try to add something like this into SLS. The idea being to add a favour system that's more general than WT. Favour gained for tasks etc + increasing sexual demands ala WT. Favour can then be cashed out for gold or for special favours. Like for example, getting your armor repaired without an armor licence (Smith). Or buying something you don't have a licence for etc (Merchant). Or a free room (Innkeeper). 

 

Should go without saying but this is a really long way off. And getting basic tasks to work well in dynamic places is going to be a little more than tricky...

 

 

Nice, Even if all NPC's weren't selectable, would narrowing down the number of NPC's that could be served help with the complexity? Even if it were just jarls, or a few of the wealthy/powerful families (Erikur, the Battleborns/Grey-Manes, the Snow-Shods, the Black-Briars, maybe some farm families) with residences... but idk anything about that, whether it might be easier to just come up with some universal packages that could be applied to anyone...

 

Anyway, I'll be looking forward to it ten or fifteen years from now, whenever... ?

[kapibar]

If I may add my opinion...
 

All these modifications are absolutely sensational. And that's the problem! You see, this mod was intended to be a starter mod that would push the player into the reality of the world of Skyrim with a sexual bent. But Mono has expanded this mod to such an extent that it surpasses the sophistication of most productions of this type, and everything after WT actually becomes a downgrade. Taking care of a house in Hearthfire requires no work at all, and there are no servants. So what, the family home requires work, and the player's home remains in pristine condition because it does? Most sex slavery mods are based on the command -> command execution principle, even the more advanced ones like SL boil down to the same mechanism. To this, Mono says "hold me a beer" and makes a starter mod that surpasses in degree of technical sophistication and mechanics absolutely everything the player can experience later. Because fuck you, that's why.
 

Congratulations, man. You made a tweak that grew on an existing mod in such a way that it absorbed it practically completely, and you didn't even notice how the mechanics you created completely filled the framework defined by that mod. At this stage, you should already stop thinking of this project as Wartimes, and start thinking about turning it into a framework that Wartimes uses. It's a waste of tremendous development potential that all of this sophisticated mechanics is confined to one mod, when virtually any mod involving sexual slavery or even servant labor can benefit from it.

[kinkeag]

43 minutes ago, kapibar said:

If I may add my opinion...
 

All these modifications are absolutely sensational. And that's the problem! You see, this mod was intended to be a starter mod that would push the player into the reality of the world of Skyrim with a sexual bent. But Mono has expanded this mod to such an extent that it surpasses the sophistication of most productions of this type, and everything after WT actually becomes a downgrade. Taking care of a house in Hearthfire requires no work at all, and there are no servants. So what, the family home requires work, and the player's home remains in pristine condition because it does? Most sex slavery mods are based on the command -> command execution principle, even the more advanced ones like SL boil down to the same mechanism. To this, Mono says "hold me a beer" and makes a starter mod that surpasses in degree of technical sophistication and mechanics absolutely everything the player can experience later. Because fuck you, that's why.
 

Congratulations, man. You made a tweak that grew on an existing mod in such a way that it absorbed it practically completely, and you didn't even notice how the mechanics you created completely filled the framework defined by that mod. At this stage, you should already stop thinking of this project as Wartimes, and start thinking about turning it into a framework that Wartimes uses. It's a waste of tremendous development potential that all of this sophisticated mechanics is confined to one mod, when virtually any mod involving sexual slavery or even servant labor can benefit from it.

Eh, thats all great, but idk, let him finish this mod first then maybe think about making it a framework. As you say, the scope is already massive (feature creep is real) ?‍♀️

[kapibar]

1 hour ago, kinkeag said:

Eh, thats all great, but idk, let him finish this mod first then maybe think about making it a framework. As you say, the scope is already massive (feature creep is real) ?‍♀️

Knowing Monoman's work - fuck yeah it'll be massive. The dude is a freak of nature. But seeing what's being implemented into a humble starting mod is actually mind boggling. The gameplay has outgrown storyline's shoes. Let's be honest here, from writing standpoint WT is no Shakespeare. It's like inventing steam engine just to spread manure over the field.

[adle]

there is a sequel after wartimes?

im playing skyrim only for wartimes ? the rest is boring. even slaverun is boring

[Monoman1]

2 hours ago, kapibar said:

If I may add my opinion...
 

All these modifications are absolutely sensational. And that's the problem! You see, this mod was intended to be a starter mod that would push the player into the reality of the world of Skyrim with a sexual bent. But Mono has expanded this mod to such an extent that it surpasses the sophistication of most productions of this type, and everything after WT actually becomes a downgrade. Taking care of a house in Hearthfire requires no work at all, and there are no servants. So what, the family home requires work, and the player's home remains in pristine condition because it does? Most sex slavery mods are based on the command -> command execution principle, even the more advanced ones like SL boil down to the same mechanism. To this, Mono says "hold me a beer" and makes a starter mod that surpasses in degree of technical sophistication and mechanics absolutely everything the player can experience later. Because fuck you, that's why.
 

Congratulations, man. You made a tweak that grew on an existing mod in such a way that it absorbed it practically completely, and you didn't even notice how the mechanics you created completely filled the framework defined by that mod. At this stage, you should already stop thinking of this project as Wartimes, and start thinking about turning it into a framework that Wartimes uses. It's a waste of tremendous development potential that all of this sophisticated mechanics is confined to one mod, when virtually any mod involving sexual slavery or even servant labor can benefit from it.

A framework for what? For buckets?

[kapibar]

8 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

A framework for what? For buckets?

For house maintenance for example. For becoming a maid. This is a quasi-medieval setup. All of the stuff is being done by manual labour. And you just invented a manual labour system ?. You're seriously not seeing the potential of the crap you developed? Dude, just launch some recently updated mods and see the chasm in technical sophistication between what you did for a (and I cannot express it enough) starting mod and what is developed currently. You overdeveloped the sh!t out of WT. "Tweak" my ass.

  

14 minutes ago, adle said:

 even slaverun is boring

Slaverun is actually boring as hell. And barely functional.

Edited May 10, 2023 by kapibar

[Monoman1]

1 minute ago, kapibar said:

For house maintenance for example. For becoming a maid. This is a quasi-medieval setup. All of the stuff is being done by manual labor. And you just invented a manual labour system ?. You're seriously not seeing the potential of the crap you developed? Dude, just launch some recently updated mods and see the chasm in technical sophistication between what you did for a (and I cannot express it enough) starting mod what is developed currently. You overdeveloped the sh!t out of WT. "Tweak" my ass.

I talked about it up a bit:

On 5/9/2023 at 11:29 AM, Monoman1 said:

There is a plan. And I mean a LONG term plan to try to add something like this into SLS. The idea being to add a favour system that's more general than WT. Favour gained for tasks etc + increasing sexual demands ala WT. Favour can then be cashed out for gold or for special favours. Like for example, getting your armor repaired without an armor licence (Smith). Or buying something you don't have a licence for etc (Merchant). Or a free room (Innkeeper). 

 

Should go without saying but this is a really long way off. And getting basic tasks to work well in dynamic places is going to be a little more than tricky

It's a lot easier to do this stuff when you know what you're dealing with: 

House occupants

House layout

Occupant occupations

Occupant relationships

Availability of tools

 

And I'm sure there's a ton more. 

 

There's more room to tell stories in WT (even though I'm not very good at stories) than there would be in a framework type mod. 

[Desvati]

7 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

There's more room to tell stories in WT (even though I'm not very good at stories) than there would be in a framework type mod. 

Was gonna say myself, part of why it comes together so well is that its part of a narrative.

[kapibar]

13 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

I talked about it up a bit:

It's a lot easier to do this stuff when you know what you're dealing with: 

House occupants

House layout

Occupant occupations

Occupant relationships

Availability of tools

 

And I'm sure there's a ton more.

That's the thing about frameworks - it's just the mechanics, it doesn't have to be you who actually does all the development ?. You know I love WT, but the story is limited. It has potential, sure, but there's a whole game around it. At some point it's no longer practical to develop the same story over and over, or you'll end up with a bloated mess (like Slaverun).

 

There are several factors inhibiting the development of Wartimes.

First, it's a starting mod that leaves very little room for takeoff. The player has to actively run away from the story to develop the character. Another is that a person of Father's ilk would never in his life let go of someone like the player character - with unlimited income-generating potential. Not even to mention the fact that PC is Dragonborn. By controlling her, Father holds all of Skyrim by the balls. That's why developing WT indefinitely doesn't make much sense - at some point the characterization of the characters will start to fall apart. IMO you are throwing valuable stuff into a story that should be more confined. It's all very cool stuff, don't get me wrong, but the longevity of the gameplay is limited. And - like I said - after that, everything else is a downgrade. I think @adle is onto something - you should at least consider a sequel.

[Monoman1]

26 minutes ago, kapibar said:

That's the thing about frameworks - it's just the mechanics, it doesn't have to be you who actually does all the development ?. You know I love WT, but the story is limited. It has potential, sure, but there's a whole game around it. At some point it's no longer practical to develop the same story over and over, or you'll end up with a bloated mess (like Slaverun).

 

There are several factors inhibiting the development of Wartimes.

First, it's a starting mod that leaves very little room for takeoff. The player has to actively run away from the story to develop the character. Another is that a person of Father's ilk would never in his life let go of someone like the player character - with unlimited income-generating potential. Not even to mention the fact that PC is Dragonborn. By controlling her, Father holds all of Skyrim by the balls. That's why developing WT indefinitely doesn't make much sense - at some point the characterization of the characters will start to fall apart. IMO you are throwing valuable stuff into a story that should be more confined. It's all very cool stuff, don't get me wrong, but the longevity of the gameplay is limited. And - like I said - after that, everything else is a downgrade. I think @adle is onto something - you should at least consider a sequel.

I dunno. This website is littered with the corpses of dead frameworks. 

By the time I developed it and someone then developed something using it I think ES6 would be out...

Thats not an exaggeration.

Edited May 10, 2023 by Monoman1

[kapibar]

17 minutes ago, Monoman1 said:

By the time I developed it and someone then developed something using it I think ES6 would be out...

Good joke. But I'm not holding my breath. Even if ES6 will be out (and it's a big fucking IF), it doesn't mean Skyrim will be dead. Fallout never even got close to what modding in Skyrim has become, so I'm fairly certain it'll live for a long time. Of course I'm not gonna force you into doing something you are not comfortable with (like I could, lol), but putting all this effort into just Wartimes seems like a waste. It's simply too good to be confined just within this mod.

[Balgin]

2 hours ago, Monoman1 said:

By the time I developed it and someone then developed something using it I think ES6 would be out...

But they made ESO as an excuse to never bother making ES6 (unless they really had to).

 

Also, whenever a new Elder Scrolls game comes out the specs are always so high that it's finally time to buy a new computer. I finally gave in and replaced my "new Skyrim pc" a few years ago a year or two after the time that Elder Scrolls 6 should have probably come out.

[Tildetyper]

I've tried it a few ways to see what the differences are.  I think there might be some people who are in here to figure out issue so I'll put spoilers in the spoiler tag.

Spoiler

Thoughts on the Good Daughter Path.  

 

I enjoyed the progression, this day-by-day ramping up of expectations and requirements felt much more enjoyable than having everything dumped on your plate immediately.   

 

The tasks were simple, carrying the tray or pot to serve him his meals was pretty cool immersive wise (Even though - the pladder looks pretty darn expensive!) 

 

I feel like the party happened too soon within the progression the last time I played, as I wasn't even at the stage of laying with him at that point - so everyone at the party would seemingly get the first shot - but I guess that could make sense if he was being paid high dollar for it (Though the things they say imply that you're much further than you are - so maybe it wasn't supposed to happen that way). 

 

I enjoyed the chores for the neighbours, even though I didn't use them all to their full extent (Not a fan of some of the actions involved) It also helped break up the time while waiting for Father to want something. 

 

The difference between the internal mod systems, and when the mod hands off to Sanguines slavery is pretty jarring.  I'm not really familliar with it, so it just felt empty by comparison. 

 

Bringing mother back, and she sees that you're naked and basically kicks you out of the house without listening to your reasoning is pretty good.  

 

I killed Father a few times to see what happens, one of the times he died, and I was left waiting to be punished by him (He's pretty hard to kill as a newb, even if he's sleeping).  The next time I tried was when Mother had returned missing limbs - and there was no real talk about - the potential for having her healed  - or her returning to her family or something like that - you just kinda walk out on her I guess and she can figure out how to manage the household without you?

 

When he turns the house into a BDSM playhouse - I was sorta bummed out that nothing was triggering to happen while on any of the equipment outside of him (or mother if she was around) making good use of 'spank that ass' mod (Her ethereal hands hurt just as much!)

 

All and all, I liked it.    It's an interesting mod to explore, and see where the different paths are, it's got enough little tid-bits to generally keep you busy. 

 

I tend to play a lot of these with Dragonborn turned off  (You are not the dragonborn) it might be interesting to know what Father would think of the idea that you are the only thing that can save the world, now running amock by near invincible dragons. 

 

Spoiler

Might appreciate the option of tracking down Mothers real location, and abscounding with her, at least until she got to some relatives or it going horribly sideways and things take a much darker turn should you fail during it.

 

Just thought I'd pass along my thoughts, thanks again for all the hard work!