OsmelMC Mod Tweaks

[OsmelMC]

3 hours ago, thedarkone1234 said:

Is there anywhere I can see the (approximate) timeline of sexlab's and DD's new releases? I had no idea there were any upcoming (since the download page claims the last version was in 2016 I wasn't even expecting it XD).

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/69936-devious-devices-framework-developmentbeta/

 

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/91861-sexlab-framework-se-163-beta-8-november-22nd-2019/

 

 

Those are the development forums but none of the mods have release date for I know.

[thedarkone1234]

24 minutes ago, OsmelMC said:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/69936-devious-devices-framework-developmentbeta/

 

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/91861-sexlab-framework-se-163-beta-8-november-22nd-2019/

 

 

Those are the development forums but none of the mods have release date for I know.

The second link appears to be exclusively about SE (at least as far as I read in its last patch). Will updates come to sexlab LE as well?

[OsmelMC]

1 hour ago, thedarkone1234 said:

The second link appears to be exclusively about SE (at least as far as I read in its last patch). Will updates come to sexlab LE as well?

Yes is just for SE and that's why I ask for luck. 

[NicoleDragoness]

18 hours ago, OsmelMC said:

The enjoyment and the amount of orgasm now depends of the Actors skills + the gender + the animation tags + Aggressive status of the Actors + the duration of the scene + the relationship between the Actors + few other things I can't remember.

 

I hope you could consider to remove the orgasm with animations that don't have specified sex tags. For example, the three kissing only animations I know (one from Nibbles and two from Byllyy).

This "rule" could be applied also for all animations that have the "LeadIn" tag (as it is available as option in the SLSO mod). In that case both partners should not orgasm.

At least if the "preliminary" setting in the SexLab framework page is active.

What do you think?

[OsmelMC]

28 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

 

I hope you could consider to remove the orgasm with animations that don't have specified sex tags. For example, the three kissing only animations I know (one from Nibbles and two from Byllyy).

This "rule" could be applied also for all animations that have the "LeadIn" tag (as it is available as option in the SLSO mod). In that case both partners should not orgasm.

At least if the "preliminary" setting in the SexLab framework page is active.

What do you think?

Is already done for the Separate Orgasm on my current version with the following rules:

    At less the actor be forced to cum or be defined as the cum source for the current Animation stage.

The Females can have Orgasm only on Animations tagged as  "Anal, Vaginal, Pussy, Cunilingus, Fisting, or Breast".

The Males can have Orgasm only on Animations tagged as "Anal, Vaginal, Handjob, Blowjob, Boobjob, Footjob, or Penis".

 

 

By the way the LeadIn Animations don't have orgasm when are called as LeadIn Scenes since always. But many of the mods with kissing scenes usually call it as standard scenes instead of LeadIn.

Also now I add the general condition that prevent orgasm when the Animation have none Cum defined with the exception of the "Lesbian" tagged Animations that for I see don't have cum defined and should allow orgasm too. So considering that mostly of the LesdIn Animations don't have Cum defined, as consequences of this condition don't longer will allow the orgasm even if are called as standard scene.

[Nymra]

14 minutes ago, OsmelMC said:

By the way the LeadIn Animations don't have orgasm when are called as LeadIn Scenes since always. But many of the mods with kissing scenes usually call it as standard scenes instead of LeadIn.

Also now I add the general condition that prevent orgasm when the Animation have none Cum defined with the exception of the "Lesbian" tagged Animations that for I see don't have cum defined and should allow orgasm too. So considering that mostly of the LesdIn Animations don't have Cum defined, as consequences of this condition don't longer will allow the orgasm even if are called as standard scene.

 

this is a big step ahead, yay! So now I can at least indirectly control the orgasm. Totally up for that!

 

But: Would it be possible to just check the Actor genders? If all actors are female: consider it a lesbian scene instead of using the lesbian tag (which again is missing often or is also on animations that could be both).

 

Other than that just some random thoughts on the side. 

 

1. LeadIn:

yeah, many mods disable LeadIn because there are only like 5 LeadIn Animations before I made my Forced Foreplay (and those are mostly non-consensual....)
Sadly there seems no way to bypass that without making a patch for those mods.

 

2. Orgasm Control:

What I miss with SLAL Json control is to be able to control on which stage the orgasm should be for Actor X
Why? Because alot of animators give a shit about Sexlab and create Scenes that have the orgasm on Stage 4 of 5 instead on 5 of 5. Cumshot can control the cum, but not the cum sound afaik. 

It should be just like JSON: Actor X - Stage Y - Orgasm = true -> profit

 

yeah, we would have to change all the JSONs, but Sexlab could just use the old system when there is no orgasm in the JSON.

Also animators usually set all the tags in their own way, so customization of individual users is required anyway with each new version.

 

For example I made a slapped together Golden Shower animation for Naked Defeat. But I cannot prevent that the orgasm sound triggers on the last stage. 

And I cannot JUST call it as a LeadIn animation.

 

3. LeadIn2:

BTw: LeadIn animations dont care for tags at all. If the Sexlab is calling a "Doggy" animation, the LeadIn will be random still, even when I have one tagged "Doggy, LeadIn". This also takes alot of control away from the modder in this case. 

I also cannot start ONLY a LeadIn Animation. When I call Tags "LeadIN" Sexlab will start a NORMAL Sexlab Scene but with the required tags (and orgasm ofc).

 

It would be very awesome if sexlab would allow for that.

 

 

[NicoleDragoness]

49 minutes ago, OsmelMC said:

Also now I add the general condition that prevent orgasm when the Animation have none Cum defined

 

What this exactly means in terms of tag inside the animation?

[Nymra]

1 minute ago, NicoleDragoness said:

 

What this exactly means in terms of tag inside the animation?

 

nothing afaik. 

the cum is not handled by the tag system

[NicoleDragoness]

Yeah, I suspected that.

And I'm still thinking that the entire tag system is almost obsolete, arbitrary and too often redundant.

[Nymra]

26 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

Yeah, I suspected that.

And I'm still thinking that the entire tag system is almost obsolete, arbitrary and too often redundant.

 

oh. no no, the tag system is very good. It is just not used in any way that makes it work.

 

1. every animator uses his own tagging logic and some just do not tag anything at all
-> this makes tagging VERY tiresome. Yeah, you can use SLATE I think, but I found that not suitable at least for my needs. And I dont know if there is some kind of "general database" where you can just upload a perfectly tagged selection for all SLAL packs

 

2. most mods ignore tags when they call sexlab scenes. OR they use tags too restrictive or call individual scenes directly, both is not a good advice. 
ideally every mod should provide a good system to customize tags used when starting scenes. I admit Naked Defeat is not yet perfect in that regard. SL adventures is doing it quite well, so is POP, hmm,

 

 

what is very flawed IMO is the way that I can control sexlab scenes via script without the requirement of tags.
yeah, tags could maybe solve that too, but not sure.

Edited June 13, 2021 by Nymra

[NicoleDragoness]

52 minutes ago, Nymra said:

1. every animator uses his own tagging logic and some just do not tag anything at all

 

This is why I always edit their json files on my own tastes and use.

 

52 minutes ago, Nymra said:

2. most mods ignore tags when they call sexlab scenes. OR they use tags too restrictive or call individual scenes directly, both is not a good advice. 

 

Absolutely agree.

 

Anyhow, I think there are some tags that are MANDATORY, always, and first one that cames into my mind is the gender notation (F,M,FM,FF,FMM and so on).

THIS tag, with the aggressive one added when needed, could solves alone almost all problems on "calling animations".

[Nymra]

7 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

 

This is why I always edit their json files on my own tastes and use.

 

I hate that like the plague. its such a lenghty work process -.- and you have to do it again on each update.
I do my own SLAL packs, but each is 1-2 full days of work (20-30 hours)

 

7 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

 

Absolutely agree.

 

Anyhow, I think there are some tags that are MANDATORY, always, and first one that cames into my mind is the gender notation (F,M,FM,FF,FMM and so on).

THIS tag, with the aggressive one added when needed, could solves alone almost all problems on "calling animations".

 

there are more...

FUTA, Femdom come to mind which are usually ignored.
Also half the animators ignore the existence of the aggressive tag. 

 

 

[OsmelMC]

1 hour ago, Nymra said:

But: Would it be possible to just check the Actor genders? If all actors are female: consider it a lesbian scene instead of using the lesbian tag (which again is missing often or is also on animations that could be both).

Not because the Lesbian Animations are just the exception of the CumID rule. After all the CumID ("add_cum") defined on the Animation is the only thing that allow me to know if the Animation have Orgasm predefined. Of course for the case of the Lesbian Animations that don't have the CumID I also check if all the Actors are Females and is the current Female Actor trying to reach the orgasm is not fully Straight

 

About the other points:

 

1. The new conditions will prevent the orgasms on mostly of the LeadIn Animations even if are played as standard scenes. And together with the previous versions modifications the issues with the LeadIn Animations are lesser each day.

 

2. About the orgasm control this version solve almost all the issues with that and my SLAL already allow in the JSON file set cum source and add different cum types for each actor and stage. Sadly the Python Scripts to convert the TXT sources on JSON apparently is beyond my skills because is showing errors each time I try it. Of course I can make the JSON directly as I always do and work fine but without the Python file I can't release the Mod update.

 

3. SexLab allow you call your own LeadIn Animations as LeadIn Scene with our without the company of the standard scene since always. But since use a different function to do it no body use it. (In case someone wants to know how, I'm willing to teach)

 

 

[OsmelMC]

2 hours ago, NicoleDragoness said:

I'm still thinking that the entire tag system is almost obsolete, arbitrary and too often redundant.

Probably redundant in some cases, but never obsolete. Because the SexLab can handle many things by his own but can't handle all, and there is where the Tag system come more relevant. Allowing the external Mods a easy way to expand the SexLab possibilities without modified the SexLab scripts. For that reason is important that the Animation authors use the tags to describe the Animation.

[OsmelMC]

52 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

This is why I always edit their json files on my own tastes and use.

To much work. I have preference for the SLATE to edit the tags.

[NicoleDragoness]

1 hour ago, Nymra said:

I hate that like the plague. its such a lenghty work process -.- and you have to do it again on each update.

 

Five minutes to edit a big json file (like Byllyy's ones). And when an update comes I found a quick way adding the new lines (related to hkx animations, behaviours, FNIS-txt and json's) to the old ones. Carefully, of course. For now it works fine.

 

Anyhow, SLAL packs' updates are not so frequent, actually. I've the time to do it.

[NicoleDragoness]

32 minutes ago, OsmelMC said:

Probably redundant in some cases, but never obsolete.

 

Well, you're probably right. The main "lack" is from animators and sex modders.

[Nymra]

1 hour ago, OsmelMC said:

Not because the Lesbian Animations are just the exception of the CumID rule. After all the CumID ("add_cum") defined on the Animation is the only thing that allow me to know if the Animation have Orgasm predefined. Of course for the case of the Lesbian Animations that don't have the CumID I also check if all the Actors are Females and is the current Female Actor trying to reach the orgasm is not fully Straight

 

About the other points:

 

1. The new conditions will prevent the orgasms on mostly of the LeadIn Animations even if are played as standard scenes. And together with the previous versions modifications the issues with the LeadIn Animations are lesser each day.

 

2. About the orgasm control this version solve almost all the issues with that and my SLAL already allow in the JSON file set cum source and add different cum types for each actor and stage. Sadly the Python Scripts to convert the TXT sources on JSON apparently is beyond my skills because is showing errors each time I try it. Of course I can make the JSON directly as I always do and work fine but without the Python file I can't release the Mod update.

 

 

thx for the answer, this sounds really very promising! cant wait to see that happen. 

I just wonder: is Utility Plus also available on SE? since I started uploading SE versions of my mods and noticed I have to check twice for dependency mods exist...

 

1 hour ago, OsmelMC said:

 

3. SexLab allow you call your own LeadIn Animations as LeadIn Scene with our without the company of the standard scene since always. But since use a different function to do it no body use it. (In case someone wants to know how, I'm willing to teach)

 

me, me! 

 

 

I want to abuse Sexlab to make paired animations and if I can use the leadin system for that it might solve some problems. 
while in fact when there is no more orgasm sound, that is already 50% of the problem solved, since now I only have to worry for Cumshot not complying

so yes, using LeadIns on their own would be my preferred way.

 

I dont know when I can start working on scripts again, I ll just PM you, its not urgent anywa.y 

[OsmelMC]

@Nymra

Yes all my Mod, Patch and Tweaks work on LE and SE. In the case of the SLU+ just reinstall it and this time select the "Special Edition" option. But my BETA is available only for LE

 

For the LeadIn just let me know when you be ready and I will send you the lines of scripts needed with some explanation. 

By the way the LeadIn scenes don't play cum, cum sounds or orgasm and have his own undress rules so if is not what you want the linked scenes is the best alternative.

 

Edited June 13, 2021 by OsmelMC

[NicoleDragoness]

@OsmelMC

For conversation, referring to my previous posts about tag, your Debug Spells have the same exact issue than Matchmaker:

 

- Selecting three actors for sex, it could start the "wrong" group animation. For example I launch the spell Target on a Male, then another Male and last a Female and it could happens (too often), that the animation chosen is a FFM. It happens ALSO if the spell sequence is Male-Female-Male or even with Female-Male-Male.

And also all FFM plus FFF animations are listed in the SexLab Tools hotkey and this should not be.

 

It was a problem that also the mod RandomSex had, but there is now a patch that changes this and the correct group animation is always chosen and in the SexLab Tools hotkey list ONLY the correct animations are listed. So it is clearly possible to do that patch for every "sex launcher" mod, I think, including Matchmaker or the Debug Spells.

 

Could you take a look at this?

[OsmelMC]

30 minutes ago, NicoleDragoness said:

@OsmelMC

For conversation, referring to my previous posts about tag, your Debug Spells have the same exact issue than Matchmaker:

 

- Selecting three actors for sex, it could start the "wrong" group animation. For example I launch the spell Target on a Male, then another Male and last a Female and it could happens (too often), that the animation chosen is a FFM. It happens ALSO if the spell sequence is Male-Female-Male or even with Female-Male-Male.

And also all FFM plus FFF animations are listed in the SexLab Tools hotkey and this should not be.

 

It was a problem that also the mod RandomSex had, but there is now a patch that changes this and the correct group animation is always chosen and in the SexLab Tools hotkey list ONLY the correct animations are listed. So it is clearly possible to do that patch for every "sex launcher" mod, I think, including Matchmaker or the Debug Spells.

 

Could you take a look at this?

In the case of the Animation selection the Debug Spells and MatchMaker both let the SexLab deal with this and almost anything else. So if some issue happens if fault of the SexLab Framework or in this case my SexLab Utility Plus.

 

For the gender tags issue first make sure of enable the "Filter Gender Tags Animations" option because this is the option that will remove the invalid Animations once the GetDefaultAnimations function is executed. Also if you have the "Female Use Strap-on" option Enabled the Female Actor are also considered as MALE and for the FFM Actors the FMM and MMM Animations will be added to the list too. I never use the "Filter Gay/Lesbian Animations" option so I not sure what do or if work but also can be useful.

 

All depends of the options enabled

 

Take in consideration that the SexLab for the Default Animations don't care too much about the gender tags because the GetDefaultAnimations function check the gender tags as a plus and cares more about the gender defined for each Actor that is not directly reflected on the Tags for example the function don't care if the genders are FMF or MFF the function just check in this case for Animations with 2 Females and 1 Male and this is usually reflected on the tags but the tags can be removed and for that reason the function first check the MaleCount and FemaleCount that are internal properties of the Animation. I also made it check for the gender tags but is just to add more possibilities for example one MM Animation usually can allow the FM tag but one FM Animation of type Vaginal shouldn't have the MM tag because the male's don't have Vagina.

 

By the way the MatchMaker sort the Actors placing the Females first before start the Animation so hi don't care about the Spell sequence. Of course at the end the SLU+ sort the Actors again based on the Animation but the damage is already done and I can't fully test my Sort Actor function with the MatchMaker. By other side my Debug Spells don't sort the Actors at first and wait for the Animation to sort the Actors based on the Animation allowing me to check if something is wrong with my Sort Actor function that should prevent male actors on Female positions at leas for vaginal Animations.

 

 

Check the options and let me know.

[Nymra]

2 hours ago, OsmelMC said:

@Nymra

Yes all my Mod, Patch and Tweaks work on LE and SE. In the case of the SLU+ just reinstall it and this time select the "Special Edition" option. But my BETA is available only for LE

 

For the LeadIn just let me know when you be ready and I will send you the lines of scripts needed with some explanation. 

By the way the LeadIn scenes don't play cum, cum sounds or orgasm and have his own undress rules so if is not what you want the linked scenes is the best alternative.

 

 

hmm, 

I just remembered in that regard:
 would it be possible to add a "strip item X in stage Y" to LeadIn Scenes? I was wondering if it would be possible to create staged stripping that way.

Right now I will try to do it with "RegisterForSingleUpdate(X)" but that tends to be unreliable when a scene takes a long time to start, hmm.

 

[OsmelMC]

36 minutes ago, Nymra said:

 

hmm, 

I just remembered in that regard:
 would it be possible to add a "strip item X in stage Y" to LeadIn Scenes? I was wondering if it would be possible to create staged stripping that way.

Right now I will try to do it with "RegisterForSingleUpdate(X)" but that tends to be unreliable when a scene takes a long time to start, hmm.

 

That will be awesome, but I can't do that on the Utility. The SexLab allow it and is very easy to do but need to be a mod like "SexLab Cumshot" with the list of Animations and the options for each Animation and stage. After all like the cum this will be different for each Animation.

 

By the way a Mod like this have to use the sslThreadHook functions to deal with the time issues.

Edited June 14, 2021 by OsmelMC

[NicoleDragoness]

9 hours ago, OsmelMC said:

For the gender tags issue first make sure of enable the "Filter Gender Tags Animations" option because this is the option that will remove the invalid Animations once the GetDefaultAnimations function is executed.

 

Hmmm ... not true because all the Lesbian group (FFF) animations still remain listed in the SexLab Tools List even with at least one Male chosen.

 

On the other side, with the option enabled the difference is very minimal:

- Spell on Male-Male-Female -------> animation chosen correctly FMM ------> BUT, actors in wrong positions (one male is in the female place).

  List -----> FFM animations are not listed BUT the FFF (Lesbian group) still are.

NOTE: changing animation with SexLab Tools --------> actors go in the right position (?).

 

- Spell on Male-Female-Female ----------> wrong animation (FMM) -----> AND all wrong animations still listed.

 

Does the sequence of casting the spell matters?

In case of Male-Male-Female should I always cast the female first or not?

 

EDIT: even worst, with the option enabled couple animations started by other mods like RandomSex or SL Approach have almost always the actors inverted (male in female place and viceversa).

Edited June 14, 2021 by NicoleDragoness

[OsmelMC]

@NicoleDragoness

I will check.

 

The Gender Tags filter for the spell on Male-Male-Female is not made to remove the FFF tagged Animations. Is made to remove the Animations without the "FMM, MFM and MMF Tags or without the MMM tag in case the Strap-on be allowed.

 

The function to sort the Actors based on the Animation will not intervene for the male actors if the Animation don't have the Vaginal tag because the the order of the actors given by the external Mod or the Debug spell sequence of casting is the most relevant and the SortActorByAnimation function try to don't intervene at less be really necessary and to know that first check the animation tags like Vaginal or Futa and then check if the Actors are not of the same gender.

 

I need your Papyrus log file.