Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

[downloader7789]

Hey, I'm having issues getting the Device Controller to recognize Devious Devices, has anyone else had this issue? I've tried rebuilding the settings file multiple times but its always empty.

[Zor2k13]

I have an old esp file that is a patch for this mod and EFF I think it came from this mod download page with v1.7.2 or older should I remove that esp before starting a new game after upgrading to this latest version?

[Lupine00]

13 hours ago, Zagzaguel said:

On 4/28/2019 at 3:58 PM, Lupine00 said:

Debuff speech significantly, impair trade pricing, possibly even block some merchants.

One thing that makes this mod really special compared to other "slavery" mods is that it doesnt stop progression even when youre enslaved. It would be rather sad if this was taken away

Doesn't block progression. The point of it is simply to put a constraint on your cashflow. You may even be able to stockpile items for later sale when you're a bit more ... appealing ... to vendors, so you don't even necessarily lose any income, it's just the cashflow that takes a squeeze.

 

I've had this sort of event happen due to Parasites many times, and it interacts really well with DF. I've already played it. It's a fact it doesn't block your game.

 

13 hours ago, Zagzaguel said:

If I force the PC to offer themselfs to a NPC (to male NPCs specifically) it could very well disrupt your gameplay and stop progression

Rain and jumping into water makes it fade instantly so you couldnt.. obey.. this deal all the time even if you wanted to 

 

Forcing specific settings from another mod onto you would also be rather annoying and being forced to run specific settings or else a deal couldnt work is poor game.. mod design imo

Some existing deals and games are already as aggressive, or more so. It doesn't add any new behaviour, certainly nothing worse than is already in slavery.

 

Ability to integrate with another mod isn't forcing, it's optional integration.

2.X flexible deal system can simply disable entire deal stages that don't have soft-dep support, but you wouldn't even need to do that - that's why I suggest the basic inflation fallback. And for those that don't like inflation - don't turn it on.

 

And you know there's already content where a follower requires you to be covered in cum, right?

13 hours ago, Zagzaguel said:

How about your follower is stealing your clothes while sleeping and you have to do some stupid stuff to get it back

Have you played this mod?  That could happen since forever. Plus more. They might add something new for you to wear...

 

Also follower will rip your clothes off while you're awake, in public, in various deals and games.

[user9120975435]

On 28. april 2019 at 10:02 PM, Zagzaguel said:

How about your follower is stealing your clothes while sleeping and you have to do some stupid stuff to get it back

 

This. Very much this! :) With inventory lock so you couldn't just redress?

[aldmerisuper1]

On 4/23/2019 at 7:45 PM, aldmerisuper1 said:

Don't have that one either. But I'll see what I can find out and if I find anything out I will share my findings here.

 

I got it to work for me. What helped for me was, first of all, uninstall 2.02a and load the game. Then I installed DF Old Files, load game, saved game. Uninstalled the mod again, after which I installed version 2.02b. And ever since then, it works.

[valmo]

hello... I've been trying to use this mod now and it keeps crashing on start up (doesn't even let me start a new game, crashes on main menu)
I dunno if this helps, but I tried enabling the papyrus log and this is the message it gets:

 

[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Papyrus log opened (PC)
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Function GetEffectMagnitudes in the empty state on type Ingredient does not exist. Function will not be flagged as callable from tasklets.
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Update budget: 1.200000ms (Extra tasklet budget: 1.200000ms, Load screen budget: 500.000000ms)
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Memory page: 128 (min) 512 (max) 76800 (max total)
 

This is my mod list and I'm using Nexus Mod Manager. I doubt it conflicts with anything (since it doesn't even say on the Devious Follower description page)

 

- ApachiiSkyHair

- Bijin Warmaidens

- Bdoyslide and Outfit Studio

- CBBE

- CBBE Vanilla Outfits

- DDassets

- DDexpansion

- DDiintegration

- Devious Followers (I tried the old version and it crashed too. if disabled, the game runs normally)

- Devious Lore

- Deviously Cursed Loot

- Enhanced Camera

- FNIS Behavior

- Fuz Ro Doh

- HDT Physics Extensions

- OneTweak

- RaceMenu

- SexLabAroused

- SexLabFramework

- ShowRaceMenu PreCacheKiller

- SkyUI

- XP32 Maximum Skeleton Extended

- ZazAnimationPack

 

I also use LOOT for load ordering...

 

I haven't listed any versions, but they should be all up-to-date since I downloaded everything yesterday and today.

 

Does anyone know what could be causing the crashes? Is it something I should have done and didn't do? (I'm installing Devious Followers via NMM)

 

quick edit: I didn't mention and it might be relevant: I'm running steam's SKSE

[Hex Bolt]

2 hours ago, valmo said:

hello... I've been trying to use this mod now and it keeps crashing on start up (doesn't even let me start a new game, crashes on main menu)

Although the mod description page doesn't list it, Devious Followers requires Dawnguard.  Are you perhaps missing that?

[aim4it]

On 4/30/2019 at 1:09 PM, valmo said:

hello... I've been trying to use this mod now and it keeps crashing on start up (doesn't even let me start a new game, crashes on main menu)
I dunno if this helps, but I tried enabling the papyrus log and this is the message it gets:

 

[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Papyrus log opened (PC)
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Function GetEffectMagnitudes in the empty state on type Ingredient does not exist. Function will not be flagged as callable from tasklets.
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Update budget: 1.200000ms (Extra tasklet budget: 1.200000ms, Load screen budget: 500.000000ms)
[04/30/2019 - 01:57:21PM] Memory page: 128 (min) 512 (max) 76800 (max total)
 

This is my mod list and I'm using Nexus Mod Manager. I doubt it conflicts with anything (since it doesn't even say on the Devious Follower description page)

 

- ApachiiSkyHair

- Bijin Warmaidens

- Bdoyslide and Outfit Studio

- CBBE

- CBBE Vanilla Outfits

- DDassets

- DDexpansion

- DDiintegration

- Devious Followers (I tried the old version and it crashed too. if disabled, the game runs normally)

- Devious Lore

- Deviously Cursed Loot

- Enhanced Camera

- FNIS Behavior

- Fuz Ro Doh

- HDT Physics Extensions

- OneTweak

- RaceMenu

- SexLabAroused

- SexLabFramework

- ShowRaceMenu PreCacheKiller 

- SkyUI

- XP32 Maximum Skeleton Extended

- ZazAnimationPack

 

I also use LOOT for load ordering...

 

I haven't listed any versions, but they should be all up-to-date since I downloaded everything yesterday and today.

 

Does anyone know what could be causing the crashes? Is it something I should have done and didn't do? (I'm installing Devious Followers via NMM)

 

quick edit: I didn't mention and it might be relevant: I'm running steam's SKSE

Racemenu already disables the precache, so you don't need that mod anymore.

[Lozeak]

On 4/30/2019 at 6:09 PM, valmo said:

hello... I've been trying to use this mod now and it keeps crashing on start up (doesn't even let me start a new game, crashes on main menu)
I dunno if this helps, but I tried enabling the papyrus log and this is the message it gets:

This kind of thing is a required thing. If it's happening when DF is enabled makes sure you run Loot/Fnis and have Dawngaurd and the latest versions of DD

 

 

 

2

On 4/28/2019 at 9:02 PM, Zagzaguel said:

One thing that makes this mod really special compared to other "slavery" mods is that it doesnt stop progression even when youre enslaved. It would be rather sad if this was taken away

I don't think that will ever change, that said when I first made the mod all content had to try and work with Skyrim/some DD mods and not be wonky. Now I may add content in the future that might not work well with the game or w/e and just make sure people can turn it off if they don't like it.

 

Currently, not added anything or started on anything. Have some plan to add to deals (more modular deals) and add some other things to make it easier for other mods to understand the state of your Follower.

 

[Lupine00]

Is there a way to find out what your modular deal requirements are?

 

When I ask about my existing deals ... nothing happens.

 

Also, there are "named" modular deals, but the names aren't in the MCM, and so it's a but puzzling. When the mod mentions the name, it seems like we're supposed to know what it means to add a new random device requirement to a given deal (rather than it just being added, or being added to some other differently named modular deal).

Even simple addition to the front-page docs to explain them (even if the explanation is "they're totally random") would be enough to fix this without any code change.

[Tiress]

I wanted to ask you guys, do you use any follower framework that you know works well with DF? I'm tempted to make enemies harder making more followers almost a must, but I'm undecided on which follower framework should I pick. I don't need anything flashy, just simple framework that supports multiple followers.

[jonsnuww]

Very functional and neat mod.

I have only one critical crucial point:

How does the dragon born get enslaved and why can't the dragon born free herself?

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity and the very first sentence the followers says to you is "I hope you don't cheat me like other adventurers" so it does really seem odd.

The dragon born can't even cheat the system, the dragon born doesn't necessarily have the moral need to pay back.

 

This obviously doesn't have to be fixed but there are probably a lot of ways to simply do so (and interesting ones).

 

One last thing: Not every follower would like payment, but I personally don't really mind, as the whole point of the mod is, as you said yourself, to make the follower a dangerous thing to have. But vice versa the dragon born is a danger for the follower as well (as pointed out earlier).

 

With that being said, thanks for putting effort into the mod itself.

[Grey Cloud]

14 minutes ago, jonsnuww said:

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity

At what point in the game does the DB become a 'very powerful entity'? Where in Elder Scrolls lore does it mention anything about 'devious' this or that?

[jonsnuww]

19 minutes ago, Grey Cloud said:

At what point in the game does the DB become a 'very powerful entity'? Where in Elder Scrolls lore does it mention anything about 'devious' this or that?

At the moment the game starts, because the player has 'free will', not only that though, the developers themselves made the player the DB a person capable of doing crazy wizard jizz and other awesome stuff. Perhaps the term entity was incorrect but it doesn't really matter as I have gotten my point across.

It doesn't, the player decides over the lore and that is partially the point of my comment.

You're creating your own lore, I myself prefer lores that "make sense".

I might not see you were going for, but I can accuse you of exactly the same, but tbf this is the internet accusations matter not.

 

a little contradicting with the "It doesn't" but I wont put in any effort in something that doesn't lead to anything.

[pihwht]

2 hours ago, jonsnuww said:

Very functional and neat mod.

I have only one critical crucial point:

How does the dragon born get enslaved and why can't the dragon born free herself?

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity and the very first sentence the followers says to you is "I hope you don't cheat me like other adventurers" so it does really seem odd.

The dragon born can't even cheat the system, the dragon born doesn't necessarily have the moral need to pay back.

 

This obviously doesn't have to be fixed but there are probably a lot of ways to simply do so (and interesting ones).

 

One last thing: Not every follower would like payment, but I personally don't really mind, as the whole point of the mod is, as you said yourself, to make the follower a dangerous thing to have. But vice versa the dragon born is a danger for the follower as well (as pointed out earlier).

 

With that being said, thanks for putting effort into the mod itself.

One thing I think would be very nice was to be a player who pays faithfully, but has followers who insist on playing games/deals with the player. My players generally feel guilty if they don't pay in a timely fashion.

[Darkwing241]

2 hours ago, jonsnuww said:

Very functional and neat mod.

I have only one critical crucial point:

How does the dragon born get enslaved and why can't the dragon born free herself?

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity and the very first sentence the followers says to you is "I hope you don't cheat me like other adventurers" so it does really seem odd.

The dragon born can't even cheat the system, the dragon born doesn't necessarily have the moral need to pay back.

 

This obviously doesn't have to be fixed but there are probably a lot of ways to simply do so (and interesting ones).

 

One last thing: Not every follower would like payment, but I personally don't really mind, as the whole point of the mod is, as you said yourself, to make the follower a dangerous thing to have. But vice versa the dragon born is a danger for the follower as well (as pointed out earlier).

 

With that being said, thanks for putting effort into the mod itself.

Seriously?

[jonsnuww]

1 hour ago, Darkwing241 said:

Seriously?

Yes, yes.

There are people in the world who just straight up scam you.

I personally don't encourage it, but knowing that I do something because it's my decision is a lot better then knowing its because I get forced to do so.

I feel like my idea is not very welcome which is good to know for the developer.

It's not like I wouldn't enjoy this mod without a minor change having the idea in mind.

 

edit: scamming could result in somekinda scenario where player is hunted. or maybe the scamming feature itself can only be done if highly in debt...

 

hell it could be optional

[Crota]

Was wondering what the effects of the "werid potion" you drink after becoming heavily in debt with deals does. I drank the potion and played for a few hours but nothing seems to have changed?

[Lozeak]

6 hours ago, jonsnuww said:

Very functional and neat mod.

I have only one critical crucial point:

How does the dragon born get enslaved and why can't the dragon born free herself?

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity and the very first sentence the followers says to you is "I hope you don't cheat me like other adventurers" so it does really seem odd.

The dragon born can't even cheat the system, the dragon born doesn't necessarily have the moral need to pay back.

 

This obviously doesn't have to be fixed but there are probably a lot of ways to simply do so (and interesting ones).

 

One last thing: Not every follower would like payment, but I personally don't really mind, as the whole point of the mod is, as you said yourself, to make the follower a dangerous thing to have. But vice versa the dragon born is a danger for the follower as well (as pointed out earlier).

 

With that being said, thanks for putting effort into the mod itself.

 

Ok, it's a valid question like why can't I just kill the follower if I want to escape.

 

Basically, what it comes down to if you could kill your follower to escape the balance of the mod would fall apart. 

Meaning I had 2 choices building lots of content around being recaptured or making it so something happens where the follower will be too strong to kill and honestly it was just easier to click make follower essential and unkillable than deal with making a ton of content to balance the mod (maybe I will in the future but no plan yet)

 

That said even without the ability to kill the follower if your such a powerful Dragonborn you could easily make the gold to buy your freedom back right?

If you were such a powerful Dragonborn why did you get a follower in the first place?

 

A lot of this comes down to how you see your character more than my mod trying to balance it, for example, if you are like a literal god then you'd be swimming in gold and never need a follower anyway so really for my mod to be fun maybe tweak it so your a little weaker and the game is a little harder so you need a follower (like for example DCL giving you devices that your follower can help you with)

 

Realistically, it's a balance between immersion/gameplay making the follower essential is in line with the game considering it does the same to important NPCs like for example gold is the main currency of the mod and what the follower wants. Yes, it would be cool to have systems based of other resources but with gold a TON of other mod and the game it's self use it meaning you can tweak your game and devious followers to work the way you want to. Like you could tweak the game that your not the Dragonborn and need a follower to get by which lead you to be a slave until you strong enough to buy your freedom.

 

 

 

 

 

2

36 minutes ago, Crota said:

Was wondering what the effects of the "werid potion" you drink after becoming heavily in debt with deals does. I drank the potion and played for a few hours but nothing seems to have changed?

 

I think one verison of the quest is bugged I need to fix it. I forgot about it, I'll look into it soon.

[Hex Bolt]

7 hours ago, jonsnuww said:

Seriously the dragon born is a very powerful entity....

Lozeak already answered this very well just above.  I just wanted to add that you don't have to be powerful.  If you've never played a non-powerful character in Skyrim, you've missed out on a lot of fun.  It's even better when you intentionally create a weak character, perhaps one that needs a follower just to survive.  And with the Skyrim Unbound mod, you can play as a non-Dragonborn, and even prevent yourself from learning shouts.  Try it.  Be a lowly adventurer just trying to get by.  It's a whole new challenge.  A lot of the LoversLab mods make more sense that way. 

[Lupine00]

13 hours ago, Tiress said:

I wanted to ask you guys, do you use any follower framework that you know works well with DF? I'm tempted to make enemies harder making more followers almost a must, but I'm undecided on which follower framework should I pick. I don't need anything flashy, just simple framework that supports multiple followers.

Latest DF explicitly attempts to support EFF and AFT.

[Lupine00]

8 hours ago, Grey Cloud said:

At what point in the game does the DB become a 'very powerful entity'?

I guess it might have something to do with tearing the destroyer of worlds to pieces with your voice.

 

But we can play it how we like. The story can be anything as long as you can sustain suspension of disbelief.

[DoctorAlman]

How about adding that the PC gets forced into deals IF the money is controlled by the follower by having the follower simply saying "Accept or I will take 10% of your gold".

I really enjoy playing around with the advanced gold control mechanics.

[DoctorAlman]

1 hour ago, DoctorAlman said:

How about adding that the PC gets forced into deals IF the money is controlled by the follower by having the follower simply saying "Accept or I will take 10% of your gold".

I really enjoy playing around with the advanced gold control mechanics.

these events themselves would only trigger at a certain willpower level

 

everything adjustable

[Lupine00]

There were some promising ideas about "contracts" a few pages back now.

 

Personally, I'm happy enough with the new feature to compel deals if you have too much debt. You can still refuse, but you might get enslaved or otherwise punished.

 

However, the contract concept, where the player has to agree to things being made worse creates a framework that explains how the follower gets such powers of compulsion.

 

Without this, it's always seemed odd that the follower magically overpowers the PC in some unexplained way and forces them to do certain things - become a slave, be sold, get put into devices. When the PC submits by choice, due to an agreement they make, it feels like it makes more sense, but it also has a good feeling of creating your own trap for yourself.

 

The thread on contracts (and the prelude to it, that began with ME vs DF) starts on page 125 of the DF forum.

The contract stuff starts here: