HDT SMP for SSE?

[esmm40]

I've been trying to edit meshes with SMP in outfit studio but doing so always distorts the mesh. Is there something I need to adjust in outfit studio to allow it to work right. If i use nifskope to make changes its fine but that won't adjust shape.

 

Just opening an outfit with SMP in outfit studio and then exporting with screw up the mesh

[Vyxenne]

On 5/29/2019 at 6:57 AM, esmm40 said:

I've been trying to edit meshes with SMP in outfit studio but doing so always distorts the mesh. Is there something I need to adjust in outfit studio to allow it to work right. If i use nifskope to make changes its fine but that won't adjust shape.

 

Just opening an outfit with SMP in outfit studio and then exporting with screw up the mesh

This is a problem with all cloth-physics meshes as far as I know, both HDT-PE (Oldrim Havok) and SMP (late Oldrim and all SSE Bullet). As such, it isn't an SMP issue per se, and your question should probably be posted for @ousnius in his Bodyslide and/or Nif Optimizer threads since both of those utilities break cloth-physics meshes.

 

If ousnius can't figure out how to optimize and/or edit/build cloth-physics meshes, I doubt anyone on the planet can do so.

[ousnius]

9 hours ago, Vyxenne said:

This is a problem with all cloth-physics meshes as far as I know, both HDT-PE (Oldrim Havok) and SMP (late Oldrim and all SSE Bullet). As such, it isn't an SMP issue per se, and your question should probably be posted for @ousnius in his Bodyslide and/or Nif Optimizer threads since both of those utilities break cloth-physics meshes.

 

If ousnius can't figure out how to optimize and/or edt/build cloth-physics meshes, I doubt anyone on the planet can do so.

Neither the optimizer nor OS (in the new versions) should cause any issues with SMP meshes.

At the very least not for all of them.

[esmm40]

So I tried Tribal Clothe as something simple since the SMP Version was over on the diamo page. The bodyslide files worked great and i was able to get the shape I wanted but if I tried to alter the mesh in any way it would freak out. In this experiment I simply tried putting the shorts from the prison rags onto the body of the tribal cloth Top (I later altered the texture of the top to basically make the prison rags with SMP since the Top mesh shape is basically the same). If I did it in OS it failed but if I just copied it with nifskope it was fine. As soon as I exported the mesh from OS the product was awful. I even tried adding the shorts to the ShapeData mesh in order to use the sliders and match the weights of the shorts with the body weight of the top but once i conformed the shorts to the body it again caused an end product that was freaked out. I ultimately achieved what I wanted by editing the shorts separately and adding them to the body using Nifskope but ofc couldn't ever match weights so I had to do a lot of back and forth to eliminate as much clipping as i could. I would really like to be able do this all in OS though. I'm using 4.7.2 and but maybe my UUNP conversion files for OS are bad?  

 

 

 

[markTheLustOne]

So, can someone point to me a easy tutorial or just set the bones of a mesh to me? I know how build the XML but not the bones.

[Vyxenne]

10 hours ago, ousnius said:

Neither the optimizer nor OS (in the new versions) should cause any issues with SMP meshes.

At the very least not for all of them.

Thank you for replying- I'll do version checks on both and give it another try then- I have some SMP outfits I've been dying to wear but since I couldn't conform them to my body preset shape (without breaking the mesh) I couldn't wear them because all my accessories clipped badly since they are conformed to my preset shape.

[Vyxenne]

9 hours ago, esmm40 said:

So I tried Tribal Clothe as something simple since the SMP Version was over on the diamo page. The bodyslide files worked great and i was able to get the shape I wanted but if I tried to alter the mesh in any way it would freak out. In this experiment I simply tried putting the shorts from the prison rags onto the body of the tribal cloth Top (I later altered the texture of the top to basically make the prison rags with SMP since the Top mesh shape is basically the same). If I did it in OS it failed but if I just copied it with nifskope it was fine. As soon as I exported the mesh from OS the product was awful. I even tried adding the shorts to the ShapeData mesh in order to use the sliders and match the weights of the shorts with the body weight of the top but once i conformed the shorts to the body it again caused an end product that was freaked out. I ultimately achieved what I wanted by editing the shorts separately and adding them to the body using Nifskope but ofc couldn't ever match weights so I had to do a lot of back and forth to eliminate as much clipping as i could. I would really like to be able do this all in OS though. I'm using 4.7.2 and but maybe my UUNP conversion files for OS are bad?  

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Wow. I didn't try any surgery on the Tribal Clothe (sic) meshes, just conformed them to my preset shape and they worked fine. However, trying to optimize them, either in Nif Optimizer or in Outfit Studio, broke them immediately. Ousnius said the new versions of both utilities shouldn't break cloth-physics meshes any more, so I'm on my way to make sure I have the latest versions and try again.

 

Out of curiosity, why not just leave the shorts in their own mesh and wear them with the Tribal Top? What is the advantage (or allure) of pushing the non-SMP shorts into the SMP Top mesh file? Personally, I go the other way- the more modular I can make my outfits, the better it is for me because it gives me more mix-n-match possibilities. So I'm always splitting my "top and bottom" meshes into two separate nif files. Since the Tribal Clothe (sic) meshes are already separate, why add items to either one?

 

PS: I like those shorts, what mod are they from? Also, your girl has a cute shape- is it a standard preset or custom? And what idle is that? Very sexy.

[esmm40]

Thanks, you made a lot of good points. I realized on the way to work that I could have just kept the parts separate but I would still have clipping where weights vary even slightly. I also like to keep parts together and use the armors as replacers rather standalone sets. For instance I'm playing through vigilant right now (again) and am replacing all the female versions of the armors with appropriate but more appealing and updated alternatives. Also, I like to free up slots if possible sometimes, in the pic I have a circlet and horns and hair but i also have a dragon priest mask on my hip for example  (All separate slots). 

 

I did have to optimize the Tribal Clothe, I know because otherwise the virtual ground mesh would flicker in game. So the optimization didnt do it for me. Now, I thought maybe I will try to conform the mesh to my preferred body shape first and not add anything else, but I have still had issue with other SMP pieces I've tried that with like the sexylingerie set and the BDO conversions out there. It has to be something to do with how OS exports the meshes or saves the changes because Bodyslide doesn't appear to do that, but those shapedata files had to be created in OS to begin with right? Thats why I assumed it was a setting issue but I'm not sure now.

 

The prison rag version I'm using is https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/94864

and my bodyslide preset is7BO take2 no Cleavage.xml

I use either the 7B Bombshell or the 7B Cleavage high sliders at 60 depending on the armor with a UUNP Special body. I also use race menu to adjust the spine and hips slightly to give her a shorter appearance without losing the curviness of the body type and then set the head bigger to compensate. Oh and the idle is https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/59048

I like it cause its not too slutty but still feminine and shows off the collision. I can't remember if there was an SE version or if I had to convert it. I had to convert the VHH animations sadly but its not hard.

[Vyxenne]

20 hours ago, esmm40 said:

the idle is https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/59048

I converted it and installed it- it's perfect, thank you.

[Vyxenne]

On 5/30/2019 at 5:29 AM, ousnius said:

Neither the optimizer nor OS (in the new versions) should cause any issues with SMP meshes.

At the very least not for all of them.

I just had to come back here and thank you! I told you I was going to test, and I just got through with my first test case.

 

I made sure I had the latest versions of BS/OS and Nif Optimizer, then grabbed a (rare) Oldrim cloth-physics armor mod featuring SMP (not HDT-PE) cloth physics. The guy who added SMP physics to this Oldrim mod only made a high-weight nif, which is one of the reasons I picked this armor for testing. Here's what I did:

• I installed the mesh with no optimization or conversion and tested in-game- full physics but a horribad body shape, which is to be expected since I hadn't yet conformed it.
• I optimized the mesh and checked it in NifSkope, where I found no distortion or stretching as has been the case in my past efforts. Nif Opt didn't break it!
• I made a new OD Project and replaced the Oldrim body with my default reference body, then checked the physics bones- all still there and in the right places!
• I conformed the armor to my Reference Body shape and rechecked the bones- all still where they belong.
• I batch-built the meshes to my custom preset shape, then inspected the armor's mesh folder
• I found both high- and low-weight nifs, so BS had built both meshes as specified
• Checking the nifs in NifSkope, I found that all the bones looked correct, but the NiStringExtraData ("HDT Skinned Mesh Physics Object") had been removed by OS and/or BS  so I manually added them back because I can't figure out how to paste a copied NiStringExtraData into a mesh file and have it land in the correct hierarchy- my first two attempts ended up with the NiStringExtraData being named "Scene Root" with no data, all the way to the left with the actual Scene Root NiNode.
• Finally, with both high- and low-weight nifs looking OK to me, I tested in game... and got full cloth physics as well as a perfect fit!!

So whatever you did to stop OS/NifOpt from breaking physics meshes, it worked, at least on RealClone's SMP Scarlet Dawn Armor mesh for Oldrim. Thank you.

[esmm40]

So I just wanted to clarify, you optimized the mesh and then loaded it in to SE version of OS to create the ShapeData? I had thought that I might need to go back and add the NiStringExtraData with nifskope afterwards but hadn’t gotten a chance yet to try it. I was going to see about creating an SMP version of dragon priestess for SE once I get this figured out. Any recommendation for an already oldrim smp armor to use now and duplicate what u did above?

i May need to make sure my optimizer is the most recent version also.

[Vyxenne]

1 hour ago, esmm40 said:

So I just wanted to clarify, you optimized the mesh and then loaded it in to SE version of OS to create the ShapeData? I had thought that I might need to go back and add the NiStringExtraData with nifskope afterwards but hadn’t gotten a chance yet to try it. I was going to see about creating an SMP version of dragon priestess for SE once I get this figured out. Any recommendation for an already oldrim smp armor to use now and duplicate what u did above?

i May need to make sure my optimizer is the most recent version also.

Well, here's the thing- I was so concerned about NifOpt>>OS>>BS deleting (or disordering or detaching) physics bones that that's all I checked for. The reason this failure on my part is significant is that I can't tell you which of the first 2 utilities actually deleted the NiStringExtraData. I know it was one of the first two because my ShapeData nif did NOT have the NiStringExtraData in it, and only Nif Opt and OS had touched it when the ShapeData nif was created. I wasn't expecting the NiStringExtraData to disappear at all and so I didn't check for it at each step like I checked the bones. Mea Culpa.

 

But yes, to answer the first part of your question, I optimized it then loaded it into SSE BS2 x64 (latest version) to create the ShapeData nif. Then when the BS output nifs did not have the NiStringExtraData I just added it to the ShapeData nif and batch-built the game nifs since that saved me two manual edits.

 

RealClone's Scarlet Dawn mesh (that's all he provides, btw, is one cloth-physics torso mesh and the SMP xml to run it, not the whole Scarlet Dawn Armor mod) is the only Oldrim SMP mod or part-mod that I can think of off the top of my head- as I'm sure you know, 99% of Oldrim cloth-physics mods used HDT-PE (Havok.)

 

If I had to pick a cloth-physics Oldrim armor that is beautiful and sorely needed in SSE I would pick Raven's incomparable Draconic Bloodline, but the problem is it's HDT-PE and I lack the skills to write the SMP xml.

 

Here's why I'd pick that particular armor:

Spoiler

 

 

 

[Yoxgg04]

recently i have HDT smp installed in game dir and alone my body physics dont work in game using MO even when i remove mods one by one is there something that i am missing?

[esmm40]

I would make sure your directory is right and all folders are spelled correctly. Then if using mod organizer move the relevant mods to the bottom and look to see what mods are conflicting with each other to ensure stuff is in the right order and finally run fnis 

[Deathmaw]

What's the difference between 62 and 73 for SMP? Is there a changelog?

[SimianJyhad]

Vyxenne that Draconic Bloodline armor is beautiful!

[Vyxenne]

13 minutes ago, SimianJyhad said:

Vyxenne that Draconic Bloodline armor is beautiful!

I knowwwwwwwwwww!

 

I could convert the armor meshes to SE myself but I simply can't write the xml for SMP, and the few "tutorials" I've found on it are either dead wrong (they were written years ago) or unintelligible gibberish (to me.)

[Vyxenne]

40 minutes ago, Deathmaw said:

What's the difference between 62 and 73 for SMP? Is there a changelog?

The difference is that hdtSSEPhysics.dll is game- and SKSE-version-specific (and has always been.)

 

Also, it has been reported that the 1_5_73 version released on April 17, 2019 for SKSE64 2.0.15 no longer causes jitters and imposes a lighter fps load, meaning less of an fps penalty.

[Andarus]

Has anyone a realistic UUNP XML with realistic Breastphysics? I don't want huge Ass-Jiggle or Breasts that move like Jelly. I use the UUNPSpSMP.xml right now and that has nice Vagina Phyiscs but the breasts are like Jelly.

[Slashz]

1 hour ago, Andarus said:

Has anyone a realistic UUNP XML with realistic Breastphysics? I don't want huge Ass-Jiggle or Breasts that move like Jelly. I use the UUNPSpSMP.xml right now and that has nice Vagina Phyiscs but the breasts are like Jelly.

Try these values
 

Spoiler

<bone name="NPC L PreBreast">
        <mass>0.000000</mass>
        <inertia x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <linearDamping>0</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0</angularDamping>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <restitution>0</restitution>
    </bone>

    <bone name="NPC R PreBreast">
        <mass>0.000000</mass>
        <inertia x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <linearDamping>0</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0</angularDamping>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <restitution>0</restitution>
    </bone>

    <bone name="NPC L Breast">
        <mass>0.5</mass>
        <inertia x="5" y="5" z="5"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="2" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <linearDamping>0.99</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.99</angularDamping>
        <restitution>1</restitution>
    </bone>

    <bone name="NPC R Breast">
        <mass>0.5</mass>
        <inertia x="5" y="5" z="5"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="2" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <linearDamping>0.99</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.99</angularDamping>
        <restitution>1</restitution>
    </bone>
    
    <bone name="NPC L Breast01">
        <mass>1</mass>
        <inertia x="5" y="5" z="5"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="2" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <linearDamping>0.99</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.99</angularDamping>
        <restitution>1</restitution>
    </bone>

    <bone name="NPC R Breast01">
        <mass>1</mass>
        <inertia x="5" y="5" z="5"/>
        <centerOfMassTransform>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="2" z="0"/>
        </centerOfMassTransform>
        <friction>0</friction>
        <rollingFriction>0</rollingFriction>
        <linearDamping>0.99</linearDamping>
        <angularDamping>0.99</angularDamping>
        <restitution>1</restitution>
    </bone>

    <generic-constraint bodyA="NPC L Breast" bodyB="NPC L PreBreast">
        <frameInB>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        </frameInB>
        <useLinearReferenceFrameA>false</useLinearReferenceFrameA>
        <linearLowerLimit x="-5" y="-5" z="-3"/>
        <linearUpperLimit x="2" y="0" z="12"/>
        <angularLowerLimit x="-0.1" y="-0.1" z="-0.1"/>
        <angularUpperLimit x="0.1" y="0.1" z="0.1"/>
            <linearStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
            <angularStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
        <linearDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <angularDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <linearEquilibrium x="1" y="-1" z="-3"/>
        <angularEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="0"/>
        <linearBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
        <angularBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
    </generic-constraint>
  
    <generic-constraint bodyA="NPC R Breast" bodyB="NPC R PreBreast">
        <frameInB>
            <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1"/>
            <origin x="0" y="0" z="0"/>
        </frameInB>
    <useLinearReferenceFrameA>false</useLinearReferenceFrameA>
        <linearLowerLimit x="-2" y="-5" z="-3" />
        <linearUpperLimit x="5" y="0" z="12" />
        <angularLowerLimit x="-0.1" y="-0.1" z="-0.1"/>
        <angularUpperLimit x="0.1" y="0.1" z="0.1"/>
            <linearStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
            <angularStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
        <linearDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <angularDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <linearEquilibrium x="1" y="-1" z="-3"/>
        <angularEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="0"/>
        <linearBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
        <angularBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
    </generic-constraint>
  
    <generic-constraint bodyA="NPC L Breast01" bodyB="NPC L PreBreast">
        <frameInB>
             <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1" />
             <origin x="0" y="0" z="0" />
        </frameInB>
        <useLinearReferenceFrameA>false</useLinearReferenceFrameA>
        <linearLowerLimit x="-5" y="-5" z="-3"/>
        <linearUpperLimit x="2" y="0" z="12"/>
        <angularLowerLimit x="-0.1" y="-0.1" z="-0.1"/>
        <angularUpperLimit x="0.1" y="0.1" z="0.1"/>
            <linearStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
            <angularStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
        <linearDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <angularDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <linearEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="-3"/>
        <angularEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="0"/>
        <linearBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
        <angularBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
    </generic-constraint>
  
    <generic-constraint bodyA="NPC R Breast01" bodyB="NPC R PreBreast">
        <frameInB>
             <basis x="0" y="0" z="0" w="1" />
             <origin x="0" y="0" z="0" />
        </frameInB>
        <useLinearReferenceFrameA>false</useLinearReferenceFrameA>
        <linearLowerLimit x="-2" y="-5" z="-3" />
        <linearUpperLimit x="5" y="0" z="12" />
        <angularLowerLimit x="-0.1" y="-0.1" z="-0.1"/>
        <angularUpperLimit x="0.1" y="0.1" z="0.1"/>
            <linearStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
            <angularStiffness x="200" y="200" z="200"/>
        <linearDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <angularDamping x="0.9" y="0.9" z="0.9"/>
        <linearEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="-3"/>
        <angularEquilibrium x="-1" y="-1" z="0"/>
        <linearBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
        <angularBounce x="1.2" y="1.2" z="1.2"/>
    </generic-constraint>

 

 

 

[Andarus]

Thanks thats already way better, maybe a tiny bit too stiff but I'll figure it out.

[SimianJyhad]

I just want to be able to edit how much a particular cloth flaps around. The Dragon Priestess Outfit from sunjeong fits perfectly the succubus I am playing (succubus hearts, succubus race strictly spell user) but the damn thing flaps around crazily when running. I would rather it settle down and be more like the smp wig I am wearing (I may not have as many hair styles as Vyxenne but I am getting there)

 

 

EDIT: Going through Gromillas files to see if anything there can help me. if you know of a similar dress that isnt so crazy but is SMP enabled and that I can get to work with a CBBE body PLEASE tell me!

[roterst]

Anyone got a xml for cbbe with collisions that doesn't drop my fps by 30~ in crowded places? Or is massive fps drop unavoidable when using collisions?

[Yoxgg04]

anyone else having problems getting to the chinese 9damo website?

[Vyxenne]

1 hour ago, Yoxgg04 said:

anyone else having problems getting to the chinese 9damo website?

Only every time I try to use it. Every. Single. Time. The Great Wall of China has been reborn on the internet.