MMO Etiquette

[KoolHndLuke]

7 hours ago, RitualClarity said:

 

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Thanks, RC. Don't mind if I use that, right? 

[t.ara]

56 minutes ago, Tyrant99 said:

It's an impressive game technically, physics, animations, models, overall content, but, then again I guess it should be since they poured a quarter billion dollars into it. I haven't played it for a few years though, 75gigs is a bit too much of my precious SSD space.

I agree 100%-anyway do I see LOT of similar things between the skyrim engine and GTAV....SKYRIM has better texture-quality....and the tree animations of gtav are not really professional, compared to the boned-tree animation of skyrim. The physics are WoW, animations also...tracy di santo has btw. also "HDT" hairs-as only single character in that game-lol...maybe they could not make the game more powerful, because it´s an online game, which needs to share the actual data from all the gamers which are in one lobby playing-this is a crazy technical action.

If I compare for example the skeleton-mesh-stretching and the clothing-deformation, I think it´s like always the same in different games. Everything´s good weigthed but they did not make a physical hype of it.

 

 

I sent you a p.m and I would be happy if you could have a serious look at that.

 

[RitualClarity]

11 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

Thanks, RC. Don't mind if I use that, right? 

Sure, go ahead!

[steelpanther24]

On 5/4/2020 at 5:12 AM, landess said:

Veteran of: Star Wars Galaxies - pre NGE.

                  WoW - pre Burning Crusade

                  Age of Conan - pre Free to Play

                  Lord of the Rings Online - pre Game Sold to other Company (tried to play some afterwards, but the changed mechanics left me less interested)

 

Honorable mentions - Lineage 2, EVE, Rift (actually not bad) and a few others I can't remember, but know that these all had a form of open world PVP which wasn't the experience I prefer. If I want PVP, I'll play the current crop of online shooters based on match play, not a persistent world.

What are the average age of the games on those that you listed?   That may also have something to do with the difference in etiquette.  I recall many a great days spent on EQ (yep I am one of Everquest players..... I think both WOW and EQ types chose to ignore those  five people screaming "but Ultima Online was first!!!"), but the age of the real players were pretty close to me and were of a similar culture (US/UK servers).   In GTA V, I have played with and against players in Taiwan, South Korea, Russia, Egypt, whose only reason for teaming is to accomplish that one goal of finishing a mission.   

 

At the risk of ruining any chance to become the Prime Minister of the UK, acceptable and standard codes of conduct are much easier to come up with with a relatively homogeneous group of people.   In a heterogeneous environment, we are left with "what is allowable under the law" (or EULA in this case).

 

You never played Dark Age of Camelot?   I liked that game too, though the quest line did  not keep me engaged.   Oh  and also talking about old stuff, who else here (from EQ) was it poor etiquette to lead the griffins in East Commonlands to the unofficial market place  in hopes that you would be saved by at least one high level player that needed the griffin feathers?   I have been on both sides of that issue.

[darkconsole]

just git gud ez mode

[landess]

5 hours ago, steelpanther24 said:

You never played Dark Age of Camelot?

No, only really heard of it from the AoC guild I joined - the core members were all veterans.

5 hours ago, steelpanther24 said:

What are the average age of the games on those that you listed?   That may also have something to do with the difference in etiquette.

That was my point. New and rude seems to be the way of things now. Also it would seem most players don't enjoy the 'holy trinity' of tank/damage dealer/healer much (although maybe Fortnight still tries to follow that formula somewhat).

5 hours ago, steelpanther24 said:

was it poor etiquette to lead the griffins in East Commonlands to the unofficial market place

That would fall under my 'don't be an asshole' recommendation. 'Training' something on purpose wasn't the same as running for your life (because death = loss of XP). I've seen that used as a griefing tactic - Max level player leads a high level enemy somewhere with lot's of low levels and watches the chaos......   As mentioned, many games began changing their game mechanics to stop losers.

[KoolHndLuke]

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile? Do they all kinda expect the players to participate in teams? I seem to remember reading about some that are more like a single player experience with the option for teaming up if you want. I don't want to play alone all the time, I just want the option to team up when I want. Do you always know where other players are in all mmos?

 

thought this was interesting- the "cannon fodder" idea in particular- meaning low level players are needed for massive battles or something (could call them mercs or whatever). Another idea I had is to give players good death alternatives- like say a detail oriented injury system that requires some players to have more support skills. I would be very interested in playing as a mechanic or highly skilled medic.

Spoiler

 

 

[Darkpig]

4 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile? Do they all kinda expect the players to participate in teams? I seem to remember reading about some that are more like a single player experience with the option for teaming up if you want. I don't want to play alone all the time, I just want the option to team up when I want. Do you always know where other players are in all mmos?

 

thought this was interesting- the "cannon fodder" idea in particular- meaning low level players are needed for massive battles or something (could call them mercs or whatever). Another idea I had is to give players good death alternatives- like say a detail oriented injury system that requires some players to have more support skills. I would be very interested in playing as a mechanic or highly skilled medic.

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I find that interesting that several people feel like going solo.

 

Why I find it interesting is because this is partly why I avoid MMOs altogether. To explain is that multiplayer has far too many problems. The grind is far too much, events are time sensitive, technical limitations make me cry and I often don't have time for that kind of thing.

 

starting with the grind it really gets in the way of having a competent team in a raid battle as many team mates are underleveled. This can really fragment teamwork and should be avoided when possible. Also the time sensitivity really gets on my nerves when an update comes along and they for example add more levels or a funny hat which is important because shuddup it is.

 

On the technical end I'm well off or I should be well off if the internet wasn't so shit. Seriously something is clearly wrong with the internet in America and fuck the details but somebody needs to fix it. Laggy internet leads to unnecessary apologies and I would rather avoid that in a multiplayer game.

 

Then there are time restraints which sounds much kinkier than it actually is. There really is nothing I can do about a 9 to 5 job, meals, bowel movements and so on.

[Fotogen]

4 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile? Do they all kinda expect the players to participate in teams? I seem to remember reading about some that are more like a single player experience with the option for teaming up if you want. I don't want to play alone all the time, I just want the option to team up when I want. Do you always know where other players are in all mmos?

 

thought this was interesting- the "cannon fodder" idea in particular- meaning low level players are needed for massive battles or something (could call them mercs or whatever). Another idea I had is to give players good death alternatives- like say a detail oriented injury system that requires some players to have more support skills. I would be very interested in playing as a mechanic or highly skilled medic.

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Guild Wars 2.

 

Basic(core) is free 2 play. Expansion costs money. But its 1-time payement. No subscription. Pay once, use forever.

 

PvE and PvP are separate. No mixing.

 

It counts as very casual friendly. It actually is.

 

Some interesting features:

- you can group in a traditional way. Like a group/squad.

- but even if you don't, whoever is around you, counts as your party member. Sort of. Sounds weird, but it works.

- it auto scales stuff based on the number of other players that are around that actually do something. If its only you, its solo, if more players, it jumps to "group"

- next to zero "quest givers". Most, near all, quests happen if someone is around(and not AFK). Its called "dynamic event".
- so you can just run around and stuff happens. No need to chase down NPCs and beg for work.

- you get XP, loot, if you participate in same way. No "im not on this quest, plz share". If you are "there' and do stuff, you get your fair share.

 

The dark side is "Fashion Wars". Many are not so obsessed with power as they are with "pretty". Female armor can be as kinky as what you can find on LL. Especialy light, caster oriented armor.

 

[27X]

The only games you're likely to play solo are Kingdom Under Fire II, Guild Wars 2 and Warframe.

[KoolHndLuke]

53 minutes ago, Fotogen said:

Female armor can be as kinky as what you can find on LL

uhmm, that's a good thing, right? I'll play as a hot stripper/hooker any time I can- it's better than some sausage fest and all the raging testosterone that goes with it.

 

I think my point is that not every player wants to beat the boss or win the race- it's enough to support those that do. So....a game with more role playing choices would be ideal in an mmo with lots of other players. I don't usually want to be the hero or leader.

[Darkpig]

16 minutes ago, KoolHndLuke said:

uhmm, that's a good thing, right? Isn't most of gaming experience the eye-candy?

I think Fotogen was talking about a lack of male fan service.

 

Goddammmit I'm getting off topic again!

 

Appearance really does mean something. I can see where skimpy armor could destroy a roleplay setting for some people especially when other players are involved. Like who wears a bikini in a Victorian London setting really?

[KoolHndLuke]

25 minutes ago, Darkpig said:

Appearance really does mean something. I can see where skimpy armor could destroy a roleplay setting for some people especially when other players are involved. Like who wears a bikini in a Victorian London setting really?

So, you're expected to dress for the part. Sure it's sometimes not just a bunch of fanboyz that get a little too exited when they see some skin? Let;s say you're on a killing spree, what avatars do you go for first?

[Darkpig]

3 minutes ago, KoolHndLuke said:

So, you're expected to dress for the part. Sure it's sometimes not just a bunch of fanboyz that get a little too exited when they see some skin? Let;s say you're on a killing spree, what avatars do you go for first?

Marcus Fe-fuck!

 

That one guy from the game about chainsaw guns.

 

I won't say that out of character costumes make a bad game. This is a guideline more than anything. A soft spoken rule is how I like to put it and like any rule it should can be broken. It is kind of like the guild that quotes or quoteth Shakespeare. Maybe they will be accepting of your modernisms but expect a lot of Shakespeare.

[Fotogen]

55 minutes ago, KoolHndLuke said:

uhmm, that's a good thing, right? I'll play as a hot stripper/hooker any time I can- it's better than some sausage fest and all the raging testosterone that goes with it.

 

I think my point is that not every player wants to beat the boss or win the race- it's enough to support those that do. So....a game with more role playing choices would be ideal in an mmo with lots of other players. I don't usually want to be the hero or leader.

It was suppose to be "advertisement"   Guild Wars 2 is really not that kinky tho. I think it counts as PG13 or something.

 

Roleplay support type? Hmm. GW2 kinda hates that.

The reason:

- if a game has roles(classes) that are more specialized like Tank, Heal, DPS, they are also very "exclusive". Only Healer can heal, only Tank can tank and so on

- nothing wrong with that, but

- it means that a group must have those "roles" or it cant do shit.

- so you wait to get all roles in your group. And wait. And wait, and ...

- "roles" also like to develop god-like-superiority complex. Do what I say, or I quit and then you all fail. And game is designed in such a way that you really fail if you don't have all roles in the group

- dark side is also: if one, just one role fails, all fail. No backup. Thats usualy Tank or Healer.

- huge pressure . It means not many player want that role. It means not many around. It means, wait, wait, wait ... and then you get a primadona that thinks he/she is a god.

 

So GW2 was designed in such a way that standard holy trinity is not required for most things.

 

If you want standard roles, GW2 is no good for you. Don't touch.

 

[landess]

6 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile?

Most any old school MMO will do this, so you can learn your character/class, get involved in the lore, see the mechanics at work. If I remember correctly, the 1st dungeon WoW threw at us was like level 12 (needed a group because the enemies were 'elite' and a proper level character couldn't last).

 

Games like LotRO never forced a player to do group content either, as they added a mechanic to do the 'book' quests that buffed the character to be on level with the elites if solo. Age of Conan had players reaching like lvl 17 IRCC before leaving the tutorial area.

 

Find something that interests you and give it a shot. If you want to continue there shouldn't be a problem finding others to do the harder stuff, And depending on the game, you may find the groups are mostly veteran players with a new class being level'd up.

[landess]

8 minutes ago, Fotogen said:

Do what I say, or I quit and then you all fail.

This is a good example of bad etiquette. The Child mentality. Now if someone is going Leeroy Jenkins all the time, then the group is bound to fail anyways - that's why they have an ignore feature so you don't make the same mistake twice.

[KoolHndLuke]

43 minutes ago, Fotogen said:

The reason:

What if the roles weren't dependent on each other or they let you cross-class? Like maybe there's a basic healing system for all chars, but more learned players become paladins- that sort of thing. That way no one can quit and fuck groups. Maybe a way to change class(es) if you want to.

[Fotogen]

34 minutes ago, KoolHndLuke said:

What if the roles weren't dependent on each other or they let you cross-class? Like maybe there's a basic healing system for all chars, but more learned players become paladins- that sort of thing. That way no one can quit and fuck groups. Maybe a way to change class(es) if you want to.

Thats how it is in GW2. All can self-heal and self-buff. You actualy can't avoid it. If you want, you can build a character that can do that support part a bit better.

 

My "reason" was more about traditional trinity based MMO games where you "just can't". Healer can heal, and that it. Others just can't.

 

At the end, you will have to see for yourself if specific game fits you. Good thing is, that all have some sort of free2play mode or trial. For testing, no money has to be exchanged.

 

[Buridan]

8 hours ago, Fotogen said:

The dark side is "Fashion Wars". Many are not so obsessed with power as they are with "pretty". Female armor can be as kinky as what you can find on LL. Especialy light, caster oriented armor.

It runs the gamut. You can go full stripperific, but there's also a lot of scope for very neat, lore-friendly looks that aren't super skimpy because at this point, Fashion Wars 2 has been spitting out outfits and armor sets for years and years.

 

I like GW2 a lot, I go back to it every few months. There's no gear treadmill so you can put it down for a bit then jump right back in. For the most part, because of the way XP is shared and loot is instanced, groups just naturally coalesce around emerging objectives without much need for formal organization, then disperse when it's done. It's the perfect MMO for introverts who want to be part of a nebulous community of players doing things in the same worldspace but not have a lot of mandatory interaction.

[MrEsturk]

8 hours ago, Darkpig said:

Appearance really does mean something. I can see where skimpy armor could destroy a roleplay setting for some people especially when other players are involved. Like who wears a bikini in a Victorian London setting really?

Other people crapping over your personal tastes in immersion is unavoidable in any MMO that groups a several hundred/thousand strangers together per server. Even if you find one without sexy armor (count me out then ) you'll get people playing fat dudes in pink speedos or other trollish joke characters. Find one with no custom outfits you'll still have to deal with leet-speak gibberish names and people naming their characters after pop culture figures that either don't fit the lore and/or the player didn't even try to make their toon resemble. And that doesn't even begin to factor in gold bot spam or all the other nonsense you'll see going on in general chat. You pretty much have to expect to see other players that make you cringe and accept there isn't much that can be done about it.

[Jahn_Doe]

21 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile? Do they all kinda expect the players to participate in teams? I seem to remember reading about some that are more like a single player experience with the option for teaming up if you want. I don't want to play alone all the time, I just want the option to team up when I want. Do you always know where other players are in all mmos?

 

Personally I like Elder Scrolls Online. Entry level gear can be crafted (get someone else or learn the crafting skills/traits yourself), mid-game gear can be gotten from easy dungeons that can be solo'd while end-game gear would then require you to either team up and go into the raids or DLC dungeons or go into the harder solo content (Maelstrom Arena).

 

Since all the mobs scale to your level throughout the game, you're not gated from entering any region because your level is too low (but you cannot enter DLC dungeons as a lower level)

[Darkpig]

On 5/6/2020 at 8:41 PM, MrEsturk said:

Other people crapping over your personal tastes in immersion is unavoidable in any MMO that groups a several hundred/thousand strangers together per server. Even if you find one without sexy armor (count me out then ) you'll get people playing fat dudes in pink speedos or other trollish joke characters. Find one with no custom outfits you'll still have to deal with leet-speak gibberish names and people naming their characters after pop culture figures that either don't fit the lore and/or the player didn't even try to make their toon resemble. And that doesn't even begin to factor in gold bot spam or all the other nonsense you'll see going on in general chat. You pretty much have to expect to see other players that make you cringe and accept there isn't much that can be done about it.

Blame the people that invented speedos not the people that wear them. Reminds me of Lord of the Rings Online where even bearded dwarves can wear dresses. Blame Gimli? Oh who am I kidding they look fabulous. If fat people wear speedos that is their choice but it is more than likely they will grow sick of it quickly especially if nobody pays attention to that fact.

[GodSmack]

On 5/6/2020 at 7:34 AM, KoolHndLuke said:

So, what's a good rpg mmo that would let me build my character/let me do my own thing for awhile? Do they all kinda expect the players to participate in teams? I seem to remember reading about some that are more like a single player experience with the option for teaming up if you want. I don't want to play alone all the time, I just want the option to team up when I want. Do you always know where other players are in all mmos?

F2p

• Gw2 - core (already been explained above)
• Tera (game bored the hell out of me so i dont know much past 20 but iirc its mostly solo)
• warframe (lot of time gates for progression and loot, im not 100% sure but i heard this game is dying or is crap, fashion is end game)
• The secret world (this game has been known as a solo player mmorpg)
• swtor trial (has a decent story depending on class picked 99% solo-able)
• FF14 trial (up to 30 i think but i'd recommend to at least try it)
• Champions online (stupid huge amount of customization though has dated graphics)
• blade and soul (eh, big tits and lolis/shotas everywhere, it customization is a joke despite what people say)
• Phantasy star online 2 (very popular in the east and had a decently large western audience that played with a translation patch, and english release is coming later this month, has a large amount customization options but its run on a gacha/loot box system so, but you can get the items through market for a stupid large amount of ingame currency, hub based)

B2p

• TESO + xpan (has some interesting outfits and class possibilities)
• GW2 expansions (^)

Sub

• ff14 (i had fun till end game, then got bored by the grind and progress locks and stopped playing, long DPS Queues, stupidly large customization, its new races are limited however.)
• swtor (significantly better than its trial)

There are obviously some left out, that's because I never played them myself so I wouldn't know if they are good or not

[Corsayr]

On 5/2/2020 at 4:52 PM, KoolHndLuke said:

Huh? Why do I need a "guild"? Think I'm missing the entire concept. Is it an "I've got your back" thing?

If you are asking why you need a guild, then you are indeed missing a big part of it. 

 

The MM in MMO is the part you missed. ?

 

Some people will now chime in to tell me that there are a lot of MMOs that soloing is perfectly viable, and they are right. But those MMOs missed the point too. ?