Devious Followers - Continued

[Corsayr]

Are you trying to make a new bash patch? 

 

If so delete the old bash patch, and all of its output (should be an ini folder) 

 

Re-run loot

 

try it again. 

 

If that doesn't work try it again but click DF to exclude it from bashing. see if that helps

 

[ovidius171]

1 minute ago, Corsayr said:

If so delete the old bash patch, and all of its output (should be an ini folder) 

where?

1 minute ago, Corsayr said:

If that doesn't work try it again but click DF to exclude it from bashing. see if that helps

DFC isnt in bashpatch.... i mean i cant untickit

[Corsayr]

Just now, ovidius171 said:

where?

What mod handler do you use? NMM, MO, MO2, Vortex... 

[ovidius171]

2 minutes ago, Corsayr said:

What mod handler do you use? NMM, MO, MO2, Vortex... 

vortex on linux.... my life isnt really easy...

[Corsayr]

4 minutes ago, ovidius171 said:

DFC isnt in bashpatch.... i mean i cant untickit

Spoiler

 

[Corsayr]

1 minute ago, ovidius171 said:

vortex on linux.... my life isnt really easy...

You should probably open a thread in the tech support topic.  

[ovidius171]

Just now, Corsayr said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

im a dumb... yes ofcourse if its unticked there all is ok just now i uninstalled it and  no problem but i like to try it!!!

[ovidius171]

6 minutes ago, Corsayr said:

You should probably open a thread in the tech support topic.

no, thanks i avoid too complicated answers

bah maybe i should stop asking questions?

anyway thanks for trying to help

[donttouchmethere]

2 hours ago, ovidius171 said:

i tryed to try it today (verry interesting and attractive description)  but wryebash gives me this error:

Unrecognized VM Data property type: 0
Error loading 'ARMO' record and/or subrecord: 091AE4B9
  eid = u'_DFIronCuffsFrontInventory'
  subrecord = 'VMAD'
  subrecord size = 1880
  file pos = 50901
Error in DeviousFollowers.esp

how idk to use TESV please help?

i get same error vith 2.09 and 2.10

Does this pop up while you rebuild the bashed patch?

There are some mods on LL that give out errors like that, but DFC isn't a mod that causes errors during bashed patch creation.

 

Either you have overwritten DFC with another mod that comes with cuffs or your DFC installation is faulty.

My guess you have another mod in LO that modifies the same cuffs, but I can't imagine what that could be ?‍♂️

 

If DFC was installed correct you can move it below the bashed patch and it will work like intended.

No need to use bashed patch on DFC. Move it below bashed patch and it will win all conflicts anyways ^^

 

[Sucker343]

On 2/26/2020 at 1:43 PM, Texmarker said:

Hi, what is the best way to use this mod but still playing without a combat follower? I really like all the things this mod offers, but i really dislike having a follower draw aggro and trivializing fights, or suicide charge into battle every time. Using EFF to make him passive in combat still makes him a tank that draws most enemy aggro. I tried making the follower wait at an inn or outside dungeons, but then he often gets stuck in szenes, making me reload significant portions of my playtime. And dragging him along and making him wait before every fight gets old really quick and kind of breaks the immersion of the follower being in charge.

Use NFF new updated and far better then other 2 in my opinion. Also have an option to fix follower glitch and better sandbox.

[ovidius171]

10 hours ago, donttouchmethere said:

No need to use bashed patch on DFC. Move it below bashed patch and it will win all conflicts anyways

big thanks,it works!

[Sucker343]

DF should not charge for spending time inside walled city. They are not doing anything there.. But they may take a minimum hiring cost. Also when enslaved they will offer some special deal to redeem excessive debt. This will be hursh deal (I am imagining slaverun  but more hardcore, maybe SWL barrel ) and reduce debt a lot.

[Demerots]

"If you want me to remove that gag, you're out of luck. It's much too devious."
What's causing this? I can still remove the items with the debug and add debt manually but I'd prefer to have it done in the dialogue, of course.

 

[Aldid]

Is there any way to move the remove the weird potion effect? It's currently tied to a glitched NPC that I can't use as a follower, so I would like to move it to my current follower instead...

Edit: Nevermind, I found the issue. I just had to use the reset function while the weird potion effect was active, since it isn't removed otherwise.

[Lupine00]

On 3/11/2020 at 2:33 PM, Demerots said:

"If you want me to remove that gag, you're out of luck. It's much too devious."
What's causing this? I can still remove the items with the debug and add debt manually but I'd prefer to have it done in the dialogue, of course.

You are wearing a Devious item that is tagged Quest, or BlockGeneric.

 

The follower IS allowed to remove BlockGeneric items, but only just after you sleep, and it will cost you a deal per removal - and  you have no control over what deal you get.

 

DF should never remove Quest items.

[Lupine00]

On 3/10/2020 at 11:44 PM, Sucker343 said:

DF should not charge for spending time inside walled city. They are not doing anything there.. But they may take a minimum hiring cost. Also when enslaved they will offer some special deal to redeem excessive debt. This will be hursh deal (I am imagining slaverun  but more hardcore, maybe SWL barrel ) and reduce debt a lot.

No charge in cities:

 

I'm on the fence about this. I mean, sure it could be an option... Is it an option that helps the mod be much more fun? Probably doesn't make so much difference.

 

The counter argument...

You are consuming the follower's time in a city, even if they aren't doing much, it's legitimate for them the charge you for that.

If you really don't want to pay them there, then pay them out and say goodbye  

 

 

An event to make lots of money in cities:

 

If you get gagged by the follower, you will be prostituted in towns but you won't see any money from it.

It's unfair on purpose. It sucks to be a slave. That was Lozeak's design, and I think it's OK really.

 

There is nothing to stop you installing your favorite solicitation mod and then using it to farm cash in towns, which you can give to your follower.

In effect, those mods already implement the feature being requested here, so DFC doesn't have to. It's not likely to do quite as good a job as a dedicated prostitution system.

[Darkwing241]

1 hour ago, Lupine00 said:

No charge in cities:

 

I'm on the fence about this. I mean, sure it could be an option... Is it an option that helps the mod be much more fun? Probably doesn't make so much difference.

 

The counter argument...

You are consuming the follower's time in a city, even if they aren't doing much, it's legitimate for them the charge you for that.

If you really don't want to pay them there, then pay them out and say goodbye  

 

How exciting! I literally studied this in a high level economics course in college!  The academics consensus is that labors sell their "labor power" that is to say their ability to do labor to their employers, not their labor.  If you want some ridiculously heavy reading for a kink mod check out Das Kapital by Karl Marx, he did a lot more than just the communism stuff!  I'd say at an academic level the DF should probably be getting paid here, probably from a labor rights point of view as well.  I like the idea of the DF taking advantage of labor theory for kinky purposes.

[Marauderrr]

I like the idea of the db getting forced to be prostitutioned out in cities, and all gold gained going to the follower, maybe forced to visit taverns or the guard barracks?

 

Or forced to visit some of the bandit camps?

 

Just a thought.

[HexBolt8]

No charge in cities:

 

I agree with the concept that you're paying for the follower's time, so there's no break just because you don't happen to have a use for it.  Technically the follower still has your back in town, whether that's protecting you from vampire raids or supervising you to be sure you honor the deals you agreed to.  It also discourages staying in a city to farm money from solicitation, alchemy, or whatever "easy" money scheme you choose to employ. 

[Lupine00]

6 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

It also discourages staying in a city to farm money from solicitation, alchemy, or whatever "easy" money scheme you choose to employ. 

If you're soliciting in town, and you have a DF, their continuing demands for payment are just regular pimp logic.

 

If you don't want to pay them, then clear your debt and get rid of them.

 

Oh, did you set your minimum contract to 90 days? Awww... Too bad... "A deal is a deal!" I guess your follower knows what's best?  

[HexBolt8]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Oh, did you set your minimum contract to 90 days? Awww... Too bad... "A deal is a deal!" I guess your follower knows what's best?  

Hey, all those extra conditions were written on the back of the contract, the part that smiling mercenary didn't show me!  I was tricked.  That, that was devious!

[Demerots]

On 3/17/2020 at 12:14 AM, Lupine00 said:

You are wearing a Devious item that is tagged Quest, or BlockGeneric.

 

The follower IS allowed to remove BlockGeneric items, but only just after you sleep, and it will cost you a deal per removal - and  you have no control over what deal you get.

 

DF should never remove Quest items.

I should've said, the gag in question was added to me by dcl and was as far as I could see a generic one - and after I made this post there were a couple other items that did the same thing that I was pretty sure were just standard devices. But then it kinda stopped happening before you replied so I didn't make another post about it. Thanks for letting me know!

[Lupine00]

3 hours ago, Demerots said:

I should've said, the gag in question was added to me by dcl and was as far as I could see a generic one - and after I made this post there were a couple other items that did the same thing that I was pretty sure were just standard devices. But then it kinda stopped happening before you replied so I didn't make another post about it. Thanks for letting me know!

I didn't say the gag itself needs to be BlockGeneric.

 

Any BlockGeneric item will cause this problem for all worn devices.

 

This is basically a performance decision. It's quite costly to go through every slot and analyse it individually, and DF was never written to have that sort of capability; it's not architected that way.

 

However, there are some odd choices in DCL about what items have BlockGeneric on them. I raised these issues on the DCL forum, and pressed as hard as I could to get some review of what I feel are incorrect decisions about the use of BlockGeneric and Quest flags where there is no real need to have them.

 

For example, if you get something like LBA from DCL, you'll get a BlockGeneric yoke. The best I can say about this is that it's not a quest yoke.

I have seen the LBA yoke mistakenly applied by various mods as 'just a regular old yoke', so that's one problem case.

[wj1299962851]

On 9/27/2019 at 10:14 PM, Lupine00 said:

lease post about any bugs you find, as one of the reasons for

I am very curious what news results. 

thumbs up! ?

[HexBolt8]

@Lupine00, on the SL Survival discussion you had mentioned alternatives to cash that you can pay followers with.  What about adding something new to the game?

 

Spoiler

For simplicity, call it a Rare Trinket.  It could be an ancient coin, officer's belt buckle, rare manuscript, et cetera; the player's imagination can fill in what kinds of rare items this follower fancies.  Probably something small and light, which will disappear after it's given to the DF (it doesn't really matter how or where the DF is stashing these treasures). 

 

The DF collects these items and becomes increasingly unhappy the longer it's been since the "payment".  With a configurable period between expected rare trinket payments, the DF could be set up as treasure hunter who only needs a token cash payment but requires lots of rare trinkets, or a gold seeker who is pleased to receive an occasional pretty. 

 

Where would you get them? 

 

Any chest, urn, or draugr corpse in a dungeon or wilderness location might have one (configurable chance).  Bonus chance for a boss chest.  Possibly a boss (bandit, necromancer, vampire, and so on) might drop one as a death item.

 

A noble or upper-class container (chest, cabinet, end table) in a dwelling might also have one, though you'd have to steal it.

 

Vendors might have them, though not often.  Which vendors should be configurable, as well as of course the chance.  A smith might have military items, a mage might have those rare books & manuscripts; the player would have to decide which vendors are appropriate.  The items would be expensive to purchase, but it provides an incentive to visit these merchants and might be worth the gold if you're overdue for giving your DF a rare trinket. 

 

A configurable chance that a purchased item is phony (the vendor might not even know) could make buying them a less desirable option.  Presenting a phony trinket to your DF would get you berated, with the suggestion that if you're going to throw your money away then maybe the DF should manage it for you.

 

Can you hoard these trinkets?

 

If you're in charge or equals, it seems reasonable that you can hang on to them and pay them as needed.  The obvious risk is that you might be robbed.  A configurable chance for the DF to steal one while you're sleeping would add more risk.  At this stage, I think a trinket could also be given as a gift to improve the DF's mood or relieve boredom, though as a gift it would not count as payment.

 

If the DF is in charge, I think the DF would confiscate trinkets as soon as they are looted.  The payment interval would reset, but you'd get little or no credit for the "early payment", maybe just a bump to the DF's mood or boredom.  If you're not enslaved, you would be able to hoard any trinkets that you purchase (we'll assume that the DF isn't looking over your shoulder every second, or allows this because you're spending your own money).  If you're enslaved or the DF basically is the master, I assume that the DF is frequently searching you and simply takes anything that he or she desires, so if you purchase a trinket the DF takes it immediately as an "early payment".

 

How does this affect the game?

 

Paying in rare trinkets subjects the player to more random chance than paying in gold.

 

When the player is at least an equal, the option to gift a trinket is an advantage.  Hoarding trinkets (assuming that you find that many) insulates the player from a run of bad luck finding them, but robbery wipes that out and a DF configured with a chance to swipe one while you sleep works against you.  But you have the choice.  If the DF is the master or has enslaved the PC, trinkets will be taken as soon as you acquire them and life will probably be more difficult than if paying only in gold. 

 

A small chance to find a Very Rare Trinket might please the DF enough to cancel one deal, just something to keep the treasure hunt interesting.

 

There's been talk about radiant quests driven by the DF.  You could be given a quest to a location guaranteed to have a rare trinket.  You could decline without consequence, but you still have to meet your trinket payments and it might provide motivation to clear that dungeon or bandit camp.  This also would help smooth over bad RNG when you just can't seem to loot one.  Given the complexity, trinket quests would be best suited to a later evolution of the system, not an initial feature.