Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

[Kimy]

13 minutes ago, zarantha said:

 

That was the 3BA bodyslide I did for SE. Not quite a drop in for you.

 

Oh right! I misunderstood that, then!

[Inte]

21 hours ago, notwavman said:

How's more tight version works with catsuits, @Inte ?

 

It works perfectly.

Spoiler

 

However I am using a catsuit patch (made by Racoonity, Serah) see here,

that should be already included in DDf 5.2. If it's not, it should be added. 

[Inte]

11 hours ago, Kimy said:

Yeah, that doesn't look right. I will see what I can do!

Thank you.

 

Another bug. 
The FOMOD animations installer has the options for ‘Default’ and ‘FeuerTin’ reversed.

 

The ‘FeuerTin’ option is supposed to install forward facing directional movement animations but it installs the vanilla types instead, whereas the ‘Default’ option installs the forward facing directional movement animations.

[Inte]

Who made the boxbinder? It is too bulky. It makes it as if once put in it you get Arnold Schwarzenegger's arms. 

If it can be made to look more like the one from the Rubber Facility it would be much better. 

 

Spoiler

 

[audhol]

9 hours ago, zarantha said:

So basically you're saying you want a non hdt version of the boxbinder 3ba?

All i did was copy the weights, because in my opinion the leather and latex stuff is not too rigid, just restrictive. So it should move with the body, including the breasts.

I was just saying that the part of the corset that moves together with the jiggling brest looks a bit odd to me, in my opinion the material shouldnt move that much but if you like the way it is then fine. How about I do a vid of how it is now and how I think it should be then you can see the difference?

 

 

So this is how it currently looks, notice how the top of the corset wobbles and follows the brest jiggles,

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

What I think looks better is to edit the lbrest02 and rbrest02 bones manually on the corset and the body to give this,

Spoiler

 

 

 

Unfortunately this would only apply to the outfit as your replacing the reference body with your own, the corset on its own uses slot 58 so removing thoose weights on just the corset would cause the brests to jiggle through the mesh.

[naaitsab]

2 hours ago, Inte said:

Who made the boxbinder? It is too bulky. It makes it as if once put in it you get Arnold Schwarzenegger's arms. 

If it can be made to look more like the one from the Rubber Facility it would be much better. 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

It's made by Noone for DaZ (https://www.deviantart.com/noone102000/art/FREEBIE-Latex-Box-tie-Armbinder-811836997) then it was converted by kziitd for Skyrim. On CBBE it's fine, maybe the UUNP set is a bit off?

[zarantha]

9 hours ago, audhol said:

I was just saying that the part of the corset that moves together with the jiggling brest looks a bit odd to me, in my opinion the material shouldnt move that much but if you like the way it is then fine. How about I do a vid of how it is now and how I think it should be then you can see the difference?

 

 

So this is how it currently looks, notice how the top of the corset wobbles and follows the brest jiggles,

 

 

What I think looks better is to edit the lbrest02 and rbrest02 bones manually on the corset and the body to give this,

 

Unfortunately this would only apply to the outfit as your replacing the reference body with your own, the corset on its own uses slot 58 so removing thoose weights on just the corset would cause the brests to jiggle through the mesh.

 

If it's just the corset (the part under the breast) I can remove or try changing the weights there. The top boxbinder part, I think removing or changing the weight would likely cause the breast to clip through, and that part i think should be moving with the breast anyway.

 

I have an update coming for the bodyslides, I'll add this to the list. Not sure how long it will take me.

 

And I just noticed the corset is actually not set up to use slot 58 in the nifs or in the outfit AA in the esm, it's using slot 32.

@Kimy is that an oversight? As it is, you could wear another corset in addition to the corset that comes with the boxbinder outfit the way it's set up right now.

[kurotatsu]

23 minutes ago, zarantha said:

 

If it's just the corset (the part under the breast) I can remove or try changing the weights there. The top boxbinder part, I think removing or changing the weight would likely cause the breast to clip through, and that part i think should be moving with the breast anyway.

 

I have an update coming for the bodyslides, I'll add this to the list. Not sure how long it will take me.

 

And I just noticed the corset is actually not set up to use slot 58 in the nifs or in the outfit AA in the esm, it's using slot 32.

@Kimy is that an oversight? As it is, you could wear another corset in addition to the corset that comes with the boxbinder outfit the way it's set up right now.

 

Yes, you can wear corset or harness and they look good together.

[ihatemykite]

Hello Everyone,

I have again worked on the expression system and updated it. The changes are quite big, but it should now be much more flexible as for users, as for mod creators.

Basically, all gag expressions are now stored in the json file. Every device have gag enchantment that apply the expression. I have edited it so it stores path to the file and also file flag. Gag then load the expression from file. This is done only when game is reloaded (save - load or restart the game). Only problem is that this needed to add more gag enchantments, as there was only one for all gags. I added enchantments for Large gags, Bit gags, Hoods (some use the gag enchantment, dunno why but I will play along), Tape gags and Panel gags. All of them have the default values stored in file SKSE/Plugins/DD/GagExpressions/DefaultExp.json . Enchantments also store array of factions which can be used for modifying expression on go. For now only previous factions are present (for simple and large gags). More can be added in future but I think that other gag types are more compatible. Mod creators can add custom gags by adding new json and then just linking it in to new enchantment, without needing to touch papyrus.

 

Notes

• This is again done as patch, so it can be installed after main mod. It can cause issue with already equipped gags, but newly equipped gags should work fine.
• Edited scripts zadexpressionlibs, zadgageffect, zadlibs and zadplayerscript
• zadlibs was edited as gag expression is now handled by new function ApplyGagEffect_v2, previous function ApplyGagEffect is stumped. Both function present were causing issues with expression. Safer would be to remove function calls but it's possible that there can be calls from other mods.
• zadplayerscript was edited so it can call new update function on zadexpressionlibs which will be used for maintaining the script
• In case that gag use default enchantment without filled properties, the script can choose which expression to use. But it can only choose between simple and large gag. This way system should be compatible with gags from other mods which use old system.
• Expression enchantment can be done in 3 levels
  1. Only expression array is filled. In this case expression is pretty much constant unless user edits the array with xEdit
  2. Path to file is filled. In that case the Array is overwritten by file values. Allow users to simply edit expression and possibly share the expression file for specific head meshes/bodies
  3. Array/File path is filled AND faction array is filled. This is most complicated but allow most flexibility, as it allow user to change default values, but also to change expression for specific NPCs. If the faction array is none, it will be ignored. It can be view more of a additional feature. Not required (as its pain in ass adding 16 faction per one gag type. With current types I created, there would need to be 96 faction total!).
• Also, this should be only used for testing purposes. Don't use this for serious playthrough
• As reference beta 7 was used, so it will only work with beta 7

Download: Devious Expressions 2.zip

 

 

Also, here is optional file with edited expressions. They are pretty much same which I used in screenshots from before. If you wan't to use it, just replace the file.

Download: DefaultExp.json

[audhol]

3 hours ago, zarantha said:

If it's just the corset (the part under the breast) I can remove or try changing the weights there. The top boxbinder part, I think removing or changing the weight would likely cause the breast to clip through, and that part i think should be moving with the breast anyway.

Yeah I perhaps should have been clearer that its only the 3ba version thats affected (unless you support BHUNP?). In my edit I didnt touch the boxbinder part as its only Lbrest01 and Rbrest01 that interact with that part of the mesh. It's  Lbrest02 and Rbrest02 that I modified on the corset and body mesh. If however you change the slot number of the corset to 58 rather than 32 then any edit is immiterial as it wont match the body thats underneath as you have no replacer of slot 32 so like you say clipping will occur. If you still use the entire mesh in the "outfit" nif then this could make use of the optimised manual bone weighting.

[Min]

On 7/24/2022 at 8:53 AM, naaitsab said:

Maybe a in-between is to see if there is a way to make a function search on parts on the inventory item ID? So for example if you search for Padded + Belt + Black you will get the black inventory item for the new black belt. Most devices are made up in a way this should be doable.

@Min made something similar to search with text for a keyword match. Not sure if this is within the possibilities of SKSE and the DD DLL plugin?

How are you envisioning this working? The function searches over a db of devices, devices in the inventory, or what?

[naaitsab]

5 hours ago, Min said:

How are you envisioning this working? The function searches over a db of devices, devices in the inventory, or what?

As formlists can be labor-intensive to maintain the idea was to make a device search function. So for example you want to equip x amount of red stuff you search for red ebonite and pass it trough the equip function. If will need to search on the ingame name or id name and return the inventory item. That can be used to equip it. Or if you want to pick a random belt just search for 'padded belt' and pass one of them to the equip function.

[Roggvir]

15 hours ago, zarantha said:

If it's just the corset (the part under the breast) I can remove or try changing the weights there.

I suggest you simply remove ALL the breast bones from the lower corset mesh, and that should do the trick.

I am still on DD 5.1 for SSE with CBBE SMP (3BBB), so i don't have the corset @audhol is refering to, but you can take a look at the "Restrictive Corset" in DD.
Assuming its BS didn't change since DD 5.1 SE - which is what i am using apart from bunch of personal modifications and tweaks, but for the corset i do use the BS that comes with DD 5.1 SE (in shapeData subfolder "DDA_CBBE_SE_Redone").
I just noticed the Restrictive Corset is actually very lightly weighted on the "NPC L/R Breast" bones, but that weighting is so subtle compared to weighting of those parts to other bones like Spine, that it doesn't really do anything noticeable in the game - the lower part under the breast stays "glued" to the torso and doesn't jiggle with the breasts at all.
So, i think if you simply remove the breast bones from the lower part, it should fix the problem.

[Roggvir]

4 hours ago, naaitsab said:

As formlists can be labor-intensive to maintain the idea was to make a device search function. So for example you want to equip x amount of red stuff you search for red ebonite and pass it trough the equip function. If will need to search on the ingame name or id name and return the inventory item. That can be used to equip it. Or if you want to pick a random belt just search for 'padded belt' and pass one of them to the equip function.

I wouldn't dismiss the usage of formlists just yet.
They may not be much harder to maintain than to write AND maintain any such search functionality including adding any "color" keywords to items or whatever the function would be using to search for things.
Formlist have one nice advantage - they can be also filled and altered at runtime, which could provide some convenient flexibility.
You could use formlists to create custom sets where the "search function" would look for "visually compatible" items.

(the best thing would be to move the whole item "database" into something like JContainers, then you can do amazing things like "lightning" fast searches, toggling items on/off, etc. - i did that in my private rewrite of DD and it is wonderful - saddly, bringing that into official DD would be a lot of work that isn't necessary unless there is more demand for the features it can provide - which there isn't as far as i am aware)

[audhol]

24 minutes ago, Roggvir said:

So, i think if you simply remove the breast bones from the lower part, it should fix the problem.

Yeah seems the easiest solution and works,

Spoiler

 

 

Unfortunately there is clipping around the neck so it might be an idea to paint some NPC Head weight around the neck part too?

 

Spoiler

 

[naaitsab]

5 hours ago, Roggvir said:

I wouldn't dismiss the usage of formlists just yet.
They may not be much harder to maintain than to write AND maintain any such search functionality including adding any "color" keywords to items or whatever the function would be using to search for things.
Formlist have one nice advantage - they can be also filled and altered at runtime, which could provide some convenient flexibility.
You could use formlists to create custom sets where the "search function" would look for "visually compatible" items.

(the best thing would be to move the whole item "database" into something like JContainers, then you can do amazing things like "lightning" fast searches, toggling items on/off, etc. - i did that in my private rewrite of DD and it is wonderful - saddly, bringing that into official DD would be a lot of work that isn't necessary unless there is more demand for the features it can provide - which there isn't as far as i am aware)

I know and FL's would be best for equipping (semi) random stuff, but Kimy stated that maintaining them is not high on the list, which I understand with the current amount of devices. And adding color keywords might be a bit of a thing as most keywords are on the rendered item and for equipping you need the inventory item. So filtering on them could also be a challenge and would still require the formlists to create arrays.

 

So I guess it's either we look for options to search for devices. And if that's not possible or to much work perhaps there are volunteers to maintain the formlists for Kimy? 

[Kimy]

12 hours ago, naaitsab said:

As formlists can be labor-intensive to maintain the idea was to make a device search function. So for example you want to equip x amount of red stuff you search for red ebonite and pass it trough the equip function. If will need to search on the ingame name or id name and return the inventory item. That can be used to equip it. Or if you want to pick a random belt just search for 'padded belt' and pass one of them to the equip function.

 

The levelled lists currently used by the framework are actually super-easy to maintain. The one limitation they have is that they don't allow selection by multiple traits, such as color AND material. I still think that these lists cover like 95% of all use-cases. I still plan to make a few changes to these lists, to give modders a way to avoid the more exotic colors getting used in situations when that's not desirable.

[Code Serpent]

8 hours ago, Roggvir said:

I wouldn't dismiss the usage of formlists just yet.
They may not be much harder to maintain than to write AND maintain any such search functionality including adding any "color" keywords to items or whatever the function would be using to search for things.
Formlist have one nice advantage - they can be also filled and altered at runtime, which could provide some convenient flexibility.
You could use formlists to create custom sets where the "search function" would look for "visually compatible" items.

(the best thing would be to move the whole item "database" into something like JContainers, then you can do amazing things like "lightning" fast searches, toggling items on/off, etc. - i did that in my private rewrite of DD and it is wonderful - saddly, bringing that into official DD would be a lot of work that isn't necessary unless there is more demand for the features it can provide - which there isn't as far as i am aware)

2 hours ago, naaitsab said:

I know and FL's would be best for equipping (semi) random stuff, but Kimy stated that maintaining them is not high on the list, which I understand with the current amount of devices. And adding color keywords might be a bit of a thing as most keywords are on the rendered item and for equipping you need the inventory item. So filtering on them could also be a challenge and would still require the formlists to create arrays.

 

So I guess it's either we look for options to search for devices. And if that's not possible or to much work perhaps there are volunteers to maintain the formlists for Kimy? 

22 minutes ago, Kimy said:

The levelled lists currently used by the framework are actually super-easy to maintain. The one limitation they have is that they don't allow selection by multiple traits, such as color AND material. I still think that these lists cover like 95% of all use-cases. I still plan to make a few changes to these lists, to give modders a way to avoid the more exotic colors getting used in situations when that's not desirable.

 

Just going to chime in here and say FormLists have their downsides. When I first implemented my own device functions in Devious Lore I used formlists, but searching through embedded lists slowed the function down severely, so it took a few seconds to equip players. That's why I've moved to armor arrays attached to a quest.

 

Of course, my implementation was a bit over the top for the framework, since I tried matching the color and material of the equipped devices to the player's already worn devices. But, from my experience, FormLists are much slower than any other type of list the engine has.

[naaitsab]

42 minutes ago, Kimy said:

 

The levelled lists currently used by the framework are actually super-easy to maintain. The one limitation they have is that they don't allow selection by multiple traits, such as color AND material. I still think that these lists cover like 95% of all use-cases. I still plan to make a few changes to these lists, to give modders a way to avoid the more exotic colors getting used in situations when that's not desirable.

Hmm, I might have misread your earlier post then.  

 

19 minutes ago, Code Serpent said:

 

Just going to chime in here and say FormLists have their downsides. When I first implemented my own device functions in Devious Lore I used formlists, but searching through embedded lists slowed the function down severely, so it took a few seconds to equip players. That's why I've moved to armor arrays attached to a quest.

 

Of course, my implementation was a bit over the top for the framework, since I tried matching the color and material of the equipped devices to the player's already worn devices. But, from my experience, FormLists are much slower than any other type of list the engine has.

It's definitely not the best solution but it's easier to maintain with the drag and drop system in the CK. But if it's noticeable faster and lighter on the papyrus engine it might be worth the effort to set it up using arrays. Perhaps you can give some examples how to set it up, use it and how to add items? Bit of effort on the dev side to give a smoother experience is something to spend some time for. As having a laggy and crashing game sucks of course  

[Code Serpent]

22 minutes ago, naaitsab said:

It's definitely not the best solution but it's easier to maintain with the drag and drop system in the CK. But if it's noticeable faster and lighter on the papyrus engine it might be worth the effort to set it up using arrays. Perhaps you can give some examples how to set it up, use it and how to add items? Bit of effort on the dev side to give a smoother experience is something to spend some time for. As having a laggy and crashing game sucks of course  

Well, you can just look at the source code in Devious Lore. I've uploaded the relevant file here._DL_DevicesScript.psc

 

Edit: Of course, feel free to ask about any specifics, but I felt it was better to just upload the source file rather than typing out a whole page that would just summarize it.

Edited August 1, 2022 by Code Serpent

[zarantha]

18 hours ago, audhol said:

Unfortunately there is clipping around the neck so it might be an idea to paint some NPC Head weight around the neck part too?

 

I thought i had, but i guess not. adding that too.

[titlover123]

Hello @Kimy it's me ya boi titlover123.
I asked a few months ago if there could be made something that allows one to modify the chance of getting one or multiple of the unique effects for DD gear, like, not being able to have it's lock picked, being un-cutable and immune to struggling, please forgive me if it has already been added in some way or form, (I have not been able to update in a while due to bad internet) I simply wish to know if you are still looking into it as you said you would since it's been so long, again please forgive me if it has already been added, or if there is already a way to modify it, (not default difficulty sliders since they are not specific/precise enough) I get that most people complain about DD being too hard, but I am one of the few that thinks it's a bit too easy.

[Zenagia]

On 7/30/2022 at 12:01 AM, Inte said:

The correct fitting Elbowbinders from DDf 5.1

  Reveal hidden contents

 

I fixed them in my game by copying the DDf 5.1 .nif files over the ones from DDf 5.2

 

@Inte Would you be so kind as to link the DDf 5.1 elbowbinder .nifs here? I can't seem to find them in my soup of files and I would like to do that file swap you did until Kimy can update her patch. I too have noticed that the 5.2 elbows are far too loose.

Edited August 2, 2022 by Sathella

[srmacbobs]

So I've been having some issues with the furniture. I can place them down and put npcs in them just fine, but if I leave the area and come back, the contraptions that had npcs in them have moved all over the the place and some simply disappeared. This happens with every contraption, no exception. Is this feature like this normally or is it a problem on my end? I'm using beta 7 by the way.

[Inte]

7 hours ago, Sathella said:

@Inte Would you be so kind as to link the DDf 5.1 elbowbinder .nifs here?

Here, 

 

DDf 5.1 Elbowbinder nifs.7z