Paid Modding is gone... or is it?

[guk]

Well i do know what Chesko hoped for.

It wasn't just for profit.

He thought that if modders would have some money to spare it would be easier to create big scale projects.

Creation of a mod like Falskaar alone is OMFG. But if you can hire some help...

 

Ok i have no idea how falskaar was created. I can only imagine.

No offense but why do you write "i do know what..." when the next paragraph admits "Ok i have no idea".

 

But you can sign up for the next big Steam Workshop project here:

 

 

 

 

No payment because somehow Lord GabeN doesn't want to give us 100,000 SteamBucks in advance, but we'll split evenly after the project is out. I promise.

 

 

 

[aqqh]

 

Well i do know what Chesko hoped for.

It wasn't just for profit.

He thought that if modders would have some money to spare it would be easier to create big scale projects.

Creation of a mod like Falskaar alone is OMFG. But if you can hire some help...

 

Ok i have no idea how falskaar was created. I can only imagine.

No offense but why do you write "i do know what..." when the next paragraph admits "Ok i have no idea".

 

But you can sign up for the next big Steam Workshop project here:

 

 

 

 

No payment because somehow Lord GabeN doesn't want to give us 100,000 SteamBucks in advance, but we'll split evenly after the project is out. I promise.

 

 

 

I do know what Chesko hoped for.

And i can only imagine what Falskaar author went through.

 

As for signing up - no idea whats that supposed to be (if it's even real) but i fear that i've never bothered to release anything on nexus so i guess i do not qualify.

[guk]

I do know what Chesko hoped for.

And i can only imagine what Falskaar author went through.

 

As for signing up - no idea whats that supposed to be (if it's even real) but i fear that i've never bothered to release anything on nexus so guess i do not qualify.

I see - well i never used Falskaar, only know that it is a big popular content mod which i usually avoided because of all kinds of incompabilities. From gameplay overhauls to ENBs and their required (or disallowed) lighting mods, there's always something not working as intended.

From Chesko i only ever used Frostfall, that also only for a short while where i spent the most time reporting bugs and giving feedback.

 

So just as a little hint from my side, all those modders and their mods are certainly great - but a good portion of the users (like me) have never used f.e. Falskaar or Pure Weathers, and thus owe nothing to their creators or even have to know who made which mod.

 

 

 

Oh and... no that "Adventurers Wanted" is not real - not sure how you can miss the satire

Maybe read it again and compare to what a few folks keep repeating, like hiring people to work on a huge mod for 1-2 years without getting any money in advance to pay them, and no chance to get sponsors because who the hell would invest large amounts of real money into an amateur project for the SWS.

Unless you would start selling it as "early access" mod, which is a potential scam even if you start the project with the best intentions. You couldn't give customers their money back, even if you wanted (Steam Bucks).

[Aydoo]

What's Falskaar incompatible with? Besides 2-3 npcs and a door, it has its own world space.

[guk]

What's Falskaar incompatible with? Besides 2-3 npcs and a door, it has its own world space.

All NPCs in the mod itself if you used for example Requiem 1.7.3 (no idea about latest version, AFAIK that's even more complicated).

 

And if you use an ENB that requires specific weather/lighting overhauls, then the whole graphics in non-vanilla places are not working as intended (example Project ENB).

 

Just saying - not that i don't appreciate good content mod, and there certainly are patches for everyhing or can be made manually, but having to apply the whole jungle of compatibility patches on top of a full content mod is something i never wanted to bother with

Not to mention that it's been around 1 year that i last made a regular playthrough, so things might have changed since then.

 

[bob11]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry mate, but there is no functional model for paid mods. Especially not one where modders gets 25%, and in order to boost their income they are trying to rob their customers. There is no way you could possibly introduce paid mods in a way that is fair for both modders and users. Either the modder gets too little for too much work, or the customer pays way too much for too little content.

Keep in mind that we're talking about very experienced modders here.

They do know how donations system looks like.

We dont.

Lets not pretend that this is otherwise.

 

They decided that 25% on steam is a better alternative for them. And imo it had to be a lot better since they did not hesitate to risk their reputation.

 

 

Well Chesko wrote what was his motivation, oh wait you should know that.

 

 

Well i do know what Chesko hoped for.

It wasn't just for profit.

He thought that if modders would have some money to spare it would be easier to create big scale projects.

Creation of a mod like Falskaar alone is OMFG. But if you can hire some help...

 

Ok i have no idea how falskaar was created. I can only imagine.

 

So i'll tell you how it looks like in Sexlab Sexslaves.

We're constantly looking for voice actresses willing to record and give some life to our characters. But it's not exactly easy to find a girl willing to voice act a mod which is obviously packed full with sexual content.

So atm we have 2 fully voiced followers with great thanks to Carida and Darkminxi (We love you girls!   ).

But if we would be able to offer say 100$ for such recording i have a feeling that we would have 8 of such followers.

 

 

Well, true, but you'd then mod cost comes into play.  You COULD try crowdfunding a serious mod attempt though(?) for projects like Falskaar or other big undertaking,  ie let's say expired wants to do some grand project of his own.  expired is a well known modder, creating racemenu among other things so he already has a level of trust that may appeal to people.  He could create this business plan or project plan, make an coding attempt at it, then create a crowdfunding project through Kickstarter or some other site like that and raise awareness for the project.  I'm sure people like expire or at least trust him enough to consider the project, and if it seems like a good idea and there is a market for it, it could be successfully crowdfunded.  That could work for any other well known modder that is competent and liked enough.  Opportunities for developing are already there.  But of course, it's easier trying to sell a sword for 5 bucks.

[aqqh]

 like hiring people to work on a huge mod for 1-2 years without getting any money in advance to pay them, and no chance to get sponsors because who the hell would invest large amounts of real money into an amateur project for the SWS.

Unless you would start selling it as "early access" mod, which is a potential scam even if you start the project with the best intentions. You couldn't give customers their money back, even if you wanted (Steam Bucks).

you got an example right on this site.

if there would be a decent chance to resurrect Forbidden Fruit project then for sure i would seriously consider it even if i would be "paid" with septims.

[techiespeek]

There are many different marketing strategies that would have worked far better than merely stepping in and slamming the "paid" Hammer down on folks. The fact that Zenimax Media went along with it and actually encouraged it, says loud and clear it will return again, and I see it in the form of "tools" first. If another game from them or any other developer comes out with a "toolset" or "tools" of any kind, expect a much higher price tag, an EULA and probably some form of digital SLA to come along with it. I do not believe the PAB are done with messing with the modding and Indie developer communities. Why? Simple.. Lost revenue streams. Any time you dip into the pockets of or take away any limelight from a major player, expect retaliation to soon follow. These are simply my impressions and opinions which do not reflect those of this site or community.

[a_citizen]

I really don't understand what concept people have of being realistic and reality.

Some people think that introducing money in modding (talking about this specific bethesda modding) is overall a good idea.

 

Well it's NOT and you can kiss goodbye to current quality and variety.

 

Do you know what it takes to make mods? RESOURCES.

 

The RESOURCES the modders are using now are NON COMMERCIAL.

 

Are you aware of that?

 

When a modder releases a pack of pretty skin, outfits, clouds and skies or terrain, rocks, grass, even hair, tattoos, weapons, cube maps… all the beauty you like… you should know inside those packs have been used a ton of FREE RESOURCES.

 i.e. stock photos, brushes, textures, patterns, also 3d models, you name it, these RESOURCES CAN BE USED by the modders because they release NON COMMERCIAL.

 

The moment these smurt modders should release COMMERCIAL they can kiss big fucking goodbye to all those RESOURCES and MUST start PAYING to get resources licensed for commercial use.

 

There is a very tiny amount of resources available for free that you are allowed to use for commercial, if you do not know, and you must also pay great attention to the terms of use.

 

Now people obviously ignore this and everything is going to be so fucking okay!

Instead you wake from the dream and this is the BIG fuck you'll get once modders should start PAYING for RESOURCES to release COMMERCIAL.

 

At i.e. Renderosity they do not google: hair brush and use them. Release is commercial and that FREE hair brush is for NON COMMERCIAL use, so if you need one for your commercial mod you CANNOT use that one, you PAY for one.

And do you think with the generous (or even fair) payment Bethesda and Valve is going to grant to modders, the modders are gonna spend their bucks?

 

At this point you should start rethinking what realism is in this situation. So FORGET the VARIETY you have now and the QUALITY around you have NOW thanks to a multitude and high-quality resources the modders every day are FREE to use.

 

I wonder if you really are a bunch of fool…  ALL those pretty skin textures your characters have on their bodies are ALL coming from Thepal (for Caliente) and Vectorcide (for Dimon) base textures of their bodies and IIRC Real Girls that is original work by Zonzai.  Now if it was market you would have 3 textures to chose from AKA the original ones and PAY for them of course, this for explaining what's mean not SHARING resources. So…

 

all those modifications you are using, ALL those modifications of the 3 original ones are there because you guess… it's FREE, the original creators granted them with no problem permission to use and modify,

it's FREE environment.

Thepal/Caliente, Vectorcide and Zonzai gave to all FREE RESOURCES and from those are made the gazzilion around.

 

What do you think you'll get once it will be Market? You can start by now forgetting all this.

 

Go ahead and continue supporting "modders must be paid", go on and get SCREWED.

 

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding (see the word: SHARING) since it's a market, so yeah you are going to get FUCKED.

Textures artists and 3d modelers will be the first ones to disappear in gifting morons who pay for mods.

 

Take a trip you bunch of realistic people and look at freebies props sites, there are no fools giving you their work as resource if you are going to release COMMERCIAL and if some do, read carefully or you are gonna get screwed more seriously.

 

I stop here and won't talk about mega-quests and overhauls of any kind where voice acting, beta testing and big collaborations are involved and NEEDED.

I'm sure there will be plenty of people eager to spend their time and give help as it was until now, sure, for people who is getting paid.

 

 

So, kiss goodbye to big choice of good mods you have NOW and be content with your shrewd bullshitting about monetizing everything is not bad. You should start monetizing your ass too.

 

I'm sure this will be of no use to people who like to get screwed and there are many, just for the few.

[Aydoo]

@Guk

Fair enough.

 

 

I really don't understand what concept people have of being realistic and reality.

Some people think that introducing money in modding (talking about this specific bethesda modding) is overall a good idea.

 

Well it's NOT and you can kiss goodbye to current quality and variety.

 

Do you know what it takes to make mods? RESOURCES.

 

The RESOURCES the modders are using now are NON COMMERCIAL.

 

Are you aware of that?

 

When a modder releases a pack of pretty skin, outfits, clouds and skies or terrain, rocks, grass, even hair, tattoos, weapons, cube maps… all the beauty you like… you should know inside those packs have been used a ton of FREE RESOURCES.

 i.e. stock photos, brushes, textures, patterns, also 3d models, you name it, these RESOURCES CAN BE USED by the modders because they release NON COMMERCIAL.

 

The moment these smurt modders should release COMMERCIAL they can kiss big fucking goodbye to all those RESOURCES and MUST start PAYING to get resources licensed for commercial use.

 

There is a very tiny amount of resources available for free that you are allowed to use for commercial, if you do not know, and you must also pay great attention to the terms of use.

 

Now people obviously ignore this and everything is going to be so fucking okay!

Instead you wake from the dream and this is the BIG fuck you'll get once modders should start PAYING for RESOURCES to release COMMERCIAL.

 

At i.e. Renderosity they do not google: hair brush and use them. Release is commercial and that FREE hair brush is for NON COMMERCIAL use, so if you need one for your commercial mod you CANNOT use that one, you PAY for one.

And do you think with the generous (or even fair) payment Bethesda and Valve is going to grant to modders, the modders are gonna spend their bucks?

 

At this point you should start rethinking what realism is in this situation. So FORGET the VARIETY you have now and the QUALITY around you have NOW thanks to a multitude and high-quality resources the modders every day are FREE to use.

 

I wonder if you really are a bunch of fool…  ALL those pretty skin textures your characters have on their bodies are ALL coming from Thepal (for Caliente) and Vectorcide (for Dimon) base textures of their bodies and IIRC Real Girls that is original work by Zonzai.  Now if it was market you would have 3 textures to chose from AKA the original ones and PAY for them of course, this for explaining what's mean not SHARING resources. So…

 

all those modifications you are using, ALL those modifications of the 3 original ones are there because you guess… it's FREE, the original creators granted them with no problem permission to use and modify,

it's FREE environment.

Thepal/Caliente, Vectorcide and Zonzai gave to all FREE RESOURCES and from those are made the gazzilion around.

 

What do you think you'll get once it will be Market? You can start by now forgetting all this.

 

Go ahead and continue supporting "modders must be paid", go on and get SCREWED.

 

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding (see the word: SHARING) since it's a market, so yeah you are going to get FUCKED.

Textures artists and 3d modelers will be the first ones to disappear in gifting morons who pay for mods.

 

Take a trip you bunch of realistic people and look at freebies props sites, there are no fools giving you their work as resource if you are going to release COMMERCIAL and if some do, read carefully or you are gonna get screwed more seriously.

 

I stop here and won't talk about mega-quests and overhauls of any kind where voice acting, beta testing and big collaborations are involved and NEEDED.

I'm sure there will be plenty of people eager to spend their time and give help as it was until now, sure, for people who is getting paid.

 

 

So, kiss goodbye to big choice of good mods you have NOW and be content with your shrewd bullshitting about monetizing everything is not bad. You should start monetizing your ass too.

 

I'm sure this will be of no use to people who like to get screwed and there are many, just for the few.

 

This isn't 100% true.

For example: The assets in my warpaint mod for example are 100% resource free, created with a program I paid for, that is licensed to allow me to sell whatever I want. The only thing that could stop it is the fact that it requires code that Expired owns and developed himself.
 

[...0...]

 

 

 

I'm sorry mate, but there is no functional model for paid mods. Especially not one where modders gets 25%, and in order to boost their income they are trying to rob their customers. There is no way you could possibly introduce paid mods in a way that is fair for both modders and users. Either the modder gets too little for too much work, or the customer pays way too much for too little content.

Keep in mind that we're talking about very experienced modders here.

They do know how donations system looks like.

We dont.

Lets not pretend that this is otherwise.

 

They decided that 25% on steam is a better alternative for them. And imo it had to be a lot better since they did not hesitate to risk their reputation.

 

 

I don't think anyone with more than two braincells is unaware that donation buttons don't get pressed.

 

I've worked in Second Life for 10 years, a lot of my content is pay to use but a good chunk of what supports my content is not. I pay for that out of what I make. And I have thousands of Second Life users that utilize that support content, free of charge, all the time.

 

I've had a donation button on my website to help support that unpaid support content for at least 6 of the ten years I've been in business, and I can count how many donations have been made in those six years on the fingers of both hands. Granted some money is better than no money but that aside donation support has never ever come close to offsetting what I spend to ensure people can continue to enjoy what I provide.

 

Now, that aside, that has not made me jump full tilt into locking everything I do behind some kind of "you must pay this much to do this thing" kind of situation....and believe me I know, probably better than you do, that people do not value things that are free, and in all fairness the content I provide in Second Life and the community I run, I have every right to make it "exclusive" or "pay only" but I don't...because thats not how it started.

 

I have always tried to find ways to not involve taxing my community and fanbase, even if I need to.

 

For example, every year for the last ten years I've had to pay taxes to the Federal and State government because my SL income is untaxed. This year alone I have 1200 USD in taxes I have to pay and I don't even have the money right now to pay  it...I certainly haven't exported that cost to my users, and the money simply isn't there because I spend almost 75% of what I make to be able to keep going.

 

So that 1200 USD has to come out of my pocket...and sure, you might argue that I 'deserve' to be supported and people should help me offset those costs because they like what I do...but the world isn't made out of money, most people playing Second Life and by comparison, modding Skyrim and playing that as a daily experience, simply don't have a lot of extra money.

 

Simple facts are is I know donations don't work even better than most Skyrim modders do. But that hasn't pushed me to monetize all the things I could possibly monetize even in an environment that allows me to do it.

 

Its called ethics. And even when "making a decent living" level money is involved...its possible to still have ethics.

 

 

Many here saying they donate if they can or even say they donate but we all know they dont, saying it on a forum is a world of difference then actually press that button and donate, they just don't most are liars.

 

I btw dont donate i want every thing for free

 

[Kendo 2]

I really don't understand what concept people have of being realistic and reality.

Some people think that introducing money in modding (talking about this specific bethesda modding) is overall a good idea.

 

 

Well it's NOT and you can kiss goodbye to current quality and variety.

 

Do you know what it takes to make mods? RESOURCES.

 

The RESOURCES the modders are using now are NON COMMERCIAL.

 

Are you aware of that?

 

When a modder releases a pack of pretty skin, outfits, clouds and skies or terrain, rocks, grass, even hair, tattoos, weapons, cube maps… all the beauty you like… you should know inside those packs have been used a ton of FREE RESOURCES.

 i.e. stock photos, brushes, textures, patterns, also 3d models, you name it, these RESOURCES CAN BE USED by the modders because they release NON COMMERCIAL.

 

The moment these smurt modders should release COMMERCIAL they can kiss big fucking goodbye to all those RESOURCES and MUST start PAYING to get resources licensed for commercial use.

 

There is a very tiny amount of resources available for free that you are allowed to use for commercial, if you do not know, and you must also pay great attention to the terms of use.

 

Now people obviously ignore this and everything is going to be so fucking okay!

Instead you wake from the dream and this is the BIG fuck you'll get once modders should start PAYING for RESOURCES to release COMMERCIAL.

 

At i.e. Renderosity they do not google: hair brush and use them. Release is commercial and that FREE hair brush is for NON COMMERCIAL use, so if you need one for your commercial mod you CANNOT use that one, you PAY for one.

And do you think with the generous (or even fair) payment Bethesda and Valve is going to grant to modders, the modders are gonna spend their bucks?

 

At this point you should start rethinking what realism is in this situation. So FORGET the VARIETY you have now and the QUALITY around you have NOW thanks to a multitude and high-quality resources the modders every day are FREE to use.

 

I wonder if you really are a bunch of fool…  ALL those pretty skin textures your characters have on their bodies are ALL coming from Thepal (for Caliente) and Vectorcide (for Dimon) base textures of their bodies and IIRC Real Girls that is original work by Zonzai.  Now if it was market you would have 3 textures to chose from AKA the original ones and PAY for them of course, this for explaining what's mean not SHARING resources. So…

 

all those modifications you are using, ALL those modifications of the 3 original ones are there because you guess… it's FREE, the original creators granted them with no problem permission to use and modify,

it's FREE environment.

Thepal/Caliente, Vectorcide and Zonzai gave to all FREE RESOURCES and from those are made the gazzilion around.

 

What do you think you'll get once it will be Market? You can start by now forgetting all this.

 

Go ahead and continue supporting "modders must be paid", go on and get SCREWED.

 

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding (see the word: SHARING) since it's a market, so yeah you are going to get FUCKED.

Textures artists and 3d modelers will be the first ones to disappear in gifting morons who pay for mods.

 

Take a trip you bunch of realistic people and look at freebies props sites, there are no fools giving you their work as resource if you are going to release COMMERCIAL and if some do, read carefully or you are gonna get screwed more seriously.

 

I stop here and won't talk about mega-quests and overhauls of any kind where voice acting, beta testing and big collaborations are involved and NEEDED.

I'm sure there will be plenty of people eager to spend their time and give help as it was until now, sure, for people who is getting paid.

 

 

So, kiss goodbye to big choice of good mods you have NOW and be content with your shrewd bullshitting about monetizing everything is not bad. You should start monetizing your ass too.

 

I'm sure this will be of no use to people who like to get screwed and there are many, just for the few.

 

This is probably the best arguement against paid modding I've seen.  BRAVO.

 

This isn't 100% true.

For example: The assets in my warpaint mod for example are 100% resource free, created with a program I paid for, that is licensed to allow me to sell whatever I want. The only thing that could stop it is the fact that it requires code that Expired owns and developed himself.

Not trying to argue here, but it is true.  You just said as much.

The warpaints were made with a program you paid the commercial use license for.  It wasn't a free student version or something else that has terms preventing sale.  In theory you could sell them anywhere since they do not rely on Bethesda software.

The only part of your mod that cannot be sold is Expired's code, since it's dependent on Bethesda software to get RaceMenu to apply it to the game.    Proves his point.

 

[DoctaSax]

I think it's rather crap actually.

 

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding

If anything, a lot of free modders - providing their stuff for free as well as freely letting others use it - haven't been doing much modding because it all boils down to modders having to be ashamed to want a choice. If there's no choice, it's not free. If people can accept goddamned youtubers making money off mods, why not the people making them?

 

There's an incredible amount of practical issues, but on the very principle of whether or not modders should be allowed to charge for their work, I've landed on being entirely pro-choice. It was never my business to tell my colleagues what they can and can't do with their own stuff. What the hell was I thinking before? Going 'who do you think you are?' at the people considering it, under different circumstances obviously, when they can send that question right back at me.

 

 

Go ahead and continue supporting "modders must be paid", go on and get SCREWED.

 

Yeah, this is helpful.

[Guerilla]

If we don't fight back everything will go EA route on us and turn PC into mobile gaming.

Low quality and everything behind pay walls.

Want to use a sword? $5!

Want to swing it? $5!

Want sound? $5!

Want blood and gore? $10! this is a 'special item' therefore gets higher price! :D :D :D :D :D :D

 

Sega ctually charges for blood in Total War games.... :||||[

[a_citizen]

I think it's rather crap actually.

 

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding

 

No problem doctasax

 

since that sentence it's referred to something no one can see now, no offence, I suppose your prediction is as crap as mine.

 

Just consider modders that are textures artists and 3d modelers are not coders, it's slightly more complicated than that, to see them releasing their creations for free while others are getting paid.

 

Only the time WILL say, of course.

 

 

and a late edit, just a reminder to all

(see the word: SHARING)

for all the categories of modders

"5. If a modder finds a new way to do something, they are less likely to share that information as it can be monetized. This will reduce the quality of mods as a whole if knowledge is horded." (user from bethesda forum)

you all do not ignore these words

 

 

I'm out-

[b3lisario]

 

 

I think it's rather crap actually.

FREE modders will slowly lose the joy of modding

If anything, a lot of free modders - providing their stuff for free as well as freely letting others use it - haven't been doing much modding because it all boils down to modders having to be ashamed to want a choice. If there's no choice, it's not free.

If people can accept goddamned youtubers making money off mods, why not the people making them?

 

Because I am not charged each time I click the play button.

 

There's an incredible amount of practical issues, but on the very principle of whether or not modders should be allowed to charge for their work, I've landed on being entirely pro-choice.

It was never my business to tell my colleagues what they can and can't do with their own stuff. What the hell was I thinking before? Going 'who do you think you are?' at the people considering it, under different circumstances obviously, when they can send that question right back at me.

 

Go ahead and continue supporting "modders must be paid", go on and get SCREWED.

 

Yeah, this is helpful.

 

 

I think the debate should not be if people is allowed to charge for their work. Of course they are.

But, how to do that without adding the money component to a game and distribution system not prepared for it?

[Guest endgameaddiction]

Don't say that! Last thing we need is a paid subscription to youtube just to view people's creativity.

[Ark of Truth]

Has the Creation Kit been removed from Steam? I can't find it under Tools anymore.

[Wobble Born]

Has the Creation Kit been removed from Steam? I can't find it under Tools anymore.

Still there for me, "Skyrim Creation Kit".

[Ark of Truth]

 

Has the Creation Kit been removed from Steam? I can't find it under Tools anymore.

Still there for me, "Skyrim Creation Kit".

 

 

Ahhh I have been looking for "Creation Kit"

 

Sneekies changed its name......

[Gameplayer]

KendoII and A_Citizen

 

They pretty much have been right on the whole time.

 

The whole conversation should have been revolving around legal precedence.  Not about how we feel about paid mods or how much we hate having to pay for something we got for free a day or two ago.

 

The reality is that it would forever change the landscape of the current community and there wouldn't be people with commercially legal access to applications and assets that would even be interested in the Setup offered by Valve.

 

You could also probably just forget about new modder's getting into this hobby as well other than some non-sence mods like I adjusted some stats on a sword hardy har har me is greash mod maker noh.

 

 

I guess my trying to say that pay-wall modders will have to own license to the assets and programs used in previous posts has fallen a bit short.

 

I've tried to say it pretty much everywhere.

 

It seems to me that there are too many ignorant end-user's and perhaps a few unaware mod producers that haven't considered that almost everything in a decent mod these days for Skyrim can be attached to or has assets used or rendered by another licensed product.

 

Quality will disappear because there will be far fewer sharing and much less people in a position to create mods.

There will also need to be new elements added to the community such as stricter law enforcement.

We would see far more policing of mods than we do now, with the added element of sales.

 

There would be a need for companies to police our mods, especially with blanket legal ownership of Valve.

I really don't think that other companies and creators of content want Valve to have a legal claim on their assets.

 

I guess it just goes way over too many peoples heads but this is a major concern when it comes to modding.

 

IDK seems bad to me, not sure why people can keep saying modders should get paid.  You cannot gloss over and ignore legal rights that have been present despite a persons ignorance.  Being uninformed only gets you so far.

[bjornk]

Honestly, seeing this pro commercialization attitude in people who have benefited from free things for so long, really discourages me to help or share anything anymore. One day you'll probably look back and think about the good old days of modding.

[Adam Jensen]

Honestly, seeing this pro commercialization attitude in people who have benefited from free things for so long, really discourages me to help or share anything anymore. One day you'll probably look back and think about the good old days of modding.

 

[Darkening Demise]

Want to get paid for modding? MAKE A GAME and not just a little mod that relies on a full standalone product. Then you can make money because then you're a developer. Counter-Strike, Team Fortress, and Killing Floor were mods then full standalone games featuring more content. The last thing we need is to start having people pay for simple color changes and giving money to thieves who take other people's work, especially the hardly noticed stuff, and making the poor real creator be left out. Plus Skyrim is just boob mods and standalone followers these days so why should we have to pay money? Why should we give money to a modder who used other mods from other modders and they get nothing but the modder of the follower? It's all flawed. Like our existence as a species.

[pinky6225]

 

 

 

 People don't buy Bethesda games for the quality of the writing, engine, development or anything else they buy PC games for; they buy them because they can be modded and FIXED for free.  What happens when 'free' is taken away?  Their games tank in the market because they are a joke without mods and no one is going to pay to fix something that should work out of the box in the first place.

 

I don't think that's quite right, considering a substantial amount of Bethesda's sales come from consoles where there is no modding scene. Many of the PC purchases were due to console players seeing all the cool shit that was happening in the mod scene, and re-purchasing the game and it's DLC. If it weren't for modding, I'd certainly still buy the games, but I doubt I'd have spent as much time with them as I have. I think therein lies part of the problem. Bethesda is not only competing against other game companies for a share of the market, they're also competing against themselves. A customer who's too busy downloading and playing the latest Skyrim mods isn't going to be as interested in buying Dishonored, or whatever other new IP they're bringing out. People who wait to purchase their next TES/FO game until the mod scene is established hurt their brand, because it's those first few months sales that the shareholders are really going to be scrutinizing.

 

The mod scene has definitely put a lot of money into Bethesda's pockets, but when viewed from another angle, it's also taking money out of their pockets by over-extending the shelf-life of their products. Skyrim's popularity, and the size and talent of it's mod scene which greatly extended it's longevity, I think took Bethesda a bit by surprise and forced them to turn up the contrast on that fuzzy line of where they're actually making money - and where they're losing money - by being so open and free with the mod scene. Paid mods were merely a way for them to generate continued revenue off of Skryim if their players weren't going to move on to their other products.

 

To clarify for some people, most businesses see the loss of potential profit as the same thing as a loss of actual profit. Whether you're losing money you already have, or losing money you could have had, your business is still poorer for it - less well able to invest in new projects and advertising - and less well able to compete against other companies for the same marketshare. "If you're not growing and expanding, you're dying". Which often just comes off as greed to the customers, which it is, but a justified greed as other companies follow the same principals. I've had enough middle-managers pound this idea into my head during monthly/quarterly employee "motivational round-ups", and I'm sure Kendo that you've heard the same lines before too.

 

I'm not justifying their decision to try to force paid modding on the community, but I can understand the rational behind the decision.

 

 

Find it strange myself everybody hates vanilla skyrim since generally speaking if i hated a game i wouldn't have played it long enough to become aware of the modding possibility.

 

Think its like hating windows, its fashionable