ambria Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I feel like anyone putting their mods up on steamingpile workshop is making a deal with the devil. They'll get no sympathy from me
aqqh Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Say i make a mod that uses SkyUI function and put it for sale on the Steam Workshop.. how does SkyUI people get a cut of my sales? i haven't heard of any method in which Steam gives some of my profits to SkyUI-people? Is it just an honour's system in yoru mind? Do i just write SkyUI a cheque every month? Its not your part of the money that would get split. from what i know they will get some part from Valves cut as service providers. Doubt that anyone knows the details of that deal. @Isee thanks mate. really.
ZaZ Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I feel like anyone putting their mods up on steamingpile workshop is making a deal with the devil. They'll get no sympathy from me See this is what fucks it up , Now Modders will think twice about uploading their mods for FREE even on steam workshop, So they loose out on the chance of being recognized for their mods there its not funny
Quisling Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 If SkyUI is going paid, what does that mean for mods like Apropos that use features from the new version? I know they don't require the new version of SkyUI to actually be installed, but they do include code from the new SkyUI, do they not? Will Apropos and Sexlab Aroused be losing their awesome new widgets? FWIW, Mardoxx has been saying all core updates will be added to the free version as well: We just have to wait and see. No one is forcing you to buy the 5.0. As previously stated.. any changes to core infrastructure like MCM flows back to the free version as well, so no one will be forced to upgrade or anything like that. It would be stupid not to. Vote with your wallets, not angry words on a forum.
D_ManXX2 Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Anyone remember Locaster ?? http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/16374 He asked bethesda to get paid for his mod but was shot down by bethesda a few months ago and now bethesda is actually doing what they where against for a long time. if fallout 4 will go the same way i will now stay away from any bethesda game in the future.
azoth1267 Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 If SkyUI is going paid, what does that mean for mods like Apropos that use features from the new version? I know they don't require the new version of SkyUI to actually be installed, but they do include code from the new SkyUI, do they not? Will Apropos and Sexlab Aroused be losing their awesome new widgets? FWIW, Mardoxx has been saying all core updates will be added to the free version as well: We just have to wait and see. No one is forcing you to buy the 5.0. As previously stated.. any changes to core infrastructure like MCM flows back to the free version as well, so no one will be forced to upgrade or anything like that. It would be stupid not to. Vote with your wallets, not angry words on a forum. Nice to have a ray of hope in an otherwise rather dreary series of events. Perhaps its just my own paranoia/stupidity, but i have to ask what is classed as core infrastructure. Are the crafting ui changes something core about SkyUI or is at superfluous as changing the color of a glass sword? I would assume that said ui change would be a core change... but again, im just an idiot when it comes to these kinds of things. Suppose ill have to read everything i can about it.
merryMalfunctioning Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Nice to have a ray of hope in an otherwise rather dreary series of events. Perhaps its just my own paranoia/stupidity, but i have to ask what is classed as core infrastructure. Are the crafting ui changes something core about SkyUI or is at superfluous as changing the color of a glass sword? I would assume that said ui change would be a core change... but again, im just an idiot when it comes to these kinds of things. Suppose ill have to read everything i can about it. What qualifies as "core infrastructure" will depend entirely on how much of the author's mortgage payments need to be covered by their modding income. And that is a big part of why free projects rarely survive the transition into commercial ones. First they try to support the free version. Then they just pretend to support it. Then they start adding terrible new features to the paid version in order to encourage people to buy a new version. Then when the new version isn't selling, they start only releasing critical bugfixes to the new version instead of patching the old one. Pretty soon they're distributing it with a custom installer that tries to trick you into installing the Ask.com toolbar and a free trial of McAfee antivirus. God, the pattern is as horrible as it is inevitable. So many great pieces of free software, destroyed because their creators tried to go commercial instead of just releasing their source code to the community like good folk should.
aqqh Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Anyone remember Locaster ?? http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/16374 He asked bethesda to get paid for his mod but was shot down by bethesda a few months ago and now bethesda is actually doing what they where against for a long time. if fallout 4 will go the same way i will now stay away from any bethesda game in the future. funny - chesko honestly was going to upload every single of his paid mods on nexus after x months of delay. so for example arissa2 mod would be for pay till say august and then it would be uploaded on nexus. if every modder would do the same there would be nothing to worry about the future of bethesda games modding. and still - amount of hatred he received likely made him quit modding entirely.
D_ManXX2 Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Rules 12: We are a free and open community; members requiring payment for mods, support, or putting anything behind a paywall will be removed without warning. Donation buttons/links to support an author is fine, so long as nothing is promised, given, or rewarded other than a sense of satisfaction for supporting an author or owner of content. Do we have a heading of Ashal view on the new steam paywall system ?? This could clash with mods being hosted here mainly racemenu or other mods. So how this effect this site now ??
Guest Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Well another way of looking at this is... Nah, I'm just messing with ya. This is stupid. The great thing though is it divides the money grubbing modders from the passionate modders. Reveals a bit more about Valve's and Bethesda's true nature. Rather depressing. Pirating mods will become a thing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMhfbLRoGEw
kissofthehell Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 What made bethesda to agree on this. Why valve even made this. People are already taking down mods from nexus and putting them behind paywall on workshop. Not to mention that some mods like Midas have popups just like ads to ask to buy the full version to remove it. Its like free mobile game to pay to turn off ads. Also a guy above me mentioned mod piracy. Guess what /r/modpiracy/ actually exists on reddit now. This "thing" that valve and bethesda made is ridiculous. Not to mention Valve wont allow the modders to upload free versions on Nexus. Many modders on Nexus hide their mods in a portest just look at /r/skyrimmods. Seeing this is the first game that will have this which will be next? Fallout 3? NV? Fallout 4 if god knows when it releases? This will destroy modding.
Nowack Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Anyone remember Locaster ?? http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/16374 He asked bethesda to get paid for his mod but was shot down by bethesda a few months ago and now bethesda is actually doing what they where against for a long time. if fallout 4 will go the same way i will now stay away from any bethesda game in the future. funny - chesko honestly was going to upload every single of his paid mods on nexus after x months of delay. so for example arissa2 mod would be for pay till say august and then it would be uploaded on nexus. if every modder would do the same there would be nothing to worry about the future of bethesda games modding. and still - amount of hatred he received likely made him quit modding entirely. I hope you won't let some pesky whiners bully you away from modding too. Just remember that it's always the minority of populus that is loudest, for every 10 of those noise-makers there's x100 more people who greatly enjoy your (and other modders) work and would really miss you should you quit.
Guest Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 What made bethesda to agree on this. Why valve even made this. People are already taking down mods from nexus and putting them behind paywall on workshop. Not to mention that some mods like Midas have popups just like ads to ask to buy the full version to remove it. Its like free mobile game to pay to turn off ads. Also a guy above me mentioned mod piracy. Guess what /r/modpiracy/ actually exists on reddit now. This "thing" that valve and bethesda made is ridiculous. Not to mention Valve wont allow the modders to upload free versions on Nexus. Many modders on Nexus hide their mods in a portest just look at /r/skyrimmods. Seeing this is the first game that will have this which will be next? Fallout 3? NV? Fallout 4 if god knows when it releases? This will destroy modding. Didn't know about the protests. That's even more of a hit on the modding community. Don't know if anyone mentioned this but I advise anyone to sign https://www.change.org/p/valve-remove-the-paid-content-of-the-steam-workshop/u/10612776 Edit: Here's an example I found thanks to you: http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33s0g8/i_have_hidden_all_of_my_mods/
Leaf the Elf Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I would simply like to point out two big-big-big loopholes of the whole system. 1. No one prevents you from downloading a mod from Nexus or LoversLab, and then uploading it to SteamWorkshop, claiming you made it. It has already been done when mods were free, and now thieves can profit from this too. Indeed, many people on Nexus have already hid their mods and modders resources because of this. 2. No one prevents you from buying a mod, copying the data files to an other folder, "unbuying the mod" (asking for refund), then copying the data files back. Hell, that same person could even upload that mod to a pirate site! As a matter of fact, it's already happening. Hell, someone might as well make physical copies of these pirated mods, and sell them for money on CDs and such. Who is going to prevent such an abuse? No one! The fact I heavily oppose the idea of paying for mods (because I'm a greedy cheapskate) is one thing, but this... This system is completely broken. I just presented you two of the many potential loopholes within this broken mockery of a "system". Who is going to prevent people from abusing these two loopholes again? No one!
Guest Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 skyui going to pay? Yes http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33s0g8/i_have_hidden_all_of_my_mods/ Edit: http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33quz6/skyui_pretty_much_one_of_the_most_essential_mods/
Broccoli Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I would simply like to point out two big-big-big loopholes of the whole system. 1. No one prevents you from downloading a mod from Nexus or LoversLab, and then uploading it to SteamWorkshop, claiming you made it. It has already been done when mods were free, and now thieves can profit from this too. Indeed, many people on Nexus have already hid their mods and modders resources because of this. 2. No one prevents you from buying a mod, copying the data files to an other folder, "unbuying the mod" (asking for refund), then copying the data files back. Hell, that same person could even upload that mod to a pirate site! As a matter of fact, it's already happening. Hell, someone might as well make physical copies of these pirated mods, and sell them for money on CDs and such. Who is going to prevent such an abuse? No one! The fact I heavily oppose the idea of paying for mods (because I'm a greedy cheapskate) is one thing, but this... This system is completely broken. I just presented you two of the many potential loopholes within this broken mockery of a "system". Who is going to prevent people from abusing these two loopholes again? No one! This is where the problems starts, Bethesda will eventually notice it and without any hesitation they will ask the so called retired Skyrim development team to create a new "update" aka encryption DRM for the Creation kit and the game. If this really happens then those mods that is updated with the new creation kit will be encrypted! and the mods will only work to those who has downloaded the mods on Workshop with his or her PC only. Say goodbye on sharing free mods =.= And secondly all of the future mods of future Bethesda games are pretty much confirmed Steam Workshop exclusive if it really happens.
Leaf the Elf Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I would simply like to point out two big-big-big loopholes of the whole system. 1. No one prevents you from downloading a mod from Nexus or LoversLab, and then uploading it to SteamWorkshop, claiming you made it. It has already been done when mods were free, and now thieves can profit from this too. Indeed, many people on Nexus have already hid their mods and modders resources because of this. 2. No one prevents you from buying a mod, copying the data files to an other folder, "unbuying the mod" (asking for refund), then copying the data files back. Hell, that same person could even upload that mod to a pirate site! As a matter of fact, it's already happening. Hell, someone might as well make physical copies of these pirated mods, and sell them for money on CDs and such. Who is going to prevent such an abuse? No one! The fact I heavily oppose the idea of paying for mods (because I'm a greedy cheapskate) is one thing, but this... This system is completely broken. I just presented you two of the many potential loopholes within this broken mockery of a "system". Who is going to prevent people from abusing these two loopholes again? No one! This is where the problems starts, Bethesda will eventually notice it and without any hesitation they will ask the so called retired Skyrim development team to create a new "update" aka encryption DRM for the Creation kit and the game. If this really happens then the mods that was downloaded and installed on the person PC will only work on his/her PC. Say goodbye on sharing free mods =.= And secondly all of the future mods of future Bethesda games are pretty much confirmed Steam Workshop exclusive if it really happens. Don't worry. Those pirates will most likely come up with something to break this system anyway. If this continued on like this, the Gaming Industry will choke itself to death - not that it hasn't already choked itself to death. (I actually play non-steam Skyrim)
aqqh Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 I hope you won't let some pesky whiners bully you away from modding too. Just remember that it's always the minority of populus that is loudest, for every 10 of those noise-makers there's x100 more people who greatly enjoy your (and other modders) work and would really miss you should you quit. I'm fine. I've never cared much about steam anyway. What i hope for is that at least some of these people would see reason and actually apologize to Chesko - because he really did not deserve what was done to him.
Leaf the Elf Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 Chesko was basically an unwitting pawn. He was exploited. A Social Darwinist would probably say "He was an idiot, so he deserved. Hope he learned his lesson", but I am not a Social Darwinist - I despise Social Darwinism. I can understand his position. He was eager to make money, and now that it backfired on him, he is public enemy number one for many, making him depressed. he fact that he regrets his bad decisions is already enough to make him a good guy, rather than a vilain. As such, people should probably apologize to him, forgive him for his mistake. Personally, I'd encourage him to continue making mods under the condition that he makes them for free.
Jazzby Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 My predictions for Sky UI. 1. Sky UI 5.0 goes up on Steam 2. Sky UI doesn't make enough money because of modder backlash This is very unlikely. SkyUI is not like any other mod there. Because its there as both mod and resource for other mods.They will get their cut from every mod that has an MCM menu. How? Does Steam have a function set up that way for modders to pay other modders royalties if one mod relies on another? Say i make a mod that uses SkyUI function and put it for sale on the Steam Workshop.. how does SkyUI people get a cut of my sales? i haven't heard of any method in which Steam gives some of my profits to SkyUI-people? Is it just an honour's system in yoru mind? Do i just write SkyUI a cheque every month? If your mod calls a SkyUI function, then anyone who runs your mod will need to buy SkyUI. So even if your mod is free, you are fueling demand for SkyUI and putting money in their pockets. Isn't the free version of SkyUI still up? Also, going by Reddit yet again, a couple of authors, one of which is Apollo, hid their mods(hid, not removed)in protest of what Madoxx and SkyUI in general is doing. So either authors will do that, or not give a damn about the new SkyUI and leave their mods using the freeware version. No idea where the other guy is, but Mardoxx is basically talking about how this outburst and outcry shows there's no community when various sites that usually can't stop fighting with each other are all fighting against this in unison. Madoxx is pretty much showing his ass at this point and that he never cared about the community.
winny257 Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 if I were not dependent on Steam (skyrim) I would it in the ton throw or the toilet to wash down. edit: if this keeps up, I'll be a pirate, do I obtain a Crack and say goodbye to Steam.
Saeros Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 skyui going to pay? Yes http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33s0g8/i_have_hidden_all_of_my_mods/ Edit: http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33quz6/skyui_pretty_much_one_of_the_most_essential_mods/ for a mod like SkyUI, I am also willing to pay.. But it is strange that would release an update right now.. after nearly TWO years.. "SkyUI LAST UPDATE ON JUNE 24th 2013" v4.1
Jazzby Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 skyui going to pay? Yes http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33s0g8/i_have_hidden_all_of_my_mods/ Edit: http://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/33quz6/skyui_pretty_much_one_of_the_most_essential_mods/ for a mod like SkyUI, I am also willing to pay.. But it is strange that would release an update right now.. after nearly TWO years.. "SkyUI LAST UPDATE ON JUNE 24th 2013" v4.1 That's actually the point and why a lot of people are upset it seems. They confirmed it "complete" a long time ago, then returned and did this when the prospect of money was available. Now, the fact that they're putting the core important stuff in freeware version is nice and all, but a good amount of the anger at the moment is towards how they're handling it. I'd understand being dismissive of blatant hateful posts and people screaming at you through a keyboard, but Mardoxx has been doing some terrible PR from the get-go on this matter with a lot of people that have anything to say on the matter. Of note is that there's already talk of a new alternative with nothing to do with the original team, legal or not.
winny257 Posted April 25, 2015 Posted April 25, 2015 if I were not dependent on Steam (skyrim) I would it in the ton throw or the toilet to wash down. That's what I did yesterday, since I don't play Skyrim anymore. I say good riddance. looking again on my last post, I have something added.
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