Devious Devices - Captured Dreams Shop v4.15 - files removed

[valcon767]

mods that i know of that can potentially interfere with CD Shop:

 

Cursed Loot - random attacks and other things (mod can be paused mid-game in Cursed Loot's MCM pages)

DEC (Deviously Enslaved Continued) - fix should be in latest version (just released 13.13.16 testing) can pause/turn off mod in its MCM also (i think) 

Random Attack - causes random attacks ( i do not use so cannot guess fix)

Random Sex - starts sex between 2 random characters (can pause it if i remember right)

Devious Followers Beta - follower deal running, follower starting a game, or being enslaved by a follower (can pause DFB in its MCM though)

Sexlab Hormones - Bimbo Curse (been a while) but make sure you are not cursed

Scent of Sex - depends on individual rules (adjust rules or pause mod i would guess)

Player Exhibitionist - forced nudity - adjust settings before starting CD quests

 

i am sure there are others that can potentially cause problems, but most of the time the problems are easy to avoid by either adjusting setting or pausing a mod.

those are just the ones i know of off-hand, and i listed fixes for the ones i know of

 

[pnutz78]

On 2/11/2018 at 6:24 PM, Veladarius said:

 

 

#1 - Cow Play - Be a Cow does a good job with the transformation, far more than I could do myself. Not sure of what items I would use, I have not looked at the items in v4 since I only installed it for short trial period. Work on v4.16 of CD will be finished in v3 but will be 99.9% v4 compatible. There will either be an alternate esp or an addon file that may be mergeable that would replace the custom armbinder for v4.

 

#2 - Pony Play - If I did anything with this it would likely be picking up and dropping of VIP customers.

 

#3 - Followers - This has given me issues for several reasons:

--- The standard follower system in Skyrim is horrible and scattered across several controlling quests.

--- Some followers (Serana or custom) use their own control system, I use one for Erani since she technically isn't a follower but could be used as one.

--- Follower Management Mods - generally they all differ in some way and determining who is an active follower is not always accurate. I would likely make my own system to handle them if you were to turn them over to Master or do something to register them with her for easier use.

--- Follower AI - either from Skyrim or mods sometimes the follower's AI can override what I want to do with them so once you have them it isn't always easy to keep them.

 

I still find handling followers awkward due to the various mods and overcoming their control of them and my initial attempt did not turn out well and was unreliable which is why it was removed. It is something I will continue to look into but adding them as optional actors to content presents other problems and complicates scenes and dialogue.

 

#4 - Endgame content - This sort of thing definitely isn't for everyone and likely isn't something that would be used on a regular basis by most people unless you have a fetish for the sort of play involved. If I did do something like this I would likely make an 'out' where you could track down someone that could reverse the effects and/or conditioning (over a short period of time). It would of course be up to you to decide if / when you left to seek them out. I am considering having them also be someone that can remove Master's custom devices as well.

 

 

I have made various plans for things and either abandoned it for a different direction or had issues implementing it so we will see where things go as a number of things in CD I didn't plan on doing until inspiration hit me for it.

Thx Vel,

 

for the insight. That all makes sense and I did not realize that follower mechanics are so tough to implement. Honestly, the most fun in the game I get simply out of role playing in the shop and talking to the master. So I was thinking if there were just more communication paths with her that trigger incremental devices being put on you either as a present (if she likes you) or as an educational measure (to a degree what happens already when you fail a job). But I would like for them to be matching set items not just any random DD and each device could be linked to a slightly different conversation option or task that you have already implemented for the property slave or a delivery/ recovery mission that she specifically asks you to do. While I love your original gear (captured dream trial set) I think the new DDE 4.0 has lots of interesting sets of items that could be incrementally applied.

 

This way you would be supporting immersive role play, which is one of the strongest aspects of captured dreams, could utilize tasks that you already coded and just combine them with a few more dialogues with the master + sense of progression when these path dependent DD sets get applied. For the paths you could use your original gages of Sub/ Dom Like/ Does not like likes sex/ does not....one set per gage? Once Such a DD set is complete there could be again one specific task that you could be doing (maybe even an existing one) to get the master to remove them incrementally again.

 

Anyways, I do love the mod and am very much looking forward to the next version. Any chance we may see something in March?

 

Take Care

[Lupine00]

11 hours ago, Veladarius said:

fUpdateBudgetMS is the time the papyrus engine gets for (all running) scripts. This time is shared between papyrus and render. That means at 60fps papyrus and render only have 16.6667  ms to get a tick done. In this case the renderer can use 15.4667ms to get the graphics done (16.6667 - 1.2). If you increase the time to, say 3ms, the renderer has to do its part in 23.6667ms, effectively killing your framerate.

Apart from the presumed typo here, there's some fallacious reasoning in it.

 

Sure, tell people that if they mess with this value, it might make their game suck worse, or crash, but it might help them get better script execution.

As for nagging modders to be less script heavy... A total waste of time. Either they are trying their best, or they don't care. The remainder, that are sitting there waiting for a crowd to beat a path to their door and demand better performance... Not many. If any.

 

So, back to technical. Yes. At 60fps you get 16.67ms to render. But at 30fps, which is the next step, if you are framelocked, you get 33.33ms, and taking a couple of ms off that is a lot less of a big deal. Assuming you are framing out.

 

Now, the guy posting the ini file info has a slow card, and a slow CPU. Which do you think is limiting his render throughput at the resolution he runs? Even with the modest i5, it's still probably that old steamboat willy gfx card. It is the bottleneck in most cases, not the CPU. But... In some locations, especially playing a lot of animation, he's going to be CPU bound, but in those locations he may care more about his script not totally fucking up than dropping a frame.

 

Now, imagine you have a 1080Ti, and a top end i7 (which is probably going to run Skyrim better than an i9), where's the bottleneck now? If you don't have an ENB, there probably isn't one, and if you have an ENB, the shadows and HDR are burning fill like crazy and guess what? You're limited by the card again and the CPU is sitting idle.

 

Or alternatively, it's nothing like that. But either way. People can try what they like, they don't need the mod police telling them that if they change their .ini file they'll go straight to Hel (with one L).

[Skullered]

10 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

Apart from the presumed typo here, there's some fallacious reasoning in it.

 

Sure, tell people that if they mess with this value, it might make their game suck worse, or crash, but it might help them get better script execution.

As for nagging modders to be less script heavy... A total waste of time. Either they are trying their best, or they don't care. The remainder, that are sitting there waiting for a crowd to beat a path to their door and demand better performance... Not many. If any.

 

So, back to technical. Yes. At 60fps you get 16.67ms to render. But at 30fps, which is the next step, if you are framelocked, you get 33.33ms, and taking a couple of ms off that is a lot less of a big deal. Assuming you are framing out.

 

Now, the guy posting the ini file info has a slow card, and a slow CPU. Which do you think is limiting his render throughput at the resolution he runs? Even with the modest i5, it's still probably that old steamboat willy gfx card. It is the bottleneck in most cases, not the CPU. But... In some locations, especially playing a lot of animation, he's going to be CPU bound, but in those locations he may care more about his script not totally fucking up than dropping a frame.

 

Now, imagine you have a 1080Ti, and a top end i7 (which is probably going to run Skyrim better than an i9), where's the bottleneck now? If you don't have an ENB, there probably isn't one, and if you have an ENB, the shadows and HDR are burning fill like crazy and guess what? You're limited by the card again and the CPU is sitting idle.

 

Or alternatively, it's nothing like that. But either way. People can try what they like, they don't need the mod police telling them that if they change their .ini file they'll go straight to Hel (with one L).

I don't care much for framerate in games, I can easily sacrifice 57 FPS for 53 so Papyrus runs a little faster.

 

One important thing to note is that Papyrus performance is also tied to your framerate. The lower your framerate is, the slower Papyrus executes as well. If you attempted testing the game with uncapped framerates far above 60 (only for testing of course), you will notice that scripts execute far faster than they were when the framerate is capped at 60.

[Veladarius]

51 minutes ago, Skullered said:

I don't care much for framerate in games, I can easily sacrifice 57 FPS for 53 so Papyrus runs a little faster.

 

One important thing to note is that Papyrus performance is also tied to your framerate. The lower your framerate is, the slower Papyrus executes as well. If you attempted testing the game with uncapped framerates far above 60 (only for testing of course), you will notice that scripts execute far faster than they were when the framerate is capped at 60.

I had to cap it using vsync. The frame rate cap setting in the enb version I am using drops it to about 15 no matter what it is set at. If I don't cap it picking locks at 200+ fps results in a lot of broken lock picks.

[Veladarius]

1 hour ago, pnutz78 said:

Thx Vel,

 

for the insight. That all makes sense and I did not realize that follower mechanics are so tough to implement. Honestly, the most fun in the game I get simply out of role playing in the shop and talking to the master. So I was thinking if there were just more communication paths with her that trigger incremental devices being put on you either as a present (if she likes you) or as an educational measure (to a degree what happens already when you fail a job). But I would like for them to be matching set items not just any random DD and each device could be linked to a slightly different conversation option or task that you have already implemented for the property slave or a delivery/ recovery mission that she specifically asks you to do. While I love your original gear (captured dream trial set) I think the new DDE 4.0 has lots of interesting sets of items that could be incrementally applied.

 

This way you would be supporting immersive role play, which is one of the strongest aspects of captured dreams, could utilize tasks that you already coded and just combine them with a few more dialogues with the master + sense of progression when these path dependent DD sets get applied. For the paths you could use your original gages of Sub/ Dom Like/ Does not like likes sex/ does not....one set per gage? Once Such a DD set is complete there could be again one specific task that you could be doing (maybe even an existing one) to get the master to remove them incrementally again.

 

Anyways, I do love the mod and am very much looking forward to the next version. Any chance we may see something in March?

 

Take Care

With the follower mechanics here is a specific example I can across:

 

- Standard Skyrim has an alias that the follower uses to control their behavior and dialogue, when you tell them to accompany you the alias is filled.

- All commands that affect the follower (dismiss and such) generally are applied to the character within the alias.

- There are factions that tell if an npc is a potential follower, has been a follower and such but detecting these requires searching the cell an examining the npc's there and that process is pretty much random. If there is a faction for current follower and all of the various mods use it I may be able to come up with something to ID them and grab them.

- Last issue is the priority setting of the quest that controls the followers, if a follower mod set it to 100 all I can do is match it and the two will fight for control of the npc. This leads to being unable to reliably control and contain the npc (initial testing of the follower system I had in CD would result in them randomly showing up at quest locations such as the Embassy.

 

- The version of AFT I use adds more aliases to the quest so it can handle multiple followers (likely most of them do something like this) so you have to tell it which follower is to be dismissed where standard Skyrim just had the one so there was no need to tell it which one.

 

IF the priority on the controlling quests on npc's is low enough that I can overcome it I can likely come up with something in the future to handle them. I will just need to download all of the follower handling mods and examine them (custom followers with their own system may be a different issue).

 

 

As for v4, I have something I have in the planning stages to get around my problems with DD. I use an older version of NMM (0.56) so everything is in the data folder, no alternate setups so what I play with is what I mod with. If I can't play the game with the mod I have no reason to use it in modding. I can make adjustments on my end to handle the scripting requirements and such so things work right but so long as I consider DD unplayable and have no alternative to make it so it is then I won't use it or mod with it. I have made patches for some of my other mods so they work with mods I don't use but they were minor issues, issues I have with DD are not.

[The Stinkin' Beaver]

On 18.10.2017 at 7:00 AM, Veladarius said:

 

Make sure the guard is there with you as he introduces you to her, without him the scene will not progress. If you need to move him to you use sqv cdxexpquest02 he should be guard1 or something like that and it will have his ID there. Use prid <id>  then  moveto player  and he should then move to his position and the scene will start.

 

Edit: the guard should be just to your left.

Having the same problem, and followed your instructions - alas to no avail. The guard will then just stand there silently next to Elenwen and me.

[Veladarius]

1 hour ago, Lupine00 said:

Apart from the presumed typo here, there's some fallacious reasoning in it.

 

Sure, tell people that if they mess with this value, it might make their game suck worse, or crash, but it might help them get better script execution.

As for nagging modders to be less script heavy... A total waste of time. Either they are trying their best, or they don't care. The remainder, that are sitting there waiting for a crowd to beat a path to their door and demand better performance... Not many. If any.

 

So, back to technical. Yes. At 60fps you get 16.67ms to render. But at 30fps, which is the next step, if you are framelocked, you get 33.33ms, and taking a couple of ms off that is a lot less of a big deal. Assuming you are framing out.

 

Now, the guy posting the ini file info has a slow card, and a slow CPU. Which do you think is limiting his render throughput at the resolution he runs? Even with the modest i5, it's still probably that old steamboat willy gfx card. It is the bottleneck in most cases, not the CPU. But... In some locations, especially playing a lot of animation, he's going to be CPU bound, but in those locations he may care more about his script not totally fucking up than dropping a frame.

 

Now, imagine you have a 1080Ti, and a top end i7 (which is probably going to run Skyrim better than an i9), where's the bottleneck now? If you don't have an ENB, there probably isn't one, and if you have an ENB, the shadows and HDR are burning fill like crazy and guess what? You're limited by the card again and the CPU is sitting idle.

 

Or alternatively, it's nothing like that. But either way. People can try what they like, they don't need the mod police telling them that if they change their .ini file they'll go straight to Hel (with one L).

Did a bit of a test run using the Dev Aveza airship flying over Falkreath, the forests, CD shop then over the lake to near Embershard mine. Dev Azera mod has been modified to handle larger script spikes than standard, works well just a bit of stutter every so often which is due to entering a new cell and SOS doing its thing with npc's - no errors in the log.

 

i5 2500k @3.3 ghz, AMD 280x w/ 3gb with my display being 1920 x 1200 and using an enb (not all effects).

fps - 25 - 45

CPU usage (per the Task Manager) - 55% average, spikes of as much as 10% more

GPU usage (per data from AMD's overdrive software) - peak of 80% usage, lows in the mid 50% with typical usage being about 65% - 75%

 

I can probably push the i5 higher but it is getting old (was current generation when I bought it).

 

Spikes from SOS are usually 110 - 150 ms and the Dev Aveza is set to a tolerance of 100 ms. I upped it to 500 ms (not that I have ever had anything that high).

 

Overall the game is more CPU bound than GPU bound and to get better frame rates you need to get to the point that the CPU is not what is limiting the game. If I removed the ENB it would be a different story as I can easily hit over 100 fps without it and that was with my old gpu (same cpu). If scripting is tied to frame rates then doesn't it make more sense to give papyrus more time to run scripts (especially if you have a script heavy setup) so they can work properly and not possibly trigger dump stack errors?

 

Like Skullered, I am willing to sacrifice some fps for a more stable game.

[Veladarius]

31 minutes ago, The Skinking Weever said:

Having the same problem, and followed your instructions - alas to no avail. The guard will then just stand there silently next to Elenwen and me.

Few things to try:

- Make sure your controls are disabled

- move a bit closer to Elenwen (enable then disable controls when done) to see if you are out of her force greet distance, once started you should move back to the proper position.

- use issceneplaying xx12dcfa  if not then use startscene xx12dcfa when you meet her, it may have not been triggered properly

[The Stinkin' Beaver]

7 minutes ago, Veladarius said:

Few things to try:

- Make sure your controls are disabled

- move a bit closer to Elenwen (enable then disable controls when done) to see if you are out of her force greet distance, once started you should move back to the proper position.

- use issceneplaying xx12dcfa  if not then use startscene xx12dcfa when you meet her, it may have not been triggered properly

Thank you. I tried "issceneplaying xx12dcfa" and "startscene xx12dcfa", and the output was "Item 'xx12dcfa' not found for parameter Scene.

[Veladarius]

14 minutes ago, The Skinking Weever said:

Thank you. I tried "issceneplaying xx12dcfa" and "startscene xx12dcfa", and the output was "Item 'xx12dcfa' not found for parameter Scene.

xx is the load position of the mod, use  help cdx  and it will be the first 2 digits of any item that comes up.

[The Stinkin' Beaver]

3 hours ago, Veladarius said:

xx is the load position of the mod, use  help cdx  and it will be the first 2 digits of any item that comes up.

Ah, yes, sure, the mod index. Sorry it's been a while. Reinstalled Skyrim only recently just to enjoy this mod. Anyway, xx is 1F for me then, but startscene 1F12DCFA doesn't do anything either (it was not running). It just keeps ending with the force greet. But hey, papyrus log has 1316 lines  

Papyrus.1.log

[Veladarius]

1 hour ago, The Stinkin' Beaver said:

Ah, yes, sure, the mod index. Sorry it's been a while. Reinstalled Skyrim only recently just to enjoy this mod. Anyway, xx is 1F for me then, but startscene 1F12DCFA doesn't do anything either (it was not running). It just keeps ending with the force greet. But hey, papyrus log has 1316 lines  

Papyrus.1.log

Most are property errors on scripts except a few things with the device hider. Do you realize this log is only 16 seconds start to finish? It has barely started up and would not have any data regarding any errors with the scenes and force greet.

[The Stinkin' Beaver]

Indeed, so it's probably got not nothing to do with your work at all. I guess it's time for an overall recap of the mods i got installed. Thanks for your suggestions!

[GreatCroco]

9 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Apart from the presumed typo here, there's some fallacious reasoning in it.

Yes it was a typo. The reasoning itself is backed up by a developer in the official Beth forum (followup post). Keep also in mind, that CPU and GPU aren't doing work completely in parallel, the CPU still has to synchronize between RAM, GRAM among other stuff. I hit that wall really fast when I was trying to implement a path finding routine for an autonomous robot on my Quattro and CUDA. Just by offloading the work onto the GPU I busted every calculation I needed to make (Bounding Boxes, Collision, etc.) on the CPU alone (and we are talking about shaving off nanoseconds in my setup here).

 

The same applies to Skyrim to an extent. Physics is still calculated on the CPU and will take up most of it's time and it's the reason why you can't run skyrim past 60 fps, even if you disable V-Sync. The Engine simply assumes that and disabling it will cause massive issues with that (really outdated physics engine), also ingame time seems (at least some people reported that) to not work properly when running >60fps

 

Btw: I run a setup with 256 mods, which includes multiple DD related mods, Campfire, Frostfall, RnD, WaC, various Civil War, Dragon and Vampire

mods and my Papyrus settings are on their default values. I never got script lag on my i7 2600k @3.4GHz.

 

 

20 hours ago, Veladarius said:

I have done my research and read what they do and have made numerous adjustments to them for quite some time to get them where they are at now.

That post wasn't intended towards you, I just quoted yours as a starting point, since it had the ini settings.

 

7 hours ago, Veladarius said:

If scripting is tied to frame rates then doesn't it make more sense to give papyrus more time to run scripts (especially if you have a script heavy setup) so they can work properly and not possibly trigger dump stack errors?

Stack dump errors have nothing to do with the time papyrus gets to calculate things. These errors appear because your stack frame is too small. Changing this won't make papyrus faster however, as the stack (usually) only holds local variables, function pointers and return values (in x86). You don't need to increase those values as every function call gets a new stack frame. For  stack dump errors to appear, your function would need to exceed 512 byte (which is almost never going to happen, as that would mean, that you just allocated just shy of  128 32bit integers inside the function) or the total amount for stack frames exceeds 75kB, which also shouldn't happen, since many more things are stored on the heap, and not the stack. You can tweak the memory settings, but it's almost impossible to do so, as you'd need to know each mod in your load order and every function in it to determine appropriate stack frame sizes

To quote the CreationKit Wiki on the iMaxAllocatedMemoryBytes setting:

Quote

WARNING: this setting is for stack size not heap size, so there is no reason for setting this to a huge value even though it is possible. Increasing iMaxAllocatedMemoryBytes to values much larger than default can cause stack thrashing (stack buffer overflows), intermittent game stuttering, erratic game behavior and CTDs. Stack thrashing will produce stack dumps in the Papyrus log, similar to the example below. The dumps can be very large if many scripts are running, producing a very large log file.

 

Also, papyrus execution speed is not tied to the framerate, it's the other way around (which is not the same). If the papyrus engine takes less time than you gave it in the ini it's going to return and your framerate goes up. If the load is high it'll use the time it's allocated and then return (reducing the framerate in the process). If the script hasn't finished it's state is saved and put back and then pulled out the next tick, resuming where left off. That's why reducing the framerate is so important, because you are effectively allocating a script double the time to finish before being forcefully interrupted.

 

 

That means, splitting big scripts into multiple smaller ones can help. Lets assume, that your Papyrus settings are on their default. You then have 20 scripts that each finish in 0.6ms (for simplicity sake, lets assume that all scripts are done in parallel), and one script that takes 4ms to complete.

Papyrus will finish the 20 scripts withoput problem, and after 1.2ms yield control back, allowing the game to advance one tick. Papyrus now can execute the followup tasks bound to the 20 finished scripts (whatever that may be) and also start finishing the last script with 2.8ms execution time remaining, allowing the followup tasks to be run four ticks later.

Now here's the problem: If you increase the Papyrus time to 4ms the 20 scripts still get executed in 0.6ms each and the big script is still getting executed in 4ms, which means every script executes their followup tasks in the next tick. However you just slowed 20 scripts for the equivalent of four ticks and didn't speed up a single one.

 

Now, that was a very simplified example and increasing the Papyrus time can help increase responsiveness for some setup, but in many cases increasing that time will slow down scripts that run faster, but can't execute followup tasks because the game hasn't advanced a tick.

[Tr_veller]

On 01/03/2018 at 4:42 PM, Veladarius said:

Use resetinventory on it, that should get things going as when you put items in the chest it will do the same thing.

Thanks, that worked. Presently sweeping up piles of dust

 

 

(says the guy wishing for a shorter latex based maids uniform...)

[Veladarius]

You can stop with the lecture, it wasn't warranted in the first place. I did not recommend any settings that were outrageous and as hylisi pointed out most of them were standard values anyway, those that were not were not far from standard and well within the limits of the game engine. Also, since I said that I alter the settings even though people say not to and you saying you shouldn't ever do it in your first line sounds like it was directed at me.

 

As for stack dump errors I have had XPMSE give a constant stream of them on several occasions with no other mods generating errors and I don't run many heavily scripted mods, those I do run have run with no issues. I have also seen logs from other people on a number of occasions that were full of them as well due to repeating errors or commands from scripts.

[Veladarius]

16 minutes ago, Tr_veller said:

Thanks, that worked. Presently sweeping up piles of dust

 

 

(says the guy wishing for a shorter latex based maids uniform...)

Find the mesh for one and replace the ones included with the mod. It was specifically set up that way so that was all that was needed to do to use whatever one you want BUT you only get the body (and shoes for CA02).

[Lupine00]

15 hours ago, Skullered said:

One important thing to note is that Papyrus performance is also tied to your framerate. The lower your framerate is, the slower Papyrus executes as well. If you attempted testing the game with uncapped framerates far above 60 (only for testing of course), you will notice that scripts execute far faster than they were when the framerate is capped at 60.

Yes, that is exactly what that variable is controlling. It limits Papyrus to X ms per rendered frame.

If you render half as many frames, Papyrus gets half as much time.

 

Unless you double that value. Which might lead to you dropping a frame because you stole time from render.

 

Honestly, the way Beth did this is idiotic, but NM.

 

I suspect, that if Papyrus has nothing to do, the render can get that extra time back anyway, but that assumes Papyrus does have nothing to do.

Almost certainly, Papyrus budget will be a CAP on the time it's allowed to run, and after that, its stopped, and work begins on the render.

 

So kicking that value up might not be so bad after all. Here's how to find out. Raise it, not too much, and see if your framerate is significantly impacted.

 

And if your goal is to run a solid 30 in the first place... You can lock that in, in your GFX card driver's vsync options. And while Skyrim deteriorates running at 30, it's going to be a lot better than jumping from 30 to 60 erratically.

 

And yes, for a lot of people framerate isn't all that big a deal, whether they're a screenshotter, or for lots of other reasons.

OTOH, having your mod break due to a stack dump is often a game wrecking experience.

That was, kind of, my point in the first place.

[Lupine00]

13 hours ago, Techpriest said:

Yes it was a typo. The reasoning itself is backed up by a developer in the official Beth forum (followup post). Keep also in mind, that CPU and GPU aren't doing work completely in parallel, the CPU still has to synchronize between RAM, GRAM among other stuff. I hit that wall really fast when I was trying to implement a path finding routine for an autonomous robot on my Quattro and CUDA. Just by offloading the work onto the GPU I busted every calculation I needed to make (Bounding Boxes, Collision, etc.) on the CPU alone (and we are talking about shaving off nanoseconds in my setup here).

Sorry. No. It's based on your understanding of what that dev said. Which I don't trust much, you've proven that your reasoning, and the conclusions you want to draw are based on a narrow treatment and insufficient experience of the area.

 

Off topic rambling about memory bandwidth aside, bottlenecks are still bottlenecks.

 

Your first mistake is thinking this is a technical argument that you win by knowing more. If you hadn't waded in, there wouldn't be an argument.

 

The (alleged) facts presented by this developer's post don't necessarily lead to the conclusion you think they do, or at the very least ignore many nuances to get from A to C without addressing B or D. But I don't want to argue with you about that, because the entire basis for your rant is based on the premise that anyone was having a technical debate about this in the first place. The argument itself appears as much about lording it over some guy who simply shared his experience, as it is about imparting useful information.

 

If you want to post technical information, that is helpful. Go ahead, nobody will complain, but when you put a huge judgmental color on something the OP just floated as an option people can try, it looks like you are asking for a cookie and spitting in the jar. So, if you wonder why I am responding to you, it's because of that, because I don't think it's ideal to use a forum as a venue for unprovoked beat downs, and that's basically what you executed.

 

People can do what they want to their game, and you can tell them they're wrong if you like, but they probably aren't going to thank you.

Your suggestion that time is best invested in nagging mod developers, is bad. That is all.

 

Actually, not all... I know stack dumps are not directly caused by performance, but even in Pap, it's more complex than that, performance issues can lead to memory use, can lead to stack dumps, it's all interlinked, simplistically reducing it all to smaller routines and faster frame rate is only helping your argument that every word you wrote was right, and everything anyone else says is not as good. That attitude is not helping mod developers. At least, not much.

 

If you want to help mod developers make better code, you need to produce recipes, guides, reference material, a SKSE plugin for analysing multi-threaded Pap scripting issues. Show them a trace that shows the waits, context transitions, etc. That might help the ones that want to be helped.

 

You're dealing with people who are not always programmers, and who often struggle with basic concepts, because those things are not in their field of interest. Involved debates about whether you think Havok is antiquated (and it isn't, and Beth had the option to choose PhysX and they didn't) don't help a single mod dev make a better mod.

 

Mod devs have basic tasks they want to do. They want their mod to work right. Tell them how to do that, in a way they understand, and they'll thank you.

 

You know, how do I chain animations seamlessly? How do I actually ensure an NPC changes package when I want? How do I stop the CK deciding to make all my dialogue disappear just because I added a new alias to a quest it doesn't even use. How can I find out what tags are in an animation so I know what callbacks to use? How do I properly manipulate the camera without resulting in a broken camera when the PC gets control back? How do I know if an NPC is failing at path finding? How can I run code efficiently on nearby NPCs, and is a cloak spell really my best option? When can't I use a cloak, and why? What is the string limit? Why does my giant MCM choke? How do I localize for another language without massive effort? This stuff has almost nothing to do with performance. If you're really the Techpriest, you have the answers, right?

 

There are good explanations of *some* of these issues out there, but they could be better, and there are probably a hundred more issues, or two hundred more that could use better explanations, better tutorials, better examples.

 

You want mod authors to write better code? Show them how.

 

Don't ask players to hassle them about their bad performance on forums. That's just trolling.

 

 

[kinkyskyrim]

Loving it so far!

 

One problem, though. After starting the slavery quest, nothing seems to remove the iron yoke. Can't pick the lock, or struggle out. I even asked Master to remove all items. It registers and charges for the yoke, but won't remove it. I also paid off the whole debt, which removed the chastity belt, but not the yoke. A notification said 'no quest items found on player' or something similar.

 

Please, I'm so helpless and vulnerable

 

EDIT: Even console commands don't work. A notification says 'Iron yoke removed', but it doesn't come off.

[Veladarius]

33 minutes ago, kinkyskyrim said:

Loving it so far!

 

One problem, though. After starting the slavery quest, nothing seems to remove the iron yoke. Can't pick the lock, or struggle out. I even asked Master to remove all items. It registers and charges for the yoke, but won't remove it.

 

Please, I'm so helpless and vulnerable

Is due to changes in v4 of DD regarding yokes and armbinders. It is a standard item so if you have any mods (such as DCUR you can use the 'Free Me' option) or use showinventory on yourself, note the id's of the CD devices (collar and such) and use DD's removeall system then give the items back and equip them.

[kinkyskyrim]

18 minutes ago, Veladarius said:

Is due to changes in v4 of DD regarding yokes and armbinders. It is a standard item so if you have any mods (such as DCUR you can use the 'Free Me' option) or use showinventory on yourself, note the id's of the CD devices (collar and such) and use DD's removeall system then give the items back and equip them.

Thank you!

[balth]

*SPOILERS AHEAD* So, I made it through the whole property slave and manor slave quest lines and chose to become a relationship slave, but the "ring to unlock belt" that the master gave me doesn't seem to work. I equip it, my character glows with a spell effect briefly, and then the ring is automatically unequipped. I can't seem to unequip the belt either during the brief period where I'm actually wearing the ring nor after it's auto-unequipped - the menu to unlock belt (and the various other options like "leave it on") pops up, but selecting "unlock belt" gives me a message about the lock being a "custom lock, while the key fits it will not turn".

 

I really enjoyed the whole CD experience so far and would like to continue down the relationship quest line, but I'd also like to take the chastity belt off sometimes.

 

I'm using CD version 4.15, DDA 3.0. DDX 2.0 and DDI 3.3.

[balth]

Ok, after more testing it seems the old belt and collar weren't being removed during the scene in the master's bedroom for some reason, so my new belt and collar weren't being equipped. I used the console removeitem command on the old gear during the scene which then let the master equip the new stuff properly, after which the "remove belt ring" worked.