Toxic Masculinity and Men's Shame

[MonVert]

7 hours ago, Resdayn said:

They still look like men and act like men. ?

 

 

Are you sure? With estrogen therapy and the ability to chop your penis up to make a vaginal orifice makes them pretty in-distinguishable from regular women. ?

[Resdayn]

1 hour ago, MonVert said:

 

Are you sure? With estrogen therapy and the ability to chop your penis up to make a vaginal orifice makes them pretty in-distinguishable from regular women. ?

Thats transition ?

 

But not really related to the subject.

[Darkpig]

6 hours ago, Ernest Lemmingway said:

This isn't about politics per se. It's about ideology. The line between the two has always been extremely thin and in a few specific cases (like AOC and "the Squad" or all of Twitter), it's nonexistent. They equate the former with the latter.

 

I also know all about what lame stream media, including Wikipedia, thinks about "toxic masculinity." True toxic personalities are clinically signs of psychopathy. How they manifest does differ between the sexes but the numbers are consistent between both (damned Psychology Today doesn't have the article archived). What pop culture calls "toxic masculinity" is just another projection by snowflakes desperate to avoid facing their own failings and a complete misrepresentation of the term "toxic."

Psychology gives words and definitions to issues with the human mind. It is clearly mostly men who have this issue and if you say it is an issue with everyone then that is very communist thinking right there. All lives matter and the nation shoulders the suffering together. Stalin would be proud. That is ideology not politics per se.

 

But ah snowflakes. If men can't own up to their problems then I'm dreaming of a white Christmas.

[Ernest Lemmingway]

3 hours ago, Darkpig said:

Psychology gives words and definitions to issues with the human mind. It is clearly mostly men who have this issue and if you say it is an issue with everyone then that is very communist thinking right there. All lives matter and the nation shoulders the suffering together. Stalin would be proud. That is ideology not politics per se.

 

But ah snowflakes. If men can't own up to their problems then I'm dreaming of a white Christmas.

I have no clue what you're trying to say. It's like two or three different thoughts are being mashed together into one. And since it's clear this is not going to get any clearer for either of us, I'm walking away. I've said what I wanted about the whole idea of "toxic masculinity" being nothing more than a projection by those who want to blame anyone and anything else for their own failings. It's not toxic "masculinity" or "femininity" that's the issue; it's just plain toxic personalities.

[Darkpig]

On 12/14/2020 at 7:22 PM, Ernest Lemmingway said:

I have no clue what you're trying to say. It's like two or three different thoughts are being mashed together into one. And since it's clear this is not going to get any clearer for either of us, I'm walking away. I've said what I wanted about the whole idea of "toxic masculinity" being nothing more than a projection by those who want to blame anyone and anything else for their own failings. It's not toxic "masculinity" or "femininity" that's the issue; it's just plain toxic personalities.

And that is what is such a communist ideal. We cannot all share the blame for our actions. That is not how the world works. Somebody needs to take the fall in order for something to be accomplished. An author needs constructive criticism to be a good author and a construction worker needs feedback to prevent the whole structure from falling down. There is shown to be more men doing criminal acts than women so it can't be a coincidence. Toxic masculinity is simply a label and like any label it has a chance to offend. Labels are used for practical and research purposes and without them there would be chaos.

 

To address the elephant in the room Karens do exist not to be confused with the ethnic group but they are not as common as you think or if they are gods help us all. Of course I am also happy to laugh at male Karens too but that is a story for another time.

[RitualClarity]

18 hours ago, Darkpig said:

And that is what is such a communist ideal. We cannot all share the blame for our actions. That is not how the world works. Somebody needs to take the fall in order for something to be accomplished. An author needs constructive criticism to be a good author and a construction worker needs feedback to prevent the whole structure from falling down. There is shown to be more men doing criminal acts than women so it can't be a coincidence. Toxic masculinity is simply a label and like any label it has a chance to offend. Labels are used for practical and research purposes and without them there would be chaos.

 

To address the elephant in the room Karens do exist not to be confused with the ethnic group but they are not as common as you think or if they are gods help us all. Of course I am also happy to laugh at male Karens too but that is a story for another time.

Oh no you didn't go there. ...

 

Labels... stereotypes .. not a "coincidence"..  Based on the statement
 

Quote

men doing criminal acts than women so it can't be a coincidence

Generalized labels and stereotypes is a major contributor to the wholesale attack by police against African American males. The majority of imprisoned males are black...A major contributor to police going all Gorge Foreman on black males. More so than other races.

 

People need to stop randomly creating labels such as Toxic masculinity, and look at possible causes and solutions. 

 

Note... Toxic masculinity has a chance to offend.. it should always offend.. Just as much as someone calling a woman a bitch or a anybody a ethnic slur... It is just something that has no purpose, meaning, or use in society except to try to put someone down, force control over someone.

[MonVert]

So, apparently, this thread is now about Woke Left Karen Communist Naze Feminist Futanari Propaganda and their George Foreman Grills.. ? Gosh, how many buzzwords can exist in one thread?

[Darkpig]

 

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Note... Toxic masculinity has a chance to offend.. it should always offend.. Just as much as someone calling a woman a bitch or a anybody a ethnic slur... It is just something that has no purpose, meaning, or use in society except to try to put someone down, force control over someone.

And if they are a bitch then they are a bitch. Despite being bitch being incorrect it is still widely regarded as a mean woman. Unfair yes? So is George Foreman, feminazi and woke as well as bitch. This is the Toxic masculinity thread in a nutshell. Are we solving any problems yet?

 

Perhaps we should handle this like gentleman with white gloves and etiquette. Nah. Toxic Masculinity is not insulting enough I think. People use toxic to casually describe fandoms all the time and masculinity is a given. I think I'll go with bitching masculinity. You can give it whatever name you want when you are doing a formal paper in what psychology? No psychology isn't real science. Well toxic masculinity it is then.

[Mr. Otaku]

7 minutes ago, Darkpig said:

Are we solving any problems yet?

We can't solve a problem that doesn't exist the way intellectual midgets say it does. So what's left to do is to look at it and call it the overblown horseshit it is, though i think it's been done enough times by now. At least here, in this thread anyway.

[RitualClarity]

2 hours ago, Mr. Otaku said:

We can't solve a problem that doesn't exist the way intellectual midgets say it does. So what's left to do is to look at it and call it the overblown horseshit it is, though i think it's been done enough times by now. At least here, in this thread anyway.

And as for solving problems... lets stop putting stupid meaningless labels on people. there. Problem solved!  It is as simple as that. These terms are only used by scared shitless, useless assholes that want to try to gain some level of control over someone else. Same for any other derogatory name calling. People that are too scared  to actually call someone what they think and/or address them directly. got to try to play mind games. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[RitualClarity]

Thisi s what some call Toxic masculinity.. however, just an Asshole

 

By the way.. loving the song.. lol.  Would live to make this a ring tone for some people I know you know.. because I AM AN ASSHOLE.. lol

another asshole video.. lol

For when someone is being an asshole.. lol

 

[Darkpig]

On 12/16/2020 at 9:13 PM, RitualClarity said:

And as for solving problems... lets stop putting stupid meaningless labels on people. there. Problem solved!  It is as simple as that. These terms are only used by scared shitless, useless assholes that want to try to gain some level of control over someone else. Same for any other derogatory name calling. People that are too scared  to actually call someone what they think and/or address them directly. got to try to play mind games. 

You're right. Labels are stupid.

 

Lets instead talk about how are we going to help those people who are suffering from (meaningless label redacted).

 

P.S. Doesn't sound fun at all but when you're right you're right.

[Kaldor Draigo]

theres no such thing thats just what the sjws want you to think

[RitualClarity]

15 hours ago, Darkpig said:

You're right. Labels are stupid.

 

Lets instead talk about how are we going to help those people who are suffering from (meaningless label redacted).

 

P.S. Doesn't sound fun at all but when you're right you're right.

I gave a hint above.. play the song, I'm an asshole if it is someone calling you Toxic.. or the other one if it is someone else. lol

[Darkpig]

On 12/16/2020 at 6:14 PM, Mr. Otaku said:

So what's left to do is to look at it and call it the overblown horseshit it is, though i think it's been done enough times by now. At least here, in this thread anyway.

Overblown yes. Like any other idea in history but many people on this thread are outright denying men have issues which strikes me as silly almost funny. I guess by their definition I would be an "SJW". Oh no I'm Sam Jacob Wilburn

[RitualClarity]

2 hours ago, Darkpig said:

Overblown yes. Like any other idea in history but many people on this thread are outright denying men have issues which strikes me as silly almost funny. I guess by their definition I would be an "SJW". Oh no I'm Sam Jacob Wilburn

Nobody is denying men have issues, EVERYBODY has issues of one sort or another. The issue is creating terms that demean an entire gender.  How far would it fly if everybody started calling women bitches?  Not far.  However, if someone (regardless of gender ) is being a total asshole .. then you can call them that.  Same goes for Bitch if the term is proper and used to reflect the actions of a single person etc.)
 

[Voiddweller]

I'd say "toxic masculinity" is when you act like a dick. Self-centered, aggressive and incapable of displaying any empathy kind of a dick. And then comes al kinds of lies and hypocrisy, to defend your precious self. Damn, even if humanity as whole, which most of the known time were led by a men, acts like universe was meant to be theirs. So it's exist to be claimed and taken. But this is not true. We are just microbes on a grain of sand, floating trough the void in a middle of nowhere. Our existence will come to an end long before we can even be able to leave any significant, constructive mark even on our world, if we continue just like that.

[Darkpig]

1 hour ago, RitualClarity said:

Nobody is denying men have issues, EVERYBODY has issues of one sort or another. The issue is creating terms that demean an entire gender.  How far would it fly if everybody started calling women bitches?  Not far.  However, if someone (regardless of gender ) is being a total asshole .. then you can call them that.  Same goes for Bitch if the term is proper and used to reflect the actions of a single person etc.)

Maybe they don't mean it but that is what is written down. From a recent post "theres no such thing thats just what the sjws want you to think." I'll leave you to distinguish what that means. Calling everybody bitches is incorrect and so is calling all men toxic masculinity. Why am I the only one unoffended by this toxic masculinity word? Whatever. The old masculine ideals should be calmly addressed by parents and psychologists. It is something that parents should talk about with their kids that such ideals are not themselves bad but when taken too far can be toxic to the individual and others. It is something that psychologists need to help people integrate into society; possibly war veterans?

 

The way it is handled in politics is concerning to put it mildly but politics is always concerning regardless of the topic. As for business even mega corporations like Disney are within their rights to make their content and gender neutral as they want. That said their sheer size does make me think there is some white collar crime going on.

 

Question: is it a dying issue or is it one that is starting to affect women as well? "WE WOMEN TAKE SHIT FROM NOBODY!" Its like looking in a mirror isn't it?

[RitualClarity]

2 hours ago, Darkpig said:

Maybe they don't mean it but that is what is written down. From a recent post "theres no such thing thats just what the sjws want you to think." I'll leave you to distinguish what that means. Calling everybody bitches is incorrect and so is calling all men toxic masculinity. Why am I the only one unoffended by this toxic masculinity word? Whatever. The old masculine ideals should be calmly addressed by parents and psychologists. It is something that parents should talk about with their kids that such ideals are not themselves bad but when taken too far can be toxic to the individual and others. It is something that psychologists need to help people integrate into society; possibly war veterans?

 

The way it is handled in politics is concerning to put it mildly but politics is always concerning regardless of the topic. As for business even mega corporations like Disney are within their rights to make their content and gender neutral as they want. That said their sheer size does make me think there is some white collar crime going on.

 

Question: is it a dying issue or is it one that is starting to affect women as well? "WE WOMEN TAKE SHIT FROM NOBODY!" Its like looking in a mirror isn't it?

You aren't the only one not offended by the "Toxic Masculinity" term.

 

Disney can make the content that they  want .. gender neutral or whatever. The problem is .. they loose customers. They have backlash, they have hate male for changing long standing characters trying to meet a SJW checkbox People don't want that shit. They want stories. They want to be engaged, they want interesting experiences.  There have been many award winning shows that cover alternate life styles. Relationships and the like. Major releases that got great reviews and was greatly enjoyed by the public. the key was they were well written and made sense and was well presented. Not a checkbox. The problem is the "checkbox" of SJWs. Doesn't work. won't work and takes away from the works and looses money for those companies. Many are starting to see that this is a loosing venture. Some have back tracked to try to gain their fans and customers back. (Gillette for example )

 

Women shouldn't take shit from anybody.. why should they? Where are you going with this .. ? Just jumping around trying to add things to this and that to try to make some sense, I don't get it.  women have a right to stand up to those that want to cause them harm. Call out people who try to abuse them, harm them or hold them back. They need to be encouraged to do so. That doesn't mean you have to be an SJW to do so.  Just someone with a sister or mother etc. Someone that wants everybody to have the same chances at opportunity. Prevent oppression or abuse.

[MonVert]

28 minutes ago, RitualClarity said:

Disney can make the content that they  want

 

They already do. They even made a movie about closet lesbians. and female doms.

 

And pretty much all of it is a box office hit.  I don't think they've made a 'traditional' romance flick since the 90s.

 

 

[Guest]

On 12/14/2020 at 5:34 PM, Darkpig said:

It is clearly mostly men who have this issue and if you say it is an issue with everyone then that is very communist thinking right there. All lives matter and the nation shoulders the suffering together. Stalin would be proud.

What issue? A man being a man is far from an issue. Some people, BOTH men and women who have bad traits are only an issue to people who are easily offended, or feel THEIR way is always right, and anyone who disagrees is Stalin. Resorting to calling people Stalin, Hitler, Communist, Nazi, etc is a clear sign that a person no longer is capable of mounting a reasonable and civil argument to support what they wish others to believe. Congratulations! Next comes, "Oh yeah... well my dad can beat up your dad!!!" ?And try growing up in Eastern Ukraine, listening to the stories of those times of Stalin... then tell me more of what you know of him.

 

 

[osculim]

It is simple if you are a straight male you are somehow evil. I'm sorry but toxic is something anyone can be whether your straight, gay, lesbian or transgender.  

[Mr. Otaku]

8 hours ago, Darkpig said:

Overblown yes. Like any other idea in history but many people on this thread are outright denying men have issues which strikes me as silly almost funny. I guess by their definition I would be an "SJW". Oh no I'm Sam Jacob Wilburn

There's a difference between saying "men have no issues" and "the issues that men and masculinity are solely getting blamed for aren't actually gender specific". The latter is the point and it is indeed overblown since masculinity is being used as a scapegoat and a punching bag. The people arguing for former are a non-factor here, don't conflate them to the rest of us.

[Darkpig]

4 hours ago, RitualClarity said:

You aren't the only one not offended by the "Toxic Masculinity" term.

 

Disney can make the content that they  want .. gender neutral or whatever. The problem is .. they loose customers. They have backlash, they have hate male for changing long standing characters trying to meet a SJW checkbox People don't want that shit. They want stories. They want to be engaged, they want interesting experiences.  There have been many award winning shows that cover alternate life styles. Relationships and the like. Major releases that got great reviews and was greatly enjoyed by the public. the key was they were well written and made sense and was well presented. Not a checkbox. The problem is the "checkbox" of SJWs. Doesn't work. won't work and takes away from the works and looses money for those companies. Many are starting to see that this is a loosing venture. Some have back tracked to try to gain their fans and customers back. (Gillette for example )

Disney had its failures sure but such a titanic company can't fail(Pause for dramatic irony) until it sinks like the titanic. Speaking of dramatic irony Gillette was from what I heard the first if not one of the first companies to sell razors to women so to call out men for their shit makes Gillette look like a hypocrite. Trends either make or break a company but very rarely do companies make trends as that would require money.

Quote

Women shouldn't take shit from anybody.. why should they? Where are you going with this .. ? Just jumping around trying to add things to this and that to try to make some sense, I don't get it.  women have a right to stand up to those that want to cause them harm. Call out people who try to abuse them, harm them or hold them back. They need to be encouraged to do so. That doesn't mean you have to be an SJW to do so.  Just someone with a sister or mother etc. Someone that wants everybody to have the same chances at opportunity. Prevent oppression or abuse.

It was a question. Mostly out of curiosity. A question to see if there was a leaking of male ideals to women.

 

It was the 1920s when women first gained independence. It was some time ago but some of those ideals still hang around today. There are plenty out there that would be happy to live during the American Civil war and there were defined gender roles then. And this is history time with Darkpig. Roll out your blankets kiddos cause this is going to get boring. Men back in ye olde days needed to be the alpha at all costs. Come the industrial revolution they were no longer their own boss, no longer the alpha of their own game but simply the bread winners. That is still a lot more power than women had. Women did have to take shit from men as they could not own jobs thus they could not live without their spouse.

 

I'm getting off topic. How did this affect men? Rather poorly I would think. Many were alcoholics so much that I think there was a prohibition.

 

Labels are stupid but they are also necessary to organize shit. Biologists need them, radiologists need them, physiologists need them and psychologists need them.

[GrimReaper]

7 hours ago, RitualClarity said:

Nobody is denying men have issues, EVERYBODY has issues of one sort or another. The issue is creating terms that demean an entire gender.  How far would it fly if everybody started calling women bitches?  Not far.  However, if someone (regardless of gender ) is being a total asshole .. then you can call them that.  Same goes for Bitch if the term is proper and used to reflect the actions of a single person etc.)
 

I'd like to chime in and say that 'toxic masculinity' ≠ 'masculinity', at least in theory. What bothers me is that this term is clearly gendered - I do not think that certain types of behavior are exclusively found within one gender, a lot of what people would call toxic masculinity, such as abusive behavior, violent temper tantrums and issues stemming from repressed emotions can be found just as often in women. We now know for example that domestic violence is in most cases reciprocal yet we still hear the narrative about men being violent thugs and women being the battered victims. It should be noted, however, that women suffer more severe injuries in general.

 

So yeah, while the term technically doesn't smear men in general, it kinda sorta does. It's just a sleight of hand to muddy the waters. If the discussion was honest, we would be talking about toxic behavior itself, regardless of gender but here we are.