AAF Violate

[EgoBallistic]

30 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

They should doublecheck the buffout version... I remember the version I was using from  was fine until I updated it in July when a vortex check said there was an update https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/47359 with a new version they posted from nexus, Had memory issues after loading game saves in fact, they would load but some would screw up settings after a few minutes of play.

 

So... 1.28.6 was causing problems, and you switched to the forked 1.31.1 by alandtse and that corrected the problems?

 

I'm still on version 1.23.1, I didn't see anything compelling in the changelogs for later versions so I never updated.

[vaultbait]

10 minutes ago, EgoBallistic said:

I'm still on version 1.23.1, I didn't see anything compelling in the changelogs for later versions so I never updated.

 

The only reason I upgraded was for the archive limit fix, though I probably wasn't hitting it I figure it's only a matter of time before I do.

[eflat01]

1 hour ago, EgoBallistic said:

 

So... 1.28.6 was causing problems, and you switched to the forked 1.31.1 by alandtse and that corrected the problems?

 

I'm still on version 1.23.1, I didn't see anything compelling in the changelogs for later versions so I never updated.

 

I was using  v1.26.2 before that, leaped before looking I removed that version out of vortex and it's dl directory. 

[eflat01]

1 hour ago, vaultbait said:

 

The only reason I upgraded was for the archive limit fix, though I probably wasn't hitting it I figure it's only a matter of time before I do.

 

That's what enticed me to click away...  

 

Yes I had problems with it and why I switched it out. Can see a post by me on Nexus that day asking them to post the prior version again... rather than wait I just grabbed the NG fork version. 

 

I'm just trying to think of dll's which had changed based on when Robert T and roflmaones said their issues started. Pop-shots in the dark.

Edited August 13, 2023 by eflat01

[EgoBallistic]

4 hours ago, vaultbait said:

Thanks! I did try variations of the linked patch which also told them to stop following, reinitialized packages and disabled AI, but I didn't consider that Violate might be overriding their packages through an alias. I bet that's the problem.

 

I had a look at your patch and at Violate's outcome code and I think I see the problem.  GetPlayerFollowers() only works on NPCs who are currently running a package that makes them follow the player.  But at the time Violate sends the player into BIP, the followers are still in their surrendered package.

 

I'm in the Violate code right now anyway, so I'm going to add a function similar to your patch that will imprison anyone in Violate's Followers alias before calling BIP, and move them back to the player when BIP ends.

[vaultbait]

8 minutes ago, EgoBallistic said:

I had a look at your patch and at Violate's outcome code and I think I see the problem.  GetPlayerFollowers() only works on NPCs who are currently running a package that makes them follow the player.  But at the time Violate sends the player into BIP, the followers are still in their surrendered package.

 

Hah, I was just coming in here to post that extra debug logging I added showed the followers list was empty. So yes, I agree that's what's going on. They aren't technically considered followers at the time the BiP handoff occurs.

 

8 minutes ago, EgoBallistic said:

I'm in the Violate code right now anyway, so I'm going to add a function similar to your patch that will imprison anyone in Violate's Followers alias before calling BIP, and move them back to the player when BIP ends.

 

Amazing, thanks! That still doesn't address BiP trying to dismiss followers when called in other ways than by Violate, but presumably a similar routine to what I posted in its support topic will cover the rest anyway.

Edited August 13, 2023 by vaultbait

[Robert T]

19 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

 

That's what enticed me to click away...  

 

Yes I had problems with it and why I switched it out. Can see a post by me on Nexus that day asking them to post the prior version again... rather than wait I just grabbed the NG fork version. 

 

I'm just trying to think of dll's which had changed based on when Robert T and roflmaones said their issues started. Pop-shots in the dark.

 

For reference, I am using Buffout 4 NG

[vaultbait]

20 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

That's what enticed me to click away...  

 

Yes I had problems with it and why I switched it out. Can see a post by me on Nexus that day asking them to post the prior version again... rather than wait I just grabbed the NG fork version.

 

Note that subsequent versions of Buffout 4 (not NG) mention in the changelog that the regression was fixed and the feature reenabled by default.

[lee3310]

3 hours ago, EgoBallistic said:

 

I had a look at your patch and at Violate's outcome code and I think I see the problem.  GetPlayerFollowers() only works on NPCs who are currently running a package that makes them follow the player.  But at the time Violate sends the player into BIP, the followers are still in their surrendered package.

 

I'm in the Violate code right now anyway, so I'm going to add a function similar to your patch that will imprison anyone in Violate's Followers alias before calling BIP, and move them back to the player when BIP ends.

just my two cents, but isn't it better to also lock companions in devices and included then in the punishment (has to be done in BIP) like Violate does or just dismiss them (go home) when BIP starts.
Edit: i think Vaultbait is referring to followers not vanilla companions so nevermind.

Edited August 14, 2023 by lee3310

[EgoBallistic]

33 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

just my two cents, but isn't it better to also lock companions in devices and included then in the punishment (has to be done in BIP) like Violate does or just dismiss them (go home) when BIP starts.

 

Well BIP is player focused, and doing that with companions would basically be rewriting the BIP mod.

 

34 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

Edit: i think Vaultbait is referring to followers not vanilla companions so nevermind.

 

Pretty much yeah.  What Violate considers followers encompasses a lot more than just vanilla companions.  The approach I am taking will handle it - I really just took Vaultbait's idea and implemented it in Violate's BIP interface quest.

[vaultbait]

57 minutes ago, lee3310 said:

Edit: i think Vaultbait is referring to followers not vanilla companions so nevermind.

 

Yes. More generally, if you have a lot of NPCs follow you to a BiP scenario, they bumble around randomly and get in the way of the other NPCs the mod sends to antagonize you, causing pathing challenges, long delays, and also randomly interject interrupting the mod's dialogue. BiP attempts to dismiss them, but that only works for companions. Also dismissing companions every time you get into a scenario may mean traveling all over the map to re-recruit them after they go home, hence the desire to effectively sequester them until the scenario ends and then teleport them to you afterward.

[lee3310]

2 hours ago, EgoBallistic said:

 

Well BIP is player focused, and doing that with companions would basically be rewriting the BIP mod.

 

 

Pretty much yeah.  What Violate considers followers encompasses a lot more than just vanilla companions.  The approach I am taking will handle it - I really just took Vaultbait's idea and implemented it in Violate's BIP interface quest.

 

1 hour ago, vaultbait said:

 

Yes. More generally, if you have a lot of NPCs follow you to a BiP scenario, they bumble around randomly and get in the way of the other NPCs the mod sends to antagonize you, causing pathing challenges, long delays, and also randomly interject interrupting the mod's dialogue. BiP attempts to dismiss them, but that only works for companions. Also dismissing companions every time you get into a scenario may mean traveling all over the map to re-recruit them after they go home, hence the desire to effectively sequester them until the scenario ends and then teleport them to you afterward.

I can totally see how having NPCs with following package can be problematic in this situation.
I'm always looking for the most realistic way to do something even if it's a game but Bip doesn't leave you too much room for handling followers. The only other option i can think of is to hold followers in the same spot where the PC got kidnapped and use real handcuffs to hold them (kneeling pose) until the player gets free and uncuffs them.

Edited August 14, 2023 by lee3310

[eflat01]

3 hours ago, vaultbait said:

 

Yes. More generally, if you have a lot of NPCs follow you to a BiP scenario, they bumble around randomly and get in the way of the other NPCs the mod sends to antagonize you, causing pathing challenges, long delays, and also randomly interject interrupting the mod's dialogue. BiP attempts to dismiss them, but that only works for companions. Also dismissing companions every time you get into a scenario may mean traveling all over the map to re-recruit them after they go home, hence the desire to effectively sequester them until the scenario ends and then teleport them to you afterward.

Yeah, I can see that, would hang up the flow... I try not to carry a crowd along. CC's and others I send off before going near raiders. 

 

BiP once sent the PC to Lexington at an intersection with a lot of ferals around running up and down the streets just stopping before the intersection. When she finally broke free had to run like hell as a dozen plus lay chase.  

 

Hannah had Cait along with her the first time I wanted to look at Violate to BIP. All her companions go to Home Plate so is easy to pick them back up again, Is also a pretty crowded place, quite noisy and they're always fighting for the bed and/or the shower. Whenever Hannah stops by to shower she end's up diving in DC's pond they use for drinking water... 

 

 

Edited August 14, 2023 by eflat01

[Spectre5342]

There seem to be some issues with AAF Violate handing the player off to Raider Pet. It occured once earlier in the game but any later occurences Violate fails to pass it over in correct areas with bosses. The player can still trigger the quest manually by walking in unarmed so I think it is an issue on Violates end. I did use some console commands to check the status of the raider pet quests and they're logged as stopped with a few stages skipped but that doesn't seem abnormal many quests that I all ready completed show the same in console commands. Not sure why Violate isn't passing it over but suppose can retrigger it manually just pefer not to. For now gonna move it much lower in the load order and try again. I also loaded back to earlier saves and the FIRST Violate and Raider Pet occurence works fine but any 2nd one pet outcome just won't work maybe it is hung up somewhere on a stage in Raider Pet but I killed the boss and received xp and black widow perk so pretty sure the quest properly concluded. If anyone has any advice on fixing it would appreciate it.

[izzyknows]

57 minutes ago, Spectre5342 said:

There seem to be some issues with AAF Violate handing the player off to Raider Pet. It occured once earlier in the game but any later occurences Violate fails to pass it over in correct areas with bosses. The player can still trigger the quest manually by walking in unarmed so I think it is an issue on Violates end. I did use some console commands to check the status of the raider pet quests and they're logged as stopped with a few stages skipped but that doesn't seem abnormal many quests that I all ready completed show the same in console commands. Not sure why Violate isn't passing it over but suppose can retrigger it manually just pefer not to. For now gonna move it much lower in the load order and try again. I also loaded back to earlier saves and the FIRST Violate and Raider Pet occurence works fine but any 2nd one pet outcome just won't work maybe it is hung up somewhere on a stage in Raider Pet but I killed the boss and received xp and black widow perk so pretty sure the quest properly concluded. If anyone has any advice on fixing it would appreciate it.

Making sure the Boss, or their replacement has actually re-spawned and you're close enough for Violate to detect them. It's been awhile since I played Raider Pet, but it seems like with the replacement Bosses I had to have them actually load before Violate would detect them as a Boss. But it's been awhile.

[vaultbait]

56 minutes ago, izzyknows said:

Making sure the Boss, or their replacement has actually re-spawned and you're close enough for Violate to detect them. It's been awhile since I played Raider Pet, but it seems like with the replacement Bosses I had to have them actually load before Violate would detect them as a Boss. But it's been awhile.

 

Also no companions. Violate is more picky about that than RP.

[izzyknows]

11 hours ago, vaultbait said:

 

Also no companions. Violate is more picky about that than RP.

That's such a given I forgot about it. or I just forgot. Most likely the latter. LOL

[eflat01]

13 hours ago, izzyknows said:

Making sure the Boss, or their replacement has actually re-spawned and you're close enough for Violate to detect them. It's been awhile since I played Raider Pet, but it seems like with the replacement Bosses I had to have them actually load before Violate would detect them as a Boss. But it's been awhile.

 

Reminds me : I know when I was toying around with Violate/Raider's Pet, the second time I decided to pound the crap out of it so used D.B. Technical H.S. as the location... There are a ton of raiders in the place - is also a pretty large building.

 

1. Went there ran into the building, dragging the raiders outside in. Then ran around top floor a bit, jumped down to the auditorium then gave up. 

2. Had named raiders - I thought unusual because it was cleared a few times before.

3. Had a defined boss - named.

4. Passed to Raider Pet without a problem, and followed the boss down to the basement where the throne is by the swimming pool.

5. Once there, Immediately got attacked by the turrent and a few raiders.

 

I suppose they were not pulled by violate to the surrender area or it could be something in raider pet - not sure.

 

Second pass at it I made sure to run once through the second floor, first floor and basement before surrendering - all worked fine.

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by eflat01

[Spectre5342]

13 hours ago, izzyknows said:

Making sure the Boss, or their replacement has actually re-spawned and you're close enough for Violate to detect them. It's been awhile since I played Raider Pet, but it seems like with the replacement Bosses I had to have them actually load before Violate would detect them as a Boss. But it's been awhile.

Didn't even know replacement bosses was a thing I just went to a new area with a boss that's still alive can't seem to get it to trigger it just goes to the I need to retreat phase. But going back in later unarmed allows raider pet to trigger on its own just not through violate for some reason. I was planning on restarting though to redo some things and oddly enough the saves seem to have stopped loading indoors and outdoors so guess that files done. Will test it more thoroughly on a new save gonna remove a lot of junk too while I'm at it.

Is there anything with the load order where raider pet needs to be below violate or AAF itself to be working correctly? I do plan to move all the AAF and adult content lower in the load order always seems a good idea. Just the list of mods that demand be in the bottom of the load order goes on so best I can do is get it as low as I can.

Edited August 15, 2023 by Spectre5342

[izzyknows]

56 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

 

Reminds me : I know when I was toying around with Violate/Raider's Pet, the second time I decided to pound the crap out of it so used D.B. Technical H.S. as the location... There are a ton of raiders in the place - is also a pretty large building.

 

1. Went there ran into the building, dragging the raiders outside in. Then ran around top floor a bit, jumped down to the auditorium then gave up. 

2. Had named raiders - I thought unusual because it was cleared a few times before.

3. Had a defined boss - named.

4. Passed to Raider Pet without a problem, and followed the boss down to the basement where the throne is by the swimming pool.

5. Once there, Immediately got attacked by the turrent and a few raiders.

 

I suppose they were not pulled by violate to the surrender area or it could be something in raider pet - not sure.

 

Second pass at it I made sure to run once through the second floor, first floor and basement before surrendering - all worked fine.

 

Bosco is scripted as hostile, the trigger box is just inside the doors to the pool that makes the pool Raiders instantly hostile. By running though the pool area you tripped the trigger and once violate was done, the vanilla agro trigger was cleared.

[eflat01]

42 minutes ago, izzyknows said:

Bosco is scripted as hostile, the trigger box is just inside the doors to the pool that makes the pool Raiders instantly hostile. By running though the pool area you tripped the trigger and once violate was done, the vanilla agro trigger was cleared.

Thx, yes Bosco was dead a long time before hand... but I suppose the agro triggering remains for raiders spawned in that area?

 

Oh another QQ, and I suppose I know the answer would be to use something like HR to iron it out and I'd be using that if did not use Workshop Framework - screws up my settlement's sustainability. Spawn which attack settlements will sometimes surrender, especially the legendary due health, My game's settlers and settlements can be very brutal and of course just keep pounding on the poor raiders, gunners, etc... just kneeling with their arms up in the air. So, I end up mercy killing them, just to get the defend settlement x quest completed.  

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by eflat01

[izzyknows]

10 minutes ago, Spectre5342 said:

Didn't even know replacement bosses was a thing

Every location with a named Boss has a generic Boss replacement so when the cell resets it still has a Boss. The Boss is what triggers a location as being "cleared". 

Yeah, when things stop loading correctly the save has serious issues. LOL

[izzyknows]

3 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

Bosco was dead a long time before hand... but I suppose the agro triggering remains for raiders spawned in that area?

It respawns with a cell rest.

[Spectre5342]

1 hour ago, eflat01 said:

 

Reminds me : I know when I was toying around with Violate/Raider's Pet, the second time I decided to pound the crap out of it so used D.B. Technical H.S. as the location... There are a ton of raiders in the place - is also a pretty large building.

 

1. Went there ran into the building, dragging the raiders outside in. Then ran around top floor a bit, jumped down to the auditorium then gave up. 

2. Had named raiders - I thought unusual because it was cleared a few times before.

3. Had a defined boss - named.

4. Passed to Raider Pet without a problem, and followed the boss down to the basement where the throne is by the swimming pool.

5. Once there, Immediately got attacked by the turrent and a few raiders.

 

I suppose they were not pulled by violate to the surrender area or it could be something in raider pet - not sure.

 

Second pass at it I made sure to run once through the second floor, first floor and basement before surrendering - all worked fine.

 

Think issue for me was that I escaped by killing the boss but the task cozy up to the boss was still in the quest log. Like it got hung up on that stage any efforts to use console command didn't move it so gonna try it on a clean save quickly run through the first round of captivity then do it again. Just not sure why Violate wouldn't pick it up but the old fashioned manual way of Raider Pet still worked its a mystery. I'll try what you mentioned though if it has issues again. I may just move over to using Rse Abductions but having the movement range of a closet is kinda suckish maybe can try that stuff with raider pet integration to remove the movement penalties testing testing time

Edited August 15, 2023 by Spectre5342

[whodownloadedthis]

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