Animal Research: The Insatiable Scholar

[fakje]

3 minutes ago, killer905 said:

Well then you probably have an old version of Pandora that does not yet support Creature.

I will be honest with you. I have no idea what is wrong. The screenshot doesn't actually throw up an error, only that it started the animation. Unfortunately, but I can't help with your problem ;/.

Did some fiddling around, pandora felt like co-operating, so FNIS is gone now with regular animations working fine. I'll try re-installing the mod, then messing around with load orders. Maybe the next update will fix the problem unintentionally? One can only hope. Thanks for trying.

[killer905]

40 minutes ago, fakje said:

Did some fiddling around, pandora felt like co-operating, so FNIS is gone now with regular animations working fine. I'll try re-installing the mod, then messing around with load orders. Maybe the next update will fix the problem unintentionally? One can only hope. Thanks for trying.

Who knows, We see.

[Denial_fox_]

I have after installing the mod all the npcs are standing still, and the character moves like this

[killer905]

13 minutes ago, Denial_fox_ said:

I have after installing the mod all the npcs are standing still, and the character moves like this

You need build animations so you need run FNIS or Pandora.

[Gristle]

11 minutes ago, Denial_fox_ said:

I have after installing the mod all the npcs are standing still, and the character moves like this

That's the classic "T-pose". It usually means you need to run the "Generate FNIS for Users" program (assuming you're using FNIS). This mod doesn't add any animations (so shouldn't cause any T-posing), but perhaps you enabled or disabled another animation mod at the same time?

[Denial_fox_]

I ran it through FNIS again and it's still the same. 
is that supposed to be the case, by the way?

 

Edited January 29, 2025 by Denial_fox_

[killer905]

1 hour ago, Denial_fox_ said:

I ran it through FNIS again and it's still the same. 
is that supposed to be the case, by the way?

 

You need install SexLabAroused too

[eflat01]

2 hours ago, Denial_fox_ said:

I ran it through FNIS again and it's still the same. 
is that supposed to be the case, by the way?

 

 

I'd actually  recommend using OSL Aroused - Arousal Reborn (SSE & AE). 

[eflat01]

8 hours ago, killer905 said:

Well then you probably have an old version of Pandora that does not yet support Creature.

I will be honest with you. I have no idea what is wrong. The screenshot doesn't actually throw up an error, only that it started the animation. Unfortunately, but I can't help with your problem ;/.

 

Something suspiciously tells me it may somehow the combined use of FNIS and Pandora? I don't know maybe Sexlab is using Pandora set directories when the function is called although the log looks like it has a value 12 for the animation pair? I'm really very unsure on the SL call... it's been at least a decade since I looked in SL code. I know it needs an idle player.

 

Maybe this may help them? Over on Nexus I found this: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/133232 

 

.. a Pandora which supports creatures.

 

But the OP mentioned that the creature animations worked with the PC but not Tirwin, which of course really baffled me. 

 

Edit: Oh! That's exactly what it is... 

 

Sexlab will find the animation to play... that's actually was loaded from the json which was loaded via SL Loaded... so that function does not fail and finds the set.

 

That aside ... I have to really wonder what the game's meshes directories looks like?

 

i.e.

 

Data/meshes/actors/sabrecat/animations/Anubs Creature

 

make sure the Anub .hks files exist.

 

Then go over and look in the behaviors directory

 

Data/meshes/actors/sabrecat/behaviors

 

Since they ran FNIS all the creature behavior files generated will  be named like: 

 

FNIS_Anubs Creature_sabrecat_Behavior.hkx

 

That is likely why it's out of sight, right... least Pandora's? Remember one of these is doing the idle playing... I think FNIS uses a .pex to do so? 

 

So... Tirwin and Snowflake get positioned and remain stick figures until the end because it likely has no clue of the animation - Pandora's it's own system for behavior file generation and FNIS it's own. Sexlab will not throw an error because as far as it's concerned it's just an .hkx idle and as far as it's concerned - a stick figure is an default idle so goes on it's merry way. 

 

Edited January 29, 2025 by eflat01

[killer905]

27 minutes ago, eflat01 said:

 

Something suspiciously tells me it may somehow the combined use of FNIS and Pandora? I don't know maybe Sexlab is somehow hooking into Pandora when the function is called although the log looks like it has a value 12 for the animation pair? I'm really very unsure who'd win on the SL call... it's been least a decade since I looked in SL code.

 

Maybe this may help them? Over on Nexus I found this: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/133232 

 

.. a Pandora which supports creatures.

 

On my SE setup i remove FNIS and i installed Pandora. No problems...

[killer905]

2 hours ago, eflat01 said:

Edit: Oh! That's exactly what it is... 

 

Sexlab will find the animation to play... that's actually was loaded from the json which was loaded via SL Loaded... so that function does not fail and finds the set.

 

That aside ... I have to really wonder what the game's meshes directories looks like?

 

i.e.

 

Data/meshes/actors/sabrecat/animations/Anubs Creature

 

make sure the Anub .hks files exist.

 

Then go over and look in the behaviors directory

 

Data/meshes/actors/sabrecat/behaviors

 

Since they ran FNIS all the creature behavior files generated will  be named like: 

 

FNIS_Anubs Creature_sabrecat_Behavior.hkx

 

That is likely why it's out of sight, right... least Pandora's? Remember one of these is doing the idle playing... I think FNIS uses a .pex to do so? 

 

So... Tirwin and Snowflake get positioned and remain stick figures until the end because it likely has no clue of the animation - Pandora's it's own system for behavior file generation and FNIS it's own. Sexlab will not throw an error because as far as it's concerned it's just an .hkx idle and as far as it's concerned - a stick figure is an default idle so goes on it's merry way. 

 

I see you edit post... so i FNIS use khx files.

 

I personally checked my SE myself and well.... Pandora 2.6.0 has a bug where some creature animations are not loading correctly. The result? I had the wolf standing still (no animation) and Tirwin had an animation Installing version 2.4.0 fixed the problem :3

 

I have more and more reasons to stay on the LE version for the time being ^^

[eflat01]

1 hour ago, killer905 said:

I see you edit post... so i FNIS use khx files.

 

I personally checked my SE myself and well.... Pandora 2.6.0 has a bug where some creature animations are not loading correctly. The result? I had the wolf standing still (no animation) and Tirwin had an animation Installing version 2.4.0 fixed the problem :3

 

I have more and more reasons to stay on the LE version for the time being ^^

 

I'm still using FNIS XLLL ir whatever it is ;-), I'd been considering moving to Pandora... in the Pandora release I linked, they actually include a FNIS.esp and likely it's scripts, they may be patching into it to handle creatures, why I've no clue?  I had not installed it, I'm assuming however that the number of DLL's it's utilizing it's utilizing those to handle the general animations?

 

The old base game actually had very limited space for animation (idles). 

 

A lot of people assume Sexlab, Ostim, FG play animations but all they really are, are frameworks, they align and set up what to do but they really pass the buck to the FNIS, etc... They're not hard dependent in structure but that is why if you do not have any of those mods installed you just get those default stick-figure poses. (least what I recollect in the code a decade ago).

 

[fakje]

17 hours ago, killer905 said:

Who knows, We see.

Fixed the problem, it was this mod, Ostim to Sexlab. Removing it solved the issue. I suppose your mod got confused when it tried to start the animation, and just skipped it to stop there being a big blowup or something. I've had some issues with the mod before, should have guessed earlier, thanks for your time before lol

Edited January 30, 2025 by fakje

[killer905]

7 hours ago, eflat01 said:

 

I'm still using FNIS XLLL ir whatever it is ;-), I'd been considering moving to Pandora... in the Pandora release I linked, they actually include a FNIS.esp and likely it's scripts, they may be patching into it to handle creatures, why I've no clue?  I had not installed it, I'm assuming however that the number of DLL's it's utilizing it's utilizing those to handle the general animations?

 

The old base game actually had very limited space for animation (idles). 

 

A lot of people assume Sexlab, Ostim, FG play animations but all they really are, are frameworks, they align and set up what to do but they really pass the buck to the FNIS, etc... They're not hard dependent in structure but that is why if you do not have any of those mods installed you just get those default stick-figure poses. (least what I recollect in the code a decade ago).

 

wow

1 hour ago, fakje said:

Fixed the problem, it was this mod, Ostim to Sexlab. Removing it solved the issue. I suppose your mod got confused when it tried to start the animation, and just skipped it to stop there being a big blowup or something. I've had some issues with the mod before, should have guessed earlier, thanks for your time before lol

Good to know for the future ❤️

[killer905]

Small update:

The final quest is practically completed. It just needs the quest to be closed properly (so it doesn't hang in your log) and there will only be need a test added quests in this update. There are also a chance that some of the previous quests may have been broke up when trying to upgrade some things like removing the XXX message by the wolf or trolls where as (and as far as I remember) Tirwin finished first and then PC, the quest could not go any further. ❤️

 

Stay tuned or enjoy new update ❤️

[killer905]

Just a quick update from Gristle.

 

The end of the quest is done, but now Gristle back in the middle. He had to make a lot of changes to all the post-dog, pre-Solstheim quests to make the new system work right (Those who follow know what system :3 ), now Tirwin can now have a"cenzorship" after the dog qyest (Ragnar). Still getting some bugs out of that. Also, He made the Whiterun Khajiit camp appear when needed. It seems to work. I also replaced the bear/troll cave with a clone of the cave to avoid issues. The bear quest is tested and works. I still need to test the troll quest and redo the logic on the two troll sex stages. 

 

 

And here you have a bug that I never had in the game

https://drive.google.com/file/d/156WjKaxzB0gNEDQJP2iyi94NfeKF-NVH/view?usp=sharing

Edited February 2, 2025 by killer905

[eflat01]

6 hours ago, killer905 said:

Just a quick update from Gristle.

 

The end of the quest is done, but now Gristle back in the middle. He had to make a lot of changes to all the post-dog, pre-Solstheim quests to make the new system work right (Those who follow know what system :3 ), now Tirwin can now have a"cenzorship" after the dog qyest (Ragnar). Still getting some bugs out of that. Also, He made the Whiterun Khajiit camp appear when needed. It seems to work. I also replaced the bear/troll cave with a clone of the cave to avoid issues. The bear quest is tested and works. I still need to test the troll quest and redo the logic on the two troll sex stages. 

 

 

And here you have a bug that I never had in the game

https://drive.google.com/file/d/156WjKaxzB0gNEDQJP2iyi94NfeKF-NVH/view?usp=sharing

 

Looking forward to this... but this also makes me wonder if I should remove the mod, clean save and play through from the start again rather than picking up from where we left off?

 

Thinking back, In my play-throughs I only experienced a few bugs - if I called them that really.

 

I had nothing like the issues people reported they had with the cave. 

 

I figured I'd be buggy as hell due how much stress I generally put on the game. (I tend to run through every angle of a quest, reloading a save pre current quest and playing it over and over exhausting choices/dialog).

 

Below is the list of what I recalled finding, most I think were fixed in previous release? 

 

Spoiler

I figure by system you meant Tirwin's npc (hair change, chattiness, etc...).

 

1. The wolf key, picking it up before it appeared in the quest log ... solution was to put it back after the log entry appeared.

2. Khajiit - the mod had left dialog on Ri'saad - and could accidentally choose it well after the quest was complete which forced the PC and Ri'saad to end up at the sex maker even though they were in another hold. The SL animation would play then Ri'saad would start running back to the other camp.

3. Giant and Mammoth ... agro from nearby when bathing. This was due to there are random encounter spawn points close by (vanilla game). Just may mess up the dialog and actions needed to move on. 

 

 

 

Edited February 2, 2025 by eflat01

[killer905]

1 hour ago, eflat01 said:

 

Looking forward to this... but this also makes me wonder if I should remove the mod, clean save and play through from the start again rather than picking up from where we left off?

 

Thinking back, In my play-throughs I only experienced a few bugs - if I called them that really.

 

I had nothing like the issues people reported they had with the cave. 

 

I figured I'd be buggy as hell due how much stress I generally put on the game. (I tend to run through every angle of a quest, reloading a save pre current quest and playing it over and over exhausting choices/dialog).

 

Below is the list of what I recalled finding, most I think were fixed in previous release? 

 

  Hide contents

I figure by system you meant Tirwin's npc (hair change, chattiness, etc...).

 

1. The wolf key, picking it up before it appeared in the quest log ... solution was to put it back after the log entry appeared.

2. Khajiit - the mod had left dialog on Ri'saad - and could accidentally choose it well after the quest was complete which forced the PC and Ri'saad to end up at the sex maker even though they were in another hold. The SL animation would play then Ri'saad would start running back to the other camp.

3. Giant and Mammoth ... agro from nearby when bathing. This was due to there are random encounter spawn points close by (vanilla game). Just may mess up the dialog and actions needed to move on. 

 

 

 

To be honest, I don't see the need to start from scratch but on the other hand it will allow new or old mistakes to be found. The decision is yours! 

 

Your dimension, your Tirwin ❤️

 

When I write ‘system’, it doesn't actually refer to hair change or chattiness etc, but it was mentioned on the forum what it would be and there was a video of the system working.

 

Looking at TO DO lists, these are not mentioned, but may be fixed in the next version. 

1 is actually a post I saw.

2 is just to add some sort of requirement so that after a task there is no longer an option.

3 it's unlikely to do much to prevent this, but resuming the conversation needs to be added.

[leking]

5 hours ago, killer905 said:

 

2 is just to add some sort of requirement so that after a task there is no longer an option.

 

 

In  my opinion it would be nice to have some kind of unlockable repeatable task with the khajit camp after the quest.

 

Like they could propose you to be their dog bitch again in exchange for money. With nice fetish voice dialogues.

 

Yes in animal mansion you have this kind of quest but it is not up to date and probably never will.

 

the khajit camp in the base game and most of mods have no real purpose. Giving it a little love to enhance its activities would be nice

Edited February 3, 2025 by leking

[killer905]

1 hour ago, leking said:

In  my opinion it would be nice to have some kind of unlockable repeatable task with the khajit camp after the quest.

The problem with Khajiits is that they travel, and so the dialogue will end up with the sex being in Whiterun and you being in Markarth. And the teleport cycle as it is so far. Unless there is a way to make one dialogue start the sex depending on whether you are in Whiterun or Markarth. Thing to check.

 

1 hour ago, leking said:

Like they could propose you to be their dog bitch again in exchange for money. With nice fetish voice dialogues.

For money? That doesn't fit very well, because Tirwin as if you don't look from a wealthy family, and so I can afford all sorts of things without degrading myself to such a thing. But for PC as an option it would already be ok.

 

1 hour ago, leking said:

Yes in animal mansion you have this kind of quest but it is not up to date and probably never will.

In truth, I had the idea of reviving Animal Mansion. There are currently 3 different versions (there used to be 4, but one has disappeared), but personally I would bet on AM+. Only you would practically have to check the whole mod and write down what to change, what to knock out, what to add, what to fix etc. I myself even had some ideas of what to add, change etc. but currently Gristle has 4 other mods on hand that also need attention. Will it be revived? We'll see.

Note:
Animal Mansion will be 10 years old this year! Counting from the last update, and 11 years from the first version.

 

1 hour ago, leking said:

the khajit camp in the base game and most of mods have no real purpose. Giving it a little love to enhance its activities would be nice

Once naked golden ass showing cats is enough, don't you think? :3

[Gristle]

7 hours ago, leking said:

In  my opinion it would be nice to have some kind of unlockable repeatable task with the khajit camp after the quest.

There are several places in the mod where repeatable events could be added. The horse could remain, the sabre cat could be re-summoned, the bear could be revisited. This will probably be done in the next pass, as I -- and I'm sure killer905 too -- would like to get the next version out very soon.  The next version adds quite a bit: 7 new creatures, 4 new locations, 1 new spell, several new NPCs, more Tirwin configuration options, a Tirwin outfit system, more Tirwin location awareness, and other surprises.  It also redoes Graywinter Watch (no more bear/troll fights) and makes the Khajiit stay at Whiterun for the quest so you don't have to wait days or chase them down. And it makes Tirwin run faster.

5 hours ago, killer905 said:

The problem with Khajiits is that they travel, and so the dialogue will end up with the sex being in Whiterun and you being in Markarth. And the teleport cycle as it is so far. Unless there is a way to make one dialogue start the sex depending on whether you are in Whiterun or Markarth. Thing to check.

Risaad does say (randomly) that he's looking forward to telling Madran, so I imagine all the Khajiit caravans will soon learn.  Also, there's no need to set a location for the sex animation. That's frequently done in order to set up a desired scene with other actors or to avoid having sex on a dead body or clipping through something. But it's not needed. The animation can just happen where the PC is standing.

Edited February 3, 2025 by Gristle

[killer905]

5 hours ago, Gristle said:

Risaad does say (randomly) that he's looking forward to telling Madran, so I imagine all the Khajiit caravans will soon learn.  Also, there's no need to set a location for the sex animation. That's frequently done in order to set up a desired scene with other actors or to avoid having sex on a dead body or clipping through something. But it's not needed. The animation can just happen where the PC is standing.

Yes, but it can lead to a situation where PC or Tirwin do sex in the middle of the road. For example, in front of Solitude.

[Dumuzi]

1 hour ago, killer905 said:

Yes, but it can lead to a situation where PC or Tirwin do sex in the middle of the road. For example, in front of Solitude.

 

I wouldn't mind the option of having Tirwin get at least somewhat more corrupted over time. Either through PC influence or the whole experience of it all. I mean it's already happening to some extent. But a slow progression to finally being ok with engaging in public would not be unheard of. That may not be the direction you want to take though, and I respect that.

[killer905]

21 minutes ago, Dumuzi said:

 

I wouldn't mind the option of having Tirwin get at least somewhat more corrupted over time. Either through PC influence or the whole experience of it all. I mean it's already happening to some extent. But a slow progression to finally being ok with engaging in public would not be unheard of. That may not be the direction you want to take though, and I respect that.

True, but remember she is from a family that is under Thalmor's watch. So one big mistake by her and her family = death, and in public. In addition, she is a pure blood elf, so Thalmor is very protective of the purity of others and they punish very much those who break this infection of copulation with other races and not pure blood High Elves.

[Dumuzi]

54 minutes ago, killer905 said:

True, but remember she is from a family that is under Thalmor's watch. So one big mistake by her and her family = death, and in public. In addition, she is a pure blood elf, so Thalmor is very protective of the purity of others and they punish very much those who break this infection of copulation with other races and not pure blood High Elves.

 

No doubt, it makes sense. Though that is the insidious nature of corruption. Leading us to take risks we would have thought unthinkable previously. It sounds like it's mainly out of fear of retribution than ideals that she holds herself. Else she would not be on this path to begin with. Perhaps with the consideration of PC protection and/or her own growing in power, she might let loose that fear over time. Or it may always have a grip on her. Either way makes sense.