Submissive Lola: The Resubmission LE/SE

[HexBolt8]

Regarding Devious Devices 5

 

I've been talking about requiring DD5 for many months.  I'd intended for the second digit in the version number (e,g., 2.0.43) to increment when the mod requires DD5, but we're up to version 43 and that still hasn't happened.  I've been holding off until DD5 matures.  When DD 5.2 officially releases (it's currently in beta), that will be the point.  5.2 offers some nice new things, and it will come in a 20% smaller download.  Other major mods, such as Laura's Bondage Shop, already require DD5.  I want to do things here that make use of DD5's improved speed & efficiency.  One of the items on my to-do list is an optional basic device unlock system.  Your owner has been taking your keys, so it's fitting to use them on a clumsy or unlucky slave who needs help.

[bubba999]

I just want to thank you for the latest update, HexBolt8! Now SLUTS Redux is incorporated in submissive game play instead of just tacked on. I like to unlock fast travel to each city by hauling a load of cargo there first and this just works. Thank you!

 

One note, you may want to mention that players should go to the Mod Integration page and refresh it so that it finds SLUTS. Not going to work otherwise!

[Anunya]

Interesting... I'd kind of ignored SLUTS, but I might give it a spin now.

[Anunya]

Question for people: what defeat set-up do you use with SubLola? I feel like if your character is a SubLola slave and you get defeated, your master shouldn't get abused but there should be some sort of negative consequence for you. But I haven't found the right combination of mods and settings to have that play out completely satisfactorily. What do you do?

[Snook001]

On 10/25/2021 at 10:11 PM, HexBolt8 said:

Regarding Devious Devices 5

 

I've been talking about requiring DD5 for many months.  I'd intended for the second digit in the version number (e,g., 2.0.43) to increment when the mod requires DD5, but we're up to version 43 and that still hasn't happened.  I've been holding off until DD5 matures.  When DD 5.2 officially releases (it's currently in beta), that will be the point.  5.2 offers some nice new things, and it will come in a 20% smaller download.  Other major mods, such as Laura's Bondage Shop, already require DD5.  I want to do things here that make use of DD5's improved speed & efficiency.  One of the items on my to-do list is an optional basic device unlock system.  Your owner has been taking your keys, so it's fitting to use them on a clumsy or unlucky slave who needs help.

Hey,

 

There is also "Toys" you may want to look at.  I'm not too familiar with it myself, but from the description it could be an alternative.

 

Keep up the good work, and thanks for the last update

 

[CaptainJ03]

After being enslaved from DFC, I submitted to my Mistress again as Lola, and was happy to find that my last Submission Score was still valid.

Was not too fond to find that the changes that DFC had made to the MCM (or most probably this mod as a reaction on being enslaved via DFC) were still there, especially those that had been greyed out during slavery.

(still playing on 2.0.43)

 

2 hours ago, Snook001 said:

There is also "Toys" you may want to look at.  I'm not too familiar with it myself, but from the description it could be an alternative.

Those toys are only interesting if you are in the I-hate-Kimy faction. If you are not, DDs are the far better choice.

[Talesien]

3 hours ago, Snook001 said:

 

There is also "Toys" you may want to look at.  I'm not too familiar with it myself, but from the description it could be an alternative.

 

I agree that Toys is great and at least to me it seems to work a lot more smoothly than DD5.1, creating next to no script lag. I would love seeing SLTR using Toys rather then DD5. I doubt that it is feasible though. Changing a massive mod like SLTR to a completely new devices API is no small task. In an ideal world with good scripting tools perhaps, but with CreationKit?


PS: Anyone ever noticed how similar SL:TR is to TL;DR? I wonder ... ^^

[Herowynne]

9 hours ago, Anunya said:

Question for people: what defeat set-up do you use with SubLola? I feel like if your character is a SubLola slave and you get defeated, your master shouldn't get abused but there should be some sort of negative consequence for you. But I haven't found the right combination of mods and settings to have that play out completely satisfactorily. What do you do?

I use Sexlab Defeat. I believe it has a “Follower Collateral” option that can be turned off.

[Pyreliter]

On 10/25/2021 at 9:11 PM, HexBolt8 said:

One of the items on my to-do list is an optional basic device unlock system.  Your owner has been taking your keys, so it's fitting to use them on a clumsy or unlucky slave who needs help.

I've been enjoying my usage of 'Devious Device Helpers" while adventuring with your SL:TR, as it provides a nice synergy of Mistress/Master holding all the keys and Lola having to ask for their removal of devices when necessary. Perhaps you can start off with a mechanic hook (status check) that regulates how likely Mistress/Master will unlock based upon submission score, days remaining in contract, or location.

 

[CaptainJ03]

Uh-oh, I think I found a bug.

At the moment Lola enjoys wearing her catsuit straightjacket, and as she doesn't have her hands free, there are some other devices locked on her.

Now we went swimming in that fjord near Solitude, Mistress has ideas about putting me in a rope harness - which would be fine, if I wasn't wearing some other corset. No hands free, not sure if I even had a key for the corset to unlock that and don the rope harness, but I got zapped to death for not wearing it before we even reached the shore. Not fair.

 

The Lights Out miniquest has this safety catch. I did not get zapped for keping the blindfold on during late hours (asked my follower via DDH to do so) and the next morning I was still bound and the blindfold was automatically equipped after the first(?) warning.

[HexBolt8]

7 hours ago, Snook001 said:

There is also "Toys" you may want to look at.

This mod uses Devious Devices and recognizes Zaz devices.  Supporting a third device framework wouldn't be practical.  DD is woven throughout the mod.  Many of the dialog and quest conditions check DD keywords, and when applying animations it checks that heavy restraints aren't equipped.  To do that in a practical manner, DD has to be a required master.  If Toys has some interesting new devices, hopefully something similar will make its way into DD and be used here.

 

Personally, I haven't noticed any DD script lag during normal game play.  Obviously, there's a significant delay when equipping & unequipping devices, but that should improve when DD5's streamlined functions can be used.  As a guess, players experiencing script lag might have devices equipped on NPCs, or be using custom devices from third party mods that might not be designed to be efficient.  Just my own experience and speculation.

 

4 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Was not too fond to find that the changes that DFC had made to the MCM (or most probably this mod as a reaction on being enslaved via DFC) were still there, especially those that had been greyed out during slavery.

Which changes?  If it's the pre-enslavement settings, that's intentional, since it's a real enslavement even if DFC started it.

 

2 hours ago, Pyreliter said:

I've been enjoying my usage of 'Devious Device Helpers" while adventuring with your SL:TR, as it provides a nice synergy of Mistress/Master holding all the keys and Lola having to ask for their removal of devices when necessary.

It's because of mods like that, that I've held off on duplicating that functionality (and DD Helpers goes further with Play Time).  DD Helpers is a good companion mod for this one.  I haven't tested it with SLTR though to discover whether the keys that SLTR transfers to the owner are actually useable by DD Helpers, since that mod uses a "key ring" to store keys safely beyond a naughty slave's reach.  Anyway, the suggestion had been made more than once that if SLTR has a basic unlock feature, then players could save a mod slot.

 

2 hours ago, Pyreliter said:

Perhaps you can start off with a mechanic hook (status check) that regulates how likely Mistress/Master will unlock based upon submission score, days remaining in contract, or location.

Those are good ideas for configuration settings, thanks!

 

2 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

No hands free, not sure if I even had a key for the corset to unlock that and don the rope harness, but I got zapped to death for not wearing it before we even reached the shore.

Hmm, yeah it's not checking for a worn corset.  I didn't realize that those conflict.  I'll add a check for corsets.  Were any other devices conflicting with the harness?

 

Edit:  Okay, rope harnesses and corsets are mutually exclusive because they both use slot 58.  I think I just have to add the corset keyword check.  Thank you for reporting this problem, CaptainJ03.

 

2 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

I did not get zapped for keping the blindfold on during late hours (asked my follower via DDH to do so) and the next morning I was still bound and the blindfold was automatically equipped after the first(?) warning.

Because you have to be able to remove & reequip the blindfold yourself depending on time of day, the mod uses DD's unlocked version of the blindfold (similar to Zaz devices).  If a locking blindfold gets equipped during the quest, that complicating matters.  I remember trying to handle situations like that, but I don't recall the details other than I didn't want the player to get punished if another mod locks on a real blindfold.  Do you believe that something went wrong during Lights Out (something that should be fixed), or were you just commenting on the unusual situation?

Edited October 27, 2021 by HexBolt8

[HexBolt8]

12 hours ago, Anunya said:

what defeat set-up do you use with SubLola? I feel like if your character is a SubLola slave and you get defeated, your master shouldn't get abused but there should be some sort of negative consequence for you.

I take the different view that although the owner has great power over the PC, the owner is just another victim in a defeat.  So I have follower collateral turned on.  It makes for interesting storytelling possibilities.  The owner would be deeply humiliated, so I might manually start a long round of forced prostitution whenever the party is safely back in a town ("since you liked fucking bandits so much").  I also might use a defeat as a point of change.  If I'm getting bored with that owner, I might switch owners after a Simple Slavery outcome and dismiss the former follower, playing it as the previous owner was killed or carried off to an unknown fate.  If I later regret that decision, then the original owner escapes, forcibly reclaims Lola, and sends the new owner away (or makes that follower a submissive playmate).  There are a lot of story possibilities if the owner is defeated.

 

In regard to negative consequences, I have a note in my list of possible features for some reaction to owner bleedout or owner rape.  But that has two problems.  First, it's on the edge of the scope for a submissive slave mod.  If you're being kept as a pleasure slave, is it your fault if the party is defeated?  Of course, masters are free to be unreasonable and blame you anyway.  The second problem is the inability to evaluate the situation.  If a bleedout occurs it's clearly from combat, but if you go on to win the battle then was that a big deal?  After all, if your won then you were doing your duty while the owner was helpless.  On the other hand, if you lose and trigger a defeat mod (and SL Defeat isn't the only one), it's probably too late to have the owner punish you if you're both captives.  Likewise for owner rape.  If it's in town, whose fault is that?  You're the one wearing a collar.  If it's after a defeat, what can the owner do to you as a prisoner?  You could lose score, but this didn't happen through lack of submissiveness, so that seems inappropriate.

 

So the idea still sits there on my list, and in my games I just make up a punishment if it seems fitting.  I'm open to suggestions, but with the difficulty of doing this right, I've never figured out what to do.

Edited October 27, 2021 by HexBolt8

[Herowynne]

10 minutes ago, HexBolt8 said:

I take the different view that although the owner has great power over the PC, the owner is just another victim in a defeat.  So I have follower collateral turned on.  It makes for interesting storytelling possibilities. 

 

Yes, I agree. I like to roleplay on a character-by-character basis whether or not it makes sense for the follower to also be defeated.

 

If I am playing with a regular human or mer follower, then it can make sense for the follower to also be defeated.

 

On the other hand, if I am playing with a magical follower, such as a daedra, spriggan, minotaur, or vampire, then I typically roleplay that the follower is okay with the bandits having their way with my player character, and the bandits just ignore the magical follower.

[CaptainJ03]

1 hour ago, HexBolt8 said:

Which changes?  If it's the pre-enslavement settings, that's intentional, since it's a real enslavement even if DFC started it.

Yes, the kept forever etc... score were set to some values that weren't mine. A bit later I realised that I could have reloaded my settings file.

 

1 hour ago, HexBolt8 said:

Hmm, yeah it's not checking for a worn corset.  I didn't realize that those conflict.  I'll add a check for corsets.  Were any other devices conflicting with the harness?

 

Edit:  Okay, rope harnesses and corsets are mutually exclusive because they both use slot 58.  I think I just have to add the corset keyword check.  Thank you for reporting this problem, CaptainJ03.

Yes, corset and (rope) harness use the same slot.

 

1 hour ago, HexBolt8 said:

Because you have to be able to remove & reequip the blindfold yourself depending on time of day, the mod uses DD's unlocked version of the blindfold (similar to Zaz devices).  If a locking blindfold gets equipped during the quest, that complicating matters.  I remember trying to handle situations like that, but I don't recall the details other than I didn't want the player to get punished if another mod locks on a real blindfold.  Do you believe that something went wrong during Lights Out (something that should be fixed), or were you just commenting on the unusual situation?

Lola had a locked blindfold already equipped when the Lights Out event started. I used this as an example where your checks do the right thing, as not punishing Lola for things she can't do anything about.

 

[HexBolt8]

3 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Yes, the kept forever etc... score were set to some values that weren't mine. A bit later I realised that I could have reloaded my settings file.

Ah, okay, I see that 3 MCM settings are intentionally changed when enslavement from DF starts, but I didn't think about setting them back afterwards.  I can save and restore the settings for kept above and below score.  The kept forever toggle gets turned off (since this is intended to be a temporary punishment), but I will leave this one off because you retain most or all of your score if you if get enslaved again, and it would be bad if the kept forever situation were to trigger right away.

 

3 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Yes, corset and (rope) harness use the same slot.

Fixed now for the next update.

[HexBolt8]

35 minutes ago, RickHunter said:

I select a buyer, disable all other SS endings. then the auction ends, and I get a text box saying "submissive lola is already running".

Simple Slavery is not detecting that you have a recent enough version of this mod that has SS integration, so it assumes that you're using the original legacy Submissive Lola, and since the mod is already running, there's nothing more that SS can do.

 

As to why it's not detecting a recent version of this mod, are you using Simple Slavery ++, or an older version?  Versions before SS++ are only aware of the legacy version of Submissive Lola.  Do you have an up to date version of SKSE installed?  Are you launching the game from Steam, or from a launcher that supports SKSE (using skse_loader.exe)?

Edited October 28, 2021 by HexBolt8

[HexBolt8]

34 minutes ago, RickHunter said:

I installed plus plus over plus, but i have no idea if it worked or not. i updated in the middle of a playthrough after the quest had started though. do you think that could be the culprit?

The problem suggests (but does not prove) that your Simple Slavery ++ scripts are outdated, possibly left over from SS+.  Since you also reported problems in the SS++ discussion, it seems likely that something went wrong with your SS++ installation.  That's about all I can say on that.

 

For what it's worth, this did inspire me to add a separate check for SS++ to this mod's MCM.  The auction buyer settings will be hidden for players who have older versions of SS to avoid confusion.  That's coming in the next update.  However, it's a very simple test of one thing in the SS esp file, so "finding" SS++ won't necessarily indicate a good installation, it will just catch an obviously older version that doesn't support the auction buyer.  It's better than nothing.

[kraigpdx]

Is there any plan to let male pc's do Pony Runs in future versions?

 

I was able to do them with a pervious version of Submissive Lola but none of the current versions. It is possible that I was able to do the Pony Runs due to an error but it would still be nice to see that implemented. I understand that I still wouldn't be able to use the SLUTS integration. 

[HexBolt8]

1 hour ago, kraigpdx said:

Is there any plan to let male pc's do Pony Runs in future versions?

I have that blocked because the event is designed only for females, in turn because the pony gear doesn't work as well for males.  (This is also the reason given for SLUTS blocking males.)  This let me make some simplifications in the dialog (you're always "pony girl" or "filly") and the events.  It tries to respect PC gender preference, but stable masters are all male.  It's just not a good fit for men, so they're excluded to ensure that the event works well.  I do try to have a variety of events, most of which are open to all characters.

[Aldid]

On 10/27/2021 at 7:29 PM, Herowynne said:

 

Yes, I agree. I like to roleplay on a character-by-character basis whether or not it makes sense for the follower to also be defeated.

 

If I am playing with a regular human or mer follower, then it can make sense for the follower to also be defeated.

 

On the other hand, if I am playing with a magical follower, such as a daedra, spriggan, minotaur, or vampire, then I typically roleplay that the follower is okay with the bandits having their way with my player character, and the bandits just ignore the magical follower.

I tend to think of it as the Owner somehow managing to convince the bandits to leave her alone by sacrificing her slave. I'll admit it doesn't make that much sense ("why don't the bandits just have their way with both?"), but I like the thought of the Owner just sending Lola off to be ravaged while she sits down and relaxes.

[Majin Buu]

Quote

New:  Road Trip (forced S.L.U.T.S. runs)
- Works with SLUTS Redux or Resume (refresh the MCM Mod Integration page).  Females only.

What is Resume? Can someone link to the page for it?

[HexBolt8]

36 minutes ago, Majin Buu said:

What is Resume? Can someone link to the page for it?

Here

[Naps-On-Dirt]

I just had Clean Sweep trigger in the Archmage's quarters when I went up there to meet with Quaranir, well before those are my quarters. 

[Dreamer1986]

Do you have some good male follower mod suggestion that work great with Lola? 

Edited October 29, 2021 by Dreamer1986

[CaptainJ03]

No bug today, but an oddity.

Mistress wanted to have a home-cooked meal (on the street somewhere between Robbers Gorge and Rorikstead) but was picky and complained about too much salt, after I gave her the meal. I got punished and ran along... but Mistress kept standing there, waiting for me. The Stewing Mistress wasn't finished - if that was intended, the message didn't come across. I gave her another meal, which she liked a litte better, the quest finished properly - but I had to tell her explicitly to follow me.

Papyruslog didn't show anything conspicious.