Devious Followers - Continued

[Lupine00]

3 hours ago, aspirine2 said:

many thanks for the support... where is the enslavement threshold submenu ...pc is a slave forgot to mention that ...the follower is angry...bud didn't discard the slave or throw pc in the Falmer pit !?

If your a slave, debt generally only increases due to punishments.

That just means you never get free, because to be free, you need to pay off the debt.

 

If you're a slave, the follower randomly sticks stuff on you, and tries to enforce and replace missing items.

 

Is the problem that the follower does not replace slave mittens/collar/boots if you somehow remove them?

They shouldn't be a concern in a dungeon, but once you leave, the follower should replace them.

 

The follower may put other chains on your too, but it's sort of arbitrary.

 

TBH, slavery has limits as a mechanic in DF, so if you push it too far, you can get away with a lot.

The alternative is to act like SD+, where you end up trapped in a room, in 27 devices, starved, dehydrated, and constantly raped.

 

DF wants to let you play the game, so it doesn't do really oppressive things.

If you want really oppressive things, add in SD+ and then enslave yourself into it when you think you deserve it  

I have used it myself for that, and it ... sort of ... works without catastrophic conflicts. Mostly.

[Buridan]

16 hours ago, Anunya said:

Whether this is a deal or a just a general setting doesn't matter to me, but making it a deal if the player character doesn't have any healing spells would be kind of mean - though I suppose keeping the follower in healing potions could work if there's a way for the DF to use them.

A few ways to solve this, I think. Could do it like NFF, which automatically gives followers a healing spell if you set their role to "healer". Or could do it like how the DF "helps out" with Frostfall, or even just have the DF give out a healing spell tome on request in exchange for debt.

 

RE: the time thing, what about pegging it to in-game time instead of real time (i.e. two in-game hours instead of one real-life minute)?

[aspirine2]

17 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

If your a slave, debt generally only increases due to punishments.

That just means you never get free, because to be free, you need to pay off the debt.

 

If you're a slave, the follower randomly sticks stuff on you, and tries to enforce and replace missing items.

 

Is the problem that the follower does not replace slave mittens/collar/boots if you somehow remove them?

They shouldn't be a concern in a dungeon, but once you leave, the follower should replace them.

 

The follower may put other chains on your too, but it's sort of arbitrary.

 

TBH, slavery has limits as a mechanic in DF, so if you push it too far, you can get away with a lot.

The alternative is to act like SD+, where you end up trapped in a room, in 27 devices, starved, dehydrated, and constantly raped.

 

DF wants to let you play the game, so it doesn't do really oppressive things.

If you want really oppressive things, add in SD+ and then enslave yourself into it when you think you deserve it  

I have used it myself for that, and it ... sort of ... works without catastrophic conflicts. Mostly.

brilliant ..many thanks ..then my mod works perfectly ...only asking about that old option about the follower dumping the heroine into the falmer pit ...does it still exist !?

[aspirine2]

back in the early versions Stenvar was buggy with this mod ..does this still happen !?...still wondering if the falmer pit is removed !?..

 

 

many thanks in advance 

[Lupine00]

On 11/18/2020 at 6:22 PM, aspirine2 said:

...does it still exist

Yes. It does. It was also "fixed" a bit so the devices are more reliable (though not perfect), and updated, so you get more bounties when it happens, so it's more severe.

 

IIRC, this happens in the case where you have been in deep debt too long. I believe you have to cross a time threshold.

I don't think it happens for slaves, only for "endless mode".

 

It's been so long that I'd have to check to be sure, but there's an option in the MCM, and I think that says what causes it.

[slvsaris]

When enslaved and traveling around, are the devices that end up on the player from the follower supposed to be removed when leaving a "city"?  Currently crawled all the way out of Whiterun and entered South Brittleshin pass and they are still on.  Would make sense to me that the follower remove the restricting items such as the mittens and boots when leaving the safe places.  The should always stay on.  The follower is the one with the keys after all :), and the player can only box with the mittens on lol.

[Lupine00]

12 hours ago, slvsaris said:

When enslaved and traveling around, are the devices that end up on the player from the follower supposed to be removed when leaving a "city"?

No, they aren't. You are stuck crawling around the world for  your follower's amusement.

The magic mittens should allow you to fight in any major battle, such as a dragon attack.

The follower will not punish you for standing up to fight.

 

The mittens and boots will be removed only in dungeons. Even then you will have to ask.

 

The follower may put other restraints on you if they get in a bad mood in the dungeon.

Those will (obviously) not be removed in dungeons, they can be removed if you reach a town.

[silveredgold]

I seem to have broken my Devious Followers install, and hoping someone can either help me fix or point me towards how to debug it. 

I'm using DFC 2.12.2 with NFF 2.7.3 (latest SLE) and everything is acting like it should be working. The MCM is set up, and correctly shows an NFF follower (when I have one) in the Other Mod Settings menu, but none of the DFC dialog options are there and there's nothing from DFC when I recruit/dismiss followers. I've tried both the Repair Follower and Reset buttons in the MCM (no change), and I've double-checked that DFC is loading after NFF (it is).

 

This is happening both to existing saves and new starts (for either custom followers or vanilla). Anyone have any idea what I should try next or how to isolate the problem (or info I should have given)?

[Lupine00]

38 minutes ago, silveredgold said:

I seem to have broken my Devious Followers install, and hoping someone can either help me fix or point me towards how to debug it. 

Most likely you have overwritten DF scripts with NFF scripts. It needs to be the other way around.

[silveredgold]

4 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Most likely you have overwritten DF scripts with NFF scripts. It needs to be the other way around.

Thanks for the tip. I just checked and the only files from DF being overwritten are `_STA_SpankUtil.pex` and `_STA_SpankUtil.psc` being overwritten from Spank That Ass (honestly not sure what order those two are supposed to be in). DFC's plugin is also loading after NFF (they're the second and third last plugins in the order).

 

Anything else I can check on that might help tracking this down?

EDIT: is there a specific version of NFF I should be using or should the latest work?

[Lupine00]

4 hours ago, silveredgold said:

EDIT: is there a specific version of NFF I should be using or should the latest work?

Any issue that is reproducible on all new games is an installation issue.

 

It's always possible that latest NFF has broken things, but it was OK with versions before the Oct 1 version.

Maybe try an older version. Also see what happens if don't install everything from NFF, as it's full of (way too many?) features, some of which are a bit marginal.

Stick to the core components until you have something working.

 

If you have new STA, it should overwrite DF's files.

 

Is it possible you recently installed some other mod that is blocking idles?

 

Have you tried the Debug option to force a follower to be a DF?

 

DF is sensitive only to file overwrites with NFF. It doesn't matter so much about the ESP.

If you have MO, check you don't have some basic mistake, like files in a wrong directory, or duplicate mods, or stuff in Overwrite, or an ESP that got unticked.

[Baltasarr80]

You can say in DA that if you are in bleedout you follower if also defeated could get killed or dismissed so it is already with this addon possible. I dont know right out of my mind because right now dcl 9.0 is not out i dont play at the moment ... but i know that DA works with Sanguine debauchery perhaps also with simple slavery? like i said dont play right now

[Meladiator]

I have a request, I personally love the hell out of this mod, even if it is bugged sometimes in my 10 year old pc with a script heavy game (my fault). I feel like a bit more flavor could be added though (instead of pure bondage, make it seriously more slave like, where it isn't bondage anymore, it's torture, and you're fucked), perhaps as an optional update or mcm option to make latter deals much more intrusive, just just consider this post ideas/requests:


Perhaps some level 4 deals?

A deal where you are required to give your master some type of sex once a day.

Evolved the cum covering deal to require all times, not just in cities, and you must cover yourself instead (of course, requiring sex) instead of your follower doing it for you.

A deal where you are required to have sex with an animal when your follower see's a friendly one and points it out (similar to the hand on shoulder).

Add a vaginal plug to the plug deal, instead of just butt plug, to bell butt plug, to sign butt plug.

Make the plug deals require much more intensive, requiring much more harsh plugs in latter deals, such as the shocking one.

Maybe incorporate the inflatable plug as a deal, and your follower sometimes pumps them at random, non combat times. Maybe expand it a little, to where your arousal perhaps increases to maximum (to the 80% addicted level) or you take damage from it.

Perhaps make willpower to be able to go negative, to where it goes from instead of being a helpless slave that cant resist, to being an obedient, mindless one, with permanent debuffs if you don't handle yourself and your willpower.

A deal where your follower has rough sex with you every time you try to rest, giving your follower some of their lives back, while you don't actually get any sleeping buff (Should have given it to them when you had the chance).

Maybe some more soft deals, like indentured servitude based, where you work for the follower instead of the follower working for you. Maybe an option (requires maximum resistance and/or willpower) where you can make smaller payments, like a loan, to your follower to pay off the debt, or instead find valuable items, particularly gems and extremely high quality weapons or armor (Value/weight > 500).

Perhaps a deal that includes more serious bondage related items, perhaps a custom item that will slowly drain the attributes and stats of the player (until death) until they do a certain thing for a follower. Perhaps so long as this deal is active, they can't accumulate more debt? Perhaps a faster way to finish their contract?

Another permanently disabling effect, one that comes from the follower instead of a random npc? Perhaps if your willpower reaches too low, it's stuck there forever, where you're quite literally nothing but an obedient, worthless slave. Soft tie in to STA, where your character makes actual dialogue to force themselves into a deal, to keep them stuck in deals forever. Maybe a small quest tie in to remove this effect? Perhaps it's magic?


I love this mod, it is absolutely one of my favorites, especially when using a follower like Buxom Wench Yuriana as a futa Master, and having her force my charcter around in helpless bondage! Not trying to stall any work with this, but just some ideas, I have some modding experience, but very little coding experience, so I'm sure some of this could actually be done if you can be bothered by it lol. Love your work! Absolutely wonderful!

 

[Baltasarr80]

4 hours ago, Meladiator said:

I have a request, I personally love the hell out of this mod, even if it is bugged sometimes in my 10 year old pc with a script heavy game (my fault). I feel like a bit more flavor could be added though (instead of pure bondage, make it seriously more slave like, where it isn't bondage anymore, it's torture, and you're fucked), perhaps as an optional update or mcm option to make latter deals much more intrusive, just just consider this post ideas/requests:


Perhaps some level 4 deals?

A deal where you are required to give your master some type of sex once a day.

Evolved the cum covering deal to require all times, not just in cities, and you must cover yourself instead (of course, requiring sex) instead of your follower doing it for you.

A deal where you are required to have sex with an animal when your follower see's a friendly one and points it out (similar to the hand on shoulder).

Add a vaginal plug to the plug deal, instead of just butt plug, to bell butt plug, to sign butt plug.

Make the plug deals require much more intensive, requiring much more harsh plugs in latter deals, such as the shocking one.

Maybe incorporate the inflatable plug as a deal, and your follower sometimes pumps them at random, non combat times. Maybe expand it a little, to where your arousal perhaps increases to maximum (to the 80% addicted level) or you take damage from it.

Perhaps make willpower to be able to go negative, to where it goes from instead of being a helpless slave that cant resist, to being an obedient, mindless one, with permanent debuffs if you don't handle yourself and your willpower.

A deal where your follower has rough sex with you every time you try to rest, giving your follower some of their lives back, while you don't actually get any sleeping buff (Should have given it to them when you had the chance).

Maybe some more soft deals, like indentured servitude based, where you work for the follower instead of the follower working for you. Maybe an option (requires maximum resistance and/or willpower) where you can make smaller payments, like a loan, to your follower to pay off the debt, or instead find valuable items, particularly gems and extremely high quality weapons or armor (Value/weight > 500).

Perhaps a deal that includes more serious bondage related items, perhaps a custom item that will slowly drain the attributes and stats of the player (until death) until they do a certain thing for a follower. Perhaps so long as this deal is active, they can't accumulate more debt? Perhaps a faster way to finish their contract?

Another permanently disabling effect, one that comes from the follower instead of a random npc? Perhaps if your willpower reaches too low, it's stuck there forever, where you're quite literally nothing but an obedient, worthless slave. Soft tie in to STA, where your character makes actual dialogue to force themselves into a deal, to keep them stuck in deals forever. Maybe a small quest tie in to remove this effect? Perhaps it's magic?


I love this mod, it is absolutely one of my favorites, especially when using a follower like Buxom Wench Yuriana as a futa Master, and having her force my charcter around in helpless bondage! Not trying to stall any work with this, but just some ideas, I have some modding experience, but very little coding experience, so I'm sure some of this could actually be done if you can be bothered by it lol. Love your work! Absolutely wonderful!

 

Devious Mindbreak or SL Survival would come there in mind but only in loose addition

[Lupine00]

14 hours ago, Meladiator said:

Perhaps some level 4 deals?

A deal where you are required to give your master some type of sex once a day.

Evolved the cum covering deal to require all times, not just in cities, and you must cover yourself instead (of course, requiring sex) instead of your follower doing it for you.

A deal where you are required to have sex with an animal when your follower see's a friendly one and points it out (similar to the hand on shoulder).

Add a vaginal plug to the plug deal, instead of just butt plug, to bell butt plug, to sign butt plug.

Make the plug deals require much more intensive, requiring much more harsh plugs in latter deals, such as the shocking one.

Some of these things are in my dev version, in a form ... follower sex deals are.

 

Other things aren't in because they were originally covered under other deals and the classic deals were designed to be non-overlapping.

 

The belt deal also involves plugs, and without a belt, plugs are problematic. You can't just check for a lockable plug via keywords, it requires slot contents fetching and checks against the armor item, and that is very slow and wouldn't be usable in dialog conditions without hacks that would introduce problems. It's just another gap in DD, and I don't imagine it's fixed in DD5  - though I've had no time to look at that yet.

 

So, it's a lot easier to make plugs something combined with a belt.

 

14 hours ago, Meladiator said:

Another permanently disabling effect, one that comes from the follower instead of a random npc? Perhaps if your willpower reaches too low, it's stuck there forever, where you're quite literally nothing but an obedient, worthless slave. Soft tie in to STA, where your character makes actual dialogue to force themselves into a deal, to keep them stuck in deals forever. Maybe a small quest tie in to remove this effect? Perhaps it's magic?

This certainly goes against Lozeak's original intent for how the mod would not wreck your game.

But... with the resistance fatigue that accumulates, there is kind of support for this already.

If you do build up massive resistance fatigue, you will be stuck with low willpower until you can cure it, which may prove hard.

 

Maybe think about ideas for more things that might modify resistance fatigue - including ways to get rid of it?

 

 

Last weekend I did start looking at getting back to working on DF. The problem is I'm part way through some big changes and took out several months without planning to do so ... now everything is in an unfinished state, but with no notes on what remains to be done ... I have to go through it all and track down what's left to be done.

[Meladiator]

19 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Some of these things are in my dev version, in a form ... follower sex deals are.

 

Other things aren't in because they were originally covered under other deals and the classic deals were designed to be non-overlapping.

 

The belt deal also involves plugs, and without a belt, plugs are problematic. You can't just check for a lockable plug via keywords, it requires slot contents fetching and checks against the armor item, and that is very slow and wouldn't be usable in dialog conditions without hacks that would introduce problems. It's just another gap in DD, and I don't imagine it's fixed in DD5  - though I've had no time to look at that yet.

 

So, it's a lot easier to make plugs something combined with a belt.

 

This certainly goes against Lozeak's original intent for how the mod would not wreck your game.

But... with the resistance fatigue that accumulates, there is kind of support for this already.

If you do build up massive resistance fatigue, you will be stuck with low willpower until you can cure it, which may prove hard.

 

Maybe think about ideas for more things that might modify resistance fatigue - including ways to get rid of it?

 

 

Last weekend I did start looking at getting back to working on DF. The problem is I'm part way through some big changes and took out several months without planning to do so ... now everything is in an unfinished state, but with no notes on what remains to be done ... I have to go through it all and track down what's left to be done.

I see.

I only requested as an option in an MCM or something to download, for those that truly want a hardcore experience towards indentured servitude rather than slavery, such as myself. I'm aware that this mod isn't supposed to be THAT game infringing, but the MCM options can make it so, which is what I'm referring to. Sometimes, I want mys mod to wreck my game, I can always reload a save :).

[coomer20]

I cant get sofia to work :/. I clicked on the "debug for adding followers" in the debug menu but nothing apears.

[Vaelorian]

On 12/1/2020 at 2:22 AM, Lupine00 said:

This certainly goes against Lozeak's original intent for how the mod would not wreck your game.

So, could we expect a cure for the follower potion at any point? 'Cause that sort of does wreck your game.

 

Honestly I love the concept, I'd toss that into one of the simple slavery outcomes if I could, IF it had a cure.

[Lupine00]

8 hours ago, coomer20 said:

I cant get sofia to work

That's because she isn't a vanilla follower. She is extremely non-vanilla.

She likely won't ever work with DF.

Even if  you could fix the follower quest, her special blocking dialogs would wreck DF.

[Lupine00]

2 hours ago, Vaelorian said:

So, could we expect a cure for the follower potion at any point? 'Cause that sort of does wreck your game.

It wasn't a priority. You can set the duration to a high value and then it has low impact.

 

That might be an alternative to a cure: no cure, just a potion that means you don't have to drink for ten days or so.

 

Ingredients for such a potion of postponement?

Fire salts + Frost salts + Void salts?

Min skill of 50 alchemy to craft.

Postpones potion drinking for an additional 10 days.

Drink every 10 days to extend indefinitely.

But how to get the recipe?

 

 

There was some kind of dream of having a cure quest, but there's no point discussing that for now.

There's at least some chance I could put the delay potion in for the next release.

[Vaelorian]

11 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

It wasn't a priority. You can set the duration to a high value and then it has low impact.

 

That might be an alternative to a cure: no cure, just a potion that means you don't have to drink for ten days or so.

 

Ingredients for such a potion of postponement?

Fire salts + Frost salts + Void salts?

Min skill of 50 alchemy to craft.

Postpones potion drinking for an additional 10 days.

Drink every 10 days to extend indefinitely.

But how to get the recipe?

 

 

There was some kind of dream of having a cure quest, but there's no point discussing that for now.

There's at least some chance I could put the delay potion in for the next release.

I'm not a fan of that solution, but hey - we can't all have everything we want, yeah?

You're the dev, you do as you please.

 

I, personally, would want a full cure available in some capacity. That is the ONLY way I would even consider turning the feature on or calling it "non-save-wrecking".

 

Still, thank you for taking the time to answer, and for the mod itself.

[Xiaron]

Just confirming, since I think I managed to search up the correct answer. While editing the Device List json file removes items, there's currently no way to add items no already coded to the list is there?

[Corsayr]

5 minutes ago, Xiaron said:

Just confirming, since I think I managed to search up the correct answer. While editing the Device List json file removes items, there's currently no way to add items no already coded to the list is there?

are you sure you don't mean Sexlab Survival? I don't think Devious Followers has a device list json file. 

 

In which case if you did mean SLS you can add devices. You just need the formID remove the first two digits then convert to Hexadecimal and put in the esp name. (Exactly the same as doing the BikiniArmor.json file)

 

 

[Xiaron]

45 minutes ago, Corsayr said:

are you sure you don't mean Sexlab Survival? I don't think Devious Followers has a device list json file. 

 

In which case if you did mean SLS you can add devices. You just need the formID remove the first two digits then convert to Hexadecimal and put in the esp name. (Exactly the same as doing the BikiniArmor.json file)

 

 

No, I did mean DFC I just didn't peg the name right. It's the Lozeak Device Controller/Device Settings.json I was asking about. I wish it was the SLS one! I do actually know how to add devices to that and mine is all nicely customized, though admittedly I used the device list spreadsheet and didn't convert by hand.

[Anunya]

I just want to make sure I haven't missed something here. If you are using a needs mod and you get a deal with a gag (which as a DD device prevents you from eating and drinkig), your options are:

1. Buy your way out of the deal ASAP
2. Manipulate the locks so you can take the gag off and quickly sneak some food/ drink.
3. End up at the worst thirst/ starvation consequences from your needs mod (could be death, could be debuff depending on setting).

Is that correct, or are there other options?

 

One idea: if you have a deal that includes a gag, have the Devious Follower say something like "alright, I'll let you rest your jaws. Five minutes without the muzzle" and remove the gag. That gives you a chance to eat/ drink (or provide oral sex, maybe that's the Follower's motivation) so you don't starve to death. Possible the interval is configurable in the MCM.

 

Good idea? Terrible idea? Good idea but too complicated or uninteresting to most people?