devious devices Devious Lore

[Nymra]

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Well, you shouldn't get out at all as low lvl ?

thats harsh. 
I mean it makes the game impossible to play even on the easiest setting on Lore and DD. That is not good gameplay just sayin
I mean you can turn the difficulty up when you want it like that, no? 

 

 

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Easiest way to escape in low lvls is to ask a friend (doesn't even need to be a follower).

that is impossible. You are out in nowhere in a dungeon, I dont use followers or spawn friendly NPC, dedun. 
 

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

I mean, why all the DD mods if it's so easy to escape them?

I dont want it to be easy, I just dont understand why it has to be implemented in such an intrusive way. 
The theory behind all that is, that the struggle game is "Telling". Nothing is really happening there, just a game mechanic. 
You cannot even enjoy the struggle animation that is played so its kinda off
I mean in a perfect world you would have a visible animation feedback or a voice feedback when you are on the wrong paths "key press" wise. 
And the pop ups are just... I mean I wrote it above that they are superfluos mostly. I mean even this mod recognizes that heavy bondage and mittens have to be autopriority over other items. So it would be just logical to continue. 

I think keys and "cut open" could be integrated into the struggle game easy. I mean both actions would require alot of struggling in reality too. 
No need to select them individually. Just in theory. 

 

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

That's like adding lots of combat mods to make fights harder and then just kill everyone with cheat weapons ?‍♂️

With DDe your out too in no time.

I add everything via AddItemMenu. No cheat weapon I can get is strong enough to autowin battles. Combat mods make sure of that
 

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

 

How can they be used as eye candy if you remove them right away?

I enjoy them often enough. Sadly there are too few of them and changing textures (like I do) is not the entire game.
I will try to replace meshes for DDs to get more variety, but the options are very limited. 
Also there are too few bound animations suitable for the different stuff. Not even talking about how DDs just make debugging shit so hard... 

 

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Lol I think I understand what you mean, but it sounds boring.

In and out without any effort, wouldn't it be easier to just add more devices to the non-devious devices mod?

I am investigating on how to add stuff to that mod. But the problem is so many mods have auto equip DDs and turning it just plain off is kinda boring.

I add most devices via SexlabUtil1 (non-DD stuff) to spice up Sexlab animations. I often cannot remove them fast because I have to run from enemies first
 

 

It all comes down to different taste of course and playstyle. But I am 100% sure that a majaor PopUp and gameplay overhaul of DDs would improve gameplay experience for hardcore fans ALOT too. You cannot decide without testing it first ?

(I mean imagine when you want to attack an NPC and there is a pop up asking you if you want to use left or right weapon. And then u select right and it asks you if you want to attack from upper left, lower left, upper right etc...) I mean that is the level of PoP up from DD mods


 

[monsta88]

Just my 2 cents.

 

I usually have these in the load order:

- Naked Dungeons 5-50% chance on entry, depending on the game. If whoring is enabled, this can be a way to get keys. It also has a rather reliable, but not so feature rich Combat Rape function. I never lost my gear unrecoverably with this mod.

- Deviously Enchanted Chests - 2-3% chance for finding a couple of DD items. It can also be configured to find keys.

- SL Adventures - define some city rules, like no nakedness/sex in the open, no bestiality, etc. These add bounty if seen by someone. Also define Proximity Rape rules, basically what are the requirements for NPCs to attack you.

- POP Overhaul - I use this is if I set up bounty rules in SL Adventures. Otherwise I don't often get bounty, so very little usage coming out of it.

- SL Helpless - I use it only to disable fast travel when the character is wearing DDs, all other functions are off.

- Aroused animals.

- OBIS and some other mods to bump up difficulty.

- Deviously Captured sometimes.

 

Now this can cascade on you: You get naked and/or in DDs in a dungeon. You need to visit a guard, to get back your gear. If you can't put on some clothes, he will punish you. If you have sex with him, you may get a bounty. If you have a bounty, you can't talk properly to guards. Also, if you are wearing DDs, the Proximity Rape may trigger. This may trigger further bounties. If you are naked Aroused animals may also trigger, which also may lead to further bounties. It can be hard to get back your gear. Sooner or later POP triggers a bounty hunter if you can't pay off your bounty.

 

This setup is mainly not too strict, you can play the vanilla game. It appears only as added difficulty.

 

I don't use DCL. It is too big, every major upgrade breaks a plethora of old features and makes my game unstable. It should be 3-4 mods, it wants to do too much things at once. When I try it sometimes, I have to switch off 3/4 of the features.

 

I don't use SL Survival in a regular game, because that makes impossible to play the game normally. I have a separate game for that, but played only for a short while.

 

Laura's shop is a good little mod, but it can crash if your character wears quest DDs while it also wants to equip quest DDs on you.

 

Devious Training never worked reliable for me. I like the concept, but the movement speed and especially the attack speed just went off the chart every time I tried it. It took like 30 seconds to swing a sword for example.

 

I also like SLUTS, unfortunately the SE version requires DCL, so I don't use it any more.

 

Then there is Defeat, which is the worst Combat Rape mod ever in keeping the player alive in a fight, especially at low levels. You just keep dying instead of being defeated. I still try to somehow make it work (usually involving Death Alternative), because it has the best features it you somehow get to the rape section.

 

Captured Dreams is too old now, a lot of the features are unreliable unfortunately. I hope Veladarius will find the enthusiasm to finish the rewrite.

 

Sometimes I also use Devious Lore or Devious Helpers, but not often. DL is a bit "light" for me and not much Lore in it. "Helpers" I usually don't need, because usually you can just free yourself, even on hardest difficulty. The only major problem w/o Helpers are the Bondage Mittens, becasue of the stupid "the key fell to the ground and disappeared" DDi feature. If this would happen while the character is wearing blindfold I may understand it somewhat, but otherwise I call that BS.

 

I couldn't find a good config for Devious Followers. It is either too brutal and you get into a downward spiral, or too easy.

 

I often use Pet Project or Devious Regulations as well if chastity is important for some reason. I'd like to play DCL's chastity related quests as well, but as I worte I don't use that mod anymore.

 

 

[lanaya1437]

How do I start a quest in this mod? It seems to have installed correctly, as I have the MCM menu and I found one of the 'non-vanilla' houses (the one between Dragonsbridge and Solitude). The house is locked though, and the innkeepers don't have any dialogue about strange people. Is it only very specific innkeepers?

[darktej]

1 hour ago, lanaya1437 said:

How do I start a quest in this mod? It seems to have installed correctly, as I have the MCM menu and I found one of the 'non-vanilla' houses (the one between Dragonsbridge and Solitude). The house is locked though, and the innkeepers don't have any dialogue about strange people. Is it only very specific innkeepers?

when you loot chestts..you should see a new misc item..for e.g. when you loot a boss chest in a draugr ruin ...you will find a misc item by the name "Ceremonial Urn". Click it to open it. you might get restrained by metal restraints or you might get some useful loot. if you get restrained...then you can go to an innkeeper and ask them..then you will have the ability to meet up with the quest giver. I am unsure though whether you have to be resrained or not by the misc item to unlock the quest to the corresponding quest giver. hopefully someone here can clarify that for you as well as for me. other misc items added by this mod are. Dwarven vials, old grimoire, smuggled package, daedric charm, ceremonial urn and east empire company crate. 

[kingofthenorth9]

Hello, Ive tried downloading you mod along side the three devious devices mods needed for your mod but I cant get it to work any ideas where I could start? It does not seem to show up in the FNIS when I update it, if this helps.

[tekuusne]

I keep hearing great things about this struggle minigame, but does it work on a controller? Where I don't have four keys for movement but rather an analog stick.

Quick edit: I suppose I could have tried this before asking, but it looks like the WASD keys do work for this even with a controller. Great!

 

Also I second the post(s) earlier in the thread about making the front page more clear about what the patches do and what to install. As a newbie modder I was confused, looked inside the files and noticed that the file dates were more recent in the main file, so I thought I didn't need the patches. Only after reading the thread do I sort of understand them.

[Zaflis]

I have reason to believe "Lore Patch" conflicts with "Enchanting - I do what I want". So re-arrange esp's so IDWIW is after Lore patch.

 

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/15884/

[Billy Joe Bob]

On 5/12/2020 at 2:21 AM, donttouchmethere said:

Mods that add escape options to any NPC => helpfulness depends on the mod

 

 

Do you happen to know any other mods apart from Devious Helpers, DCL and SD+ that happen to add dialogue to all npcs, not just blacksmiths and merchants? DCL has the comments system with action chances where they can give you keys, but this doesn't help if the device you're wearing can't be unlocked by yourself, Helpers relies completely on followers and SD+ isn't configurable. I know DD had dialogue options in the past that involved all npcs, but the mods of DD unfortunately removed that feature in DD4 (I believe). 

 

Basically, it would be nice to have mods that gave the option to ask ANY npc for assistance with outcomes depending not only on luck, but your relationship with the npc (so that a friend npc won't decide to rape you for asking for an unlock). 

 

Also: Is the struggle minigame meant to replace the original DD escape options, or add essentially an "additional" option? I ask because whenever I attempt to struggle, pick, etc. by picking a device in my inventory, it still uses the default escape options. I must press the hotkey set by DL to use the struggle minigame, so essentially I get 2 chances for escape. There were no conflicts that I saw in TES5Edit either. I know the description says it's meant to be a "replacement," but this is why I'm a bit confused. 

[Kharos]

Bug report (at least I am assuming this is a bug):

The merchant inventory of the jail masters never resets. Since they only have a single one of each restraints, this make it hard to buy "the same restraint" multiple times during a longer game (you can do it by travelling to each city, but it is a bit inconvenient).

Afaik if you want the same behavior as with standard merchants, you need to set the "Respawn" flag in the merchant chest (I think it is _DL_StoreJailmaster).

 

[Edit] Oh, I just notice in TES5Edit that the flag is missing in all other merchant containers too.

[Swoolfie]

Just wondering if this is compatible with the SSE build.

[tekuusne]

On 6/4/2020 at 4:23 PM, Billy Joe Bob said:

Also: Is the struggle minigame meant to replace the original DD escape options, or add essentially an "additional" option? I ask because whenever I attempt to struggle, pick, etc. by picking a device in my inventory, it still uses the default escape options. I must press the hotkey set by DL to use the struggle minigame, so essentially I get 2 chances for escape. There were no conflicts that I saw in TES5Edit either. I know the description says it's meant to be a "replacement," but this is why I'm a bit confused. 

I see it as an additional option myself. I don't use a keyboard so I start it by trying to equip a lockpick.

 

I've noticed that when I try to escape while blindfolded, the stamina bar doesn't show up until I'm all exhausted. Is this a bug or intended behavior? I suppose it makes sense that with a blindfold it would be even more difficult, but it can be quite hard indeed with no bar.

[tekuusne]

9 hours ago, donttouchmethere said:

Cool! How did you manage that? =D

Well I wouldn't know. It was already broken when I got here 

It does add variety which I like. With a difficult enough arm restraint, you might not be able to escape without help if you happen to be blindfolded as well.

 

I got other issues too. Sometimes it says it's playing an animation, but the characters just stand there listening to the sound effects for the duration. Sometimes one of the participants slowly drifts away. Sometimes the positions don't match, for example frostbite spiders always seem to have sex with my characters neck. Not problems with this mod obviously, just an indication that not everything is quite right with my installation.

[Lupine00]

In my latest game, the Lore Mongers have locked themselves inside their dwellings and will not come out.

 

I've found dozens of items and I can talk to inn-keepers, but those elusive Lore Mongers are unwilling to show their faces.

 

If I port into their locations they tell me that I need to leave. Very unfriendly.

 

 

The thing about this particular game that springs to mind is that it does not contain "Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul", which I was using previously, as it appeared to be taking over NPCs from other mods in undesirable ways.

 

It may be possible that Devious Lore accidentally relies on AIO for its NPCs to work?

Or maybe it's something else?

 

Has anyone else seen anything similar?

[Lupine00]

On 6/12/2020 at 11:42 AM, tekuusne said:

for example frostbite spiders always seem to have sex with my characters neck

Spiders have historically had a lot of issues. This isn't indicative of anything.

You may want to get the latest MNC though, as spiders have had repeated fixes and improvements.

[neghthraw]

6 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

In my latest game, the Lore Mongers have locked themselves inside their dwellings and will not come out.

 

I've found dozens of items and I can talk to inn-keepers, but those elusive Lore Mongers are unwilling to show their faces.

 

If I port into their locations they tell me that I need to leave. Very unfriendly.

 

 

The thing about this particular game that springs to mind is that it does not contain "Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul", which I was using previously, as it appeared to be taking over NPCs from other mods in undesirable ways.

 

It may be possible that Devious Lore accidentally relies on AIO for its NPCs to work?

Or maybe it's something else?

 

Has anyone else seen anything similar?

After the update from the previous version, afaik you need to do three quests for any lore mongers in total (until you get to the "choose a reward" dialogue and they stop just giving you random stuff as reward) to unlock their shops, even on saves were you already were in their shops and knew them.

 

Side note: I'm using "Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul".

[Code Serpent]

15 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

In my latest game, the Lore Mongers have locked themselves inside their dwellings and will not come out.

8 hours ago, neghthraw said:

After the update from the previous version, afaik you need to do three quests for any lore mongers in total (until you get to the "choose a reward" dialogue and they stop just giving you random stuff as reward) to unlock their shops

Lore Mongers should open up their shops after you ask who they are and get the prompt to start the first retrieve quest. They also have schedules, so they will head to bed and close up shop at night.

[Lupine00]

1 hour ago, Code Serpent said:

Lore Mongers should open up their shops after you ask who they are and get the prompt to start the first retrieve quest. They also have schedules, so they will head to bed and close up shop at night.

Can't have any dialog at all with Lore Mongers because they are locked inside their dwellings. And I do mean locked.

Their dwellings are locked up so you cannot enter.

 

As I noted above, porting in there to try and talk, was in vain, as all they would do was say "You need to leave" and would not converse in any way.

 

Asking innkeepers about them got the usual responses, but no lore monger ever ventured out to be encountered in towns, rendering the inn-keeper conversations moot.

 

No quest can be completed and I can't hand in any items I find, because they won't speak to me.

 

They are not following schedules. They are stuck "going to bed" indefinitely. All of them.

 

As I noted previously, they worked for me before with I had AIO installed. Now I have removed it, they do not work. This may be totally unrelated, but I haven't changed my DL version, I was previously using the latest DL version successfully when I had AIO installed.

[Code Serpent]

1 hour ago, Lupine00 said:

Can't have any dialog at all with Lore Mongers because they are locked inside their dwellings.

Ask innkeepers about strange people visiting town.

[Lupine00]

2 hours ago, Code Serpent said:

Ask innkeepers about strange people visiting town.

Already tried that. See remarks on this in both my posts above.

 

... I'll quote the most important bit ...

 

  

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Asking innkeepers about them got the usual responses, but no lore monger ever ventured out to be encountered in towns, rendering the inn-keeper conversations moot.

 

[Code Serpent]

3 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Already tried that. See remarks on this in both my posts above.

Then you're game is bugged somehow, and I can't do anything for you.

[Lupine00]

14 minutes ago, Code Serpent said:

Then you're bugged.

Possibly. But you haven't discussed the AIO interaction.

 

When I look at my log, it's not the log of a broken game.

 

There's some rubbish in there, but it's from mods I know spew rubbish all the time (ToH, SS, BaboHH) and a little noise from RND and SLS... but they shut up once loading is over.

 

 

Nothing from DL ... crickets ... so I guess maybe some scripts never started at all?

But it's not the usual properties didn't fill on quest start flaky-Skyrim-business-as-usual.

 

Let's say my DL NPC handling didn't get started ... because Skyrim ... what quests should I be looking at the status of?

What would a happy DL look like in terms of quest stages?

 

 

Quests not starting would fit with dialog not appearing on the Lore Mongers too. Probably?

[neghthraw]

So, if I understand correctly, you can ask Innkeepers about lore mongers, but the quest to find them afterwards does not start? I don't think Immersive Citizens would prevent quests from starting.

[Code Serpent]

10 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

 

Actually, ignore my last post. It was late, and I didn't give it enough thought.

 

Now, when you ask the innkeepers, do you actually let their dialogue run all the way through? If not, that might cause the quest to not completely start.

 

If all else fails, you can use some console commands:

 

Type: help _DL_Status

 

That will give you the ids of the Lore-Monger status quests. Set their stages to 5, and that should allow their stores to open.

[worik]

On 6/17/2020 at 10:13 AM, Lupine00 said:

It may be possible that Devious Lore accidentally relies on AIO for its NPCs to work?

? I had never AIO in my game and the lore mongers seem to behave like they should.

They  idle in their houses until I lure them out with the inkeeper dialogue. And once I've done their quest, they obediently return home.

 

I guess there is something else going on

[Lupine00]

5 hours ago, Code Serpent said:

Now, when you ask the innkeepers, do you actually let their dialogue run all the way through? If not, that might cause the quest to not completely start.

 

If all else fails, you can use some console commands:

 

Type: help _DL_Status

 

That will give you the ids of the Lore-Monger status quests. Set their stages to 5, and that should allow their stores to open.

Thanks.

 

I think I completed all available dialogue. I'll re-test and see what I can learn from quest states.

 

If I've got a LO problem that's breaking DL, I want to figure out what it is. However, DL is pretty late in my LO.

 

After DL, there's only Alternate Start, ccas_starts, Devious Bashnag, and Trapped in Rubber that have gameplay content - everything else is lighting or weather, 

or a SLAL pack I added after game-start when I realized I needed it - and those were added after DL already seemed to be stuck.

 

I also have a merged patch, but it's almost entirely composed of conflicts between Bijin All-in-One and vanilla armor replacers.

 

I looked at DL in Tes5Edit, and there's basically no conflict with anything.

 

 

I did find one little quirk:

The DL esp, and the DD - Lore Patch esp both apply the same edit to zadx_hood_rubber_blackAA from DDx.

Not likely to cause any problems of any kind, but you can probably drop the record from the DD - Lore Patch because DL applies the edit itself, as with the execution hoods.