Prison Overhaul Patched (LE)

[jlaak222]

Update time, most def.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like you want an update

 

 

Okay so I don't think I'm doing this right. I originally had an issue where I guards came up to me, I submitted to being arrested (bounty of 1000) but after that nothing happened. I was locked in place and no spell happened and no transport to jail happened.

 

After about 3 minutes, I reloaded the save, tried it again; same results. I quit out of the game and came here to look for solutions and saw someone mentioned the 'location scan' so I loaded a save before I committed the crime, changed that to 60 seconds then went out and hit a guard. I got a small bounty (60 or 80) and submitted to arrest. This time, I was stuck in place again and the guard walked off, but after about 20-30 seconds he cast a spell that looked like it missed. However, my weapons were unequipped and when I entered 3rd person view my character was hogtied with a hood on. However, they were just stuck laying on the streets of Solitude like that. After a few minutes I pressed the movement buttons and my character got up and started walking about. The hood, cuffs and gag were still equipped (and couldn't be taken off) and I talked to a guard and the gagged dialogue came up (apparently my gag talking skill increased by 5%).

 

Just now I tried again. I reduced the Minor Bounty Threshold to 50 and Major to 1000 (Dunno if they have any effect) and then I stole a couple of cheap things and attacked a guard. Same things happened again except this time, movements buttons didn't get my characters. However, space bar (my jump button) made my character jump up and stand like they would be standing normally but unable to move and with the prison items still equipped. After about 30 seconds, a guard (might have been the same one) stood in front of me, said some unvoiced lines (I can't remember them exactly but it read like he was going to take me to jail) and then did nothing. They were just stood in front of me. This continued for a few minutes until I quit to desktop via the menu.

 

I've attached my mod load order and my papyrus log (thats the only log I have because I only just activated it for the last/most recent attempt. Is there any chance of being able to fix this issue?

 

I had a look at your log.  I'm not a tech whizz, but I think I know just enough to be certain that if I had a log like that, I'd go back to a previous save, from some time ago, and if that showed similar errors, I'd just completely scrap that game and start again  

 

 

 

 

I've done that for the same problem I have (fresh save). Gonna see if maybe it's just Riften that won't work in my game (although in a previous post I did state I got it to work once).

[bicobus]

I'm pretty sure Inte has a bucket on the head and cannot see POP fan's plights properly. Or maybe Inte's been locked up together with Zaz, with a lone bucket to share - the struggle is real.

[mule45]

 

Okay so I don't think I'm doing this right. I originally had an issue where I guards came up to me, I submitted to being arrested (bounty of 1000) but after that nothing happened. I was locked in place and no spell happened and no transport to jail happened.

 

After about 3 minutes, I reloaded the save, tried it again; same results. I quit out of the game and came here to look for solutions and saw someone mentioned the 'location scan' so I loaded a save before I committed the crime, changed that to 60 seconds then went out and hit a guard. I got a small bounty (60 or 80) and submitted to arrest. This time, I was stuck in place again and the guard walked off, but after about 20-30 seconds he cast a spell that looked like it missed. However, my weapons were unequipped and when I entered 3rd person view my character was hogtied with a hood on. However, they were just stuck laying on the streets of Solitude like that. After a few minutes I pressed the movement buttons and my character got up and started walking about. The hood, cuffs and gag were still equipped (and couldn't be taken off) and I talked to a guard and the gagged dialogue came up (apparently my gag talking skill increased by 5%).

 

Just now I tried again. I reduced the Minor Bounty Threshold to 50 and Major to 1000 (Dunno if they have any effect) and then I stole a couple of cheap things and attacked a guard. Same things happened again except this time, movements buttons didn't get my characters. However, space bar (my jump button) made my character jump up and stand like they would be standing normally but unable to move and with the prison items still equipped. After about 30 seconds, a guard (might have been the same one) stood in front of me, said some unvoiced lines (I can't remember them exactly but it read like he was going to take me to jail) and then did nothing. They were just stood in front of me. This continued for a few minutes until I quit to desktop via the menu.

 

I've attached my mod load order and my papyrus log (thats the only log I have because I only just activated it for the last/most recent attempt. Is there any chance of being able to fix this issue?

 

I had a look at your log.  I'm not a tech whizz, but I think I know just enough to be certain that if I had a log like that, I'd go back to a previous save, from some time ago, and if that showed similar errors, I'd just completely scrap that game and start again  

 

 

 

 

I've ended up starting a new game entirely now and it seems to be working well enough. Miminal CTD's that I'm pretty sure just come from poor load ordering.

 

[DonQuiWho]

 

 

 

 

I've ended up starting a new game entirely now and it seems to be working well enough. Miminal CTD's that I'm pretty sure just come from poor load ordering.

 

 

 

Glad to hear that. 

 

There's really not much wrong with xPOPatches... apart from Inte's needing to feed patch after patch after patch to Punga to keep him from starving to death in his cell     

 

Now there's an idea, what about a cabbage patch? 

[trippleT]

I figured out my MCM problem!

 

POP loads perfectly when DD is installed and I wanted to run a game without DD (silly me). It seems that it couldn't load properly because of some soft(?) dependencys. So Inte (or whoever else mentains the mod page) could you please update the mod page so everybody sees that they need DD and/or make it a hard requirement in the .esp? That would be awesome. Thanks.

 

Edit: I should read the patch notes :head-->desk:

[jlaak222]

Started a new save where I did the Helgen start instead of just picking a city and it worked (in Whiterun at least). Not sure what the exact problem is if it works in one city and not the others.

[GeorgiaCav]

Sorry if this has been requested before, but could the pillories and X-cross in Morthal be moved? At the moment, they're exactly where Better Fast Travel places a carriage.

 

Thanks for all your work on making this mod fun, stable, and working.

 

EDIT: Actually, as a workaround, I guess I could disable BFT anytime I'm jailed in Morthal, since I'M NOT FUCKING GOING ANYWHERE ANYWAY. Self face-palm. Of course, if you wanted to add it to patch, I wouldn't object to that either. 

[Punga]

Sorry if this has been requested before, but could the pillories and X-cross in Morthal be moved? At the moment, they're exactly where Better Fast Travel places a carriage.

 

Thanks for all your work on making this mod fun, stable, and working.

 

EDIT: Actually, as a workaround, I guess I could disable BFT anytime I'm jailed in Morthal, since I'M NOT FUCKING GOING ANYWHERE ANYWAY. Self face-palm. Of course, if you wanted to add it to patch, I wouldn't object to that either. 

 

That is a good place to place things, yes. I vote for the POP's things.

[Punga]

 

 

 

 

 

I've ended up starting a new game entirely now and it seems to be working well enough. Miminal CTD's that I'm pretty sure just come from poor load ordering.

 

 

 

Glad to hear that. 

 

There's really not much wrong with xPOPatches... apart from Inte's needing to feed patch after patch after patch to Punga to keep him from starving to death in his cell     

 

Now there's an idea, what about a cabbage patch? 

 

 

Yes. We wants it, we needs it. We must have the patch. The patch in mine! My patchhhh.

[Inte]

[jfraser]

omg, rofl.

[Punga]

 

 

Now let's get this update ready, shall we?

Like I said before, don't worry if it's a small one, plenty of letters left in the alphabet.

[Kimy]

I don't believe in escaping a DD restraint anyway. I mean c'mon! You can escape an armbinder? Just not immersive to me so I always find somebody to help me out.

 

I agree that it's not very realistic. If the armbinder is applied correctly (read: tight), it's about as impossible to struggle out from as it gets. At least I have never heard of anybody accomplishing such a feat. Making it escapable in DD is a compromise solution that was made to prevent certain devices from being total showstoppers. Any really secure restraint is designed in a way that makes it impossible to remove without help, even if you get hold of the keys. Likewisely, a blindfold in real life prevents you from seeing -anything-, while in DD they do not. Talking through a gag in an understandable fashion is also much harder in real life than in the game. It's just design decisions we made to keep the game fun.

 

EDIT: What I do not like is the 'gag talk'. 

 

Perhaps a better solution would be for the NPC to remove your gag temporarily to talk and then put it back if they do not agree to help.

 

I guess from a RP perspective you could imagine the gag talk to work this way. Which is why your character speaks normally when you completed the gag talk successfully.

 

Or they can just refuse outright with something like "Yeah, I don't understand what you are trying to say. OR I don't have a key for your gag there. You might want to try someone else." That way you do not loose half a day trying to do the impossible and talk through a gag. This can potentially eliminate the 'Catch 22' situation an armbinder + gag can introduce.

 

I am not a fan of the potentially near-endless loops the DDI gagtalk can inflict on you either. Which is why I wrote my own take on it in DCL. I could even port the code to the framework, but I am not sure if its main idea (failures having negative consequences) would be appropriate for the framework.

 

[bicobus]

Yeah, but what if you have a sharp appliance on hand? Like, I don't know, a sword? As far as I know, armbinders aren't made out of metal and thus can be cut down or the fabric can be worn away by rubbing it on a rough area.

 

About the gag talk, it really should be left on a per mod basis. Give the DDi framework the ability to decide wether or not the "talk" succeeded with no actual outcome. If an outcome needs to exists, create a limited dialogue tree with just the basic stuff available in case of failure: "help me out of this thing", "give me food please", etc.

 

The DDi loop on failure is so frustrating I have a physical response to it. It wouldn't be missed if it were removed.

[Kimy]

Yeah, but what if you have a sharp appliance on hand? Like, I don't know, a sword? As far as I know, armbinders aren't made out of metal and thus can be cut down or the fabric can be worn away by rubbing it on a rough area.

 

About the gag talk, it really should be left on a per mod basis. Give the DDi framework the ability to decide wether or not the "talk" succeeded with no actual outcome. If an outcome needs to exists, create a limited dialogue tree with just the basic stuff available in case of failure: "help me out of this thing", "give me food please", etc.

 

Since your hands are sealed inside the glove, you can't really handle a cutting instrument. Your best bet indeed would be finding a sharp object that won't move, so you could cut the straps by rubbing against it. And that's a long shot, because a thorny bush will not do the trick and that's about the sharpest object you will find in open nature. And while blades are very common in Skyrim, it would still be quite hard to arrange one in a position you could use them for cutting the straps. Let's just say it would still be very, very difficult.

 

About the gag talk - that was basically the status-quo before we integrated the gag talk. The framework made no statement about handling gags, so they just disabled speaking entirely. But that meant that gags were basically showstoppers. Not ideal, either.

 

[bicobus]

Sorry I didn't express myself correctly. What I meant with the gag talk was that the framework should not intervene at all unless a third party mod requires it. For example, you could have DCL do a call to DDi to know wether or not the gag talk succeeded, and the follow up outcome is decided by DCL. You can have that mechanic with nearly all the other mods, to leave them the creative process and choice to do whatever they want with the player. An example of implementation with POP could be that when the PC talks to a guard while wearing a gag, if failing the guard could think the PC insulted him and initiate the jailing punishments.

 

As it stands, the DDi implementation do not help anybody.

 

And yes it would be very difficult to escape an armbinder, but not impossible given the location. Beside, you can find sharpish rocks everywhere too. The idea revolve around the hardness of the material, not how sharp it is.

 

Edit: words

Edited May 16, 2017 by bicobus

[jfraser]

My biggest annoyance with the gags (and I know this isn't this mod's problem, but now I want to vent ) is that if someone comes up to you with a gag on their mouth and says, "mmmmph mmph!" there is only one thing they could possibly be saying, which is, "get this fucking thing out of my mouth!" It makes no sense to me that the NPC's act like they have no clue what I'm trying to say.

[bicobus]

Unless the gag you are wearing is the "Godly Blessed Gag of the Fox", making you so smart. The first shortfall is that you cannot speak, so it cancel the advantages. The second shortfall is when you remove it, you lose that extra smartness and then think to yourself: "Oh, that gag is making me smarter? Let's equip it!"

[jfraser]

New mod: Ironic Gags of Skyrim. I like it! XD

[DonQuiWho]

t if someone comes up to you with a gag on their mouth and says, "mmmmph mmph!" there is only one thing they could possibly be saying, which is, "get this fucking thing out of my mouth!"

 

I'd never been quite certain about that, especially as so many mod authors out there seem to think that the PC has been bound and gagged by some miscreant as an invitation to be responded to, in a form such as ...

 

"I'll take that thing out of your mouth so that my NPC can get their fucking thing into it"

 

But you learn something new every day, don't you? ....

 

[Inte]

 

Yeah, but what if you have a sharp appliance on hand? Like, I don't know, a sword? As far as I know, armbinders aren't made out of metal and thus can be cut down or the fabric can be worn away by rubbing it on a rough area.

 

About the gag talk, it really should be left on a per mod basis. Give the DDi framework the ability to decide wether or not the "talk" succeeded with no actual outcome. If an outcome needs to exists, create a limited dialogue tree with just the basic stuff available in case of failure: "help me out of this thing", "give me food please", etc.

 

Since your hands are sealed inside the glove, you can't really handle a cutting instrument. Your best bet indeed would be finding a sharp object that won't move, so you could cut the straps by rubbing against it. And that's a long shot, because a thorny bush will not do the trick and that's about the sharpest object you will find in open nature. And while blades are very common in Skyrim, it would still be quite hard to arrange one in a position you could use them for cutting the straps. Let's just say it would still be very, very difficult.

 

About the gag talk - that was basically the status-quo before we integrated the gag talk. The framework made no statement about handling gags, so they just disabled speaking entirely. But that meant that gags were basically showstoppers. Not ideal, either.

 

 

 

Ok, I agree that the leather can be cut and escaped from, but I was referring to the Ebony/Ebonite restraints.

 

I thought that Ebony restraints cannot be cut and/or damaged in any meaningful way and that this was one of the original DD canons when Ebonite was introduced by @Coopervane, no? 

 

[Inte]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I've ended up starting a new game entirely now and it seems to be working well enough. Miminal CTD's that I'm pretty sure just come from poor load ordering.

 

 

 

Glad to hear that. 

 

There's really not much wrong with xPOPatches... apart from Inte's needing to feed patch after patch after patch to Punga to keep him from starving to death in his cell     

 

Now there's an idea, what about a cabbage patch? 

 

 

Yes. We wants it, we needs it. We must have the patch. The patch in mine! My patchhhh.

 

 

Ok Sméagol, your 'precious' update is ready.

 

I just need to test it a bit more.  

It will be a small one, tho.

[bicobus]

Perhaps it IS a good day to die! I say we ship it!

[Kimy]

 

 

Ok, I agree that the leather can be cut and escaped from, but I was referring to the Ebony/Ebonite restraints.

 

I thought that Ebony restraints cannot be cut and/or damaged in any meaningful way and that this was one of the original DD canons when Ebonite was introduced by @Coopervane, no? 

 

 

To be honest, I have no clue. I always thought Ebonite was a lore-friendly synonym for "Latex".

 

[jfraser]

 

 

 

Ok, I agree that the leather can be cut and escaped from, but I was referring to the Ebony/Ebonite restraints.

 

I thought that Ebony restraints cannot be cut and/or damaged in any meaningful way and that this was one of the original DD canons when Ebonite was introduced by @Coopervane, no?

 

To be honest, I have no clue. I always thought Ebonite was a lore-friendly synonym for "Latex".

I thought Ebonite was a black coloured mineral.