Grand Lewd Modder Program/App/Thing? (For LoversLab)

[Screws]

So... there are plenty of games out there that would be amazing to see lewdly modded, and there are many talented modders on this site. Unfortunately, a lot of the times, games people really enjoy don't get any modding love because modding tends to be a passion project by most. Which is understandable. Personally, I want to see more lewd mods for all kinds of games of different genres that have yet to be explored since there aren't passionate modders working on them yet.

I've come up with an idea, a solution to this dilemma, of many fans, not enough passion project modders, so to speak.

I'm no programmer, I don't know how to pull it off, but consider a site like Fiverr, where you can practically hire anyone to do anything pretty much. What if Loverslab had something equivalent to this? 

A way to where a community centered around specific games could pool funds to essentially pay a modder to make lewd mods for a specific game or something like that?

It's a very raw concept, but essentially it would be the equivalent to a bounty system. 

The basic idea I had for it, is essentially anyone could start up a 'Work Order' for a project where they outline what kind of mod they'd like to be made and the features in it. So there would be a primary representative for the idea. People could donate to the 'Work Order' and thus raise its value. Any modder can then contact the one in charge of the work order and basically submit work and get awarded the 'work order' bounty so to speak. Thus allowing some modders to potentially make some money on the side and thus allowing potentially more lewd mods to be featured on LL as a whole! (A cut of the Work Order bounty, perhaps 5% or so would go to Loverslab itself for hosting such a service and head moderating over it all.)

Rough concept, but I figure someone else could better expand upon it. Perhaps even some of the head honchos here on LL might take an interest.

Thoughts? Concerns? Ideas? Let me know down below.

[KoolHndLuke]

For the very reason you just stated (scarcity), MAs don't have to cater to any requests (for profit or otherwise) if they don't want to. In fact, I'd bet that a fair share of them don't want money specifically because they value the freedom to do exactly what they want, when they want to. Granted... what you outline sounds like a good idea, but I think things will remain pretty much as they are now.

[Pamatronic]

Oh boy, yet another Grand and completely unworkable Idea by someone who has never created anything... Love these.
There were already a few hints of realization in your post, but lemme give you the full version anyway:

Modders do stuff because they enjoy it. If the game isn't interesting to them or simply not accesible for modding, they will leave it alone.
Me and pretty much every other semi-decent modder i´ve ever talked with has some background in programming or the it sector, which means the few peanuts you could raise with a knockoff fiver wouldnt be any incentive to them. They make many times that much in their regular jobs.

And as someone who actually makes quite a bit of money with modding, I can absolutely tell you that the time/earning ration on this is Bad.
I only do it because I have the freedom to do that very specific thing I want to do and get to enjoy it. The second I have to take directions from some yahoo, the math doesn't work anymore.

And this doesn't factor in the Risks when dealing with randos. I´ve done a few commissions (for stuff which closely aligns with my interests anyway), and you have to be very careful from whom you take commissions. If you´re unlucky, you sink hundreds of hours into a job and the recipient doesn't want to pay you because he doesn't like the outcome or insists on some changes which were never mentioned in the initial pitch.
Personally I only take commissions from other Modders or folks who have a basic grasp on the technicals, so their expectations are realistic. But I´ve heard plenty of horror stories from fellow colleagues here.
So yeah, If you turn this into a free for all, quality control on both sides simply wont be possible.

So in conclusion, horrible Idea.
Try to make something yourself and get an Idea of the creative process before you advocate for bringing the Horrors of Fiver and the late stage capitalism gig-economy to LL.

[Screws]

4 hours ago, KoolHndLuke said:

For the very reason you just stated (scarcity), MAs don't have to cater to any requests (for profit or otherwise) if they don't want to. In fact, I'd bet that a fair share of them don't want money specifically because they value the freedom to do exactly what they want, when they want to. Granted... what you outline sounds like a good idea, but I think things will remain pretty much as they are now.

Aye, I mean at least a monetary incentive would be involved and no one would be forced to make things they want to. It's just a sort of like "Hey, if you want to make some money with those skills of yours, here's basically a bounty you can do if you like!"

[Screws]

2 hours ago, Pamatronic said:

Oh boy, yet another Grand and completely unworkable Idea by someone who has never created anything... Love these.
There were already a few hints of realization in your post, but lemme give you the full version anyway:

Modders do stuff because they enjoy it. If the game isn't interesting to them or simply not accesible for modding, they will leave it alone.
Me and pretty much every other semi-decent modder i´ve ever talked with has some background in programming or the it sector, which means the few peanuts you could raise with a knockoff fiver wouldnt be any incentive to them. They make many times that much in their regular jobs.

And as someone who actually makes quite a bit of money with modding, I can absolutely tell you that the time/earning ration on this is Bad.
I only do it because I have the freedom to do that very specific thing I want to do and get to enjoy it. The second I have to take directions from some yahoo, the math doesn't work anymore.

And this doesn't factor in the Risks when dealing with randos. I´ve done a few commissions (for stuff which closely aligns with my interests anyway), and you have to be very careful from whom you take commissions. If you´re unlucky, you sink hundreds of hours into a job and the recipient doesn't want to pay you because he doesn't like the outcome or insists on some changes which were never mentioned in the initial pitch.
Personally I only take commissions from other Modders or folks who have a basic grasp on the technicals, so their expectations are realistic. But I´ve heard plenty of horror stories from fellow colleagues here.
So yeah, If you turn this into a free for all, quality control on both sides simply wont be possible.

So in conclusion, horrible Idea.
Try to make something yourself and get an Idea of the creative process before you advocate for bringing the Horrors of Fiver and the late stage capitalism gig-economy to LL.

Oh boy, another condescending voice on the internet! Love these!

Also I'm not saying follow the exact Fiverr model. Essentially it would be almost like a patreon in a way, but not subscription based. Essentially people could donate money to a 'bounty' aka the mod they want that has been outlined. If 100 people gave $10 each to a single bounty, that is 1000 smackaroos right there, which is a pretty decent sum. I assure you there are plenty of people who are not very outspoken who would readily contribute to such a thing.

Also its not meant to replace an IRL job, its more of "Hey I got extra time to kill, I need some extra money, boom I can knock one of these bounties out and make some extra dosh."

I will agree with the issue of randos and commissions, however, that is why there is an arbitrator above the commissioner and the modder. They're the one that gets final say so to speak. I've seen artists deliver trash and call their commissioned job finished, likewise I've seen scum refuse to pay hard working artists for their master pieces. This takes some of the risk out of the equation as essentially the commissioner and supporters would have already donated their money to the bounty. So the cash is already out of the commissioner's hand. It's just if the bounty has been fulfilled does the money get dolled out to the modder.

I do have experience with this, believe it or not. Having worked as an arbitrator for commissioners and artists in the past, the middleman so to speak. It all comes down to proper management, and by having one that can mediate transactions. 

You can think of it this way, if your condescension will let you. Ordinarily the circumstances regarding a Commissioner and Artist/Modder/etc. is basically a 1 on 1 he said/she said, their word vs my word situation. It's what leads to a lot of the messiness and horror stories.

Now this idea takes that and puts it in a more professional setting. Think of it like a Courtroom almost, with the arbitrator being the judge. The money is already on the account ready to be transferred to one who completes the bounty, so the commissioner can't decide at the last second to pull a fast one and dip with the dosh and the product, as the money isn't in their hands anymore, it's on the bounty already, ready to be paid out. I'd even say a no refunds policy on it would be in order.

Honestly the major issue of this idea is a bunch of the legality nonsense that would have to be navigated, which makes this idea a rather unrealistic one to be honest. An idea better on paper, truthfully, but not for the reasons you've stated.

[Mr. Otaku]

Okay lets address a few things here.

 

1) If you're donating to a mod "bounty" then that's a form of subscription anyway, people do that already with stuff like outfit mods and what not so the framework is still the same.

 

2) Adult mods come to exist because the creators had specific goals/visions for what they wanted in their game and then decided to share them (free or not) but i don't think a bounty will motivate most modders to create anything. If i'm a modder and a mod for something i don't care about wins the bounty on my page then it would just feel like a chore to make it assuming i even can.

 

3) Different games are built differently and every single one needs different technical knowledge to mod it, some games are less moddable than others and some not at all. So a modder could be capable of creating a mod that won the "bounty bid" but they can't do it in the requested game cause they either don't understand how that game works or it's just not moddable.

 

4) Then there's a question of getting everyone to congregate into one place somehow to bid on mods, it'll take two days for it to become completely fragmented and you'll end up with offshoot communities like we already have.\

 

5) A program or an app that acts as a modding tool for all games is quite frankly the most unfeasible and unrealistic thing imaginable unless we somehow get every game company and developer to create games in one single engine which is even more unfeasible lol.

 

Overall, not a great plan.

[Screws]

18 hours ago, Mr. Otaku said:

Okay lets address a few things here.

 

1) If you're donating to a mod "bounty" then that's a form of subscription anyway, people do that already with stuff like outfit mods and what not so the framework is still the same.

 

2) Adult mods come to exist because the creators had specific goals/visions for what they wanted in their game and then decided to share them (free or not) but i don't think a bounty will motivate most modders to create anything. If i'm a modder and a mod for something i don't care about wins the bounty on my page then it would just feel like a chore to make it assuming i even can.

 

3) Different games are built differently and every single one needs different technical knowledge to mod it, some games are less moddable than others and some not at all. So a modder could be capable of creating a mod that won the "bounty bid" but they can't do it in the requested game cause they either don't understand how that game works or it's just not moddable.

 

4) Then there's a question of getting everyone to congregate into one place somehow to bid on mods, it'll take two days for it to become completely fragmented and you'll end up with offshoot communities like we already have.\

 

5) A program or an app that acts as a modding tool for all games is quite frankly the most unfeasible and unrealistic thing imaginable unless we somehow get every game company and developer to create games in one single engine which is even more unfeasible lol.

 

Overall, not a great plan.

1) Not quite. Subscriptions are typically Weekly/Monthly/Annually fees consistently paid. It's basically money that is being paid regularly generally at a fixed rate, like world of warcraft's $15 a month sub fee. Whereas this would be a bit different in the fact that you don't have to regularly donate to it, but it is similar, I will give you that.

2) It's not about winning bounties, my friend. Think of it like a Quest Board in an MMORPG where each bounty is effectively its own quest. The people who post up the bounty are the NPCs looking for help. The Modders are essentially the adventurers that choose which 'adventure' aka Bounty that they want to do, if they want to do any at all. A modder isn't getting forced into making mods for something they do not enjoy, they have a plethora of options to choose from, but they don't have to mod anything at all. After all, they only get paid on job completion like an MMORPG.

3) I think you might be misunderstanding how the bounty system works. In many industries bounties are placed on bugs in various software development teams where indie coders/programmers/etc. will find what is causing the problem in a situation, fix it, and then get paid by the company for it. And again its not like there is 1 bounty up at a time as in this is the only game that can be modded. No no, its a basically an entire board of various games people would like to be modded and are willing to pay to see that mod realized. For example, on the board there might be a bounty for Dungeons 3 ($500), Risk of Rain 2 ($890), and say... Going Medieval ($450). Modder isn't forced to do Risk of Rain 2 mod unless they want to. They can just as easily do the mod for Dungeons 3  or Going Medieval if they prefer.

4) Again, I think you're misunderstanding the entire concept...

5) It's not a modding tool in of itself.. I really don't think you understand the entire idea, my friend.

Another thought exercise to better understand it would be to think of a Wild West Town. A bandit is causing trouble (The Mod that people want) , so the townsfolk (The Donators/People that want the mod and are putting their money on the line) pool together money and set a price on the Bandit's head, I.E. a Bounty on a bounty board. A gunslinger, bounty hunter, w/e you wanna call em (The Modder) can check the bounty board and see if any of the jobs interest him. He might see the bounty for that Troublesome bandit (The previously mentioned mod) and decided to undertake the task of bringing him to justice (I.E. The modder starts making the mod), After justice has been dispensed and turned into the sheriff (Basically the Arbitrators will review the mod to see if it meets the criteria of the bounty). The bounty hunter (The Modder) gets paid the bounty. (The money that was donated into a pool for the bounty)

Not trying to sound condescending to you, Otaku! So forgive me if I come across that way. I just feel like you misunderstood the concept of the bounty board lol.

Edited December 9, 2022 by Screws

[Mr. Otaku]

22 minutes ago, Screws said:

1) Not quite. Subscriptions are typically Weekly/Monthly/Annually fees consistently paid. It's basically money that is being paid regularly generally at a fixed rate, like world of warcraft's $15 a month sub fee. Whereas this would be a bit different in the fact that you don't have to regularly donate to it, but it is similar, I will give you that.

 

I said it's a type of subscription and there are various types. The subscription here would be similar to being a kickstarter supporter where you pledge a sum of money to have your name listed as a supporter.

 

24 minutes ago, Screws said:

2) It's not about winning bounties, my friend. Think of it like a Quest Board in an MMORPG where each bounty is effectively its own quest. The people who post up the bounty are the NPCs looking for help. The Modders are essentially the adventurers that choose which 'adventure' aka Bounty that they want to do, if they want to do any at all. A modder isn't getting forced into making mods for something they do not enjoy, they have a plethora of options to choose from, but they don't have to mod anything at all. After all, they only get paid on job completion like an MMORPG.

 

Doesn't this already happen though? People request mods all the time and sometimes they get picked up by modders that might be interested, there was a thread for a Skyrim mod that's really popular now and i remember participating in that thread where we talked about what the mod should be like and everything, then it was created and expanded upon. I don't see how the system you're describing is any different from that.

 

27 minutes ago, Screws said:

3) I think you might be misunderstanding how the bounty system works. In many industries bounties are placed on bugs in various software development teams where indie coders/programmers/etc. will find what is causing the problem in a situation, fix it, and then get paid by the company for it. And again its not like there is 1 bounty up at a time as in this is the only game that can be modded. No no, its a basically an entire board of various games people would like to be modded and are willing to pay to see that mod realized. For example, on the board there might be a bounty for Dungeons 3 ($500), Risk of Rain 2 ($890), and say... Going Medieval ($450). Modder isn't forced to do Risk of Rain 2 mod unless they want to. They can just as easily do the mod for Dungeons 3  or Going Medieval if they prefer.

 

Alright but that doesn't seem related though. The bugs already exist in a software that already exists so a programmer has to just go through the main code and look for the problem parts and money is acting as the primary incentive here. With modding it's different because the hypothetical mod doesn't exist yet, it's only being requested by someone so that a modder might make it which is not any different from going to a modder's patreon and commissioning them for a mod which you can already do.

 

32 minutes ago, Screws said:

4) Again, I think you're misunderstanding the entire concept...

 

Maybe, i just feel like this is trying to re-invent the wheel in some way.

 

33 minutes ago, Screws said:

5) It's not a modding tool in of itself.. I really don't think you understand the entire idea, my friend.

 

Oh i saw "Modder Program/App" thing on your title so i threw that point in there, if you didn't mean an actual modding software then disregard that point.

 

36 minutes ago, Screws said:

Another thought exercise to better understand it would be to think of a Wild West Town. A bandit is causing trouble (The Mod that people want) , so the townsfolk (The Donators/People that want the mod and are putting their money on the line) pool together money and set a price on the Bandit's head, I.E. a Bounty on a bounty board. A gunslinger, bounty hunter, w/e you wanna call em (The Modder) can check the bounty board and see if any of the jobs interest him. He might see the bounty for that Troublesome bandit (The previously mentioned mod) and decided to undertake the task of bringing him to justice (I.E. The modder starts making the mod), After justice has been dispensed and turned into the sheriff (Basically the Arbitrators will review the mod to see if it meets the criteria of the bounty). The bounty hunter (The Modder) gets paid the bounty. (The money that was donated into a pool for the bounty)

 

Yeah like i said, it just feels like you're trying to rework an already existing thing and i can't see many people getting on board if any at all. Forum polls, discussion threads and requests/commissions already cover everything needed.

 

38 minutes ago, Screws said:

Not trying to sound condescending to you, Otaku! So forgive me if I come across that way. I just feel like you misunderstood the concept of the bounty board lol.

 

Fuck i picked such a cringe username when i signed up here, what was i thinking? So stupid lmao.

[steelpanther24]

One point to bring up as I am on the side that thinks this idea is good in theory but would be impossible in practice.

 

However there are some universal game engines that could have an universal mod tool built for them, specifically I am addressing Mr. Otaku''s point:

19 hours ago, Mr. Otaku said:

5) A program or an app that acts as a modding tool for all games is quite frankly the most unfeasible and unrealistic thing imaginable unless we somehow get every game company and developer to create games in one single engine which is even more unfeasible lol.

 

 

 

https://www.thegamer.com/great-games-use-unreal-4-game-engine/

 

https://www.gamespot.com/gallery/every-unreal-engine-5-game-so-far/2900-3990/#2

 

However, to get to that point, there are some serious knowledge requirements and investments needed.    While I disagree with @Pamatronic's tone, I have to agree with him that the skills required would require a much larger audience (and/or financial incentive) than LL would be able to generate.  

 

 

[Screws]

57 minutes ago, steelpanther24 said:

One point to bring up as I am on the side that thinks this idea is good in theory but would be impossible in practice.

 

However there are some universal game engines that could have an universal mod tool built for them, specifically I am addressing Mr. Otaku''s point:

 

 

 

https://www.thegamer.com/great-games-use-unreal-4-game-engine/

 

https://www.gamespot.com/gallery/every-unreal-engine-5-game-so-far/2900-3990/#2

 

However, to get to that point, there are some serious knowledge requirements and investments needed.    While I disagree with @Pamatronic's tone, I have to agree with him that the skills required would require a much larger audience (and/or financial incentive) than LL would be able to generate.  

 

 

Kind of have to agree with ya on that tbh lol

[Alter Native]

On 12/8/2022 at 8:13 PM, Pamatronic said:

Oh boy, yet another Grand and completely unworkable Idea by someone who has never created anything... Love these.
There were already a few hints of realization in your post, but lemme give you the full version anyway:

Modders do stuff because they enjoy it. If the game isn't interesting to them or simply not accesible for modding, they will leave it alone.
Me and pretty much every other semi-decent modder i´ve ever talked with has some background in programming or the it sector, which means the few peanuts you could raise with a knockoff fiver wouldnt be any incentive to them. They make many times that much in their regular jobs.

And as someone who actually makes quite a bit of money with modding, I can absolutely tell you that the time/earning ration on this is Bad.
I only do it because I have the freedom to do that very specific thing I want to do and get to enjoy it. The second I have to take directions from some yahoo, the math doesn't work anymore.

And this doesn't factor in the Risks when dealing with randos. I´ve done a few commissions (for stuff which closely aligns with my interests anyway), and you have to be very careful from whom you take commissions. If you´re unlucky, you sink hundreds of hours into a job and the recipient doesn't want to pay you because he doesn't like the outcome or insists on some changes which were never mentioned in the initial pitch.
Personally I only take commissions from other Modders or folks who have a basic grasp on the technicals, so their expectations are realistic. But I´ve heard plenty of horror stories from fellow colleagues here.
So yeah, If you turn this into a free for all, quality control on both sides simply wont be possible.

So in conclusion, horrible Idea.
Try to make something yourself and get an Idea of the creative process before you advocate for bringing the Horrors of Fiver and the late stage capitalism gig-economy to LL.

 

This 100%.

The proposed idea is unpractical for the modding community and at best applicable in some nieche cases. 

 

[Screws]

1 hour ago, Mr. Otaku said:

 

I said it's a type of subscription and there are various types. The subscription here would be similar to being a kickstarter supporter where you pledge a sum of money to have your name listed as a supporter.

 

 

Doesn't this already happen though? People request mods all the time and sometimes they get picked up by modders that might be interested, there was a thread for a Skyrim mod that's really popular now and i remember participating in that thread where we talked about what the mod should be like and everything, then it was created and expanded upon. I don't see how the system you're describing is any different from that.

 

 

Alright but that doesn't seem related though. The bugs already exist in a software that already exists so a programmer has to just go through the main code and look for the problem parts and money is acting as the primary incentive here. With modding it's different because the hypothetical mod doesn't exist yet, it's only being requested by someone so that a modder might make it which is not any different from going to a modder's patreon and commissioning them for a mod which you can already do.

 

 

Maybe, i just feel like this is trying to re-invent the wheel in some way.

 

 

Oh i saw "Modder Program/App" thing on your title so i threw that point in there, if you didn't mean an actual modding software then disregard that point.

 

 

Yeah like i said, it just feels like you're trying to rework an already existing thing and i can't see many people getting on board if any at all. Forum polls, discussion threads and requests/commissions already cover everything needed.

 

 

Fuck i picked such a cringe username when i signed up here, what was i thinking? So stupid lmao.

1) I suppose so.. but just because I spend money on a Hershey's bar or pay some guy from Fiverr to make me a mod, doesn't mean I'm subscribed to either of those things.

2) Oh yeah there are always tons of requests, but not many modders interested in making mods for some games. This adds a monetary incentive. Capitalism at its finest. If no one wants to do something for free, put money on the table and someone will be willing to do it lol. For Example, there has been a Sex mod Discord for Risk of Rain 2 for about a year now... Nothing has happened with it. Project is dead in the water. Why? No Programmer/Coder has shown up to create the framework. The main difference is adding a financial incentive to potentially coax a modder into making a project they wouldn't make for free, because now they're getting paid for it.

3) I don't think you understand the bounty system most corporations use whenever there are flaws in their security systems. Hell there are White Hat Hackers that take on these bounties and expose critical flaws within security systems and get paid bounties for discovering these flaws and reporting them to the company. Also there is a difference. If I want to find a modder for skyrim and commission them via patreon to make a mod for me, that's easy to find. However, what about finding a modder that would mod Dungeons 3, Risk of Rain 1 or 2, Going Medieval, Evil Genius, Neverwinter Nights (The original old game), Master of Orion 2. (Not saying I'd want them all to necessarily be lewdly modded) however, you're not really going to find anyone that can/will mod these games via patreon. This idea brings both the people that would pay to have mods made, and willing modders together more easily.

4) It's more like adding actual wheels to a car that's been driving on its rims lol.

5) All good! I meant maybe someone could design some sort of program to make the idea work, to bring modders and potential customers together. People pay money to modders to get mods, and everyone gets more mods as a whole! Its a win win for all really. Modders get paid, players get good mods, everyone can benefit really! Maybe a bit too idealistic of me though haha!

6) Unless someone is passionate about it themselves, a modder isn't going to invest their time and effort into making something someone else asks for. Again, that's why I'm basically suggesting a way to put up a monetary incentive that even if a modder isn't passionate about making a mod for a certain game, they can potentially be drawn in by the promise of a good chunk of money for putting in the effort in making a mod. Most of the time requests go out, and the mod never gets made (See the Risk of Rain 2 sex mod example). Prolly repeating myself but anyway, its just if no one wants to do it for free, there is always willing to do something for the right price lol.

7) Trust me, I've been there, at least you can easily change your username on here unlike some other places lol.

[Screws]

3 minutes ago, Alter Native said:

 

This 100%.

The proposed idea is unpractical for the modding community and at best applicable in some nieche cases. 

 

Impractical* Niche* (Sorry, English major tendencies)

I really don't think so, but to each their own really. If anything it would open the doors for modders to get paid for their work if they chose. It's not forcing anything on anyone, its simply giving out options. For Example, do you think there would be nearly as many doctors and nurses in the world if they didn't make a lot of money? Not saying there aren't those who do it out of the goodness of their hearts, but the world tends to run on money. How many Sewer maintenance workers do you think there would be if they didn't get a rather hefty paycheck?

It offers up a non-invasive way that modders who have the skills to get paid for working on mod projects, thus giving the community as a whole more mods to work with in general.

[DoctaSax]

Fwiw, back when FO4 just came out & everybody was like "how long until we have a proper sexlab-style environment for this game?", I figured a bounty system might've sped things up a bit in the area of modding tools and utilities like a FNIS-type thing. People just kinda assumed that fore would do that, and that arthmoor & co would do the bugfixing mods etc etc, like they either own that corner of the modding market or are obliged to continue doing what they used to do until the end of time. In the meantime it was also sort of expected that anyone else would just have to sit on their hands.

 

I think bounty systems could really be useful for when projects are both quite essential to creating the mod environment in the first place, and require a level of specialized skill that isn't common. The practicality of organizing the financial aspect of it though... eh.

[Screws]

28 minutes ago, DoctaSax said:

Fwiw, back when FO4 just came out & everybody was like "how long until we have a proper sexlab-style environment for this game?", I figured a bounty system might've sped things up a bit in the area of modding tools and utilities like a FNIS-type thing. People just kinda assumed that fore would do that, and that arthmoor & co would do the bugfixing mods etc etc, like they either own that corner of the modding market or are obliged to continue doing what they used to do until the end of time. In the meantime it was also sort of expected that anyone else would just have to sit on their hands.

 

I think bounty systems could really be useful for when projects are both quite essential to creating the mod environment in the first place, and require a level of specialized skill that isn't common. The practicality of organizing the financial aspect of it though... eh.

Yeah the practicality is what is difficult, but I am glad someone else sees the system for what it could potentially be lol. It would definitely take someone with more know-how than I, to feasibly put something together that works to make a fair bounty system especially for getting the ball rolling on mods.

[TRX_Trixter]

You are right.

 

I will tell you simple thing: if skyrim modding will gives me 1000$ at month - i will do it forewer   Biggest problem - financial motivation. Especially for really skilled people. We all need to pay our bills.

 

For example: someone ask you to make some complicated thing. You understand that this work will take for example 40 - 80 hours of your work, additional resources (sometimes additional licenses for money). moddeling, texturing, programming. What price you mast tell? 100$?  1.5$ for one hour of your work. If you tell more.... "no thanks, its too much" 

 

 There are more than enought tallented people who can make really incredible things but they always have one simple question: what for? Modding (i mean really complicated projects like SexLab) is oftenly a really professional work. Almost the same as different parts of commercial game developing. And this is not only question of professional skills like modeling or programing but a lot of additional stuff: mod support, testing, bugfixing, work with community consultations / help / requests / idiots in comments etc And all of this is time of your life.  Will you spend it for 1.5$ per hour? I don think so.

 

Few examples for your understanding:

 

1. COtR = 8 month of work. Team of 5 people + more than 1000$ from our pockets for licenses and additional stuff / hell of a problems with DAZ and DMC strikes = free for all mod. My people ask me: what for?

 

2. TRX SOS addons = 3-4 month of my work + money for licenses (original resources) and help of other modmakers with texturing (yep its not for thank you) = free for all mod + little Patreon support. What for?

 

Yes im a maniac and i will work further even at war but most of the people not like me.

 

Real problems:

 

1. Financial motivation and targeting 

 

You can tell its a problem? People dont want to pay for mods a good money? Nexus monthly donation report for last month: 1400 000$ of donations for Skyrim mods... O_o

For these money we can request from professional game developers full port of DAZ gen 8 bodys to Skyrim with full package of new professional game and sexlab animations. 

For one month of Nexus donations.

 

2. Most of really tallented pepople cant do a simple thing - project management. No one knows about them - in simple words. They dont know how to solve this and have no time for this.

 

So they need someone or something that gives to them this ability with minimum time loss. This is one of the biggest problem. Sometimes people spend a years for it. Someone cant make a good screenshots, someone cant make video or just good presentation, someone cant make "beautifull" description, some other people dont have time to support projects and etc.

 

3.   Team management

Large projects need a team work. How to collect and manage this team? Have you any ideas how to solve this problem?

 

4. People dont understand what about they asking for.

 

Customer: Hey, can you port this character from (somewhere) for me to Skyrim? 

I: Yes 300$ (just for example)

Customer: O_o Are you crazy? It must be so simple!

 

5. Patreon problem.

 

I know a lot of people who drop off modding for money because of "beautifull" Patreon system: someone pay you for tier, then take your content, decline his payment and go away.

[Screws]

1 hour ago, TRX_Trixter said:

You are right.

 

I will tell you simple thing: if skyrim modding will gives me 1000$ at month - i will do it forewer   Biggest problem - financial motivation. Especially for really skilled people. We all need to pay our bills.

 

For example: someone ask you to make some complicated thing. You understand that this work will take for example 40 - 80 hours of your work, additional resources (sometimes additional licenses for money). moddeling, texturing, programming. What price you mast tell? 100$?  1.5$ for one hour of your work. If you tell more.... "no thanks, its too much" 

 

 There are more than enought tallented people who can make really incredible things but they always have one simple question: what for? Modding (i mean really complicated projects like SexLab) is oftenly a really professional work. Almost the same as different parts of commercial game developing. And this is not only question of professional skills like modeling or programing but a lot of additional stuff: mod support, testing, bugfixing, work with community consultations / help / requests / idiots in comments etc And all of this is time of your life.  Will you spend it for 1.5$ per hour? I don think so.

 

Few examples for your understanding:

 

1. COtR = 8 month of work. Team of 5 people + more than 1000$ from our pockets for licenses and additional stuff / hell of a problems with DAZ and DMC strikes = free for all mod. My people ask me: what for?

 

2. TRX SOS addons = 3-4 month of my work + money for licenses (original resources) and help of other modmakers with texturing (yep its not for thank you) = free for all mod + little Patreon support. What for?

 

Yes im a maniac and i will work further even at war but most of the people not like me.

 

Real problems:

 

1. Financial motivation and targeting 

 

You can tell its a problem? People dont want to pay for mods a good money? Nexus monthly donation report for last month: 1400 000$ of donations for Skyrim mods... O_o

For these money we can request from professional game developers full port of DAZ gen 8 bodys to Skyrim with full package of new professional game and sexlab animations. 

For one month of Nexus donations.

 

2. Most of really tallented pepople cant do a simple thing - project management. No one knows about them - in simple words. They dont know how to solve this and have no time for this.

 

So they need someone or something that gives to them this ability with minimum time loss. This is one of the biggest problem. Sometimes people spend a years for it. Someone cant make a good screenshots, someone cant make video or just good presentation, someone cant make "beautifull" description, some other people dont have time to support projects and etc.

 

3.   Team management

Large projects need a team work. How to collect and manage this team? Have you any ideas how to solve this problem?

 

4. People dont understand what about they asking for.

 

Customer: Hey, can you port this character from (somewhere) for me to Skyrim? 

I: Yes 300$ (just for example)

Customer: O_o Are you crazy? It must be so simple!

 

5. Patreon problem.

 

I know a lot of people who drop off modding for money because of "beautifull" Patreon system: someone pay you for tier, then take your content, decline his payment and go away.

Yeah, so you see how a bounty system could work as well, right? Offering jobs that could easily (I'd say) give up to $1k per completion. Of course it would be a 1 time lump sum payout, rather then a continuous and reliable stream of dosh coming throughout the year. So.. there is that. Still I think it has a lot of potential to work into something amazing. Everyone knows exactly what they are getting.

I appreciate the response : )

Edited December 10, 2022 by Screws

[TRX_Trixter]

3 hours ago, Screws said:

Yeah, so you see how a bounty system could work as well, right? Offering jobs that could easily (I'd say) give up to $1k per completion. Of course it would be a 1 time lump sum payout, rather then a continuous and reliable stream of dosh coming throughout the year. So.. there is that. Still I think it has a lot of potential to work into something amazing. Everyone knows exactly what they are getting.

I appreciate the response : )

Its can be a lot of different systems. You will have three main directions to think about:

 

1. When people presenting as downloadable content his own mods. My idea + my work

2. Requested content (like commissions work)

3. Collect money for big projects or long time work support (like kikstarter etc)

 

Three main questions: how to get money from users? How to give money to modders? How to avoid "patreon trick": (subscribe-download-usubscribe)?

 

One of the best i saw was on one old japanese site: 1 unique download = 1$. Sounds fullish but its not. I think you saw here, on Nexus and on many other sites mods with 100 000 unique downloads and with 100 likes   Beleave me if authors will have even 10 cent for each download.... 

Nexus take this system but there 1000 unique download = 1$ Idiotic... Yes because Nexus pay for this. But when user itself pay for directly to modder - this system work in other way. 

In this case you will have some questions too:

 

1. If user have no money? - Nexus. Or other way: many authiors make two versions of content: fre for all and for money.

2. 1$ is too much!!! (aha... tell it to DAZ, renderotica etc...),  But even 10 cents will be enought.

3. ....

 

What it gives? This solves problems of long time support, big cost (20 000$ project  = 20 000 downloads), no "blank" downloads and you dont need likes and other not working shit for showing to other users content quallity. Downloads count will be more then enought.

 

Is this a best system? I dont know. Will this work in your case? I dont know. Its just a thoughts...

 

And last one thing.

 

First of all you need to understand what do you do: system for people (without someons commisions) or your bussines like Nexus or Patreon.

 

P.S.

 

How you can make money when you give bukses form users directly to modders? Am... Professional content showcase for modders. As i alredy told good showcase is a one of the biggest problems for modders because in a lot of cases description + screenshots + videos ssale peoples content. You can make brilliant content but with shitty presentations (like mine for example) you will loose. But you need to understand in this case that shit is a shit even in golden sprite and not do this.

 

Edited December 10, 2022 by TRX_Trixter

[belegost]

1 hour ago, TRX_Trixter said:

You can make brilliant content but with shitty presentations (like mine for example)

One word: boobs.

 

Boobs on the front page. Boobs as the first thing a potential user sees. Boobs always sell. Even if it's just another SoS addon and there are no actual boobs in the mod, find a way to show nice pair of boobs (or ass - that also works). You want to draw attention. Anything else is irrelevant in the first impression. Most people don't bother even that much,  just skimming the title,  but if there are boobs they are more likely to click and see what's up. Then they can read description and see what's it all about,  but that's after they already clicked. They may leave at that point or they may actually become intrigued. But that's already more than they would've done under normal circumstances.

[t.ara]

Really a terrible idea which of course is not working in the reality.

All that sponsoring and moneytising is a future-offering death for modding/creating mods.

You will see this. The most of the earlier created stuff is nowadays administered by third party users, with little make make up on stuff of the past. In the badest way the stuff is 1:1 like FNIS and simply the money is rolling into the cash register. This is absolutly PERVERS.

The more I think about that the stuff via FNIS (which is the most part of LL and also NEXUS) is making money and hurting FORES AGB, btw. also the AGB of Creation-Kit is being hurted same way as the use of Creation Kit is meant to be used privatly for own stuff, which can be created but not being moneytised is simply unbelievable.

All of this development will take care that some guys who are impudent enough, will use something like patreon, and sponsor also patreon to get money "for nothing", only the platform-costs-which is like google, facebook, amazon and others ideal to built-up-imperiums which will once buy the whole world-at least there will be one single firm, which is ruling all others...ideal to have thumb-rolling life after some work and see the dollars income. This is the new world of virtual business-and this you want to build up also here ????? As a creator of mods I absolutely will not participate at this (forgive me) shit of internet. As the major creators like ASHAL need to be payed for the servers and the work to keep the page running, their team to have some moderators payed is fine, same on the nexus-everything in another dimension, there....but not for a modding into a ready-to-play-game. This is ridiculous.

 

Different games can not be modded same way with same depth and as pamatronic told, is modding only possible if the interest is there. If you want to see more qualified mods, you need to work in teams, which is not for all of us "ideal". And btw. would I never let me to become pressed to have a deadline. Not for money and not for fun.

Professional modding by making money is simply not allowed-this is a positive aspect. Those, who like to do something really remarkable can use the open game engines and create some new stuff. There´s lot of open engines available nowadays and btw. there are also engines, which can be used PROFESSIONAL, like gamebryo. In that case can the teams work a lot and also get their respected income if they create a serious product. Such teams like illusion-softwork in the past made their way and become famous.

 

And sex-related 3D-gaming is depending on a most complex game-mechanic, on a most innovative animation-engine you can get. This will stay a wish for all times. What there until now has been done in skyrim and co. you probably will never see inside of a professional product as this would no serious company would support.

 

So take it easy and enjoy how it is actually. And have the hope that the few creators are staying healthy many years to offer some content "with love and for free".

Edited December 10, 2022 by t.ara

[Pamatronic]

10 hours ago, TRX_Trixter said:

Biggest problem - financial motivation.

Have you ever thought about "creating" stuff for sims4? The average user over there has long abandoned all braincells and might consider this a viable statement.

As mentioned before, the Really talented people who make worthwhile stuff don't care about the money, they do it because its fun to them and they want to add something to a game they enjoy. And on the other hand we have folks like you who are brazen enough to write shit like this:

5 hours ago, TRX_Trixter said:

Three main questions: how to get money from users?

 

5 hours ago, TRX_Trixter said:

One of the best i saw was on one old japanese site: 1 unique download = 1$. Sounds fullish but its not.

Have you ever considered applying for a job at EA? I think you might feel right at home there.

Sorry, but you are the type who makes some minor low effort cosmetics and then gets mad if people aren't a fan of micro-transactions. Because that's exactly what you are proposing here.
 

[TRX_Trixter]

7 minutes ago, Pamatronic said:

Have you ever considered applying for a job at EA? I think you might feel right at home there.

 

Aha. Deaminig about it. Look in to my profile here before writing shit like this and you will see how much "microtransactions" there are.

 

15 minutes ago, Pamatronic said:

Sorry, but you are the type who makes some minor low effort cosmetics and then gets mad if people aren't a fan of micro-transactions. Because that's exactly what you are proposing here.

 

Try to recreate by youeself any of my "minor cosmetics", altruistic genious. 

[Pamatronic]

1 minute ago, TRX_Trixter said:

Aha. Deaminig about it. Look in to my profile here before writing shit like this and you will see how much "microtransactions" there are.

I don't look at peoples profiles before quoting. I go by their posts. And Im sorry if I misinterpreted this, but I really don't know what else "1 unique dowloand = 1$, sounds good", could be interpreted as other than endorsing those greedy business practices we see all the times from those companies.

 

4 minutes ago, TRX_Trixter said:

Try to recreate by youeself any of my "minor cosmetics", altruistic genious. 

I have dabbled in character modelling, and I didn't even have to use frickin DAZ assets for it. therefore I know Creating A statue with a wiener tacked on isn't high art.
And honestly it doesn't matter, If you had fun creating it, that's the important part. But don't go around claiming that you "deserve" a dollar per download.

[TRX_Trixter]

9 minutes ago, Pamatronic said:

I have dabbled in character modelling, and I didn't even have to use frickin DAZ assets for it. therefore I know Creating A statue with a wiener tacked on isn't high art.
And honestly it doesn't matter, If you had fun creating it, that's the important part. But don't go around claiming that you "deserve" a dollar per download.

Im not the professional artist and my work is not a masterpieces. And i newer pretend for this.

 

But.. Show me your hi artistic characters creations. Just want to look at really professional work instead of "frickin DAZ assets". Yours must be much mor better right? 

 

And.... where do you saw my claiming? Almos all my content is free for all. 

 

15 minutes ago, Pamatronic said:

And Im sorry if I misinterpreted this,

You misinterpreted reason of this topic at all. People make their work. Some of it they share for free and some for money. You think their work not cost that money? Ok, dont pay for it. Wat is your problem? All around you must work for "thank you"?

[Pamatronic]

15 minutes ago, TRX_Trixter said:

You misinterpreted reason of this topic at all. People make their work. Some of it they share for free and some for money. You think their work not cost that money? Ok, dont pay for it. Wat is your problem? All around you must work for "thank you"?

My "Problem" with this topic and some of your posts is that Its all about Money.

Again, modding is something that should be done out of passion. Lets use @t.ara as an example. Zap has been an absolute cornerstone of Adult modding for ages. And now Look at her post above to see whats her stance on monetization...

And this is true for most of us. Users who think that money should be the primary incentive when doing this, are simply a negative influence on the overall community.
If all you can think about Is how to commercialize modding, you probably should just stop and go for a more lucrative conventional occupation.
Making some bucks as a side effect is all fine and dandy, but Making it the driving factor is poison for any creative process.