toys Toy Story SE & LE

[bubba999]

I met Millionce at the Orc stronghold. She's down in her cellar and keeps saying "You're not supposed to be in here." What to do?

[VirginMarie]

4 hours ago, ntesterrr52 said:

I am stuck at the Phase Stone encounter quest stage after picking up and reading the "Degeneracy book". I cannot activate the stone. Is there an activation condition?

1. Is the mod installed successfully? Run the Toys MCM - Setup Tab - Installation Test. Pass or fail? If fail, follow instructions.
2. Is this a new game?
3. Only condition is that the quest has told you to go to that quest marker. Do you have a quest marker on it when the quest is active in your Journal? EDIT: another condition is that you are not in combat, so maybe a slaughterfish is wanting you for lunch?
4. What is the current objective in your Toy Story quest? The exact wording please (or a screenshot)
5. Did you make a save and load it after starting a new game? Toys&Love wont finish initializing till that happens.
6. EDIT: I see you are asking questions for VR... you using VR? Please don't expect Toys mods to work well with VR... no idea if that's the problem in this case or not

Edited May 24, 2022 by VirginMarie

[VirginMarie]

1 hour ago, bubba999 said:

I met Millionce at the Orc stronghold. She's down in her cellar and keeps saying "You're not supposed to be in here." What to do?

 

2 mods are listed in Known Mod Conflicts - Toy Story that cause this.

 

If you don't have one of them, we may be finding another mod similar that changes the cellar too.

[bubba999]

1 hour ago, VirginMarie said:

 

2 mods are listed in Known Mod Conflicts - Toy Story that cause this.

 

If you don't have one of them, we may be finding another mod similar that changes the cellar too.

 

I don't have any of those and became an Orc plaything using Sexlab Solutions. No luck. I wish she would leave her basement....

[gregaaz]

12 minutes ago, bubba999 said:

 

I don't have any of those and became an Orc plaything using Sexlab Solutions. No luck. I wish she would leave her basement....

 

Any mod that changes the basement in any way can cause this issue for Toy Story if you don't patch your conflicts. 

 

You might be able to get Milonce to leave the basement if you prid her formID and then use moveto.player in the console. 

[bubba999]

35 minutes ago, gregaaz said:

 

Any mod that changes the basement in any way can cause this issue for Toy Story if you don't patch your conflicts. 

 

You might be able to get Milonce to leave the basement if you prid her formID and then use moveto.player in the console. 

 

That worked. Thanks.

[VirginMarie]

56 minutes ago, bubba999 said:

 

I don't have any of those and became an Orc plaything using Sexlab Solutions. No luck. I wish she would leave her basement....

 

This gave me an idea, for a future release, for any situation where you've been considered a trespasser...

 

I could make it so if you don't talk to her for a while (regardless of the trespasser thing), but are in proximity, she DOES leave her basement for a bit.   

 

[ntesterrr52]

18 hours ago, VirginMarie said:

1. Is the mod installed successfully? Run the Toys MCM - Setup Tab - Installation Test. Pass or fail? If fail, follow instructions.
2. Is this a new game?
3. Only condition is that the quest has told you to go to that quest marker. Do you have a quest marker on it when the quest is active in your Journal? EDIT: another condition is that you are not in combat, so maybe a slaughterfish is wanting you for lunch?
4. What is the current objective in your Toy Story quest? The exact wording please (or a screenshot)
5. Did you make a save and load it after starting a new game? Toys&Love wont finish initializing till that happens.
6. EDIT: I see you are asking questions for VR... you using VR? Please don't expect Toys mods to work well with VR... no idea if that's the problem in this case or not

A short update. 

 

After doing 1. I get a pop up message say appoximatly: Cant run test while in combat or busy. I similar messege is given, when trying to activate the Phase stone so I think this is the underlying problem. It is regardless of combat, because it occurs in a fresh start.

2. Tried on multiple saves. Fresh. Non Fresh. Saved, reloaded.

5. yes

6. yes, VR

 

Gonna try making a screenhot at some point. 

 

[VirginMarie]

3 hours ago, ntesterrr52 said:

A short update. 

 

After doing 1. I get a pop up message say appoximatly: Cant run test while in combat or busy. I similar messege is given, when trying to activate the Phase stone so I think this is the underlying problem. It is regardless of combat, because it occurs in a fresh start.

2. Tried on multiple saves. Fresh. Non Fresh. Saved, reloaded.

5. yes

6. yes, VR

 

Gonna try making a screenhot at some point. 

 

 

Its the VR. VR is not supported.

 

I'd added this FAQ just now....  Can Toys&Love be used with VR?

[IBAGadget]

Sadly, even with the upgrade, CoTN: Winterhold still breaks Nelacar. Tried moving up to his room and then using moveto player command to bring him in, but he just turns around and walks back downstairs after telling the player he doesn't concern himself with college business.

 

 

Time to start another new game I guess..........

[VirginMarie]

54 minutes ago, IBAGadget said:

Sadly, even with the upgrade, CoTN: Winterhold still breaks Nelacar. Tried moving up to his room and then using moveto player command to bring him in, but he just turns around and walks back downstairs after telling the player he doesn't concern himself with college business.

 

 

Time to start another new game I guess..........

 

I would expect the solution implemented to only work on a new game. Its about Nelly's AI package, and once Nelly is already loaded, his AI is baked in.

 

On a new game, he's going to a vanilla marker, instead of the custom one I was using. It was this custom one that CoTN: Winterhold is killing.

Edited May 26, 2022 by VirginMarie

[IBAGadget]

6 hours ago, VirginMarie said:

 

I would expect the solution implemented to only work on a new game. Its about Nelly's AI package, and once Nelly is already loaded, his AI is baked in.

 

On a new game, he's going to a vanilla marker, instead of the custom one I was using. It was this custom one that CoTN: Winterhold is killing.

Ah, right. 

 

I'll start a new game tonight and see how it goes.

 

Edit: thinking about it, I had started a new game, because I had to re-install CoTN: Winterhold. I'll start a new game and give it another shot anyway. As there is significant changes to the Winterhold Inn, maybe I'll move it below all the toys mods and see if that does the trick. Your mod tells Nelacar's AI where to go, but then Winterhold modifies that. 

 

could work?

Edited May 26, 2022 by IBAGadget
new information

[VirginMarie]

4 hours ago, IBAGadget said:

Ah, right. 

 

I'll start a new game tonight and see how it goes.

 

Edit: thinking about it, I had started a new game, because I had to re-install CoTN: Winterhold. I'll start a new game and give it another shot anyway. As there is significant changes to the Winterhold Inn, maybe I'll move it below all the toys mods and see if that does the trick. Your mod tells Nelacar's AI where to go, but then Winterhold modifies that. 

 

could work?

 

Toy Story would need to load AFTER CoTN: Winterhold, if you want it to "win".

 

But I would not imagine it's changing actors.

[Varithina]

Just got to talk to millonce, in the cellar, having worked through the various conversation options, I finally got to the one where she wanted me to spank her, had the music for a scene to be running, and the save and quick save are greyed out as would be expected, but the conversation with her does not close and nothing else then happens, after a while of music just playing and nothing else happening, I get the ability to move around again, but the quest does not update to show anything else, and she will not talk to me about anything again, though save and quick save are still greyed out which makes me think something has not triggered.

[VirginMarie]

37 minutes ago, Varithina said:

Just got to talk to millonce, in the cellar, having worked through the various conversation options, I finally got to the one where she wanted me to spank her, had the music for a scene to be running, and the save and quick save are greyed out as would be expected, but the conversation with her does not close and nothing else then happens, after a while of music just playing and nothing else happening, I get the ability to move around again, but the quest does not update to show anything else, and she will not talk to me about anything again, though save and quick save are still greyed out which makes me think something has not triggered.

 

If you go back to a save before this happened...

1. .... and run the Toys&Love MCM - Setup tab - Installation Test... is it a pass or fail?
2. .... does trying again with Millonce recreate the problem?

For this to happen, it's an external factor, not the specific outcome in the quest. Possibly you are running on a corrupt save...

• When you first installed Toys, did you start a new game? Its the requirement.  do I really need to start a new game?
• If you DID start a new game, have you since then, broken the Golden Rule ?

Some things to know if you are trying again...

• Pressing the Scene End hotkey (see all hotkeys in Toys MCM), will skip the scene instead of just waiting for a non-scene. Might even result in being able to progress the quest.
• Using Toys MCM - Debug Tab - Player Reset, if you are stuck, will unstuck you. Might also let the quest proceed, but not likely.

...might help to know what doing each of those ends up doing.

 

In conclusion...

• If #1 above is a fail, must fix that
• If #2 does not recreate the problem, you will continue to have problems elsewhere most likely. There is still a root cause
• Figuring out what to recommend will need first, answers to each of the questions above

[IBAGadget]

8 hours ago, VirginMarie said:

 

Toy Story would need to load AFTER CoTN: Winterhold, if you want it to "win".

 

But I would not imagine it's changing actors.

I don't think it's changing the actors, but I think it's changing the markers. You've got Nelacar using vanilla markers, but CoTN: Winterhold changes the inn so much, that the vanilla markers don't exist. In order for Nelacar to be of use in the Azura quest, his AI would have to be updated to use the new room marker created by CoTN. In my current load order, Toy Story is loading after Winterhold, so it's 'winning', and setting Nelacar's AI to use a marker that doesn't exist anymore. He'll talk to me initially, but when he then has to move, there's nowhere for him to go, and so he breaks. 

 

If I load Winterhold after Toy Story, that might set his AI on the right path, so to speak.

 

I'm going to break the golden rule for this test, and just swap these two mods load order, load my save before going to winterhold, and see what happens. If it works, then I'll dump this playthrough, keep the load order and start a fresh game. If it doesn't work, then I'll dump CoTN: W and start a fresh game. 

[VirginMarie]

34 minutes ago, IBAGadget said:

I don't think it's changing the actors, but I think it's changing the markers. You've got Nelacar using vanilla markers, but CoTN: Winterhold changes the inn so much, that the vanilla markers don't exist. In order for Nelacar to be of use in the Azura quest, his AI would have to be updated to use the new room marker created by CoTN. In my current load order, Toy Story is loading after Winterhold, so it's 'winning', and setting Nelacar's AI to use a marker that doesn't exist anymore. He'll talk to me initially, but when he then has to move, there's nowhere for him to go, and so he breaks. 

 

If I load Winterhold after Toy Story, that might set his AI on the right path, so to speak.

 

I'm going to break the golden rule for this test, and just swap these two mods load order, load my save before going to winterhold, and see what happens. If it works, then I'll dump this playthrough, keep the load order and start a fresh game. If it doesn't work, then I'll dump CoTN: W and start a fresh game. 

 

Oh I did not imagine CoTN: Winterhold being that destructive. There's no hope for it to work at all. Fuck that mod... I mean seriously wtf? The only way to make it compatible is to not do this in Winterhold.

Edited May 27, 2022 by VirginMarie

[IBAGadget]

For some perspective on how much CoTN changes just the inn in Winterhold:

 

Exterior and interior - Nelacar's room is underneath the crosshair in the center of the pic. Upper floor.

 

All of the CoTN mods are beautiful creations, overhauling the appearance completely of the respective towns/cities, giving each of them their own unique flavor. The layouts are slightly altered, and each inn is different, so they don't look like they all came out of the same Ikea catalog. Because of these changes, they do tend to mess with other mods that modify the vanilla buildings. Some mods have patches to work around these changes (Falkreath Bathhouse, Winterhold Bathhouse), but not all unfortunately. I'm not savvy enough with xEdit to find out how CoTN or Toy Story changes Nelacar's AI, so I'm just guessing on the load order option. I'll move Winterhold below Toy Story, run a quick test and see what happens. 

 

I hate to lose winterhold, but if it's a choice between that an Toy Story, well......

 

spank me Urag, harder....

[VirginMarie]

11 minutes ago, IBAGadget said:

spank me Urag, harder....

 

No. It's... Harder Daddy! Harder!

 

As for that mod, it needs to be spanked into oblivion. Mod's that do this should be outlawed!

 

If the vanilla marker I use is gone, its gone. Toy Story can't work, there no load order solution. Its not about the AI package, its about no marker for the AI package to use, so he can never reach the destination. To fix you gotta go into the CK or XEdit and give the AI package a new marker to use. Then it will work (after you start a new game so it registered the change).

[IBAGadget]

Yah, I just finished my test run. no change in Nelacar's behavior. Sadly, I have no clue how to alter Nelacar's AI to put in the correct marker, so it's back into storage for Winterhold, and another new game for me.

 

I wonder if the CoTN author would be willing to make a patch to revert the inn to its vanilla state?

[gregaaz]

10 hours ago, IBAGadget said:

For some perspective on how much CoTN changes just the inn in Winterhold:

 

Exterior and interior - Nelacar's room is underneath the crosshair in the center of the pic. Upper floor.

 

All of the CoTN mods are beautiful creations, overhauling the appearance completely of the respective towns/cities, giving each of them their own unique flavor. The layouts are slightly altered, and each inn is different, so they don't look like they all came out of the same Ikea catalog. Because of these changes, they do tend to mess with other mods that modify the vanilla buildings. Some mods have patches to work around these changes (Falkreath Bathhouse, Winterhold Bathhouse), but not all unfortunately. I'm not savvy enough with xEdit to find out how CoTN or Toy Story changes Nelacar's AI, so I'm just guessing on the load order option. I'll move Winterhold below Toy Story, run a quick test and see what happens. 

 

I hate to lose winterhold, but if it's a choice between that an Toy Story, well......

 

spank me Urag, harder....

 

Ooh, I like that inn. Might have to grab it for my build. If I do, I'll make a patch for TS and share it (hint hint @VirginMarie it'll be easier for me to patch if the mod goes back to using a custom marker instead of using the vanilla one)

[VirginMarie]

2 hours ago, gregaaz said:

 

Ooh, I like that inn. Might have to grab it for my build. If I do, I'll make a patch for TS and share it (hint hint @VirginMarie it'll be easier for me to patch if the mod goes back to using a custom marker instead of using the vanilla one)

 

The current implementation is less prone to other mods conflicting. It would not make sense to revert back to having 2 things to break instead of one.

[gregaaz]

1 hour ago, VirginMarie said:

 

The current implementation is less prone to other mods conflicting. It would not make sense to revert back to having 2 things to break instead of one.

 

Haha fair enough. I suppose I can find the target marker in the plugin readily enough so it's no skin off my back either way. 

[VirginMarie]

2 minutes ago, gregaaz said:

 

Haha fair enough. I suppose I can find the target marker in the plugin readily enough so it's no skin off my back either way. 

 

The AI Package I added to Nelly, routes him to the vanilla X-Marker where he stands behind his desk in his room. All it needs is to take him to an alternate marker like that, really does not even matter where.

 

What I don't get is how the mod could remove that vanilla marker? Nelly might be broken just for vanilla sandboxing and the Azura quest. If that's the case he could end up stuck beyond hope that my package is going to work, depending on what's already happened, so we can't assume the fix I describe is enough.

 

Patching like this is fine for personal use, but if you publish it, now you gotta maintain it for changes to potentially both mods. You gonna do that? I'd not. And I'm not going to host the patch and have to support it. CoTN shold die in hell, not be supported.

[gregaaz]

1 hour ago, VirginMarie said:

 

The AI Package I added to Nelly, routes him to the vanilla X-Marker where he stands behind his desk in his room. All it needs is to take him to an alternate marker like that, really does not even matter where.

 

What I don't get is how the mod could remove that vanilla marker? Nelly might be broken just for vanilla sandboxing and the Azura quest. If that's the case he could end up stuck beyond hope that my package is going to work, depending on what's already happened, so we can't assume the fix I describe is enough.

 

Patching like this is fine for personal use, but if you publish it, now you gotta maintain it for changes to potentially both mods. You gonna do that? I'd not. And I'm not going to host the patch and have to support it. CoTN shold die in hell, not be supported.

 

I downloaded COTN Winterhold and reviewed its contents. Here is what I found:

 

• COTN does not disable any vanilla markers. It does move them to new locations.
• None of the new locations appear to be out of bounds, -30,000 Z type stuff. They all have granular coordinates that suggest they were hand placed in the revised cell
• This includes, for example, 91AEA, seen below:

 

I'm actually rather unclear after looking at this why @IBAGadget still had a loss of function after you switched to a vanilla marker. I'd be interested to know if any of COTN's markers on his mod stack are being overwritten by other mods. Also, these are persistent refs, so if COTN was added after the start of the game they will of course all be broken. I don't recall if IBA tested this on a new game or not to verify.

 

Anyway, after looking at it, I don't think this should even need a patch if you're pointing Nelly to a vanilla marker. They're all there and adjusted for the new geometry.

 

Condemnation of the mod to hell may be premature.