Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

[Reesewow]

On 3/3/2018 at 12:36 PM, Gimlord said:

Hello. I want to use this mod but have also zaz 8 plus which says that zep should be installed before zaz, but mod organizer asks to put zep after zap.
So my question is what load order should i use to get the mod working, if possible with no issues. I would clear zep with tes5edit, but have no idea how to clear conflicts between mods and even if i should do that, cause i can find the conflicts but don't know if i should remove them.

Some discussion has already been made on previous pages you can check out, but the main thing is:

 

- This mod is intended to be used with ZAP 7 and ZEP.  ZEP conflicts with ZAP 8/8+.

- If you want to use ZAP 8+ with no conflicts you should remove ZEP from Devious Followers.  This will let you remove Heretical Resources and ZEP, and the only thing you lose from Devious Followers is the crawling animation while enslaved in towns (which is kinda buggy anyway).

- To do the above you simply need to delete the ZEP crawling effect from Devious Followers and clean its master list using TES5Edit.  Previous pages have people describing exactly what to delete in more detail.

 

[steelmagpie]

the other way which may or may not work is uninstal ZEP..  Run FNIS Generater then once its done reinstal ZEP.. This is kind of a pain as it must be done anytime you alter any mods which require you to re run rhe FNIS generate ..  Handy if you are like me and know nothing about TES5 edit though..  Down and dirty fix haha ..  (I say NO to overwriting anything with the ZEP and it allows you to play but with no crawl)

 

[BigOnes69]

On 3/3/2018 at 3:36 PM, Gimlord said:

Hello. I want to use this mod but have also zaz 8 plus which says that zep should be installed before zaz, but mod organizer asks to put zep after zap.
So my question is what load order should i use to get the mod working, if possible with no issues. I would clear zep with tes5edit, but have no idea how to clear conflicts between mods and even if i should do that, cause i can find the conflicts but don't know if i should remove them.

In MO on the left hand mod installation side put zep before all other sex lab files so it is overwritten and zaz 8 after sexlab and some of the other framework. On the right side move ZEP esm above all other sexlab esm so it is overwritten. Do not run fnis with zep installed. Always when you want to run fnis  uncheck on the left hand installation of zep. I have been doing this for some time now and have had no hiccups. It probably depends on what mods you have installed.

[Krynn]

Which mod do I need for the slave Tats?
Or does it not work yet?

Another question:
Town Collar and Iron Prisoner Chains have no texture with me?!

 

Edit:

I also get a Devious Devices Error.. Hard Bondage Items missing or something like this.

[valcon767]

13 hours ago, Krynn said:

Which mod do I need for the slave Tats?
Or does it not work yet?

Another question:
Town Collar and Iron Prisoner Chains have no texture with me?!

 

Edit:

I also get a Devious Devices Error.. Hard Bondage Items missing or something like this.

latest versions of Slave Tats and Slave Tats Event Bridge worked for me

https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/619-slavetats/

https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2126-slavetats-events-bridge/

and some slave tats packs of tattoos of course.

 

the devious devices error sounds like the one i hit from Cursed Loot with it spawning bound girls (have not had it show up since i turned the number of Bound Girls to 0)

 

[Krynn]

2 hours ago, valcon767 said:

latest versions of Slave Tats and Slave Tats Event Bridge worked for me

https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/619-slavetats/

https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2126-slavetats-events-bridge/

and some slave tats packs of tattoos of course.

 

the devious devices error sounds like the one i hit from Cursed Loot with it spawning bound girls (have not had it show up since i turned the number of Bound Girls to 0)

 

 

Ah, thanks, I'll try that!
Do you also happen to know what the Town Collar and Iron Prisoner Chains have no textures with me?
Heretical Resources is actually up to date.

 

Edit:

The Error is: [Keyword<zad_DeviousHeavyBondage(0f05226c)]>

 

Where are the textures / mashes taken from? Maybe DDx or something is outdated for me. It was not Zaz.

 

 

[Krynn]

I have now installed Slave Tats Event Bridge and SlaveTats-1.3.0-beta-2.7z, but I do not get any tattoos.
Do I need anything else or when do you get these?

 

 

[valcon767]

12 hours ago, Krynn said:

I have now installed Slave Tats Event Bridge and SlaveTats-1.3.0-beta-2.7z, but I do not get any tattoos.
Do I need anything else or when do you get these?

 

 

you will also need a tattoo pack (get it on the slave tats page optional downloads) so it has something to apply.

to get them i had to turn the tattoo option on DFB and then get enslaved.

 

[Lostdreamer]

Liking this mod a lot.

 

It does something I have been looking for for a long while. The whole 'loanshark' thing of adding a time limit to gameplay. Now there are consequences for hanging around!

 

I havn't experimented with the enslavement that much (the objective for my build is that you try and avoid such things...) but it does seem to work.

Top marks that man.

[Lozeak]

You need Rapetattoos not eventbridge.

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/71329-rapetattoos/

[Krynn]

2 hours ago, Lozeak said:

You need Rapetattoos not eventbridge.

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/71329-rapetattoos/

 

Thanks, it works!
I only lack the textures described above.

[steelmagpie]

I can highly recommend this pack.. it is a little on the big side but has pretty much all the tats you'll ever need  https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/3334-slavetats-all-in-one-wreduced-sizes/

 

Hope that helps...  LL's search function is down for me so links to good  stuff is a wonderful thing

 

[Senick]

is it at all possible via console to reduce that chance for the "slut" event to occur, it gets a bit annoying when it happens like 3+ times in a row on the same NPC I'm trying to talk to, maybe a cooldown of some sort would be nice in a future update? Even if it's only for like 30 seconds or something. (or configurable)

the mod is great though, thank you so much for your hard work!

[doometernity]

On 3/5/2018 at 10:35 AM, Krynn said:

 

Another question:
Town Collar and Iron Prisoner Chains have no texture with me?!

 

I've got a similar problem. All 3 items seem to be missing for me, (mittens/boots/collar) leaving my pc with just stumps. I have all dev builds and all requirements installed

 

Edit: Ok I figured out part of the problem was I hadn't run Bodyslide on DDx and DDa, but I'm still missing the town collar, what dd mod does that come from?

[orgs1n]

Your mod equipped some chain on the PC which prevented her from equipping a town collar: "You can only wear one collar at a time." Is this intentional or were just being extra devious?

 

Spoiler

 

Yeah, that's an armored troll. I'm playing through the Dawnguard quest line for the first time and they do count as followers for your mod. It feels a bit weird that they get the normal dialogue options, as trolls don't speak.

[Reesewow]

4 hours ago, orgs1n said:

Your mod equipped some chain on the PC which prevented her from equipping a town collar: "You can only wear one collar at a time." Is this intentional or were just being extra devious?

 

Yeah, that's an armored troll. I'm playing through the Dawnguard quest line for the first time and they do count as followers for your mod. It feels a bit weird that they get the normal dialogue options, as trolls don't speak.

Put some glasses on the troll, that means he's really smart and knows the common tongue well enough to write a really sexy contract for his services.

 

Pretty sure that chain is something you can get for breaking the rules and does block the town collar.  So intentional as being shackled like that is worse than being forced to crawl.

[orgs1n]

7 hours ago, Reesewow said:

Pretty sure that chain is something you can get for breaking the rules and does block the town collar.  So intentional as being shackled like that is worse than being forced to crawl.

This was the first time the PC exceeded her debt, and as I recall this chain was auto-equipped... she could not have broken any rules yet.

 

Speaking of exceeding debt, an auto-pay option would be nice. I use iNeed like that as well: it maintains the cost, but removes the tedium.

 

About the crawling animation, I would have loved to see that, but am using Zaz 8.0+ so I had to edit that out. I'm hoping Zaz 8.0+ will be supported at some point.

[s3ngine]

Greetings again.

 

I have a rather specific question: If I were to, say, remove the essential status from my follower and he would kick the bucket (read: die) shortly after, would that mess with the mods quest a lot?

I did a quick test run and found that the next follower I hired did not start the dflow dialogue on his own. No big deal, I just used the debug option and had it running agani. I was just wondering, if there might be any worse effects not immediately apparent.

Does anybody have experience with this?

 

Thanks a lot in advance for any reply.

 

Regards, s3ngine

[Choppytehbear]

The only thing I dislike is the bondage mittens. I mean, I can't even pick up or buy anything.

[s3ngine]

Greetings.

 

Just wanted to report back regarding my earlier question about killlable followers and possible issues with DFLOW: I have played around with it for a while, and all it does is this: After you kill your current devious follower, you will have to restart the _dflow quest (stopquest _dflow, startquest _dflow) in order to have your next follower start being devious again (read: start the conversation with "nice to meet you, hun...").

Havent had any other issues yet.

Just in case somebody would be interested in this. As for me, I was interested in the idea of being able to kill my follower (= slave master) in order to give me an immersive escape mechanic, since I use DFLOW primarily for player slavery.

 

Regards, s3ngine

[Hex Bolt]

This mod looks interesting.  I thank the author for the effort that went into this creation, and encourage the author to keep working toward that 1.0 release! 

 

For me though, the hard dependency on ZEP (which in turn requires Heretical Resources) is a turnoff.  I don't use use those mods, and haven't needed them for anything else.  Also, ZEP conflicts with the latest ZAP (which I'm using) -- another show-stopper.  Reading through the discussion, it looks like HR and ZEP are only needed for the crawling animation, and many players have taken to editing the mod to remove the dependence.  In the interest of "Keep It Simple" and maximum compatibility, it might make sense to drop that one animation and be able to support a wider playerbase.  Just my 2 septims.

[Hex Bolt]

So I took some time to look over the mod, because there are not that many choices for player enslavement mods, especially as an adventuring slave, and I'd really like to encourage the author in this mod's development.

 

I realize that it's in beta, and much can change.  My comments are meant to be food for thought, constructive criticism to offer another viewpoint.

 

Idea:  Start the debt by having the follower loan the player money (if the player asks to).  With the many great mods available that provide free custom followers, no one will seriously need to hire a follower with debt.  But especially for a low level character, the ability to borrow a few thousand gold could be very helpful, and irresistible.  Allow a configurable grace period (1-7 days) to repay the loan with interest, during which the follower sticks with you.  Fail to repay on time, and the follower enslaves you and regular "my share" payments begin.

 

Please consider carefully the follower's attitude toward the player character.  On the surface, this is an indentured servant situation.  But much of the dialogue sounds like an abuse & humiliation mod, such as when the follower calls you a "fuck pig" or "worthless whore".  Seriously??  This is my follower, not an enemy who defeated me in battle.  I'd think that the follower would view the player as an investment, and a very profitable one at those interest rates.  Sure, the follower can have some fun with you and play some mean games, but only short-term stuff, more like teasing and messing with you, enjoying being the dom but without needing to grind you into the dirt.  

 

Which leads me to the harshness of the enslavement rules.  At the entry point to enslavement, the player should be on friendly terms with the follower, and just happens to owe a lot.  So a collar is in order.  A slave collar clearly marks a person as a slave.  There's no need, at the lowest level of enslavement, to make you always be naked in town (and crawl, assuming the player hasn't edited out that feature).  Think about it.  Naked, crawling.  That's serious degradation, by your follower, over a debt.  And the mods I'm using make multiple rapes pretty likely for being collared and naked.  Is that really the attitude that you intended for the follower to take toward his/her "Huni"?  (That's a really cute nickname by the way.)

 

Then there's the boots and mittens.  Yes, they come off in dungeons, but the mittens make picking up things difficult, and combat impossible.  What happens during a serious overland encounter, like a dragon attack?  The follower will have to fight alone, and blame you for each "death".  Doesn't seem reasonable.  Not without serious misbehavior that earned a serious punishment.

 

Or perhaps abusing and humiliating the player character as much as possible, in every conceivable way, is exactly what you intended.  That's not what I'm looking for (not without cause, not without seriously angering the follower).  However, plenty of players might enjoy the abuse, love it even.  But it feels really one dimensional that way, lacking in depth, and I think that it would get old pretty quickly.  When a player tires of a mod it's time to uninstall and move on, but a mod that doesn't interfere too much with actually playing the game can see long-term use.  Let the player choose the nature of the relationship.  If I'm polite and obedient, then I get treated well with few restrictions -- an investment.  The more rude and rebellious I am (perhaps intentionally if I want abuse), the more the follower piles on the punishments and humiliation -- a troublesome slave.  Ideally it's something that changes over time if the player character learns her lesson and behaves, or relapses and misbehaves.

[valcon767]

6 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

So I took some time to look over the mod, because there are not that many choices for player enslavement mods, especially as an adventuring slave, and I'd really like to encourage the author in this mod's development.

 

I realize that it's in beta, and much can change.  My comments are meant to be food for thought, constructive criticism to offer another viewpoint.

1

Idea:  Start the debt by having the follower loan the player money (if the player asks to).  With the many great mods available that provide free custom followers, no one will seriously need to hire a follower with debt.  But especially for a low level character, the ability to borrow a few thousand gold could be very helpful, and irresistible.  Allow a configurable grace period (1-7 days) to repay the loan with interest, during which the follower sticks with you.  Fail to repay on time, and the follower enslaves you and regular "my share" payments begin.

2

Please consider carefully the follower's attitude toward the player character.  On the surface, this is an indentured servant situation.  But much of the dialogue sounds like an abuse & humiliation mod, such as when the follower calls you a "fuck pig" or "worthless whore".  Seriously??  This is my follower, not an enemy who defeated me in battle.  I'd think that the follower would view the player as an investment, and a very profitable one at those interest rates.  Sure, the follower can have some fun with you and play some mean games, but only short-term stuff, more like teasing and messing with you, enjoying being the dom but without needing to grind you into the dirt.  

3

Which leads me to the harshness of the enslavement rules.  At the entry point to enslavement, the player should be on friendly terms with the follower, and just happens to owe a lot.  So a collar is in order.  A slave collar clearly marks a person as a slave.  There's no need, at the lowest level of enslavement, to make you always be naked in town (and crawl, assuming the player hasn't edited out that feature).  Think about it.  Naked, crawling.  That's serious degradation, by your follower, over a debt.  And the mods I'm using make multiple rapes pretty likely for being collared and naked.  Is that really the attitude that you intended for the follower to take toward his/her "Huni"?  (That's a really cute nickname by the way.)

4

Then there's the boots and mittens.  Yes, they come off in dungeons, but the mittens make picking up things difficult, and combat impossible.  What happens during a serious overland encounter, like a dragon attack?  The follower will have to fight alone, and blame you for each "death".  Doesn't seem reasonable.  Not without serious misbehavior that earned a serious punishment.

5

But it feels really one dimensional that way, lacking in depth, and I think that it would get old pretty quickly.  When a player tires of a mod it's time to uninstall and move on, but a mod that doesn't interfere too much with actually playing the game can see long-term use.  Let the player choose the nature of the relationship.  If I'm polite and obedient, then I get treated well with few restrictions -- an investment.  The more rude and rebellious I am (perhaps intentionally if I want abuse), the more the follower piles on the punishments and humiliation -- a troublesome slave.  Ideally it's something that changes over time if the player character learns her lesson and behaves, or relapses and misbehaves.

perspective of another player (i am NOT the mod author)

 

1 - the loan money idea is a good one (there is another mod that actually does this, "loansharks of skyrim", if i remember the name right), however you have 

     hit on the reason for the payments already.   there are a ton of follower mods where all you do is talk to a follower once and they follow you.

     why should a follower (another person who is better than you at the beginning of the game) follow you around???? this mod answers that - for cash.

 

2 - i actually agree here totally.  the player is an investment for the follower (in time if nothing else), and initial failure (and enslavement) should not be super harsh.

 

3 - the harshness could be read as another reason to pay off the debt (follower being mean deliberately) to encourage you to pay them what you owe.

     a possible way to fix this is if the mod tracked how many times you were enslaved, with the starting harshness increasing for every time (or 2-3 times) you get

     enslaved (3 levels maybe??).  first level could be collar and naked (slaves don't need clothes), 2nd level is the collar, naked and crawling, 3rd level collar, naked,

     crawling and other restrictive gear.  when you get enslaved the follower could say something like "Didn't last time teach you to pay on time??".

 

4 - boots just slow you down (and do make a few other things a little harder), and the mittens can be a game stopper depending on build.  mittens do make picking

     stuff up challenging and combat very challenging to almost impossible (depending on player build and level).  having said that though they are yet another 

     reason to "pay your debt on time".

 

5 - it does feel that way at times (one dimensional).  for the most part this mod does exactly that (let the player continue playing without much interference).

 

if you want a mod that does slavery of the player and adjusts according to how you act (player choices change the tone of the slavery) just tell me which

version you want

1 - a mod that does this but works with its own npcs??? (it will still take over the game to some extent but less than option 2)

2 - a mod that takes over the game??

 

i can make a couple of suggestions depending on which you prefer, but this mod is not that.

 

[Reesewow]

8 hours ago, HexBolt8 said:

Or perhaps abusing and humiliating the player character as much as possible, in every conceivable way, is exactly what you intended.  That's not what I'm looking for (not without cause, not without seriously angering the follower).  However, plenty of players might enjoy the abuse, love it even.  But it feels really one dimensional that way, lacking in depth, and I think that it would get old pretty quickly. 

Some well though out points in your post, and I think a mod based around these ideas could be pretty great.  Could be a great post in the request forum, and I could see a stand-alone follower built around these ideas working well.  I like the idea of your character getting into a "soft" slavery state that can get harsher based on responses/decisions, with levels of dialogue and restrictions.

 

I do think unfortunately that what you are hoping the mod to become and what it has been built as are quite different.  Also not the author and obviously don't speak for them, but I don't think the mod intends to be a heavily immersive/fleshed out slavery mod.   

 

From what I understand following the mod's development and playing with it is that it is primarily a gameplay/consequences mod.  The mod adds risk to having a follower around and an in-game money sink to add value to gold, and the consequence of failure is the harsh treatment/restrictions.  That's why the main mechanic of the mod is the daily payments instead of the suggested loan amount, and I think the intention is that you really don't want to be enslaved often (typically it happens when I forget or other mods wreak me/steal my money).  The mod only really has one level of slave, and if you enter slavery you've already hit the mod's "fail" state - the "deals" are more like the levels of slavery you were talking about where they start soft and good-natured but get pretty dire as you stack them up.

 

It sounds like Lozeak may only be a few more "follower games" away from calling this mod finished and perhaps dropping some of the more outdated/troublesome master (like ZEP), if they can find the time to work on it.  Which I'm definitely hopeful for, I do love the concept of this mod.

[Hex Bolt]

Thank you Valcon767 and Reesewow, you helped me understand what this mod is about.  I was looking at things backwards.

 

About 90% of the mod's content is the player enslavement (the author even plans to add more "games"), plus there's no reason to ever go into debt to hire a follower (all the custom ones are free), AND the mod's MCM screen even has a button that you can press as often as you like to add another 1000 to your debt and put yourself in deeper.  So I concluded that the mod was all about the enslavement aspect.  Without that, it's a fairly simple mod to convert your follower into a money sink, with dire consequences for missing a payment.  Which is disappointing.  (To me.  I know it's all about personal preferences, and different things appeal to different people.  Not trying to deny other people their enjoyment.)

 

So yeah I concluded (wrongly) that you install this if you want your follower to enslave you (Reesewow hit it exactly with the "soft" slavery phrase).  And that it would be viable to remain in the enslaved state for a lengthy time (you know, the follower does keep offering you deals that only dig you deeper into debt).  You guys have helped me understand that it's the other way around, that the point is to avoid the enslavement.  And that explains why the treatment is so over the top, with the abrupt transition in my follower's personality from friendly, to flaming a-hole. 

 

When I saw this follower mod, I think it triggered memories of Submissive Lola, with its "soft" slavery, in which it is very viable to play indefinitely as an Adventuring Slave who has a demanding follower.  (I really enjoyed that mod, but eventually it got too repetitive, and the mod never got fully developed before the author was kidnapped by Fallout 4, never to return.)  But I see now that that's not what this mod tries to be.

 

I forgot to mention before that I like the mod's willpower concept, and how low willpower can restrict the player's choices.  Nice touch.  Though unfortunately that too is in the content that you're supposed to try to avoid. 

 

I do hope that the author will decide to add a loanshark feature to the follower, as a practical way to become indebted.  I might check back later if I'm ever at the point in a game in which I need a money sink (although about that time I tend to get bored and start another playthrough). 

 

This is a nice, helpful community.  Thank you again for taking the time to explain this to me.