Devious Followers (8 June 2019)

[outercourseman565]

1 hour ago, Lupine00 said:

Won't work? Could you be more specific?

 

Is your debt in excess of the enslavement debt?

Do you have lots of items still that the follower might steal off you in lieu of cash?

Is your follower tired and angry?

 

I'm not sure that high willpower blocks enslavement. I think it's happened for me even with fairly high willpower (8?).

Sometimes the follower will be more interested in stealing items. Though there is some configuration for this, there's also a random factor.

 

Enslavement in DF is perfectly fun. The downside of it is that it often crashes, leaving you with no DF follower dialogs or mechanism to interact with the follower.

It's not quite as fun as it could be, because the follower still takes a very passive role, but once you get used to its foibles, it's playable.

Gold control can make it quite tricky to get out of. Somewhat exploitative techniques can be required in that case.

Well, it won't trigger I guess would be the right term.

 

I may have mistaken what the enslavement debt is then, because its description states "Debt threshold at which your follower will give up and discard you, if you've been enslaved."

It just came to my mind now, but does it mean that the threshold will be used for when I'll be enslaved, and then again for when the follower will discard me?

 

No, I don't really have high value items, and he's pretty tired, yeah. Although I have disabled gold control and theft after sex.

 

EDIT: Managed to make it proc by adding debt via debug. Maybe it was luck, maybe I just needed high debt and plenty of deals.

[gr4ssi]

Is an update from 2.02b to 2.03a supported? Or do I need a new savegame? I wasn't sure if the "new save needed" statement in the changelog is referring to an upgrade from the 1.x version or if this is also within the 2.x version.

When I use EFF, do I need the patch when I install 2.03a?

Right now, I use EFF and 2.02b and I works kind of, but on Chloe, the user menu is not from EFF but plain standard. When I recruit Sasha or Leah, the interaction is different.

Thanks however for the cool mod, I love it! :-)

[Lupine00]

With regard to followers being given keys:

 

I think if you give a follower keys to hold, they should let you have them back - situationally.

 

 

Let's say you are bound with zero devices, the follower should just let you have your keys back whenever you ask. Why not?

In that case you can move keys freely between follower and PC.

 

But if you have devious devices binding you, then that's cutting into the follower's potential profits.

 

So, if you're bound by a device a DF would remove, you cannot have your keys back - at all.

 

And if you're bound by a device a DF can't/won't remove, you can have your keys back, but at at a fixed cost per-key.

 

It's then up to the player whether they set that price competitive with the key-game, or higher.

There is a qualatative difference - the keys did come from the player in the first place.

 

 

I think that would be a good balance. You can still choose not to give the follower keys, but if you decide to "cheat" DCL events by hiding keys on the follower, then access to your keys might sometimes be restricted.

 

You can always not give keys to the follower if you don't like the system.

 

A "be my keyholder" request would also be nice. In which case keys would flow automatically to the follower, and that would be that - goodbye keys.

[Hermit36]

Is there a way to remove specific followers from DF. I don't want housecarls or Chloe to be part of DF.

[Lupine00]

13 minutes ago, Hermit36 said:

Is there a way to remove specific followers from DF. I don't want housecarls or Chloe to be part of DF.

Yes. In the Debug menu there is a button that lets you remove a follower from DF.

[Hermit36]

2 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Yes. In the Debug menu there is a button that lets you remove a follower from DF. 

Guess I should game with my glasses on. After paying the debt (also tried reset from MCM) when I try to remove Chloe I'm to I'm still indebted to her. Is the only time I can remove them is before I make them a follower?

[Lupine00]

9 hours ago, Hermit36 said:

Guess I should game with my glasses on. After paying the debt (also tried reset from MCM) when I try to remove Chloe I'm to I'm still indebted to her. Is the only time I can remove them is before I make them a follower?

That sounds plausible ... but ... get a new DF, and the problem should go away. DF only tracks one debt.

[Hermit36]

Thanks. That took care of it

[Arkinnian]

I'm currently doing the "weird potion" quest, and I haven't gotten a debuff yet. The journal update alluded to a severe penalty that my character was experiencing, but it hasn't shown up on my effects menu in the magic tab. Is this a bug, or has the debuff not been implemented yet?

[Lupine00]

32 minutes ago, Arkinnian said:

I'm currently doing the "weird potion" quest, and I haven't gotten a debuff yet. The journal update alluded to a severe penalty that my character was experiencing, but it hasn't shown up on my effects menu in the magic tab. Is this a bug, or has the debuff not been implemented yet?

 

Spoilage:

Spoiler

 

You'll only get the debuff if you abstain from doing what your follower wants, or have no follower for a time.

It takes a while to kick in. When it does, you will know about it!

 

 

[Arkinnian]

6 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

 

Spoilage:

  Hide contents

 

You'll only get the debuff if you abstain from doing what your follower wants, or have no follower for a time.

It takes a while to kick in. When it does, you will know about it!

 

 

 

Thank you for the reply! I don't know how to make spoilers here, so I'll ask: How long do you have before the debuff takes place? I'd like to test to see if it's working.

[Lupine00]

16 hours ago, Arkinnian said:

Thank you for the reply! I don't know how to make spoilers here, so I'll ask: How long do you have before the debuff takes place? I'd like to test to see if it's working.

My memory is hazy, a couple of days I think. At most three. But could be less  I knew at one point, as I had some issues with it, and proposed that it be player configurable, but that was months ago now.

[Lupine00]

16 hours ago, Arkinnian said:

Thank you for the reply! I don't know how to make spoilers here, so I'll ask: How long do you have before the debuff takes place? I'd like to test to see if it's working.

My memory is hazy, a couple of days I think. At most three. But could be less  I knew at one point, as I had some issues with it, and proposed that it be player configurable, but that was months ago now.

[tester86]

I got arrested today with Janessa as my Devious Follower. She, somehow, did not seem to take offense for being thrown in jail with me, raped, and paraded naked through town. That seems like something I'd have to pay for... in spades. 

 

Just a suggestion. If your Devious Follower goes to jail with you there should be some sort of repercussion.  If there is, apologies, I didn't see it.  

 

Great Mod and I like how it keeps getting better.  

 

 

[tester86]

Small bug report...

 

Was still playing with DF and today I got to see the potion quest. Cool. Except that I was in Belethor's shop at the time and Bart the dog was the one that offered the potion.  I'm pretty sure a dog can't have the conversation that Bart and Janessa had.  Maybe not have dogs do the talking? 

 

 

[Lupine00]

10 hours ago, tester86 said:

Maybe not have dogs do the talking? 

If you try and get a dog to talk in Skyrim, good luck with it.

The inability to get non-humans to speak reliably is the reason for all those horrid pop-up boxes in SD+.

The irony.

 

I'm guessing that Lozeak did not restrict it to playable races because many custom followers are not playable races.

There are also creature factions you can exclude.

[Corsec]

How compatible is the current version of this mod with Relationship Dialogue Overhaul? The latest DF plugin seems to have less conflicts with the EFF patch that RDO provides.

 

Last time I checked there would be two dismissal options for followers, one from each mod. So you could only apply the dismissal scripts from one mod, but not both.

[Lupine00]

26 minutes ago, Corsec said:

Last time I checked there would be two dismissal options for followers, one from each mod. So you could only apply the dismissal scripts from one mod, but not both.

That has nothing to do with RDO though. It happens if you have EFF. Or was that what you meant?

 

I don't believe there's been any meaningful progress on the RDO problems. Possibly Lozeak suggested that improvements will come in the next release, though that could be a while away.

[Corsec]

1 minute ago, Lupine00 said:

That has nothing to do with RDO though. It happens if you have EFF. Or was that what you meant?

 

I don't believe there's been any meaningful progress on the RDO problems. Possibly Lozeak suggested that improvements will come in the next release, though that could be a while away. 

 

Oh, I was mistaken then. I thought the double dismissal dialogue was a RDO incompatibility problem, not an EFF problem. Has that bug been fixed yet?

 

So how bad are the remaining RDO problems, are they gamebreaking? Are both mods unplayable together? I was interested in DF a while back but I was deterred by the incompatibility with other mods.

[Lupine00]

4 minutes ago, Corsec said:

Oh, I was mistaken then. I thought the double dismissal dialogue was a RDO incompatibility problem, not an EFF problem. Has that bug been fixed yet?

 

So how bad are the remaining RDO problems, are they gamebreaking? Are both mods unplayable together? I was interested in DF a while back but I was deterred by the incompatibility with other mods.

EFF double dialog not fixed that I know of.

 

RDO problems aren't something I test. I simply removed RDO when it had a problem with DF, and didn't miss it afterwards.

However, I suspect the extent of the problem always depended on what other mods you had in the mix, it wasn't simply down to RDO.

 

If you try it, and report the results, then we'll all be wiser.

[Corsec]

7 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

EFF double dialog not fixed that I know of.

 

RDO problems aren't something I test. I simply removed RDO when it had a problem with DF, and didn't miss it afterwards. 

However, I suspect the extent of the problem always depended on what other mods you had in the mix, it wasn't simply down to RDO. 

 

If you try it, and report the results, then we'll all be wiser.

 

So how bad does it bug the game to have double dismissal dialogue?

 

Thanks for the responses, I think I'd probably just dump RDO if I go ahead with DF. Debugging is just hours and hours of frustration, I already almost have PTSD from doing it with other mods. I get a nervous eye twitch every time there's a hiccup on the loading screen. So, so many CTDs.

[Lupine00]

2 minutes ago, Corsec said:

So how bad does it bug the game to have double dismissal dialogue?

Not really that big a problem. You can fix EFF by resetting it, and that dumps the followers properly.

 

My solution is not to use EFF, as its extra follower inventory is a big cheat, and more than one follower can get a bit tedious sometimes.

Still, I do like it when you get loads of followers, and they just do everything, and you're useless, and get no XP, and then, when they enslave you, it makes perfect sense.

[Lozeak]

Wish I had better news but still a long way until I release anything. Don't want to list a ton of excuses but life is complicated and for me to make more content I'd need to force my self to do it and it would likely be unhealthy for me so... I'm just waiting until I'm in a better place. Unfortunately I don't see that for a while cause work is busy too.

[tuxagent7]

10 minutes ago, Lozeak said:

Wish I had better news but still a long way until I release anything. Don't want to list a ton of excuses but life is complicated and for me to make more content I'd need to force my self to do it and it would likely be unhealthy for me so... I'm just waiting until I'm in a better place. Unfortunately I don't see that for a while cause work is busy too.

 

Take care of yourself first

 

Give us some news once in a while like you do it's appreciated

[HexBolt8]

2 hours ago, tuxagent7 said:

Take care of yourself first

I second this.  Never force yourself, Lozeak.  We all appreciate your work on this mod, but don't make yourself miserable; no one wants that.  Well, I guess a devious follower would enjoy making you miserable, but I meant in real life.