Devious Devices Framework Development/Beta

[Kimy]

On 11/2/2020 at 12:10 PM, UnEvenSteven said:

@Kimy Well that wasn't fun but here's a file that contains separate "1stperson" meshes of all the colors for the catsuit and both versions of the gloves. Tested in-game, all work.

 

CatSuit1stPersonStuff.7z 420.31 kB · 7 downloads

 

The meshes should be fine to stick in the "00 Core" folder so CBBE or UUNP installs can use them.

 

Hopefully the changes in the .esp can easily be merged in xEdit. Also fixed a few of the Straitjacket variants not have the weight slider enabled in the ArmorAddon entries. Another small coat of wax on the framework.

 

Thank you! Will merge this!

[Kimy]

On 11/3/2020 at 5:48 AM, DeWired said:

P.S. On that note, @Kimy - I guess, library version of filter needs some way to work with suppresstags in case bound anim is actually needed - so that if there are provided "Vaginal, Oral, Anal" for example, it will set permitVaginal=false and so on. Either that, or adding permit* as parameters for function.

The function will determine any blocked slots itself and add it to the suppresstag string as required. It will also take manual suppressing of slots passed in the suppress tag parameter, so users can still disallow vaginal intercourse even if the situations would normally allow it.

[OsmelMC]

32 minutes ago, Kharos said:

Technically it would be better if @Kimy would provide you with a DD api where you can tell DD "I am now starting a sexlab scene, please do not interfere with this single scene (do not replace animations, do not hide devices, etc.)". 

Like I said before SexLab have his own method to force the Animation and not even DD is made to replace that Animation.

[Kimy]

8 minutes ago, osmelmc said:

Like I said before SexLab have his own method to force the Animation and not even DD is made to replace that Animation.

Yes, DD is using that exact function to prevent the filter from processing animations it already processed. Which is why I am wondering why @VirginMarie isn't just using this method for the animations truly requiring it, instead of asking me to hand her control over the entire filter. :S

[Kharos]

17 minutes ago, osmelmc said:

Like I said before SexLab have his own method to force the Animation and not even DD is made to replace that Animation.

Ok, I guess that is the answer to my question, thanks you @osmelmc.

 

Sorry I am not very well versed with SexLab and DD APIs. Strike that, I have no bloody clue about how they are working ?.

@VirginMarie, you say that the removal of the MCM option does not leave you a way forward with DD 5. Now as I wrote above my knowledge is very limited. But trying to follow the discussion here, it almost looks like the following approach could work:

• Gather some information about the current situation (how many actors, are they wearing devices, are some of them creatures, etc.).
• Maybe call SelectValidDDAnimations() to find out if there are valid animations
• Then depending on all that information either call SexLab with the valid DD animations, or call it with an invalid animation (allowing the DD filter to step in and either remove devices or break up the animation), or call the function mentioned by @osmelmc that forces the "invalid" animation to prevent the DD filter from interfering.

I am probably missing something here... what is it?

 

[Edit] Kimy just wrote the same thing while I was typing, sorry for asking the same question.

[Kimy]

Devious Devices 5 Beta 11

- Added: Colored variants of several catsuit models, to make the correct color model display in First Person Mode.
- Added: Multi-actor animations featuring more than 3 actors now have their own fallback mechanics to prevent filter hiccups.
- Changed: Even more optimizations for the animation filter, which now should pick more varied animations.
- Changed/Fixed: If the animation filter finds certain DD devices having no complete selection for animations available, it will now hide the restraints if the first attempt to replace the animations fails.

 

Delta Patch for updating from Beta 1:

 

Devious Devices 5 LE Beta Delta Patch Beta 1 to Beta 11.7z

 

Delta Patch for updating from Beta 9:

 

Devious Devices 5 LE Beta Delta Patch Beta 9 to Beta 11.7z

 

Devious Devices 5 Beta 9 Download link (full release):

 

https://mega.nz/file/jJtw3arB#wqgkLIOs8qnCPZ0Nw-fHNMXnt0fpQsBBOxhs1JEZZgE

 

[Skullered]

17 minutes ago, Kimy said:

- Added: Colored variants of several catsuit models, to make the correct color model display in First Person Mode.

@UnEvenSteven

Wouldn't it be easier just to have a single 1stperson mesh that uses texture sets, instead of a unique mesh per color? It'd vastly cut down on file size as well as memory usage.

Naturally this would mean it has to be done all over again, but xEdit should make that a breeze.

 

EDIT: I just noticed you addressed this in an earlier post, I'm going to have a look at it myself

[OsmelMC]

@Kimy Can you include some animations like the "DDBeltedSolo" but Laying installed of Standing.

 

The problem is that I using "Go To Bed" Mod and probably I not the only one. And almost every time the player wakes up with belts and without leave the bed the DDBeltedSolo Animation started and is a bit immersion breaking see the standing Animation instead of some one similar but laying. 

 

With just adding the laying Animation on that scene can be enough to allow the SexLab Framework select the right Animation. 

 

I can even try to make the Animation my self to send it to you if you like (I have 0 skills animating but I can easily build one JSON file with part of some Animation already see)

[Kimy]

8 minutes ago, osmelmc said:

@Kimy Can you include some animations like the "DDBeltedSolo" but Laying installed of Standing.

 

The problem is that I using "Go To Bed" Mod and probably I not the only one. And almost every time the player wakes up with belts and without leave the bed the DDBeltedSolo Animation started and is a bit immersion breaking see the standing Animation instead of some one similar but laying. 

 

With just adding the laying Animation on that scene can be enough to allow the SexLab Framework select the right Animation. 

 

I can even try to make the Animation my self to send it to you if you like (I have 0 skills animating but I can easily build one JSON file with part of some Animation already see)

I would totally love to include more bound/belted animations. I also have zero relevant skills to make them myself. If someone can make some for inclusion in DD, I'd happily take them. Mind you that DD's animation system isn't built like SLAL, so I'd need an actual HKX to integrate it. I also fear that I won't be able to add this (or anything else that's not fixing reported issues) at this point for DD5.0, as I do plan to release it as soon as the filter is confirmed stable and working.

[Shion11]

after seeing if DCL's suits still allowed belts and corsets to show up together after 5.11 i used obsidian and it didn't work

[Bane Master]

10 hours ago, Mister X said:

And yes, looking at the postings and reports here, you're pretty much the only maintainer of a major DD mod who's participating.

Well I doubt they can be described as major mods - but I'm here with Deviously Enchanted Chests and Estrus Charus+

 

I released a DeC DD5 beta a couple of weeks ago with updated code for selecting generic items without registration,  around 900 people have downloaded it and I have received no reports of issues. Hence I have nothing to add at this point.

 

EC+ remains compatible with DD5 as it's only interactions with devices are keyword based filters to stop tentacles trying to get where they can't!

 

[UnEvenSteven]

30 minutes ago, Skullered said:

@UnEvenSteven

Wouldn't it be easier just to have a single 1stperson mesh that uses texture sets, instead of a unique mesh per color? It'd vastly cut down on file size as well as memory usage.

Naturally this would mean it has to be done all over again, but xEdit should make that a breeze.

 

EDIT: I just noticed you addressed this in an earlier post, I'm going to have a look at it myself

 

This is interesting actually. Texture Sets didn't seem to work with 1stPerson models in earlier versions of DD. This is why you have Black, Red, and White "1stPerson" versions of the Restrictive Gloves. I remembered this when I was working on 1stPerson Catsuit stuff and just created separate models. But I just did some testing and TextureSets appear to be working correctly now with 1stPerson models.

 

I wonder if this is a result of the various script updates for devices throughout all the Beta versions. Like the "rendered" versions of devices are being properly updated now or something and TextureSets now work properly. Kimy may not like another update from me in the 11th hour but I can get one out.

[Kimy]

9 minutes ago, Bane Master said:

Well I doubt they can be described as major mods - but I'm here with Deviously Enchanted Chests and Estrus Charus+

 

I released a DeC DD5 beta a couple of weeks ago with updated code for selecting generic items without registration,  around 900 people have downloaded it and I have received no reports of issues. Hence I have nothing to add at this point.

 

EC+ remains compatible with DD5 as it's only interactions with devices are keyword based filters to stop tentacles trying to get where they can't!

 

Thanks for the report, and glad that your stuff still works!

[Kimy]

@Shion11: I will need to update DCL to make its custom chastity and corsets work. They will remain broken until I get to make a DCL release.

[VirginMarie]

46 minutes ago, Kharos said:

Technically it would be better if @Kimy would provide you with a DD api where you can tell DD "I am now starting a sexlab scene, please do not interfere with this single scene (do not replace animations, do not hide devices, etc.)". Because in that case, the effect would be constrained to that single scene started by your mod, without affecting anything else. Also since such an API would be part of DD, only DD aware mods would be using it, in situations where their author hopefully knows what they are doing.

Yes, this is close to what I asked for. But it could also allow mods to opt into the DD filter, which I DO want to use in some scenes where it fits.

 

I'm suggesting that instead of intercepting the mod event to filter after sexlab has already started a scene, which is imo prone to sexlab having troubles, like stacked actors that do not animate, misaligned actors, and stuck scenes, DD could instead wrap StartSex and apply its value added filter feature, without the delay, and then Sexlab can function normally without possible problems.

 

Option 1

This new DDStartSex function would be an opt-in just by using it, and would expect you have used SelectValidDDAnimations. This gives you 2 choices:

1. Use DDStartSex if you want the filter or other DD features, including removal of devices and bondage animations
2. Do nothing (use sexlab's StartSex like normal if you do not want DD's features)

• Less need for any global toggles
• No impact to mods that were written before the animation filter existed like my mod. It's backwards compatible
• There IS impact to mods that expect the filter by doing nothing, so maybe you provide a global toggle to opt in (not so good, I would not do that)

 

Option 2

DDStartSex could be both an opt-in and opt out, giving you 3 choices:

1. If the mod does nothing, then calls to Sexlab are intercepted and DD applies the filter (like now as a delayed interrupt)  <-- I am not in support of this forced behavior, but its what we have now
2. Use DDStartSex, with Filter = true, requesting the filter to be included, and perhaps other parameters for the creature and bondage animations
3. Use DDStartSex, with Filter = false when you need the filter off, etc

• Needs the global toggle to remain IMO, because of #1 above. This remains backwards compatible as long as you keep the MCM toggle, and will not be impacting any mod
• If we don't care about backwards compatibility, drop the MCM toggle, and some mods like mine will need DDStartSex and SelectValidDDAnimations to be implemented. I'd still be happy because I'm around to provide the updated release to my mod, and would love to be able to selectively use the filter

 

Option 3 - The status quo as in DD4 current release

1. If the mod does nothing, then calls to Sexlab are intercepted and DD applies the filter - We have no choices here other than the global toggle

• Has (and imo badly needs) the global toggle. Is backwards compatible... as long as the user knows to  mess with a global toggle
• A user cant choose to have the filter on for one mod, and off for another mod

 

 

From what I understand the current DD5 plan is to keep the status quo but remove the global toggle. I'd suggest that the feature could be great, but it's in need of more than status quo with a few bug fixes. The more impactful problems are not DD bugs, and cannot be solved.

 

Summary for my situation:

• With status quo, I guess my path forward is what @osmelmchas suggested. I was not aware and don't yet understand it. Would this stop DD interrupting?
• I will try the latest beta @Kimyjust released to see if it changes things for me
• With something along the lines of option 1 or 2, I'd happily be an early adopter and utilize DDStartSEx, using the filter in many cases, and timing my release with DD5 as a big supporter. We'd have DCL too of course, so at least 2 early adopters of the DD5 filter

 

 

[VirginMarie]

1 hour ago, Kharos said:

Then depending on all that information either call SexLab with the valid DD animations, or call it with an invalid animation (allowing the DD filter to step in and either remove devices or break up the animation), or call the function mentioned by @osmelmc that forces the "invalid" animation to prevent the DD filter from interfering.

This would be a path forward, maybe, assuming the function Osmelmc suggested is actually not interrupted by DD. I don't understand it yet.

 

EDIT: We have to consider that DD is doing a bit more than the filter. Its also removing/hiding devices in situations, including creatures.

[Kimy]

2 minutes ago, VirginMarie said:

This would be a path forward, maybe, assuming the function Osmelmc suggested is actually not interrupted by DD. I don't understand it yet.

I can assure you it's not. Otherwise, the DD filter would chain-filter its own overrides.

 

You can still always try actually letting the filter do its thing and see if it works, and fall back to forcing animations if it's not. It's why I added all the new code to the filter. It should no longer break 4 or 5 actor animations.

[Skullered]

36 minutes ago, UnEvenSteven said:

 

This is interesting actually. Texture Sets didn't seem to work with 1stPerson models in earlier versions of DD. This is why you have Black, Red, and White "1stPerson" versions of the Restrictive Gloves. I remembered this when I was working on 1stPerson Catsuit stuff and just created separate models. But I just did some testing and TextureSets appear to be working correctly now with 1stPerson models.

 

I wonder if this is a result of the various script updates for devices throughout all the Beta versions. Like the "rendered" versions of devices are being properly updated now or something and TextureSets now work properly. Kimy may not like another update from me in the 11th hour but I can get one out.

I tested it just now, and yeah texture sets work fine on my end too.

Also something worth pointing out: If the 1stperson meshes don't contain any changes whatsoever from the world one, it'd be better to just outright remove the 1stperson entry in the armoraddon, since that will make the game automatically use the world mesh for 1stperson without further changes needed.

 

This is also why 1stperson was all black initially, if there hadn't been a 1stperson entry in the first place, the colors would've automatically carried over.

 

 

Bondage mittens could also benefit from this, as the colored variants are also black at the moment.

[VirginMarie]

10 minutes ago, Kimy said:

You can still always try actually letting the filter do its thing and see if it works, and fall back to forcing animations if it's not.

How? The main problems are stuck, stacked, misaligned, and visual glitch from delay. My code cannot detect if that has or is going to happen.

[VirginMarie]

1 hour ago, Kimy said:

Yes, DD is using that exact function to prevent the filter from processing animations it already processed. Which is why I am wondering why @VirginMarie isn't just using this method for the animations truly requiring it, instead of asking me to hand her control over the entire filter. :S

I don't understand.

 

I just want to stop the main problems... stuck, stacked, misaligned, and visual glitch from delay.

 

I would be happy if DD takes care of the filter, but I've not expected that in the past thus SLaV does already filter. DD's filter, when not causing side effects, IS an improvement. The side effects are far more common in the multi actor scenes which is very common in SLaV, thus I had hopped to NOT use the filter for scenes where sexlab can't handle it.

[Kimy]

25 minutes ago, VirginMarie said:

How? The main problems are stuck, stacked, misaligned, and visual glitch from delay. My code cannot detect if that has or is going to happen.

No, but you can test it. Try the new update and see if the new code handles multi-actor scenes better. It should. I think the filter is on its way to become fairly robust, really. And your reports really helped.

 

Otherwise, you can still make your code force your animation through the filter by using the function suggested. Either way, I guess this solves your problem.

[VirginMarie]

3 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Otherwise, you can still make your code force your animation through the filter by using the function suggested. Either way, I guess this solves your problem.

I thought you just said the suggested function will not work? If used it, will it be intercepted by DD?

 

5 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Try the new update and see if the new code handles multi-actor scenes better.

I am about to. But since my prime concern is "stuck, stacked, misaligned, and visual glitch from delay" and these are likely sexlab having troubles due to DD's impact, and they are not showing in the log, then how am I to report evidence that it happened because of DD, if it does happen still? I have no means to turn DD off, so I can't try the same test with it out of the picture. My only evidence is that I did not change anything other than installing DD5 (and of course the hidden animation toggle is ON instead of off, which I also cannot use as a test). You wont take my word, so then what? Maybe if we need, you give me the MCM toggle temporarily?

 

Do you have any suggestion, or is it worth even reporting those types of problems? 

[UnEvenSteven]

@Kimy Well if you saw the conversation between me and Skullered there was a bit of a revelation. TextureSets appear to be working for "1stPerson" models again. Maybe it was recent script changes in these Beta builds that fixed this. Or maybe they've always worked and I'm just a moron for not looking very closely at the issue.

 

Here's a file that "fixes" the 1stPerson models of catsuits and gloves and, as Skullered pointed out, also fixes the 1stperson models for bondage paw mittens. Tested all, works in-game.

 

1stPersonStuffAgain.esp

 

Delete that entire "1stPerson" folder I sent you before (that you just included in your last update), it's not needed anymore.

 

Sorry Kimy.

 

 

[Kimy]

9 minutes ago, VirginMarie said:

I thought you just said the suggested function will not work? If used it, will it be intercepted by DD?

I said quite clearly that DD will NOT intercept any animation started with SetForcedAnimation()

 

9 minutes ago, VirginMarie said:

 

I am about to. But since my prime concern is "stuck, stacked, misaligned, and visual glitch from delay" and these are likely sexlab having troubles due to DD's impact, and they are not showing in the log, then how am I to report evidence that it happened because of DD, if it does happen still? I have no means to turn DD off, so I can't try the same test with it out of the picture. My only evidence is that I did not change anything other than installing DD5 (and of course the hidden animation toggle is ON instead of off, which I also cannot use as a test). You wont take my word, so then what? Maybe if we need, you give me the MCM toggle temporarily?

 

Do you have any suggestion, or is it worth even reporting those types of problems? 

1 Startup Delay is unfixable. If that's a dealbreaker for you, there is no need to discuss this anymore.

2. Stuck is -probably- something I can fix with making changes to the filter, so I am definitely interested in getting reports about that.

3. Stacked/Misalinged, I'd also be curious if the newest changes do anything to improve this.

[Skullered]

@Kimy

I went ahead and updated the For Him and Beast Race Refits plugins so they're (semi) up to date with the beta, however I haven't made any new meshes for the straitjacket variants or the new panel gag just yet.

 

For Him:
-Added the names of people who've worked on For Him in the past to the plugin author header.
-Carried over changes to allow catsuit and bondage mitten colors to work properly in first person.
-Carried over changes to rope colors in the inventory.
-Reforwarded all keywords on all armor records.
-Sorted masters on the plugin.

 

BRRF:
-Added a reminder to the plugin description header that it needs to be placed after For Him.
-Added myself to the plugin author header.
-Reforwarded all keywords on all armor records.
-Sorted masters on the plugin.

Devious Devices For Him.esp Devious Devices - BRRF.esp