HDT SMP for SSE?

[R246]

HDT-SMP SSE updated 28/03/2018

 

http://www.9damao.com/thread-61878-1-1.html

 

20180328：
修复读档时主角身上的物理衣物大概率没有正确加载物理配置的bug

Fix the physical clothes on the protagonist's body during the reading. The physical configuration bug is not properly loaded

[DykkenTomb]

11 hours ago, R246 said:

HDT-SMP SSE updated 28/03/2018

 

http://www.9damao.com/thread-61878-1-1.html

 

20180328：
修复读档时主角身上的物理衣物大概率没有正确加载物理配置的bug

Fix the physical clothes on the protagonist's body during the reading. The physical configuration bug is not properly loaded

I bet this was the issue I was seeing with the clothes fragmenting during load. Certain clothing was breaking up. I'll test out the new version shortly. 

[minalia]

That recent fix kinda helps with sexlabs scenes when it ends with a sudden ctd and i have not had any major slowdowns other then whenever i put a broken smp mods with infinite stretch meshes. Another thing is that the smp effect does not break anymore whenever i load in a new game. Meaning i don't have to re equip pieces of gear to get the smp effect back anymore.

[tavi2018]

I would be quite interested in converting a hdt hair pack from oldrim to work with HDT SMP on SSE. Is this possible and how easy woud it be? I found a few hair packs in my searches which are supposed to work with HDT SMP. Would these be compatible and if not, what kind of conversion process would I have to do? I already have the HDT SMP framework installed, by the way.

[DykkenTomb]

7 hours ago, tavi2018 said:

I would be quite interested in converting a hdt hair pack from oldrim to work with HDT SMP on SSE. Is this possible and how easy woud it be? I found a few hair packs in my searches which are supposed to work with HDT SMP. Would these be compatible and if not, what kind of conversion process would I have to do? I already have the HDT SMP framework installed, by the way.

I'm interested myself since I would like to take the Oldrim's clothing and give it bullet point setup to work with Skyrim SE SMP. I'd like to see if I can get the mesh to get setup in nifskope or would I have to use blender?

 

Edit:... I'm working on cloaks as of right now. Once I get the pathways set for the HDT Illustrious cloaks. I'll test it with an XML file I've found. If it works I'll upload it for everyone to test out. 

[DarkFireTim]

@Changer @TheWilloughbian

 

Is there a simple way to remove a bone from a mesh? I'm trying to convert several smp wigs from oldrim and running into the problem Changer described with 2 of them, a part of the mesh stretching out to infinity. Both problem wigs have more bones than the others, by a large margin, and I'm pretty sure the smp xmls are set up properly. Honestly I'm hoping this turns out to be a red herring, a bone limit would be a shackle the community doesn't need.

[TheWilloughbian]

13 minutes ago, DarkFireTim said:

@Changer @TheWilloughbian

 

Is there a simple way to remove a bone from a mesh? I'm trying to convert several smp wigs from oldrim and running into the problem Changer described with 2 of them, a part of the mesh stretching out to infinity. Both problem wigs have more bones than the others, by a large margin, and I'm pretty sure the smp xmls are set up properly. Honestly I'm hoping this turns out to be a red herring, a bone limit would be a shackle the community doesn't need.

Outfit Studio. 

[Zaknea]

21 hours ago, TheWilloughbian said:

Outfit Studio. 

I'll add that you need to be careful when just deleting bones.  I've had some pretty crazy things happen to my nif when exporting doing this.  Like exploding nif crazy.  Also need to make sure that Outfit Studio is using your custom skeleton.  At least this worked for me.

 

I just about have the BDO Milren Fedora converted over to SMP... Now I am trying to figure out why my butt is sucking in.  It's harder to notice while say, naked, but when I have a skirt mesh on it is super apparent and annoying.  I'm using Ous's CBBE SSE xml's... But I have made my own edits to try to get rid of this.  Anyone else have this problem?  I don't see it with the breasts and copying the same config to the butt does not fix the problem, so it might not even be xml related.  I believe it's a collision problem, I just haven't been able to find it.

[Zaknea]

Anyone run into this when converting a PE mesh over to SMP?  I've done around 10 full outfits or so now, and this is the only one that does this.  This isn't the fall through the floor issue caused by not declaring bones.  The mesh looks like this even with physics disabled (i.e. go into menu, I'm using skyrim souls)... The stretched parts have physics and collisions too.  I know I need to go nifskope digging, because half of my dangly bits are fine but the other half does this and they're all structured the same.  Just wanted to see if someone knew what I needed to look for, try to save myself some hours.  The mesh looks normal in nifskope also, just so you know.

 

If I uninstall SMP, everything looks ok.  Just the normal stretch of not having physics and the mesh isn't travelling to this point on the floor.

 

I've seen this happen before with PE when throwing physics enabled hairstyles on followers, but this is the first time I've seen it on a body mesh.

 

[DarkFireTim]

2 hours ago, Zaknea said:

Anyone run into this when converting a PE mesh over to SMP?  I've done around 10 full outfits or so now, and this is the only one that does this.  This isn't the fall through the floor issue caused by not declaring bones.  The mesh looks like this even with physics disabled (i.e. go into menu, I'm using skyrim souls)... The stretched parts have physics and collisions too.  I know I need to go nifskope digging, because half of my dangly bits are fine but the other half does this and they're all structured the same.  Just wanted to see if someone knew what I needed to look for, try to save myself some hours.  The mesh looks normal in nifskope also, just so you know.

 

If I uninstall SMP, everything looks ok.  Just the normal stretch of not having physics and the mesh isn't travelling to this point on the floor.

 

I've seen this happen before with PE when throwing physics enabled hairstyles on followers, but this is the first time I've seen it on a body mesh.

 

This looks like what I'm dealing with in my wigs, and I think what changer and thewilloughbian were discussing a few posts ago. I've been looking around for a fix for the last few days and the response I usually get is "wait for nif optimizer to update and fix it for you", however if we are all talking about the same issue than the problem may be a limit to the number of bones SSE can handle in a mesh. It may be a coincidence but I've converted close to 40 smp wigs over to SSE and in my experience this only happens with meshes that have a large number of bones, think 8 individual sectors with 8 to 16 bones a sector. However I don't really know what I'm doing so I'm having some trouble nailing down whether or not this is a coincidence or a real thing, also if it is a real thing what the "bone limit" is.

[Zaknea]

2 hours ago, DarkFireTim said:

This looks like what I'm dealing with in my wigs, and I think what changer and thewilloughbian were discussing a few posts ago. I've been looking around for a fix for the last few days and the response I usually get is "wait for nif optimizer to update and fix it for you", however if we are all talking about the same issue than the problem may be a limit to the number of bones SSE can handle in a mesh. It may be a coincidence but I've converted close to 40 smp wigs over to SSE and in my experience this only happens with meshes that have a large number of bones, think 8 individual sectors with 8 to 16 bones a sector. However I don't really know what I'm doing so I'm having some trouble nailing down whether or not this is a coincidence or a real thing, also if it is a real thing what the "bone limit" is.

I was leaning the same way, so I did an experiment where I went ahead and deleted some unused nodes in the skeleton in my nif.  Now granted these weren't applied to the actual shape at all...It didn't "give back" any more of my danglies... 

 

Plus I think this has just as many bones as the nier automata DLC SMP and I didn't have any issues with that one doing this... =/

 

I wasn't sure if Ous had even planned on updating nif optimizer.  I'd rather have a skeleton that gets maintained in outfit studio.  A lot of times when I export my nif it explodes because a lot of the nodes get ripped out of the skeleton part of the nif and put into the root ninode.  So I end up having to do a lot of extra work, but that's the nature of the beast right now to get an SMP mesh working with the new CBBE.

 

If it is a limit too.  I am wondering if it's for an overall nif or individual shapes.  If it's the shape we could seperate vertices and make other shapes... Maybe if I feel up to it tonight I will try it.  Right now I'm just going to play for a while, been at this for about 2 weeks now with only 10 outfits completed.  10 outfits closer to done though I guess... I've had a new problem on just about every project too.  So once I figure this out, I'm not sure what else I can possibly run into lol.

[cheekygirl]

why are there no tutorials on how to set up or convert oldrim hdt pe armor to sse hdt smp armor? -.-

[Zaknea]

There is.  PrZ made one a while back.  It takes a little bit of work, but in my opinion, is much easier than PE ever was to set a mesh up to have physics.

 

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/68070-tutorial-how-to-make-hdt-meshes-work-with-hdt-smp/

 

SSE's SMP does NOT read NiTriShapes, at least in my experience, so you will need to convert everything over to BSTriShapes to use it.  Ous's nif optimizer will do it, I haven't had it break any of my meshes, though I hear it will double hair meshes, but that's just because the geometry is doubled which is common in hair meshes.

 

Also if using PrZ's tutorial, depending on where you are in the world... You'll need to change the commas to periods.

[TheWilloughbian]

5 hours ago, Zaknea said:

SSE's SMP does NOT read NiTriShapes

Good to know. TY

[znaroks]

On 3/29/2018 at 1:53 AM, R246 said:

HDT-SMP SSE updated 28/03/2018

 

http://www.9damao.com/thread-61878-1-1.html

 

20180328：
修复读档时主角身上的物理衣物大概率没有正确加载物理配置的bug

Fix the physical clothes on the protagonist's body during the reading. The physical configuration bug is not properly loaded

How is this HDT different from the one on the nexus?

[27X]

13 minutes ago, znaroks said:

How is this HDT different from the one on the nexus?

April fool's is over, pretty sure.

[znaroks]

1 minute ago, 27X said:

April fool's is over, pretty sure.

Sorry, but I have been out of the loop for a while, and got linked to this thread from SSE mod tracking.

[Zaknea]

On 3/31/2018 at 9:54 PM, Zaknea said:

I was leaning the same way, so I did an experiment where I went ahead and deleted some unused nodes in the skeleton in my nif.  Now granted these weren't applied to the actual shape at all...It didn't "give back" any more of my danglies... 

 

Plus I think this has just as many bones as the nier automata DLC SMP and I didn't have any issues with that one doing this... =/

 

I wasn't sure if Ous had even planned on updating nif optimizer.  I'd rather have a skeleton that gets maintained in outfit studio.  A lot of times when I export my nif it explodes because a lot of the nodes get ripped out of the skeleton part of the nif and put into the root ninode.  So I end up having to do a lot of extra work, but that's the nature of the beast right now to get an SMP mesh working with the new CBBE.

 

If it is a limit too.  I am wondering if it's for an overall nif or individual shapes.  If it's the shape we could seperate vertices and make other shapes... Maybe if I feel up to it tonight I will try it.  Right now I'm just going to play for a while, been at this for about 2 weeks now with only 10 outfits completed.  10 outfits closer to done though I guess... I've had a new problem on just about every project too.  So once I figure this out, I'm not sure what else I can possibly run into lol.

 

 

 

BOOM!

 

Guys... Not sure how seperating shapes will work with hair.  But this seems to be a limitation with Skyrim SE and nothing with the tools we are working with.  Once I seperated the shape, I had the same thing, but noticed that the shape still had all the other bones still attached to it.  So YES it is a bone limitation BUT... It only occurs by shape, not the overall nif.  I seperated the parts that were stretched, deleted the other bones that were on the other shapes that were no longer needed on the stretched part.  I deleted them via outfit studio.  Rebuild, load up game and here we are.  Just gotta set up my collisions and good to go!  On to the next issue once it pops up lol.

[minalia]

Mind sharing whatever broken smp outfits you end up fixing with the rest of us?

[Zaknea]

On 3/31/2018 at 7:31 PM, DarkFireTim said:

This looks like what I'm dealing with in my wigs, and I think what changer and thewilloughbian were discussing a few posts ago. I've been looking around for a fix for the last few days and the response I usually get is "wait for nif optimizer to update and fix it for you", however if we are all talking about the same issue than the problem may be a limit to the number of bones SSE can handle in a mesh. It may be a coincidence but I've converted close to 40 smp wigs over to SSE and in my experience this only happens with meshes that have a large number of bones, think 8 individual sectors with 8 to 16 bones a sector. However I don't really know what I'm doing so I'm having some trouble nailing down whether or not this is a coincidence or a real thing, also if it is a real thing what the "bone limit" is.

Here's a shot to prove out working with wigs... 165 bones on this one.  Had to split the back into 3 shapes from 1.  It was doing the same thing where it would stretch to the middle.

 

 

42 minutes ago, minalia said:

Mind sharing whatever broken smp outfits you end up fixing with the rest of us?

I wouldn't mind, but I'd have to get permission from the mod authors.

[DarkFireTim]

23 hours ago, Zaknea said:

Here's a shot to prove out working with wigs... 165 bones on this one.  Had to split the back into 3 shapes from 1.  It was doing the same thing where it would stretch to the middle.

 

 

Thank you for confirming that, you've saved me a great deal of frustration. In the past few days all I've managed to figure out is that I need a better understanding of my tools, and that I forgot to turn off steam updates for SSE... sigh. Can you split shapes in outfit studio? Or do I need to get something like blender? Either way if you happen to have a link to a good guide or tutorial handy I'd appreciate it. After I get these last two wigs working I'm hoping I'll be moving on to adjusting the xmls, getting the range of motion and such right. The wig I'm using now, when I take a break and actually play the game, works but all ways ends up floating just above the body and spreading out like shes under water. And my few attempts at smp tails are really interacting awkwardly with her butt.

[Zaknea]

1 hour ago, DarkFireTim said:

Thank you for confirming that, you've saved me a great deal of frustration. In the past few days all I've managed to figure out is that I need a better understanding of my tools, and that I forgot to turn off steam updates for SSE... sigh. Can you split shapes in outfit studio? Or do I need to get something like blender? Either way if you happen to have a link to a good guide or tutorial handy I'd appreciate it. After I get these last two wigs working I'm hoping I'll be moving on to adjusting the xmls, getting the range of motion and such right. The wig I'm using now, when I take a break and actually play the game, works but all ways ends up floating just above the body and spreading out like shes under water. And my few attempts at smp tails are really interacting awkwardly with her butt.

Yes, you can split shapes in outfit studio.  Mask what you want to split then under shape there is an option to seperate vertices.  Name your new shape and there you go.  Just remember to delete the extra bones from that shape or you'll run into the same problem.

 

The whole butt thing is there's something colliding with it.  What I do to keep my bounce and stop weird collisions like that is to always declare the shape with physics to NOT collide with the body, and paste a new body into the nif that isn't a body at all... Then I delete any butt or breast bones from it, just to be safe but I don't think it really matters lol.

 

A few things I have found that have made me want to go crazy that I will pass along...  Case sensitive.... I messed with one outfit for about 3 days just to find that everything was good, my xml logic was broken because I had a capital on one bone.  Another xml took me two days because I didn't see a space at the end of the bone name...  Gotta pay close attention to the details, but SMP is 500% easier to work with than PE than you ask me, and much better movement and collisions, with no weird shape spaz.  Except when forcing into a new cell, but it lasts like 1 second.

 

Now that I've ironed out some of these issues with myself... I can convert an outfit to SMP from PE in less than an hour typically... That 165 bone hair took me maybe 2 hours to get right.  For movement my suggestion is keep the angular limits low, and play with the mass and inertia.  If you have a high mass object and have a really small inertia, you can actually make the shape pile onto the ground, so I've found playing with those I can get some really nice movement.  I've even made my own mesh that had zero physics work with SMP.  Took maybe 2 hours and took something I'd probably never put on my character to something that's pretty damn cool now...

[Changer]

that was exacly the way i fixed my mesh. maybe i should have elaborated more... it just seemed that people didnt realy care at that time, so i didnt :x

[Zaknea]

I was pulling my hair out.  When I saw it I couldn't believe it (but really could).  Save, re-equip, poof.  3 days of work solved lol.

 

Doing HongHuaHui now... I don't really like how the nodes look on the skeleton, this one might be a rewrite...

[Changer]

it took me 1.5 days to stumble over the solution also (more or less by accident)... i was going crazy.

i even started googling for someone writing about some max-bones-per-shape-limit. but found nothing.

I am guessing that there was no such thing in classic skyrim and its a SSE thing or maybe the new nif format.