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Mod collaborations


Carabosse

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Why aren't there more projects where a team of mod makers work together? There are so many gifted creators here, each with their own niche(s) of expertise. We see many mods with overlapping functionality.

This is also great of course, that anyone can do whatever they want and post it, that should never be different. I just expected to see more team efforts between like minded individuals.

As a mod creator, is there something that is a put off from working with others? Creative control? A lack of faith in the commitment of others? Good ole' antisocialism? Personally, I might be too jealous in guarding content.

I've seen some calls for contributors in the past. However, my first impression were that most of those were made by "dreamers" that had a sketchy understanding of what is involved in making a mod (less they might temper those initial aspirations).

Do you think that LoverSlab could do more to foster a community of collaboration. If so, how?

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Probably because you first need people that like the same thing sometimes it's hard to find a group that like the same thing and also are willing to or want to work in a group. Sometimes there will be too much head butting when working in a group as each person might have ideas that they want to use and another wanting to do something else instead.

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Probably because you first need people that like the same thing sometimes it's hard to find a group that like the same thing and also are willing to or want to work in a group.

 

I was tempted to say, you're all a bunch of pervs so just make a pervy mod, but I won't say that.

 

 

Why aren't there more projects where a team of mod makers work together?

Version control, would be my guess.

 

This is a definitely a thing, for me at least, I can't do any kind of version control between my own mods let alone with some kind of collaboration.

 

There's a part of me really wants to work on something bigger, but I know I'd be an absolutely horrible person to work with. :)

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I was tempted to say, you're all a bunch of pervs so just make a pervy mod, but I won't say that.

Especially not in a public forum!

 

 

 

here's a part of me really wants to work on something bigger, but I know I'd be an absolutely horrible person to work with.  :)

Maybe some sort of big mod with one dictatorial leader and task assignment based on what each modder thinks they're capable of. So the leader (let's call him Lahsa) tells his underlings (let's call them Bob, Samantha, Allison, and Steve [real names hidden for legal purposes - they're actually Bob, Samantha, Allison, and Benny]) to do specific things. Bob is good at dialogue, Samantha handles the coding, Allison does textures and modeling, and Steve orders the pizza and fetches coffee (you may laugh at Steve and his menial job, but when you figure that this is being done over the internet, with people in various far-flung places, "fetching coffee" is actually a pretty daunting task).

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I can answer this pretty well. I have been part of some of the collaboration and many times these groups start to fall out. Real life issues, conflicts on direction, and other stresses cause it to fall apart and end up having the  mod in limbo. This has happened many, many times in the past. It is difficult to get total consensus among various individuals on the project scope and direction first of all then to have each have their task done in a timely bases (so others can do their work in time when they have committed it) is almost impossible.

 

Think of it this way, how many actual payed for games professionally created get delayed for various reasons? If those get delayed. imagine the difficulty of getting a project done when nobody is really the "boss" (paying for the services). Also consider there is no conflict on direction as there is a "boss" for those projects. ;).

 

If you do go do a "public" project with a group of people have 2x the people for each stage of the development if possible so that the stresses can be avoided and the project can be completed. Also if someone is unable or unwilling to continue you can still ... well continue as I don't know anyone that has all the skills to create a complete mod. (complex quest, conversations, scripts, textures, meshes, conversations, etc.)

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Hence my suggestion for a single dictatorial authoritative leader. Schedules conflicting or people losing interest is one thing, and can't really be prevented at all. Heck, I could get in a car wreck tomorrow and end up in a coma (or worse) and stop working on the mod just before I submitted my code, and then where would the mod be? Stuck until someone else came along and did my job.

 

However, the thing about total consensus is it's certainly possible to do without that. I mean, not in a mean way, but... it would require the willing sublimation of the ego, and willingness to take whatever order comes your way.

 

I dunno... maybe it's too hard, or rather too chancy, but it would be nice. :)

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I can answer this pretty well. I have been part of some of the collaboration and many times these groups start to fall out. Real life issues, conflicts on direction, and other stresses cause it to fall apart and end up having the  mod in limbo. This has happened many, many times in the past. It is difficult to get total consensus among various individuals on the project scope and direction first of all then to have each have their task done in a timely bases (so others can do their work in time when they have committed it) is almost impossible.

 

Think of it this way, how many actual payed for games professionally created get delayed for various reasons? If those get delayed. imagine the difficulty of getting a project done when nobody is really the "boss" (paying for the services). Also consider there is no conflict on direction as there is a "boss" for those projects. ;).

 

If you do go do a "public" project with a group of people have 2x the people for each stage of the development if possible so that the stresses can be avoided and the project can be completed. Also if someone is unable or unwilling to continue you can still ... well continue as I don't know anyone that has all the skills to create a complete mod. (complex quest, conversations, scripts, textures, meshes, conversations, etc.)

 

This is exactly as I imagined. I followed development of some of the bigger Morrowind/Oblivion to Oblivion/Skyrim projects and the project spokesperson has always bemoaned (not in a bad way) the turnover within those projects.

 

Those truly are epic projects though, is there not scope for something smaller, something more realistic, within the LoverSlob community?

 

Any time I see a collaborative project proposal here it is so ridiculously over extended, as if they think more people directly equates to larger scope. Surely there's a sweet spot in there somewhere.

Hence my suggestion for a single dictatorial authoritative leader. Schedules conflicting or people losing interest is one thing, and can't really be prevented at all. Heck, I could get in a car wreck tomorrow and end up in a coma (or worse) and stop working on the mod just before I submitted my code, and then where would the mod be? Stuck until someone else came along and did my job.

 

However, the thing about total consensus is it's certainly possible to do without that. I mean, not in a mean way, but... it would require the willing sublimation of the ego, and willingness to take whatever order comes your way.

 

I dunno... maybe it's too hard, or rather too chancy, but it would be nice. :)

 

Maybe this is also a stumbling block to collaboration on this particular site, given the content. Most of us would wish to remain anonymous, I know I would, my job depends on it. To be truly collaborative, the participants would have to be able to contact each other outside of this forum.

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they think more people directly equates to larger scope.

Many do and even if they don't it usually does.

 

Surely there's a sweet spot in there somewhere.

Yes there is. It seldom happens but when it does it is epic. Mostly things that happen are like Lovers mods for Oblvioon, Sexout and even Sexlab. Mods start and content is created and slowly added to the main framework. People leave and or decide they have finished their work and then these also get added etc. More like a Bolder rolling downhill gathering up assets and such.

 

Some of the conversations above and the result is an excellent example of how a group of people working on a project can fall apart and pride get hurt. Or as Kendo would say "But hurt". Don't let that stop you in modding doing what you do. If you need help with parts of your project post threads about it and ask for help and show what you have done and see if someone can help with that part. There are script writers, texture artist and other experts that could lends hand on a project (more specifically geared ;) project with definitive output ;). if you get my point :)) which might allow you to expand your goals and thoughts and create the mod or mods that you wish. As you gain reputation you will find that others will be more willing to give assistance provided your rep is a good one. (honest, helpful, sharing, giving (assistance with the skills you have for others mods etc)

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Guest endgameaddiction

I'm not one of those gifted modders, but even now I can't and won't cope with others. I rather do things solo and never release anything. I dunno, I'm just not the type to share my own stuff and I can't quite grip on it. I find anything I do is personal. And it's a good thing many don't think like I do.

 

And it's a good thing I don't model and texture. I'd be too much of an ass showcasing it and teasing people only to see people beg for something never to be released. I'm such a dick. lol

 

Anyways, ritualclarity has the right of it. Apart from schedule. If people are not devoted and have tolerance and patience, and even will to sacrifice their ideas to have them intervened by others, it won't work.

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DD Integration is (now) a collaboration between a number of people. There are several people who contribute code to it, animations, models and textures (when they can) and we have a discussion about the mod features and testing of it. Framework type mods like this are easier to collaborate on than quest / story based mods as those have most of their work done in the esp rather than the scripting. Story or quest based mods would require a different setup, something more like a movie production where you have different people who handle sets (exterior and interior spaces), casting (actors), craftsmen (build and texture items), writers (dialogue and quests) and a director who has an overall view and can put it all together. It would take a good amount of planning and discussion even before starting not to mention people who could commit to the project.

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This is a really good thread. While I can agree with the statements regarding the difficulty of such projects involving others, don't use that difficulty as a weight to practice restraint against trying. You just never know. Maybe a group of novice level modders will want to produce a bigger mod that requires help. I know I do, but my ideas would require an entirely new game to be built using an engine that doesn't suck donkey dick. I came to that realization last year, early on, as a couple of my pet projects became dead in the water; even if I could get the help I need, the Skyrim engine just can't hack it.

 

But please try. I always value hope over negativity (not that the sound advice is meant to be negative, but it can always be taken and exercised negatively).

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This is a really good thread. While I can agree with the statements regarding the difficulty of such projects involving others, don't use that difficulty as a weight to practice restraint against trying. You just never know. Maybe a group of novice level modders will want to produce a bigger mod that requires help. I know I do, but my ideas would require an entirely new game to be built using an engine that doesn't suck donkey dick. I came to that realization last year, early on, as a couple of my pet projects became dead in the water; even if I could get the help I need, the Skyrim engine just can't hack it.

 

But please try. I always value hope over negativity (not that the sound advice is meant to be negative, but it can always be taken and exercised negatively).

 

You might be interested in this

https://openmw.org/2016/openmw-0-39-0-released/

If they can get this to work I imagine they can move on to other games as well or create a foundation that could be used for further game creation using tools similar to what we are used to already.

 

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I'm not one of those gifted modders, but even now I can't and won't cope with others. I rather do things solo and never release anything. I dunno, I'm just not the type to share my own stuff and I can't quite grip on it. I find anything I do is personal. And it's a good thing many don't think like I do.

 

And it's a good thing I don't model and texture. I'd be too much of an ass showcasing it and teasing people only to see people beg for something never to be released. I'm such a dick. lol

 

Anyways, ritualclarity has the right of it. Apart from schedule. If people are not devoted and have tolerance and patience, and even will to sacrifice their ideas to have them intervened by others, it won't work.

 

One of the keys is to have the group members understand a clear concise and direct path of what is and what isn't to be done for the project. A project is a task that has a clear beginning middle and end. ONe can easily see where a project progress is at any time based on the plan. Planning and getting most of the main details established is critical to get a project done when there are many people working on it.

 

Most of the mods here are "development" driven (or so I say  lol) where there is more of a general idea of what is to be done and direction which can change. This works very well with the loose knit work from many members which can drop in and give a bit and move on when they need to. It creates a slower progress but progress none the same. One person is usually the lead such as in Sexlabs or Sexout framework development with many chiming in to keep things honest. In this case there is loads of collaboration around here. If I wanted to I could jump in to almost any aspect of various mods currently being updated with my meager and limited skills. There are all sorts of task that can be done by many. I have been asked many times for help with dialogue in the GECK/CK and sometimes work with Item Ids and importing assets into the game from someone's creations (texture artist)

 

You (the OP) might not realize the level of cooperation and work that is being shared currently in almost all aspects of mods here on LL. This is unique in most communities as many other ones are smaller core groups of individuals that work together on a project (but usually continue for project after project etc) Sexlab, Sexout, DD all have had numerous members contribute their various skills to being them up to the level that they are. Zaz is another one. I believe even Submit was a small group of individuals as well.

 

If you want to show your skills or willingness to learn and volunteer and I am sure someone will come along and help you.. yes I said help YOU...lol You would be helped pretty much as you would be  helping or in early learning cases more so. The member would be helping you earn and re-enforce your skills making you a better more skilled individual. Hell I haven't even done much on the Geck and even less with the CK but I have helped others with heir tech support which actually uses the program through my time helping and reading ... all without even using the dam program.. LOL..

 

If you (or anyone does )decide to start their modding careers and share work and help try to be realistic with your time and ability to give what you promise. You can always give more.. (bonus) but giving less usually leaves those you work with a sour taste in their mouth. Of course there will be RL events that occur and in time your rep will stand for itself.

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This is a really good thread. While I can agree with the statements regarding the difficulty of such projects involving others, don't use that difficulty as a weight to practice restraint against trying. You just never know. Maybe a group of novice level modders will want to produce a bigger mod that requires help. I know I do, but my ideas would require an entirely new game to be built using an engine that doesn't suck donkey dick. I came to that realization last year, early on, as a couple of my pet projects became dead in the water; even if I could get the help I need, the Skyrim engine just can't hack it.

 

But please try. I always value hope over negativity (not that the sound advice is meant to be negative, but it can always be taken and exercised negatively).

 

You might be interested in this

https://openmw.org/2016/openmw-0-39-0-released/

If they can get this to work I imagine they can move on to other games as well or create a foundation that could be used for further game creation using tools similar to what we are used to already.

 

 

 

Maybe I should release chapter one first. I'm actually writing a fan fiction story which is the basis for one of those mods. Nothing lays out a concept like the story in depth.

 

On Tuesday I added several pages to chapter one. It just poured out for the first time in eighteen years.

 

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Honestly I think the biggest stumbling block is "version control", also known as "How the hell do I get all these different pieces into ONE mod".  For whatever reason, Beth and Steam made it beyond difficult to do that.  If you don't want to hand-duplicate Every Single Record, (and then hand-check them) then you have to resort to third-party software, which may or may not work correctly -- through no fault of that developer's own, but more due to the hidden and unreleased stuff, that people may not even know is a problem.  The SEQ thing back when Skyrim and the CK were first launched is a really good example of that.

 

The second stumbling block is people themselves -- conflicts over what the mod should do; real-life interference with deadlines; misunderstanding of priorities or even basic ideas.

 

The third one is personal stuff -- Will I get credit?  I thought I knew how to do (___insert thing here___) but I didn't, now what?  and so on.

 

But IMO both those last ones are easily overcome.  The first one... Yeah, not so much.

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Hence my suggestion for a single dictatorial authoritative leader.

 

Well, we're not getting paid for what we do, so why would I want to listen to somebody's orders? In -particular- if their vision conflicts with my own. I have like...zero incentive to do that, when I can just make my own mod the way I want it to be, no?

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Hence my suggestion for a single dictatorial authoritative leader.

 

Well, we're not getting paid for what we do, so why would I want to listen to somebody's orders? In -particular- if their vision conflicts with my own. I have like...zero incentive to do that, when I can just make my own mod the way I want it to be, no?

 

 

Because they could bind you up in devices that take up to seven keys to remove, that's why!  :D

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Hence my suggestion for a single dictatorial authoritative leader.

 

Well, we're not getting paid for what we do, so why would I want to listen to somebody's orders? In -particular- if their vision conflicts with my own. I have like...zero incentive to do that, when I can just make my own mod the way I want it to be, no?

 

 

Because they could bind you up in devices that take up to seven keys to remove, that's why!  :D

 

 

Don't give me any ideas, CC. That cursed collar belongs around Kimy's neck.

 

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I probably should have made distinction between the framework style mods and others. As important as the mods that make two actors idle animate in close proximity to each other are ( :rolleyes:), I was thinking more of content enhancing mods.

I yearn for story based mods or overhauls that add sexuality as a meaningful aspect of the gameworld and I don't just mean a global dialogue line along the lines of "Fancy a fuck?"

 

 elitist snobs

 

Woop, I've been warned about commenting on such things. :)

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I probably should have made distinction between the framework style mods and others. As important as the mods that make two actors idle animate in close proximity to each other are ( :rolleyes:), I was thinking more of content enhancing mods.

 

I yearn for story based mods or overhauls that add sexuality as a meaningful aspect of the gameworld and I don't just mean a global dialogue line along the lines of "Fancy a fuck?"

 

 elitist snobs

 

Woop, I've been warned about commenting on such things. :)

 

 The MSex mods my Mavia for New Vegas add some interesting and more intellectually oriented sexual

content, although they are BDSM-themed. There's another mod that allows romance with Doc Mitchell,

and Sexout Intimacy, which tries to give a more realistic representation of different facets of human relationships.

Sexout Soliciting allows you to explore being a prostitute and adds some nicely scripted unique encounters;

it's one of my favorites, and one that I contributed to, along with many LL members. There's Loogie's Tryouts,

which is pretty hard-edged and more male-oriented, and the TTW Quest Overhaul, which was a group effort.

 Fertile Breeder and Sexout Breeder are both epic bestiality-themed mods.

 

 What seems to work the best is to let one person do the scripting, another handle artistic assets, maybe someone

else creates cells, another person writes the dialog. It's kind of like being in a band, and rather than giving the

other band members sheet music, you trust them to come up with their own parts and hopefully come up with

something more interesting than you would have done by yourself... kind of like the Beatles  :lol: 

 

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Guest endgameaddiction

 There has been been quite a lot of collaboration with Sexout modding for New Vegas; maybe

Skyrim modders are just a bunch of elitist snobs  ;)

 

It is a very much different vibe between Fallout 3/NV and Skyrim here. I remember even back when we used to post screenshots back in the days it was all fun times and in Skyrim it has turned to shut and post images only. Or used to be for a while. Wish we can jump back 3-4 years ago here. Fun times.

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