MSMA: SexFight (like "Succubus Drain") and Bimbofication

[epitaph78]

Hi again..

 

ONLY iff its not to much of a hassle..

could you let us define the morph name external ? (like in a .json)

 

 

so we can control the look of the morph so it fits the Bodyslide Preset that is used.

 

 

[MSM_Alice]

3 hours ago, epitaph78 said:

Hi again..

 

ONLY iff its not to much of a hassle..

could you let us define the morph name external ? (like in a .json)

 

 

so we can control the look of the morph so it fits the Bodyslide Preset that is used.

 

 

Perhaps after I am done with the current social system.
It would probably mean adding a new script extender/requirement that would allow the mod to read/write from a JSON file into Papyrus.
I haven't done that yet, so I would need to learn how it is done.

[epitaph78]

3 hours ago, MSM_Alice said:

Perhaps after I am done with the current social system.
It would probably mean adding a new script extender/requirement that would allow the mod to read/write from a JSON file into Papyrus.
I haven't done that yet, so I would need to learn how it is done.

 

SUP F4SE comes to my mind.

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/articles/3946

 

It's no demand just if you realy got the spare time and nothing to do..  don't want to interfere with your development.

[judge007]

1 minute ago, epitaph78 said:

 

SUP F4SE comes to my mind.

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/articles/3946

 

It's no demand just if you realy got the spare time and nothing to do..  don't want to interfere with your development.

That mod on Nexus and Discord, is completely halted in development,

and it's author has been missing in action since the start of the Ukraine war.

It only functions for 1.10.163

 

While it is a very good "library" dll, it's not something to count on for upwards development in Fallout 4 modding.

A better choice would be the upcoming update to Papyrus Common Library.

 

Just my $0.02

[epitaph78]

20 minutes ago, judge007 said:

That mod on Nexus and Discord, is completely halted in development,

and it's author has been missing in action since the start of the Ukraine war.

It only functions for 1.10.163

 

While it is a very good "library" dll, it's not something to count on for upwards development in Fallout 4 modding.

A better choice would be the upcoming update to Papyrus Common Library.

 

Just my $0.02

 

YW

just know that library from the past and it was good..  but didnt know the author is missing and like you say with the OG/NG shit around its better to get someting thats going to get updates.

[Cheburashka100500]

You know, I didn't find any logic in Depravity mods, like why I should let Kellogg live. And your mod explained it very simply and clearly.

[MSM_Alice]

23 minutes ago, Cheburashka100500 said:

You know, I didn't find any logic in Depravity mods, like why I should let Kellogg live. And your mod explained it very simply and clearly.

I would love it if  you could expand a bit on that,
You mean, because in this alt-universe, Nate was a cheat, and had it coming?
And killing Kellogg won't reverse the passage of time, and won't bring a more innocent version of Shaun back, so the vengeance quest is mostly a self-destructive one.

Or because the player's mind is externally hijacked from the vengeance quest?

Or what do you mean?
I am interested, as after I am done with these new mechanics, polishing the alt-story is the next thing, and I want to learn why some parts of the premise work for some but not for others. 

 

Edited January 9 by MSM_Alice

[MSM_Alice]

4 hours ago, epitaph78 said:

 

YW

just know that library from the past and it was good..  but didnt know the author is missing and like you say with the OG/NG shit around its better to get someting thats going to get updates.

@judge007

Both Papyrus Common Library and the GardenOfEden Script Extender are the ones that I am eyeing for potential inclusion, so ic can do fancier stuff better.

[MSM_Alice]

What are your feelings on 

Flashy(JoeR) - Crime And Punishment at Fallout 4 Nexus - Mods and community
 

Becoming a required mod for MSMA? (soft requirement, needed for the social interaction consequences to feel more real,  to be more fleshed out, not a hard requirement) 

 

In the social interaction, some branches invariably will lead to events (either by the player or the NPC) that would count as a crime.
Whether that is mere indecent exposure, sex in public,  or murder, and instead of reinventing the wheel in terms of these events being crimes and having a punishment system, I'd rather move faster, build on top of already existing mods addressing those aspects, and just build the bimbo-specific parts. 

Edited January 9 by MSM_Alice

[judge007]

1 hour ago, MSM_Alice said:

What are your feelings on 

Flashy(JoeR) - Crime And Punishment at Fallout 4 Nexus - Mods and community
 

Becoming a required mod for MSMA? (soft requirement, needed for the social interaction consequences to feel more real,  to be more fleshed out, not a hard requirement) 

 

In the social interaction, some branches invariably will lead to events (either by the player or the NPC) that would count as a crime.
Whether that is mere indecent exposure, sex in public,  or murder, and instead of reinventing the wheel in terms of these events being crimes and having a punishment system, I'd rather move faster, build on top of already existing mods addressing those aspects, and just build the bimbo-specific parts. 

I'm currently running most of Flashy(Joer)'s mods along with an idle Commonwealth Slavers & Nuka Ride.

In my opinion, Crime and Punishment is a good fit, probably not to the level of CS or NR.

So, soft requirement. This is so if someone were to play CS seriously, they could dispense with Crime and Punishment.

They intersect (in a conflicting manner) at too many spots, the DC security office as a prime example.

 

When I say running Slavers in idle, I mean running it & it's requirements, and choosing to decided not to play it when prompted at first encounter with Murphy.

This allows the full use of it's custom animations and the Film Studio at the Hook. Access to instant futafication (is that even a word?), and jewelry,

plus all sorts of cheats from it's MCM.

[judge007]

2 hours ago, MSM_Alice said:

@judge007

Both Papyrus Common Library and the GardenOfEden Script Extender are the ones that I am eyeing for potential inclusion, so ic can do fancier stuff better.

The author of Papyrus Common Library has indicated they are going to include SUP_F4SE's functionality in the update, all dependent on Bugthesda finalizing the AE upgrade.

If that helps.

[Cheburashka100500]

4 hours ago, MSM_Alice said:

I would love it if  you could expand a bit on that,
You mean, because in this alt-universe, Nate was a cheat, and had it coming?
And killing Kellogg won't reverse the passage of time, and won't bring a more innocent version of Shaun back, so the vengeance quest is mostly a self-destructive one.

Or because the player's mind is externally hijacked from the vengeance quest?

Or what do you mean?
I am interested, as after I am done with these new mechanics, polishing the alt-story is the next thing, and I want to learn why some parts of the premise work for some but not for others. 

 

 

Of course, it could have been written more dramatically—Nate leaves for another woman. Instead, - Nora refuses him oral sex, and he gets bored and files for divorce. Although, in essence, it's the same thing.
I understand you did all this with humor, and that's very good.)

[Mimirue17]

3 hours ago, judge007 said:

I'm currently running most of Flashy(Joer)'s mods along with an idle Commonwealth Slavers & Nuka Ride.

In my opinion, Crime and Punishment is a good fit, probably not to the level of CS or NR.

So, soft requirement. This is so if someone were to play CS seriously, they could dispense with Crime and Punishment.

They intersect (in a conflicting manner) at too many spots, the DC security office as a prime example.

 

When I say running Slavers in idle, I mean running it & it's requirements, and choosing to decided not to play it when prompted at first encounter with Murphy.

This allows the full use of it's custom animations and the Film Studio at the Hook. Access to instant futafication (is that even a word?), and jewelry,

plus all sorts of cheats from it's MCM.

I am interested, I noticed CS has been updated (haven't played it in a very long time, not really my thing).   If I understand the front page its DC Expansion that has conflicts with Crime and Punishment in the DC Security office, though I have not looked in the comment section to confirm its the only conflict.  Curious how much of the soft requirements you use and option items you use in CS itself to go along with this playing MSMA and how they interact/conflict (if any)

 

edit: looks like its the Jail that CAP alters - so there may be ways to fix that with a patch (as they patched it for Depravity) though I do not know who could make such a patch, I also do not know what CS does in DC Security as it has been a long time like mentioned.

Edited January 9 by Mimirue17

[tim8867]

Hello, is there a way to prevent intelligence from decreasing when you're a bimbo or a slut? I see that I can gain 5 intelligence points, but I don't understand how.

[judge007]

3 hours ago, Mimirue17 said:

I am interested, I noticed CS has been updated (haven't played it in a very long time, not really my thing).   If I understand the front page its DC Expansion that has conflicts with Crime and Punishment in the DC Security office, though I have not looked in the comment section to confirm its the only conflict.  Curious how much of the soft requirements you use and option items you use in CS itself to go along with this playing MSMA and how they interact/conflict (if any)

 

edit: looks like its the Jail that CAP alters - so there may be ways to fix that with a patch (as they patched it for Depravity) though I do not know who could make such a patch, I also do not know what CS does in DC Security as it has been a long time like mentioned.

With CS, the cell you are placed in before starting the DC Whore quest will be behind a wall.

This is also changed by the Pervert mod, and Problems of Survivor mod

 

As for the requirements, all of them. I use the skin cleaning cream, remove DD cheat, remove KFT cheat.

Sometimes I use the futa cheat, piercings, some clothes

JB left a console command to enable the Hook, so that's available as well

 

During Luck Day quest, when you get to the place where there is a campfire, and Mur[hy shave your head there will be three NPCs who cause

Gristle and Murphy to aggro, and are unkillable

If for DC Whore quest, you don't Fast Travel there, Gristle will attack NPCs near the Outskirts of DC,

although there is no repercussions for that (the guards will just watch)

Edited January 9 by judge007
Forgot some info

[judge007]

13 hours ago, epitaph78 said:

 

YW

just know that library from the past and it was good..  but didnt know the author is missing and like you say with the OG/NG shit around its better to get someting thats going to get updates.

Someone just pointed this out to me:

 

https://github.com/Datanomicron/SUP-F4SE-NG/releases/tag/v0.77

 

[MSM_Alice]

14 hours ago, tim8867 said:

Hello, is there a way to prevent intelligence from decreasing when you're a bimbo or a slut? I see that I can gain 5 intelligence points, but I don't understand how.

Hello

• The intelligence drop from SA Slut status is done by the SexAttributes mod. To fix that you need to recover from slut status by reducing your sex addiction.
  • MSMA gives you a simple way to lower your sex addiction by using Zen, one of the 4 magic dildos bestowed upon you by Marina. You can also do that via sexfight, but that's a more advanced technique involving pressing the sexfight button when the pleasure is high,  but outside of an NPC-issued challenge.
• The SPECIAL  stats altered from race-specific perversions (the things that happen if having aggressive sex while mindbroken) are also done by the SexAttributes mod (MSMA gives you an additional  way to cure those perversions, though, via Marina's hypnotic trigger) 
• The SPECIAL stats altered as a consequence of the value of high arousal, self-esteem, or low willpower are done by the Sex Attributes mod. 
  • MSMA gives you a way to improve those stats using the 3 magic dildos corresponding to Willpowerr, Self-esteem, and Arousal ( Courage, Harmony, and Joy).
• The bimbo -1 Intelligence per bimbo level is the one directly done by MSMA. You do gain +1 Endurance and +1 Charisma in return.  Also, to offset up to 5 intelligence lost from that maximum seven total, you can  
  • - Invest  in Bimbo in Denial/Not a bimbo specialist skill track  (that eventually gives you a permanent solution in the  form of a bimbo specialist skill that claws back up to 5 int from the int lost to bimbo level ups)  OR
  •  (once cravings set in) There is an anti-craving medicine/consumable from Marina (24-hour effects, with some side effects) that will allow you to recover 5 int as well for the duration of the effect.  It is the same 5 int that the bimbo in denial skill gives you ( they do not stack). This one is temporary.

 

That being said, the implant will push you to do activities that,  if analyzed carefully, are sometimes against your best interest, and that is why it needs to make you less intelligent, so you don't think too much about it and comply.  The 7 int decreasers (1 Int per bimbo level) as you level up have a place in the lore/story.

The lost int that MSMA causes on Bimbo level ups is a modifier effect on top of your base INT stat (but does not alter the base stat itself ). That means you can still push that base stat up to 10 in your Perk Chart, and unlock all intelligence-based vanilla Perks as normal, should you want to.

Edited January 10 by MSM_Alice

[tim8867]

31 minutes ago, MSM_Alice said:

Hello

• The intelligence drop from SA Slut status is done by the SexAttributes mod. To fix that you need to recover from slut status by reducing your sex addiction.
  • MSMA gives you a simple way to lower your sex addiction by using Zen, one of the 4 magic dildos bestowed upon you by Marina. You can also do that via sexfight, but that's a more advanced technique involving pressing the sexfight button when the pleasure is high,  but outside of an NPC-issued challenge.
• The SPECIAL  stats altered from race-specific perversions (the things that happen if having aggressive sex while mindbroken) are also done by the SexAttributes mod (MSMA gives you an additional  way to cure those perversions, though, via Marina's hypnotic trigger) 
• The SPECIAL stats altered as a consequence of the value of high arousal, self esteem, or low willpower are done by the Sex Attributes mod. 
  • MSMA gives you a way to improve those stats using the 3 magic dildos corresponding to Willpowerr, Self-esteem, and Arousal ( Courage, Harmony, and Joy).
• The bimbo -1 Intelligence per bimbo level is the one directly done by MSMA. You do gain +1 Endurance and +1 Charisma in return.  Also, to offset up to 5 intelligence lost from that maximum seven total, you can  
  • - Invest  in Bimbo in Denial/Not a bimbo specialist kill track  (that eventually gives you a permanent solution in the  form of a bimbo specialist skill that claws back up to 5 int from the int lost to bimbo level ups)  OR
  •  (once cravings set in) There is an anti-craving medicine/consumable from Marina (24-hour effects, with some side effects) that will allow you to recover 5 int as well for the duration of the effect.  It is the same 5 int that the bimbo in denial skill gives you ( they do not stack). This one is temporary.

 

That being said, the implant will push you to do activities that,  if analyzed carefully, are sometimes against your best interest, and that is why it needs to make you less intelligent, so you don't think too much about it and comply.  The 7 int decreasers (1 Int per bimbo level) as you level up have a place in the lore/story.

The lost int that MSMA causes on Bimbo level ups is a modifier effect on top of your base INT stat (but does not alter the base stat itself ). That means you can still push that base stat up to 10 in your Perk Chart, and unlock all intelligence-based vanilla Perks as normal, should you want to.

Okay, thank you for your reply. So it's not that bad to be negative in intelligence if I have a base of 10. I was afraid that it would hinder my science skills and my ability to hack.

[nefer385]

On 1/8/2026 at 5:41 AM, MSM_Alice said:

All of that being said, does not change that sitting on furniture or using a shower cabin shouldn't have been treated as if the player was running or sprinting. 
That was a bug.

Here is an interim version with that fixed, but be warned, I am in the middle of adding the social interactions quest, and that is not finished, so there may be extra oddities and loose ends here.    Though did my best to comment it out, as I only want to release it when it is proper functional and fun and not half-baked,  but who knows, something might have slipped by.


V 1.0280
Changelog:

• The Motion penalties for big chest/butt/belly should correctly identify the moment the player is sitting on furniture, and not trigger in such occasions 
• The Motion penalties for big chest/butt/belly should correctly identify the moment the player surrenders in AAF violate, and auto stop
• The Motion penalties for big chest/butt/belly should correctly identify the moment the player enters Bleedout, and should auto-stop.
• Ligher DD restraints, such as nipple clamps, plugs, should no longer change the context menu to " I'm restrained, need to do something about it" menu; only the more serious motion-limiting restraints should do that now
• Added a morality actor value to NPCs to decide how their behaviour would lean in later social interaction. Added the social interaction quest  and script, and variables infrastructure (but it should do nothing for now)

MSMA_Act1_[In_Development]_1_0280.zip 129.79 MB · 1 download

 You helped me tremendously.  I have been wearing the clothing that I had obtained from Marina.  However, I did not add the Hypersexual weave into the clothing.  It makes total sense now, that the mod is looking for the specific tags.  I will be sure to add/convert the proper tag to the attire.  Thanks for the temporary hotfix.  I knew it was something a bit off that each time I had the character go to the shower, sink or toilet she'd get dinged for her large attributes.  

[Mimirue17]

13 hours ago, judge007 said:

With CS, the cell you are placed in before starting the DC Whore quest will be behind a wall.

This is also changed by the Pervert mod, and Problems of Survivor mod

 

As for the requirements, all of them. I use the skin cleaning cream, remove DD cheat, remove KFT cheat.

Sometimes I use the futa cheat, piercings, some clothes

JB left a console command to enable the Hook, so that's available as well

 

During Luck Day quest, when you get to the place where there is a campfire, and Mur[hy shave your head there will be three NPCs who cause

Gristle and Murphy to aggro, and are unkillable

If for DC Whore quest, you don't Fast Travel there, Gristle will attack NPCs near the Outskirts of DC,

although there is no repercussions for that (the guards will just watch)

Pervert Mod will likely be ok now for DC security - he moved all his stuff to a door on a wall and new cell.   I will test CS vs CAP when I get to DC - CAP says you can add it mid game so will test it with and without.   I do not recall anything dealing with Futa options in the MCM for CS, not that it really matters that much but would have been interesting.

Will post results when I get there.

[tinkerbelle]

On 1/9/2026 at 1:25 AM, MSM_Alice said:

What are your feelings on 

Flashy(JoeR) - Crime And Punishment at Fallout 4 Nexus - Mods and community
 

Becoming a required mod for MSMA? (soft requirement, needed for the social interaction consequences to feel more real,  to be more fleshed out, not a hard requirement) 

 

In the social interaction, some branches invariably will lead to events (either by the player or the NPC) that would count as a crime.
Whether that is mere indecent exposure, sex in public,  or murder, and instead of reinventing the wheel in terms of these events being crimes and having a punishment system, I'd rather move faster, build on top of already existing mods addressing those aspects, and just build the bimbo-specific parts. 

I have personal issues with JoeR mods.  While I can understand that you'd wish to make use of the functions included with Crime and Punishment, making it a hard requirement would mean my needing to remove MSMA_Bimbo from my load order.  I haven't looked, but previous JoeR mods used a JoeR framework mod which had many of the functions.  Maybe if a framework exists for Crime and Punishment you could make that framework a requirement.

 

Not to mention that JoeR has a history of suddenly removing his mods.  Crime and Punishment has been around for a while, so maybe he won't be removing that one.

 

[MSM_Alice]

1 hour ago, tinkerbelle said:

I have personal issues with JoeR mods.  While I can understand that you'd wish to make use of the functions included with Crime and Punishment, making it a hard requirement would mean my needing to remove MSMA_Bimbo from my load order.  I haven't looked, but previous JoeR mods used a JoeR framework mod which had many of the functions.  Maybe if a framework exists for Crime and Punishment you could make that framework a requirement.

 

Not to mention that JoeR has a history of suddenly removing his mods.  Crime and Punishment has been around for a while, so maybe he won't be removing that one.

 

Thank you. 

What was interesting about CaP is that it seemed to have been lighter/rewritten and more streamlined,  it was encapsulated and its own thing, and didn't come with all the stuff from older mods like RSE/RSE2. 
I haven't yet decided if I will make this move or not; currently still looking/pondering if it is the right move.
Even if I do it won't be a hard requirement.

In a first stage, I think I will only do the interactions that only result in conversations, and not much else, and I don't need another framework for that just yet.


What I really want is just the law enforcer/jail system framework, so that the consequences of doing antisocial stuff feels more real.
Someone on the Discord brought up two good points, though. 

- Technical: There are lighter karma-based frameworks that provide some of that  (Crime and Punishment has a lot of different subsystems that I don't really need, which might complicate things, and does not provide script sources by default, so any finer integration would require script decompiling, which might be a hassle).

- Lore/Story In a set-up such as Fallout, where any law enforcement effort is already stretched thin ( if present at all), would people waste effort, jail space, and resources on punishing sex crimes? Or would those be handled through fines or, at most, community service more than anything else?

Valid points, both of them.
 

 

I'll also look at something like BoundInPublic to see if that could be some form of jail replacement for sex crimes, if fines or community service are not acceptable.
 

 

Edited January 10 by MSM_Alice

[epitaph78]

7 hours ago, MSM_Alice said:

Thank you. 

What was interesting about CaP is that it seemed to have been lighter/rewritten and more streamlined,  it was encapsulated and its own thing, and didn't come with all the stuff from older mods like RSE/RSE2. 
I haven't yet decided if I will make this move or not; currently still looking/pondering if it is the right move.
Even if I do it won't be a hard requirement.
.......

 

Are you going to make your mod seperated in modules or will it be a single big mod ? like the Sexfight and Bimbofication as the Core/Framework and the up comming features seperated as modules ?  

Iff you split it up ppl can deactivate parts they got problems with or features they just dont like.

[Mimirue17]

4 minutes ago, epitaph78 said:

 

Are you going to make your mod seperated in modules or will it be a single big mod ? like the Sexfight and Bimbofication as the Core/Framework and the up comming features seperated as modules ?  

Iff you split it up ppl can deactivate parts they got problems with or features they just dont like.

I think you already can do that with the current MCM options.   For example I am an a very harcore type playthrough (most sex scenes are not voluntary for player) and have the cravings turned off completely.   You can basically turn the QoH off by setting values at 0.   You can even turn off sexfight if you just want the other options.   I would see this as something that would likely continue allowing the player to use what features they want vs it being hard coded.

[Mimirue17]

8 hours ago, MSM_Alice said:

Thank you. 

What was interesting about CaP is that it seemed to have been lighter/rewritten and more streamlined,  it was encapsulated and its own thing, and didn't come with all the stuff from older mods like RSE/RSE2. 
I haven't yet decided if I will make this move or not; currently still looking/pondering if it is the right move.
Even if I do it won't be a hard requirement.

In a first stage, I think I will only do the interactions that only result in conversations, and not much else, and I don't need another framework for that just yet.


What I really want is just the law enforcer/jail system framework, so that the consequences of doing antisocial stuff feels more real.
Someone on the Discord brought up two good points, though. 

- Technical: There are lighter karma-based frameworks that provide some of that  (Crime and Punishment has a lot of different subsystems that I don't really need, which might complicate things, and does not provide script sources by default, so any finer integration would require script decompiling, which might be a hassle).

- Lore/Story In a set-up such as Fallout, where any law enforcement effort is already stretched thin ( if present at all), would people waste effort, jail space, and resources on punishing sex crimes? Or would those be handled through fines or, at most, community service more than anything else?

Valid points, both of them.
 

 

I'll also look at something like BoundInPublic to see if that could be some form of jail replacement for sex crimes, if fines or community service are not acceptable.
 

 

I plan to play around with this mod in the near future - as you can turn off almost every option in the mod if you do not want it.   Would like to see how it interacts with the sexfight mechanics in different environments and mod options chosen.   It has potential to be something that could be very customizable to fit your style/route your bimbo has chosen.   I also have concerns the same as have been mentioned, as some of the previous mods from this author are on the 'never ever use' list for AAF on the manual and have had personal experience with a few of them that were not great but way before this mod was created.   If this is indeed a standalone and streamlined usage of what they learned, I am willing to test it out and not judge beforehand.

Edited January 11 by Mimirue17