Massively votes TESO be biggest FLOP!

[ChaisyM]

I'm playing it and having fun doing so. Pretty much everyone here criticizing is making mountains out of mole-hills. Sorry they couldn't develop the game to each and every fan's exacting personal tastes, or that lore gets slightly re-written over time. Is it fun? Yes. Does it feel like The Elder Scrolls to me? Yes. Ok then, I'm in!

[nutluck]

I played it in beta and thought it was ok. Not great but not bad. My issue with it was this. I didn't consider it really any better than the huge array of f2p MMO's out there, which begs the question why would I pay a monthly fee for it? Well I wouldn't, when and I do say when it goes f2p I will likely play it some thing.

 

My other issue with f2p and this has nothing to do with TESO is I like to play a variety of games. So I play games and take breaks sometimes for weeks or even months from one game only to go back later. I always feel a bit cheated paying a monthly fee for a game that I know I wouldn't play every month. Yes I know I can just pay for the months I want, but even then there is times I play a game for a week. Something unexpected comes up and I don't play for the next 3 weeks wasting my subscription time.

 

This is a big reason why I think monthly fee's just don't work in today's market. Micro transactions I think are a far far better way to handle games personally. Then I buy the extra's I want, play when I want and not feel cheated when i don't play enough, get invested long term in the game and slowly spend money on it. World of Tanks and SWtOR have both gotten a lot more money out of me than I ever planned on spending on them when i first started.

 

So I don't think TESO is going to be a "flop" which is a subjective term anyways, but I do think it is going to fail to live up to expectations and will end up f2p with micro transactions like the vast vast majority of MMO's on the market.

[Mebrilia]

I'm playing it and having fun doing so. Pretty much everyone here criticizing is making mountains out of mole-hills. Sorry they couldn't develop the game to each and every fan's exacting personal tastes, or that lore gets slightly re-written over time. Is it fun? Yes. Does it feel like The Elder Scrolls to me? Yes. Ok then, I'm in!

 

No offence ....... What personal taste you are talking bout? Since we know how a TES game should look like... And this is just a themepark with broken mechanics and lores tossed outside the window.....

 

Dark elf with grey purple yellow eyes?....((when azura turned all the dark elf with ash like skin and red eyes??))

 

Winged twilight coming from coldhalbur portals? ((winged twilight belong to azura and are used like messengers there is was just an exception... in a quest in morrowind when you have to kill a winged twilight that is the daughter of Molag Bal...but since he is the lord of rape is understandable how a winged twilight can be his daughter))

 

It is fun?... That's a matter of opinion i am not arguing with that...to me was NOT fun....mostly because i think MMO mechanics are immersion breaking and stupid....

 

It is a tes? HELL NO even the race design don't follow the lores there is so many example i can make that a single post will be not enough to explain all the mistakes teso did with lores....

 

Dunmer with Argonians and Nords? please.... Dunmer hate argonian they consider them beasts and about the Nords? well Dunmer Fought the nords when they were chimer....

 

And how about the alienish look the elf are supposed to have in TES? where are their distinctive tracts? tossed out from the window so the kiddies can be happy and make a stupid generic elf with dark skin purple eyes and white hair... oh look im a drow how COOL is that!?

 

 

Please.......

 

 

Listen is ok if you like it because is a MMO but is NOT and never will BE a TES game..

[Duoleb The Chosen]

Mer still look alien-ish

[Mebrilia]

http://media.pcgamer.com/files/2013/10/the-elder-scrolls-online-faces.png

 

Indeed very alienish....they seem just caucasian with pointy ears....come on....since the dumbing down of skyrim some race become human like but this is too much....and sadly is not the only problem that tes online have....Also the culture difference are not potrayed at all.. Dunmer style armor are just generic...soul less.. plastic like....same at the north one at the point that seem to me they just taken the nord armos mesh and just used different texture ... Chitin warrior where are they? since even in the book written by vivec itself chitin warrior are mentioned like a distinctive feature of the dunmer of morrowind...And please don't tell me ...But is 800 years before skyrim... Because since vivec is around in TESO that's not a good excuse....

 

Seriously i can understand you can like teso as a moorpg BUT IS NOT a tes game it will be NOT at tes game and who claim different don't have any idea of what is talking about....

 

Now the skyrim look of the race is not lore accurate as well but at least they have minor differences 

http://www.kotowari.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/Skyrim-Races.jpg

 

Seriously Dunmer with silver yellow or purple eyes all around!? When azura cursed the dunmer she made them to have ash like skin and RED eyes.......

 

The race face of TESO are just caucasian with pointy ears.. they don't have even face bone difference between races... AH but its ok since the mmo crowd are not interested in lore but just farm farm kill kill and pvp....

 

TESO can be nice as mmorpg

 

But is not a Tes game.....because as a tes game is boring....soul less....crap that feels like plastic...

 

End of line

 

About the lores: You can't change the lores by much over the time.... Having solid lores makes the world feel more alive and believable change the lore and toss them outside from the window is the easy way to get a stramlined soul less title with a laughtable result....

 

Example?:

 

Dragon age Origins: Solid overall lores that fit perfectly to the world design...

 

Dragon age 2: That tossed the lores adding Na'vi elves looking a sort of crossbreeding between Donkey and gremling... And still the lore in dragon age say: Elves a supposed to be very generally attractive......

 

 

[Coopervane]

Mer still look alien-ish

 

The Bosmer do, infact i think they did a good job on the Bosmer, they have the big almond shaped eyes and heart-shaped faces that has always been a staple of TES elves. They look not quite human, but also not like generic monsters (unlike Skyrim where the elves all look like Satan for some reason).

 

But the Altmer practically just look like humans with pointy ears, and the Dunmer are sort of an inbetween of the two (and should have red eyes!).

[Mebrilia]

 

Mer still look alien-ish

 

The Bosmer do, infact i think they did a good job on the Bosmer, they have the big almond shaped eyes and heart-shaped faces that has always been a staple of TES elves. They look not quite human, but also not like generic monsters (unlike Skyrim where the elves all look like Satan for some reason).

 

But the Altmer practically just look like humans with pointy ears, and the Dunmer are sort of an inbetween of the two (and should have red eyes!).

 

 

I am sorry to disappoint you but actually mer in skyrim that are still not completely accurate by the lores are the ones that resemble much more the races potrayed on the lores....

 

Is interesting this point because the author of skywind decided also to do an add on to get rid of the base races of skyrim and adding the same races but more closer to the lore concept of the race....

 

Race distinction disappeared with oblivion then added almost back with skyrim...Mer in TES was never supposed to look too much like humans with pointy ears.. 

 

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Bosmer_(Skyrim)

 

look at the concept art at the end of the page and you will notice how a bosmer is supposed to be.... The original elf look was potrayed in morrowind but not rendered well since because the low poly models...

[Kaputzki]

Initial box/sub is not the criteria to the game's success. It's the lifespan and development of said game in both technical, player base-size and gameplay which deems if a game is successful. MMOs can live as much as games like Skyrim due to the replayability value it provides with new content (in the single player case, mods) and they take time to evolve.

 

 

The real big issue TESO is facing is the expectations it didn't live up to; there will forever be a looming shadow over the title's head of a game that failed to deliver and that will drive interested players away.

 

For the sake of example, I'm a player interested in MMOs, I will google TESO post-release, and possibly the first things I will see are going to be:

 

TESO - official website.

TESO - review

Website 1 - article - how TESO broke my heart

Website 2 - article - how TESO ruined my dreams

Website 3 - TESO, a waste of your time and money.

Website 4 - TESO porn.

 

The internet has a habit of not forgetting.

 

 

[Coopervane]

 

look at the concept art at the end of the page and you will notice how a bosmer is supposed to be.... The original elf look was potrayed in morrowind but not rendered well since because the low poly models...

 

I am looking, and big almond shaped eyes and heart-shaped faces are the distinctive features of that concept art, and unlike the look they ended up with in Skyrim, they don't look like Satan in those drawings.

 

I stand by what i said.

[GrimReaper]

Initial box/sub is not the criteria to the game's success. It's the lifespan and development of said game in both technical, player base-size and gameplay which deems if a game is successful. MMOs can live as much as games like Skyrim due to the replayability value it provides with new content (in the single player case, mods) and they take time to evolve.

 

 

The real big issue TESO is facing is the expectations it didn't live up to; there will forever be a looming shadow over the title's head of a game that failed to deliver and that will drive interested players away.

 

For the sake of example, I'm a player interested in MMOs, I will google TESO post-release, and possibly the first things I will see are going to be:

 

TESO - official website.

TESO - review

Website 1 - article - how TESO broke my heart

Website 2 - article - how TESO ruined my dreams

Website 3 - TESO, a waste of your time and money.

Website 4 - TESO porn.

 

The internet has a habit of not forgetting.

 

What are you talking about, the expectations were pretty low. There was no real hype about this game. All previews were basically about how crappy the game looked and how clunky and irritating the gameplay was.

[GrimReaper]

 

I am sorry to disappoint you but actually mer in skyrim that are still not completely accurate by the lores are the ones that resemble much more the races potrayed on the lores....

 

Is interesting this point because the author of skywind decided also to do an add on to get rid of the base races of skyrim and adding the same races but more closer to the lore concept of the race....

 

Race distinction disappeared with oblivion then added almost back with skyrim...Mer in TES was never supposed to look too much like humans with pointy ears.. 

 

http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Bosmer_(Skyrim)

 

look at the concept art at the end of the page and you will notice how a bosmer is supposed to be.... The original elf look was potrayed in morrowind but not rendered well since because the low poly models...

 

 

What the fuck is wrong with you loremongers, really. TES is one of the worst works of fiction when it comes to the consistency of the lore. The allmighty power of retcon is actually a part of the lore itself. The warp in the west and CHIM ring a bell, yes? They can do whatever they want with the lore and it is still within the lore. There is no original lore. It changes with every game that is released.

[Arizona_Steve]

Honestly I'm waiting to see what happens to the subscriber base once the free month is up.

[Kaputzki]

 

Initial box/sub is not the criteria to the game's success. It's the lifespan and development of said game in both technical, player base-size and gameplay which deems if a game is successful. MMOs can live as much as games like Skyrim due to the replayability value it provides with new content (in the single player case, mods) and they take time to evolve.

 

 

The real big issue TESO is facing is the expectations it didn't live up to; there will forever be a looming shadow over the title's head of a game that failed to deliver and that will drive interested players away.

 

For the sake of example, I'm a player interested in MMOs, I will google TESO post-release, and possibly the first things I will see are going to be:

 

TESO - official website.

TESO - review

Website 1 - article - how TESO broke my heart

Website 2 - article - how TESO ruined my dreams

Website 3 - TESO, a waste of your time and money.

Website 4 - TESO porn.

 

The internet has a habit of not forgetting.

 

What are you talking about, the expectations were pretty low. There was no real hype about this game. All previews were basically about how crappy the game looked and how clunky and irritating the gameplay was.

 

 

You're undeniably right about the previews part, but the hype was generated before even the beta was launched. I've had people telling me what TESO's going to feature, I've read about some of it myself and it sounded absolutely delicious and also improbable.

 

A lot of people thought TESO was going to revolutionize class systems giving us a free-TES-like system where you can mix and match classes to your heart's content.

 

Combat was also hyped considerably being a somewhat refreshing breeze with no targeting system but usage of manual aim only.

 

Both these main features (at least those are the main two I've read about on the official site back then) failed to deliver and made a lot of people unhappy.

 

The fact the rest of the gameplay also failed to deliver as it was previewed just like you said, contributes to my point that once a MMO is marked as "fails to deliver" then it'll be remembered as such and will be avoided by many players (google example above). Which damages its possibility to evolve and become successful.

 

Hope that cleared some things up.

[Aenyalu]

[...]

In the end i own a legal copy of the game.... with key..explorer pack key...and those 30 days free ONLY if i make a sub free

 

well done Zenimax.... what a scam..

It's even better. If you make a sub, ZeniMax is charging your account right away to test if it is legit. The charge is then canceled, usually before any money is taken from your bank, however this didn't always work and in some cases it took a few days for the money to be reimbursed. Stupid as they are they also didn't realize that some methods of payment they offered in Germany won't allow to reimburse the charge at all.

So, in several cases you had to pay for whatever sub you choose (at least temporarily) in order to ransom your free 30 days.

 

Some people notified the Verbraucherzentrale (consumer protection, better business bureau), which gave ZeniMax a warning to either stop charging people for the 30 free days or to stop advertizing the game with 30 free days. The third option of course is to pay a fine. As far as I know ZeniMax thus made history as the first game developer to ever achieve that. Well done, ZeniMax!

 

Here is a link for those that understand German:

http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/The-Elder-Scrolls-Online-Verbraucherschuetzer-mahnen-Spieleentwickler-ab-2168319.html

 

Anyway, ZeniMax has now reacted by taking out several payment options, thus making it impossible to start a new subscription without a credit card, even Paypal seems to demand one now. Given that credit cards aren't very common in Germany (people usually pay cash or at the most use their bank cards), they can pretty much write off the German market if it stays that way. Mind you, the German games market is big enough to warrant a German translation for pretty much every game so far.

 

I was expecting for ESO to have a few bugs, server hiccups and other such difficulties on release, which is pretty normal, but usually at least they get the legal basics right. This level of fail is absolutely beyond me.

[Rayblue]

 

What the fuck is wrong with you loremongers, really. TES is one of the worst works of fiction when it comes to the consistency of the lore. The allmighty power of retcon is actually a part of the lore itself. The warp in the west and CHIM ring a bell, yes? They can do whatever they want with the lore and it is still within the lore. There is no original lore. It changes with every game that is released.

 

 

This.

 

I read Neal Stephenson's REAMDE, and there were several pages devoted to which one of the characters, a "loremaster", debates with other developers of the fictional MMO on the supposed "lore", such as details concerning the gameworld's geological features; these all remind me of the similar debates going on with TES "lore".

[GrimReaper]

 

You're undeniably right about the previews part, but the hype was generated before even the beta was launched. I've had people telling me what TESO's going to feature, I've read about some of it myself and it sounded absolutely delicious and also improbable.

 

A lot of people thought TESO was going to revolutionize class systems giving us a free-TES-like system where you can mix and match classes to your heart's content.

 

Combat was also hyped considerably being a somewhat refreshing breeze with no targeting system but usage of manual aim only.

 

Both these main features (at least those are the main two I've read about on the official site back then) failed to deliver and made a lot of people unhappy.

 

The fact the rest of the gameplay also failed to deliver as it was previewed just like you said, contributes to my point that once a MMO is marked as "fails to deliver" then it'll be remembered as such and will be avoided by many players (google example above). Which damages its possibility to evolve and become successful.

 

Hope that cleared some things up.

 

 

The fun thing is that the beta was indeed pretty bad, but the final game is actually pretty good. The collision detection was a much needed addition that wasn't present in the public beta but was included in the final game. That alone changed the feel of the combat from clunky to enjoyable. It doesn't feel like any MMORPG I've every played - you can actively block, bash and dodge, attack with light or heavy attacks and depending on what your enemy is doing you have to react accordingly. It's not a super deep and complex system but you feel a lot more involved in the gameplay.

 

When you create a character and pick a class, you can use whatever equipment you like. You can play a mage in heavy armor with two 1h weapons if you like and it actually works. The whole system is pretty modular in a sense because there are different skill lines for every weapon, armor and class.

 

[Mebrilia]

What the fuck is wrong with you loremongers?

 

Right because if easy to defend a game just justify lore tossing like that right?....Lore are the heart to make a believable world in rpg...if you will not be consistent in the lores you will end to make the rpg feel like souless...Plastic.... Before ESO the lore in tes still remained overall consistent they changed a little but at least they avoid to broke them..

 

Break the lore is the fast way to destroy the background of a world created we all know that TES universe is in constant evolution but Teso bring that in another step breaking the lores in such a manner that seem Zenimax had not even the good intention to read them... This is never happened before... And is normal if someone bring the argument of lores ti criticize Teso...

 

In RPG the lore of the world must be one of the firm key...

 

Or we have streamlined titles pretending to be RPG ala dragon age 2... Is not a mistery that the best CRPG of all times were very strong about Lores...The people that don't care about lores usually should not even play rpg... Is like play a shooter and dislike guns

 

So in the end i am happy to be a Loremonger because we are talking about an RPG series not of call of duty

 

Split on the people that defend the lores of a series even if fictional just to defend a medriocre mmo and a crap Tes is fanboysm nothing more nothing less

[Kaputzki]

That sounds really good, Grim.

 

If you like gameplay involvement I'd recommend having a glimpse at Wildstar, too.

It's not as flexible class-customization style like TESO but has a lot of interesting innovations to many old mechanics in the MMO field.

 

 

edit: I'm the king of the page!

[...0...]

 

[...]

In the end i own a legal copy of the game.... with key..explorer pack key...and those 30 days free ONLY if i make a sub free

 

well done Zenimax.... what a scam..

It's even better. If you make a sub, ZeniMax is charging your account right away to test if it is legit. The charge is then canceled, usually before any money is taken from your bank, however this didn't always work and in some cases it took a few days for the money to be reimbursed. Stupid as they are they also didn't realize that some methods of payment they offered in Germany won't allow to reimburse the charge at all.

So, in several cases you had to pay for whatever sub you choose (at least temporarily) in order to ransom your free 30 days.

 

Some people notified the Verbraucherzentrale (consumer protection, better business bureau), which gave ZeniMax a warning to either stop charging people for the 30 free days or to stop advertizing the game with 30 free days. The third option of course is to pay a fine. As far as I know ZeniMax thus made history as the first game developer to ever achieve that. Well done, ZeniMax!

 

Here is a link for those that understand German:

http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/The-Elder-Scrolls-Online-Verbraucherschuetzer-mahnen-Spieleentwickler-ab-2168319.html

 

Anyway, ZeniMax has now reacted by taking out several payment options, thus making it impossible to start a new subscription without a credit card, even Paypal seems to demand one now. Given that credit cards aren't very common in Germany (people usually pay cash or at the most use their bank cards), they can pretty much write off the German market if it stays that way. Mind you, the German games market is big enough to warrant a German translation for pretty much every game so far.

 

I was expecting for ESO to have a few bugs, server hiccups and other such difficulties on release, which is pretty normal, but usually at least they get the legal basics right. This level of fail is absolutely beyond me.

 

 

Turbine did the exact same thing back in 2002 with asheron's call 2 which coused ALOT problems with many people specially in europe.

 

This billing system is not new turbine did this already in the past.

 

[GrimReaper]

What the fuck is wrong with you loremongers?

 

Right because if easy to defend a game just justify lore tossing like that right?....Lore are the heart to make a believable world in rpg...if you will not be consistent in the lores you will end to make the rpg feel like souless...Plastic.... Before ESO the lore in tes still remained overall consistent they changed a little but at least they avoid to broke them..

 

Break the lore is the fast way to destroy the background of a world created we all know that TES universe is in constant evolution but Teso bring that in another step breaking the lores in such a manner that seem Zenimax had not even the good intention to read them... This is never happened before... And is normal if someone bring the argument of lores ti criticize Teso...

 

In RPG the lore of the world must be one of the firm key...

 

Or we have streamlined titles pretending to be RPG ala dragon age 2... Is not a mistery that the best CRPG of all times were very strong about Lores...The people that don't care about lores usually should not even play rpg... Is like play a shooter and dislike guns

 

So in the end i am happy to be a Loremonger because we are talking about an RPG series not of call of duty

 

Split on the people that defend the lores of a series even if fictional just to defend a medriocre mmo and a crap Tes is fanboysm nothing more nothing less

Molag Bal pulling a Mehrunes Dagon and invading Tamriel ~800 years before Mehrunes Dagon actually does the same thing is not any worse than Talos altering the reality in such a manner that Cyrodil never was a jungle or Mannimarco being first an altmer, then a lich, then a god and for reasons no one knows becoming an altmer again just so he can be killed in a sidequest. Like I said, Bethesda established the power of retcon in the lore so moaning about things being changed is pointless because things like that are actually part of the lore.

 

Or Sheogorath actually being a cursed Jyggalag, the Daedric Prince of order. Never heard of him again, did we.

[Duoleb The Chosen]

 

also when the numidium cockslapped akatosh in the events of daggerfall, cyrodiil was retconned from a jungle to New Zealand

 

Arena and Daggerfall confirms that Cyrodiil was a freakin Jungle, but then Morrowind and Oblivion Retconned that saying that the land was "shaped"

[Mebrilia]

 

also when the numidium cockslapped akatosh in the events of daggerfall, cyrodiil was retconned from a jungle to New Zealand

 

Arena and Daggerfall confirms that Cyrodiil was a freakin Jungle, but then Morrowind and Oblivion Retconned that saying that the land was "shaped"

 

 

For this i say oblivion was the worst of the series.. By the lores the jungle thing was corrected saying the jungle was a traslation error.....

 

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pocket_Guide_to_the_Empire,_1st_Edition/Cyrodiil

 

That was a weak excuse but i am one that first admit Oblivion was a damn mess...

 

But this is different because TESO don't only destroyed the lores but also the race appearances..

[D7Rock88]

Did it really destroy the race appearances?  The races looked one way in oblivion and then vastly different in Skyrim, I mean seriously take a look at the elves from oblivion and then how they ended up looking in skyrim.  They weren't really what I would call pretty to look at, especially elven vampires...literally killed those things with fire.

[Duoleb The Chosen]

you could create a human looking Mer in skyrim with vanilla assets

 

stop bitchin

[D7Rock88]

you could create a human looking Mer in skyrim with vanilla assets

 

stop bitchin

 

Who are you saying is bitching exactly?  Cause if its me your accusing it of I feel I must point out that I'm not.  I was simply stating a fact about how the races change appearances throughout the games and using the elves as an example.  So there's no need to be hostile.  Again though I'm not sure if you were directing that at me.  It seems like it was, and if it was then I wonder if I should retaliate....hmm doesn't really seem like its worth my time.