LAPF

[galgat]

do I need all those Hotfixes are is the 1.4.7 complete ?

[wilco444]

They're included.

[galgat]

thx u, I just did not want to DL anything that was un needed

[galgat]

Yes I got it working ( I did not really have to change much, I installed only what I needed you had a lot of stuff in there that I already had installed), Wonderful stuff you have done, but you left a lot of gaps in the numbers, I was glad I did not delete my files in the ani2 folder [i just let yours over write the ones It wanted to replace, and left the rest], and that I made a back up of the INI folder, it was easy to replace the missing INI files numbers that way, and my normal animations in those missing (or INI motion gap) file places came back fine. On one of my numbers the love seat popped up in the wilderness, that made me laugh.

 

   I Made a duplicate copy of my Oblivion folder to install it in, I may wait a while till I am sure things have settled down with this moving animations all over the place [and making mods that call specific Motions incompatable], before I attempt to make any of my stuff conform (right now, I feel even extending my mods is sort of a waste of time till this settles down).  I do wish some how the same type animations could have been placed in all the original spot's, so many Lovers RPG I deal with will be mixed up now , and not just mine [if I go to this. So I will not for now.]  I am not saying duplicate animations, just the same type, as in BJ , Anal , Missionary , foreplay , and so on.

 

   For RPG exact motion call's the Spos (Number) is still the best way to call them, and these can be converted to Quest variables that can be used in dialog conditions very easy.

 

    It is really troublesome when a mod gets very large to search out all the numbers, and then replace them with another (when you have all ready worn your self out making it to start with).

 

   I Guess I will when I am sure they are not going to be flipped around again look into fixing mine to match (maybe, I am just not sure the loversPK engine is becoming so unstable to make RPG mods on, now that backward compatability has been thrown out the door.)  The ones that will really be most trouble are the one's I fixed up a special animation for, and used when switching places with the character.

 

   Is very nice stuff though. I am very proud of what you have done. I am just not ready to take the full plunge yet.

For now I will swap back to my original Oblivion folder, and stay there, but it was nice to see what you had done.

[serri]

Trying out the mod right now, Is it supposed to be dependant on some mods? The positions are frozen for me unless I load player slave encounters, then the animations start working

[Nepro]

Is there way to decrease forced sex attribute penalty? I find it that the penalty drains my attributes too heavily and I can't use chapels easily because I have Oblifall Losing My Religion mod. 

 

P.S. Grega unlock this thread http://www.loverslab.com/topic/5615-shock-spell-graphics-crashing-oblivion/ please.

[metalmadc]

I have a lovers error that I cant figure out.?

xLoverspkr get motion paramby sposlnd-ex not found spos=9

[galgat]

I have a lovers error that I cant figure out.?

xLoverspkr get motion paramby sposlnd-ex not found spos=9

 

 

I hope you made a back up of your INI folder, I know Greg mentioned deleting files 1 - 200, but he does not have all the INI files to complete 1 - 200 in his package.

 

  I also hope you did not delete the .ks files in your ANI2 folder as you will need those too. [The ones that greg di not replace]

 

  If you did not delete the ANI2 Files that greg did not over write from 1 - 200, and you backed up the INI folder ( Open two window explorers) one open to your backed up INI files, and the other Open to the new INI folder.

 

   Look for the INI file number gaps between your Back up INI folder and your new INI folder. Copy, and past from the Back up folder all the INI files that are missing in the Number sequence of the new INI folder.

 

  As long as your did not delete your ANI2 folder uncopied over files you should be okay after that.

 

 But I could be miss understanding the problem too..   As I am not running this Update to the  LoverPK  Engine at this time.

 

 

 

 

[gregathit]

Yes I got it working ( I did not really have to change much, I installed only what I needed you had a lot of stuff in there that I already had installed), Wonderful stuff you have done, but you left a lot of gaps in the numbers, I was glad I did not delete my files in the ani2 folder [i just let yours over write the ones It wanted to replace, and left the rest], and that I made a back up of the INI folder, it was easy to replace the missing INI files numbers that way, and my normal animations in those missing (or INI motion gap) file places came back fine. On one of my numbers the love seat popped up in the wilderness, that made me laugh.

Thanks for the kind words. I did my best to make things easy for both noobs and advanced modders alike to install.    

 

The animation shuffling as I said before was a by product of eliminating 40+ duplicates and 5+ completely broken animations. Something had to give and the numbering seemed to be the best option at the time.

 

 

 

I Made a duplicate copy of my Oblivion folder to install it in, I may wait a while till I am sure things have settled down with this moving animations all over the place [and making mods that call specific Motions incompatable], before I attempt to make any of my stuff conform (right now, I feel even extending my mods is sort of a waste of time till this settles down).  I do wish some how the same type animations could have been placed in all the original spot's, so many Lovers RPG I deal with will be mixed up now , and not just mine [if I go to this. So I will not for now.]  I am not saying duplicate animations, just the same type, as in BJ , Anal , Missionary , foreplay , and so on.

Nothing animation numbering wise will be changing. The only thing that will be done at this point is adding new animations to the pack to fill in the empty spots. I have a couple of bondage animations I am slowly tinkering with (one is a bound in chair bj and the other is a tied to a pole from behind fuck). As myself and other animators create new animations I will add them to the empty spots to round things out.

 

Again, not to kick the dead horse but the renumbering was a necessary deal. There was simply no way to preserve the old numbers with as many duplicates as there was. You know just how monumental a task it is to just change your two mods to the renumbered system. It would have been 10 times that for me to try to figure out what mod used what animation (often using a duplicate of a duplicate) and keep all that straight. It was a nightmare that I struggled with for two months and multiple spreadsheets trying to do. Finally I just gave up and said the heck with it. My goal was never to restructure things but rather to redo all the animations to use the animated penis, to have bbb and to line up right. I also wanted to spice up the aggressor side of the animations as many of them were just lame or clipped very badly.

 

I hate that it messed some mods up but there was just no way around it that I could find.   

 

 

 

For RPG exact motion call's the Spos (Number) is still the best way to call them, and these can be converted to Quest variables that can be used in dialog conditions very easy.

Actually you can use UMID calls just as easy and with the new system we have with the LAPF the UMID number can stay consistant regardless of what the actual animation number is. Thus if someone renumbers their animations and you use a UMID call it will still play the correct animation. UMID calls work the exact same as spos calls so there is no difference in their use.

 

 

It is really troublesome when a mod gets very large to search out all the numbers, and then replace them with another (when you have all ready worn your self out making it to start with).

 

   I Guess I will when I am sure they are not going to be flipped around again look into fixing mine to match (maybe, I am just not sure the loversPK engine is becoming so unstable to make RPG mods on, now that backward compatability has been thrown out the door.)  The ones that will really be most trouble are the one's I fixed up a special animation for, and used when switching places with the character.

Again, the numbering won't ever change again as the animation overhaul is done. The only thing that will happen is adding animations into the empty spots as new ones are created.

 

I am more than willing to help you change the calls to the new numbering system and if there is an animation that did not make it into the LAPF for whatever reason then I would be more than happy to remake it or even make a new customized version for your plugins. Your plugins are top notch and it would be my honor to make an animation for one or both of them.

 

 

Is very nice stuff though. I am very proud of what you have done. I am just not ready to take the full plunge yet.

For now I will swap back to my original Oblivion folder, and stay there, but it was nice to see what you had done.

Again, I appreciate the kind words. The animation overhaul and the LAPF took me just over 9 months of constant blender work to make.  I think I managed to put in more hours per week than I worked at my paying job. I never realized the amount of work (or time) it would take me when I started it. If I had known I probably would have never attempted it and run away screaming like a little girl.         

[galgat]

To Greg

 

yeppers! I saw when the extra bones were added to the skeleton for penus, and vagina, that this could be done, but the time,and effort to get all the animations re-worked was something I could never stay at long enough to have done, I am amazed at your work effort.

 

  I hope you understand why I am discouraged only with your numbering. What you have done, is done to the actual game engine, and because of this it effects every mod out there, I mean if one of my mods does not work for you, just turn it off, and forget about it, but this modification effects every mod, and has to be on for LoverPK to work.

 

   Actually duplicate's were not a probem if you could have slowly worked you way through the animation's, and replaced duplicate animations with ones of the same type, of course  with a modified Look.

 

   Now I think due to some of your earlier stuff we may have 3 or 4 different numbering systems floating around.

 

   That is only reason, and I am sorry if I have upset you by complaining about the numbering system. And hinted at how it would have been nice if you could have kept the same type animations in the more original locations.  That for me would have made it even more wonderful.

 

   And I want you to know it is wonderful stuff, I am really proud of not only what you have done, but I truly know how much time you had to spend on it.

 

   And you have really gotten good at animation's. I can barrely tweak some of them for my own need's, and do minor things to animations in blender, but you have really done some neat stuff, not only in Quanity, but in Quality.

 

   I like very much what you have done. I just right now can not fully swap over to it.

[gregathit]

I have tried to remove all traces of the other modifications of stuff I did as a stop gap during the animations overhaul.  That really was one of the major reasons I made the LAPF was to help folks grab one thing and be assured they did not have to go anywhere to get anything else.  

 

As to the renumbering, I don't mind discussing it.  It was a difficult decision and I knew some might be upset.  However it was the only way I could figure out how to tackle the project and keep it coherent both on paper and in my head.  About the only way I could have kept the old scheme was to learn to animate 3 years before I did.  Back then the animations were still being ported in from F&L, Sex Darkness and Sexlivion as well as new stuff that contained bbb and THEN we could have organized things.  Ah well, done is done.  

 

As to the animations, if someone wants to restructure or renumber them, then they have my blessing to do so.  Whilst I did pour a lot of blood sweat and tears into the project, I claim zero ownership of it.  Folks are free to do anything they please with the animations and everything else.  I did the work for the community here at LL and as far as I am concerned, everything is free to do anything you guys please with.

 

Cheers to all.

Greg

[galgat]

you did a fine job greg, I know you made Decisions base on your best thinking cap. Its all okay, I Am glad that someone decided to do it.

 

I just have to get use to it. What you have done is really amazing!

 

YOu do so darn much. I think the world of ya, I really hope you never take offence at my stupid Idea's or my some times to deep thinking on things.

 

I want so badly to use LAPF right now cause what I saw when i ran it was awesome.. I hope you understand why I have to hold back for a bit.

 

I will get swapped over soon as I can figure out how with out losing a lot of stuff I have been, and am still working on. or rather soon as I figure out how to keep it coherent.

 

Oh, and i think this is your deal, lets not get to many more renumbering's floating around out there..LOL  I think it best to leave that in the master animator's hands.

 

****Edited***

 

Changing the subject, did you ever use PCSX2 emulator  http://pcsx2.net/ , I was re playing shadow heart's all three games just recently, and I still think they are way better than FF series. The story line is just so much more better seems like, at least in shadow hearts one, and 2, three is nice, but it seems disconected from the other two.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadow_Hearts

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ-yEUgipBQ

 

also been playing "Star wars Knights of the old republic Sith lord's" restored content mod, and robot planet mod installed again, it is a blast, it is still a very fun game. http://www.moddb.com/mods/the-sith-lords-restored-content-mod-tslrcm

[gregathit]

I have never played Shadow's heart, but I have played (and will continue to play) both of the old KOTR games.  I too have those mods and many others installed.  Funny that games as old as KOTR is can still be so awesome.  I guess it shows you that gaming companies may have improved their graphics and effects but they have lost the skill to tell a really good story somewhere along the way.

 

As to the LAFP and your plugins, I am more than willing to let a hand to help you either switch to using UMID calls or to change out the setpos calls to the LAPF numbering scheme.  I'm also willing to create a few custom animations for one or both of your plugins so if you have a scenario you are working on that might benefit, just jot down what you are wanting and let me know.  I can't guarantee that I can pull it off, but I'll certainly give it a try.

 

The LAPF comes with a spreadsheet that shows the old numbering that the Daedra Sutra shows and what the new number in the LAPF is.  This is how I would look through and switch things if you would like my help.  I completely understand you not wanting to back track in your plugins.  For the longest time I wanted nothing to do with Bravil Underground after I finished translating\re-writing it.  And that was only about 3 months worth of effort.  Your plugins have been years in the making.

 

Right now I have only my laptop, so while I can not animate, I certainly could go in and start updating your plugins to use the LAPF numbering.  I won't get my desktop until after Thanksgiving when the movers make it here with my stuff.  So for the next 3 weeks I could devote time to helping you switch over.  Your call.  

 

I hold no rancor at all over any of this.  We all want what is best for the community so we are all after the same thing.  

[galgat]

 

The only things I won't work on are translations and animations. I just don't have the patience for it.

 I am with you on this, I now only do translations when I really want or need to. I did many of the early translations to a lot of lovers mod's, but I just don't have that urge very often any more.

 

As to the fixing or getting compatability with LAPF

first of all I have not looked at the UMID system you are talking about, is it a Quest variable, or is it a global.. if it is not then it won't be much help, as the condition block only allows some thing to function right with the conversation dialog.

 

   If it has to be converted to a Quest variable or script variable ( and I try very hard never to use globals in my Plugin's, There is some disagreement as to there effect on FPS so I have avoided them as a rule) this mean's many more lines of script have to be added or changed in many different area's [ and that does not include all the dialog condition call's & result settings that may be involved]. and then testing from start to finish at least 3 or 4 times. any Errors along the way mean restarting the testing after you have fixed the problems.

  Very time consumming.. as even the changes require me to re test at least one maybe 2 more  times before uploading.

 

   Having built the mods as I have over time (My family problems sometimes distracting me for long periods) my scripting styles change, from one update to the next, so I dont always remember just what I did, and where.

  For me, it will not be that easy. to be sure I don't miss anything. and as I may use many variables to call the text dialog during sex. and I may use different Callbacks to ignite these. it is not as easy as just flipping one variable. Though in some case's it might be.

   I am really not ready to start looking at just how big a task it may be. I sort of freak out sometimes thinking about it. Probably why I mention my dis like of the motion number change "to often I know" so much.

 

  And then there is DarkBloodline,  and some that people will just find as they try to play them, and others mostly RPG type I can not think of off the top of my head that also used the old motion number system, these are also needed to be changed, they are actually quite a few mods I play that make call's that expect certain motions to be where they always were the experience with them will be destroyed or tarnished as well in many places with the different motion numbering.

 

 

as you prowl through scripts, and dialog result's, and scripted Objects it is not uncommon to find, in fact it is very common

set xLoversQuest.SPos to 116 ;where a certain motion has been called for by the Maker

for me because using a script variable from a dependancy mod will often fail, I have to do sometimes a 2 stage for this as in

set galgatmod.sexact to xLoversQuest.SPos
 
;or
 
set galgatmod.sexact to 119
 
;then in the sex call function use
 
set xLoversQuest.SPos to galgatmod.sexact ;to get the result I need
 

sometimes there is failin in this, and another (or different) step is needed to get what I want, as in the function

 
short Motion
 
Begin function { }
 
set motion to galgatmod.sexact ;set in dialog, another place that would have to be changed
;or possibly set in callback or by a scripted object
 
set xLoversQuest.SPos to Motion ;to get the result I need
 

so it could be troublesome tracking them all down.

 

It would probablly be easier to just add the needed motion's and there INI files, and there animObject (if any) to my mod than to do all this.

 

   But I don't have the animations, that would have your wonderful work in them. as they might need to be for my mods ( and I would maybe compound the problem again for other mods by doing this ). so all I could add would be the Original motions. Which I did do in my last updates to Loverscrowningisle. But i don't think I caught them all just the main ones I could think of at the time.

 

  And as to the AnimObject you may have added one to the motion number I decided to change with my mod, now the player will have two AnimOjects for the same Motion.. that could also be a problem.. though I think it would be rare.

 

[gregathit]

I'll take a look at crowning isles and make a quick run through to check out your calls.  

 

As to UMID calls, they are no different from spos calls.  They call a specific animation to play.  The benefit to umid calls is that they are not dependent on the animation numbering.  As long as the ini file contains the umid number then then correct animation will play.  It is a way to get around someone renumbering animations (like if they switch around some animation like the 1-9 ones or something).

 

Scripting calls are no issue to change, it is just a matter of going through each one and making the change.  Dialogue calls are pretty much the same thing.  Nothing complicated, just tedious.  I'll work through things this week and give you a shout if I run into anything that baffles me.  The toughest thing is just figuring out what animation you were calling and matching it up to its current number in the LAPF.  With the DS and the spreadsheet I made, it should be fairly straight forward.

[galgat]

Thx u greg, I just am kind of over loaded right now, got so many bread roll's in the oven sort of, and just hate weeding through it all, and retesting right now.

 

  You will find that my scripting style changes a lot, as I learned new stuff, and because of the long periods when I could not work on them, and then starting back up.

 

   One of the most painful things is I started LoversCrowning isle with out the enhanced CS version, and I used 001Questwhatever in all my scripts, the original CS did not care, and they actually don't bother anything the way I used them, but the enhanced version complains about it all the time, which is bothersome when I edit.

 

   I have been slowly converting them over to Letter's when I feel like searching for anyplace where there variables are used or they are called,  but It takes time.

[fejeena]

Is it possible to change the LAPF system so that the player and NPCs use different "lowerbody" folders.
Many people play with unique player bodies (NPCs all E cup and player DMRA or NPCs Roberts  default Muscular and player bulky barbarian or slender magician)
So it will be possible that the player or NPCs do not have wrong lowerbodies during sex.And it will be possible to play races like Poontank's "GSB's Draenei Race" with hooves lowerbody.

 

 

[fejeena]

HGEC, HGEC GM, DMRA and DMRA open pussy are in  "Alternate Female Bodies" also 7 Roberts Body variants in "Alternate Roberts Body Types" and they all works with the animations. So you can pack one Body typ in the NPC Folder and another in the Player Folder.

Yes hooves lowerbodies might look funny with some animations.but should work fine with most animations. And there will be no seems if you choose the right lowerbody. Now you have seams, if you use a DMRA Body and DMRA LAPF lowerbody and your NPCs have a HGEC Body all NPC have seems and a fat ass during sex. Same with different male Player and NPC bodies.

[gregathit]

Ok,  here are the limitations of Lovers as I understand them:

 

1.  It will only utilize ONE mesh for the lowerbody for the attacker.  Now you can turn this off and the attacker will keep his clothing or armor on, but that is all you can do.  In theory you could use this to keep your custom body.  The "problem" with doing this is that you would have to get naked prior to having sex.  Now that might not be a problem for some races, but potentially would for most.  Remember that this effects NPC's as well so if you have Joburg installed and turn off the attacker taking his\her clothes off then they won't.  For some races this might be ok, but for most it won't.  They will be humping away in full clothing or armor with no dick.

 

All of this is caused by the fact that the penis is "part of" the lowerbody.  The only way around this is to eliminate the lowerbody and have the penis be in the amulet or tail slot.  This however leads to a whole slew of other problems which we could not figure out how to overcome.  I "might" relook at this once I finish the creatures animation overhaul but then again......I might not.  No promises.

 

 

2. Now for the "defender" the issues really don't exist.  If you make the "body" parts "unplayable" then by default lovers won't take them off.  Thus, your hooved chick will have her hooves and all will be well.  This is not something you mess with lovers to enable, but rather your esm\esp body plugin.

 

Please don't etch any of this in stone as I don't claim to be 100% correct about all of this.  This is my best understanding based on what I have done and on what my poor little pea brain understands.  Perhaps there is an easy solution to remedy things, but if there is I am not aware of it.

 

 

 

So in summary, for attackers you get one body that is textured per your or the NPC's race.  That's it.  Sucks but that is how lovers has always been.

For defenders, you can keep any body you have or want as lovers does not swap out anything for them, OTHER than removing clothes if you have it set that way in the settings (note there are setting for both rape and consensual sex - the rape settings are off by default).  For custom bodies you may need to mark them as UNPLAYABLE to keep lovers from swapping them out.

 

Hope that clarifies things.

[gregathit]

Wrong.

 

The LAPF lower bodies are based off of:

Males: Robert v52:  http://oblivion.nexusmods.com/mods/40532//?

Females: HGEC 1.12: http://oblivion.nexusmods.com/mods/34442//?

 

This is clearly spelled out in the install instruction section of the OP and in the install instructions readme.txt in the download.

 

I use nothing at all from Setbodies Reloaded.  The reason for this is that not everyone is or will use setbody.  Additionally there are some compatibility issues as well with getting bodies to line up with no seams.  I won't go into that here however.

 

Hope this gets everyone on the same page.  Sorry for any confusion.

[gregathit]

Grumpf was trying to help us overcome using the lowerbody, but we never could figure out all the ins and outs to make things as robust as it currently is.  It is a shame, as it would have made things more body friendly.

 

The other issue is it would have made all male body plugins that currently exist obsolete.  You couldn't use any of them or you would end up having two penises at the same time, one limp that came with your body mod and one stiffy for sex.  Thus we would have had to create a whole new male body mod to get around the issues.  No small task.  

 

I am open to ideas but I could never figure out how to overcome all the obstacles and the months upon months of work that it would take.

[fejeena]

Isn't it possible with an extra script line?

Now the game/script checks if attacker/Defender and male/female. (so a female attacker with futa Settings enabled get a futa lowerbody)

A extra line:

if Player use Folder/lowerbody ID xyplayer

elseif use Folder/lowerbody ID xy

 

( Considerations of a script noob )

[gregathit]

Unfortunately I am a script noob as well.

 

I don't think it is that simple.  Lovers has a shit ton of scripts that talk to one another and you'd have to figure out which ones to change and how to add additional body support.  Bottom line, you'd be changing\adding to multiple scripts, once you figured out which ones are connected.....no small task for that alone.

[gerra6]

Greg's got it right.  It would be incredibly ugly to implement.  There are simply too many body variants out there, and if people are doing strict replacers, there is no way to reliably detect which one they are using.  I know of no in-engine way to determine which replacer a person is using (or even if they are using a replacer at all).

 

On the other hand, if a person is using a Setbody mod, those have ways to report which body is currently assigned to a given NPC, but since all of the Setbody mods use different folder structures and naming conventions, a given script would need to specify the specific Setbody that is being used.  So, for example, it is possible to find out the current body assigned for someone using Setbody Reloaded, but you would also need to use a different method for someone using Setbody Tspec, which would be different from someone using the original Setbody.

 

Even if you solved that problem, the real problem begins.  Each combination of body types might need different animation displacements.  Somehow, you would need to find out a way to determine the proper animation displacements for the different combinations of body types.  That could number in the 10's of thousands.  Once you had that (an impossible task) those displacements would need to be loaded from an external ini file.

 

Finally, some body types would need entirely different animations to avoid tearing and/or clipping.  That would require some sort of supplemental framework that intercepts the animation call and replaces it with a parallel animation stored in an entirely new structure.  And, of course, someone would have to make the alternate animations in the first place.

 

It's ugly, no matter how you look at it.

[fejeena]

I only want 2 Lovers lowerbody Folders: meshes\clothes\as (with the NPC animated lowerbodies) and meshes\clothes\asPlayer (with the Player lowerbody). Or NPC and Player lowerbodies in the as Folder with different names (NormalAnimFuta.nif and NormalAnimFutaPlayer.nif)

LAPF should not change the whole Body, I don't wont 50 diffrent Folders for Auto SetBody, and I don't want more bodies in the "Alternate Female Bodies" pack ( I can use NifSkope and add the ani-penis to any Body I want)

And the animations work with HGEC and DMRA.

It would be nice if you can use both = HGEC for the NPCs and DMRA for the Player. And if I use another Body for the Player I must put the right lowerbodies in the Folder before I start the game. ( no Script Body check in Lovers)

"Only" a "if Player" script check in the "few" Lovers scripts.

"if Player" use Player lowerbody meshes.

"else" use  the normal lowerbody meshes (NPC)

 

NO NEW ANIMATIONS, NO CHECK OF THE PALYER/NPC BODy TYPES, NO NEW LOWERBODY MESHES.

 

And if I use a AGHGEC Body and have Problems with not matching and clipping animations then that's my own fault.