Naked Defeat AE/SE

[Nymra]

14 minutes ago, theprof90 said:

I have 4.95.4 installed.
to install 4.95.5 do I have to simply install the patch, and do the procedure "disable/enable"?

 

hey,

in this case it should work as it is (no disable/enable required)

 

Edited September 10, 2024 by Nymra

[Talesien]

33 minutes ago, Nymra said:

ROADMAP for near future updates:
- removing DDs on Naked Defeat Start (requires DDe / DeviousDevicesEQUIP (from inte) 
- equipping devious devices for or after Sex (requires DDe / DeviousDevicesEQUIP (from inte) 

Honestly I don't think that's a good way forward, perhaps from the perspective of a LE user it's ok, but for most SE users it's a no-go. DDe requires a full slot and has a hard dependency on SUM which also eats a full slot. I would not complain if both were ESL flagged or could be easily compacted/esl'ified, but that's sadly not the case. Both mods use scripts with the getformfromfile call, so those scripts need to be recompiled. At that point, it quickly escalates to an unbelievable avalanche of (compile) dependencies. Trust me, I tried.
Aside from the functionality in ND, neither DDe nor SUM brings anything to the table (or has any business being a non-compacted mod), so 2 full slots for just better DD handling in ND ... sorry, that's not gonna fly. My LO is well over 2k mods and around 248 mods that require a full slot. I absolutely hate it if a mod with less than 2048 (slowly extending to 4096 now) records occupies a full slot, there is always another mods with more than that number of records that could make use of that slot, so a smaller mod occupying a full slot either gets esl'ified or failing that, removed unless it brings something I REALLY want.

If inte would at least compact his mods (that doesn't cause any issue for LE), so they could be simply esl flagged, things would look different, but I don't see that coming.



Btw. ever considered compacting ND? Now THAT would be GREAT. ^^

Edited September 10, 2024 by Talesien

[Nymra]

33 minutes ago, ZenoSamaZ said:

Hi there, is anyone knows if nd is now compatible with baka defeat ? I like baka defeat but I have to admit ND seems to be a good mod (I've never tested btw....)

 

 

Compatible - no
Can be configured to work alongside each other - yes
Recommended to do so? - no

I m trying my best from my side to make it easier for you to adjust Naked Defeat to work next to other SL Defeat mods but since SL Defeat does not communicate with Naked Defeat, it will probably never be perfect 

[Nymra]

23 minutes ago, Talesien said:

Honestly I don't think that's a good way forward, perhaps from the perspective of a LE user it's ok, but for most SE users it's a no-go. DDe requires a full slot and has a hard dependency on SUM which also eats a full slot. I would not complain if both were ESL flagged or could be easily compacted/esl'ified, but that's sadly not the case. Both mods use scripts with the getformfromfile call, so those scripts need to be recompiled. At that point, it quickly escalates to an unbelievable avalanche of (compile) dependencies. Trust me, I tried.

 

hmm, I dont fully understand this part. 
I m using GetFormFromFile alot too, getting armors, furnitures and idles and never noticed any drawbacks. 

The only thing bad that I remember was Getting FromFrom file for zadlibs directly or sth like that. 
EDIT: ah, now I think I understand a bit more... 
you mean the GetFormFromFile scripts make it harder to make the ESPs into one or into ESLs? 
Further down I mention that I think Inte made a 1 plugin version for AE
 

23 minutes ago, Talesien said:

 

Aside from the functionality in ND, neither DDe nor SUM brings anything to the table (or has any business being a non-compacted mod), so 2 full slots for just better DD handling in ND ... sorry, that's not gonna fly. My LO is well over 2k mods and around 248 mods that require a full slot. I absolutely hate it if a mod with less than 2048 (slowly extending to 4096 now) records occupies a full slot, there is always another mods with more than that number of records that could make use of that slot, so a smaller mod occupying a full slot either gets esl'ified or failing that, removed unless it brings something I REALLY want.

 

strange, I always thought it is LE that has the Slot problem and SE has no issue like that?! 

 

23 minutes ago, Talesien said:

If inte would at least compact his mods (that doesn't cause any issue for LE), so they could be simply esl flagged, things would look different, but I don't see that coming.

 

I read somewhere that in AE all POP, SUM and DDE are merged into one but ofc cant find that comment anymore....

 

23 minutes ago, Talesien said:

Btw. ever considered compacting ND? Now THAT would be GREAT. ^^

 

I honestly dont know what compacting means. Turning into ESL?

Since I m still playing on LE Naked Defeat will be developed with that in mind for the foreseeable future. 
I slowly start building an SE profile, but I have so many mods that I manually edited, I m not sure how long itll take. 
Also I m afraid of having to deal with new mental issues because of stuff like Sexlab P+ and Bethesda Updates... as if running Skyrim is not already edgy...

My 5 cents for the future: 

A thing that will definatly NEVER happen is a Hard depenency of Devious Devices Framework for Naked Defeat. 
What WILL happen at some point is me making a companion mod for Naked Defeat that is kind of a slim DDe. It will maybe called Naked Struggle (which sumarizes my experience on dealing with DDs all the time...) and not only work directly with Naked Defeat AND devious devices but also offer new ways to Work with DDs (a one hotkey struggle feature and many more immersion improving stuff).... one of the many reasons I dont play with DDs are the pop ups and the constant requirement to open inventory (it would still require and extra slot tho). 

 

EDIT: I am also not 100% satisfied with DDe. 
I thought I give it a try since it look useful, but in the past 3 years inte changed the way the profiles were stored and other stuff so often that I no longer want to be dependend on it too. Plus both DDe and SUM take a slot and their MCM is too complicated to work with even with the guides I make for it for myself. I tried to use SUM for the outfit system I built, but ended up just making it myself instead because it was less of a struggle...

TLDR: I want to get rid of both DDe and SUM in the future anyway. 

Edited September 10, 2024 by Nymra

[Talesien]

56 minutes ago, Nymra said:

hmm, I dont fully understand this part. 
I m using GetFormFromFile alot too, getting armors, furnitures and idles and never noticed any drawbacks. 

The only thing bad that I remember was Getting FromFrom file for zadlibs directly or sth like that. 
EDIT: ah, now I think I understand a bit more... 
you mean the GetFormFromFile scripts make it harder to make the ESPs into one or into ESLs? 
Further down I mention that I think Inte made a 1 plugin version for AE

The point is, in order to ESL flag a plugin, all records need to be in a certain range. Originally that was xx000800 to xx000FFF (hence your 2048 records limit for ESL plugins), starting from 1130 the formerly reserved space from xx000000 to xx0007FF has also been made available (and that functionality has been backported to all SE versions from 1.5.97 and newer by BEES), extending the record range for ESL plugins to 4096. Anyway, as stated, in order to qualify as an ESL flagged plugin, all records in that plugin must be in that range. Both CK and SSEDit have functions to do so (CK it's File -> Compact Active Files Form IDs), hence people call those compacted plugins. If a plugin is compacted, you can leave it as is, and it will work just fine as a full plugin. Or you can ESL flag it.* The problem is, that compacting your records is just a nice name for renumbering them, hence it changes your form IDs and that makes it necessary to adjust the form ID you have in your script's getformfromfile call (and afterwards obviously the script needs to be recompiled).

To add insult to injury, once you did all that and flagged your plugin as esl (or not), if you then add new records with the CK it doesn't give a damn and happily adds the new records outside the aforementioned address space (because why wouldn't it? It's the Creation Kit, if there is a way to make things harder it will employ it). So you need to recompact again. If you forget that your plugin is no longer a valid light plugin and it will overflow into the address space of the following plugin. Due to this LOOT will throw a scary "This Plugin will corrupt your save" warning. And while the jury is still out how valid that warning is in practice in theory it totally could do that. At any rate it's certainly not helping, but it's of course pretty frustrating for mod authors having to remember to recompact every time they added new records (and keep in mind to adjust the scripts if those new records are used in them ... might be better to recompact first, then work on the scripts ... but we all know how it goes...)

-------

* If you decide not to flag it, so you can use one esp for both LE, SE and VR people can easily do so themselves, with some mod managers you don't even need to use SSEEdit anymore, the mod manager can flag the file for you with the press of a button.

 

56 minutes ago, Nymra said:

I read somewhere that in AE all POP, SUM and DDE are merged into one but ofc cant find that comment anymore....

I certainly can't find that merged version. The latest versions I can find (from July 12th) certainly are all separate downloads and plugins, with both POP and DDe listing SUM as requirement.


 

 

56 minutes ago, Nymra said:

strange, I always thought it is LE that has the Slot problem and SE has no issue like that?! 

SE has no slot problem for light plugins, you can have some 16000 of those IIRC. The number of mods that occupy a full slot is still unchanged (actually it's lower due to FE now being reserved for light plugins and worse with the full AE version there are a number of former CC mods that take up a full slot and can't be easily removed as well.
Hence, why I don't like mods with only a few hundred records (or sometimes even less) taking up a full slot. Those should be reserved for mods that actually need them, i.e. have thousands of records.
 

Edited September 10, 2024 by Talesien

[jbezorg]

Why is the player being killed?

 

I've gone as far as re-enabling Death Alternative, turning on differed death and enabling essential, disabling it. Then enabling Naked Defeat and the player is still being killed. 

[Nymra]

5 minutes ago, jbezorg said:

Why is the player being killed?

 

I've gone as far as re-enabling Death Alternative, turning on differed death and enabling essential, disabling it. Then enabling Naked Defeat and the player is still being killed. 

 

no idea. in general I d say, use either DA or NADE, never both.

 

In pratice: No idea.
Naked Defeats Immortality is tied to a quest value in the ESP and I am not 100% sure how that interacts.

On one of the next updates this will be changed from ESP to Script based immortality. 
I HOPE that this will make handling this a bit easier in the future and increase compabitily with other "Death Outcome" mods.

I dont need it personally but still pursue this because it was part of the original concept of making Naked Defeat as compatible as possible.

 

Keep an eye on the patch notes, I ll highlight it (will also bring more bridge possibilities like PDA etc.) 

[Nymra]

18 minutes ago, Talesien said:

The point is, in order to ESL flag a plugin, all records need to be in a certain range. Originally that was xx000800 to xx000FFF (hence your 2048 records limit for ESL plugins), starting from 1130 the formerly reserved space from xx000000 to xx0007FF has also been made available (and that functionality has been backported to all SE versions from 1.5.97 and newer by BEES), extending the record range for ESL plugins to 4096. Anyway, the point is, in order to qualify as an ESL flagged plugin, all records in that plugin must be in that range. Both CK and SSEDit have functions to do so (CK it's File -> Compact Active Files Form IDs), hence people call those compacted plugins. If a plugin is compacted, you can leave it as is, and it will work just fine as a full plugin. Or you can ESL flag it.* The problem is, that compacting your records is just a nice name for renumbering them, hence it changes your form IDs and that makes it necessary to adjust the form ID you have in your script's getformfromfile call (and afterwards obviously the script needs to be recompiled).

To add insult to injury, once you did all that and flagged your plugin as esl (or not), if you then add new records with the CK it doesn't give a damn and happily adds the new records outside the aforementioned address space (because why wouldn't it? It's the Creation Kit, if there is a way to make things harder it will employ it). So you need to recompact again. If you forget that your plugin is no longer a valid light plugin and it will overflow into the address space of the following plugin. Due to this LOOT will throw a scary "This Plugin will corrupt your save" warning. And while the jury is still out how valid that warning is in practice in theory it totally could do that. At any rate it's certainly not helping, but it's of course pretty frustrating for mod authors having to remember to recompact every time they added new records (and keep in mind to adjust the scripts if those new records are used in them ... might be better to recompact first, then work on the scripts ... but we all know how it goes...)

-------

* If you decide not to flag it, so you can use one esp for both LE, SE and VR people can easily do so themselves, with some mod managers you don't even need to use SSEEdit anymore, the mod manager can flag the file for you with the press of a button.

 

I certainly can't find that merged version. The latest versions I can find (from July 12th) certainly are all separate downloads and plugins, with both POP and DDe listing SUM as requirement.


 

 

SE has no slot problem for light plugins, you can have some 16000 of those IIRC. The number of mods that occupy a full slot is still unchanged (actually it's lower due to FE now being reserved for light plugins and worse with the full AE version there are a number of former CC mods that take up a full slot and can't be easily removed as well.
Hence, why I don't like mods with only a few hundred records (or sometimes even less) taking up a full slot. Those should be reserved for mods that actually need them, i.e. have thousands of records.
 

 

short answer since I m out of time:
- Naked Defeat ESP has currently 699 records. Interesting. I never looked at that value
- all GetFormFromFile I use are for external mods, not internal, so changing the IDs for Naked Defeats records will at least not hurt the mod itself internally, its all Property based or communicates between scripts via callfunctions

- I dont think I will ever need that many records, so I guess NADE qualifies for "compacting". But before I do that there will be some obstacles... SE port AND me having an SE profile that I m satisfied with, because I want to preserve the ability to go back to LE in case I hate it in the future   and I m not sure if it would be an easy process to do that once its an ESL with lot of changes to it.

 

Thx for the update, quite interesting read and definatly something I will consider when time is due. 

and I understand the SLOT thing totally, even on LE. (while I just removed some 20 ESPs that basically only added stuff I never or rarely use or look at lol. Statues with boobs, by the gods 5 ESPs for THAT!

 

[Guest]

Posting a papyrus log.  May not be useful as I updated during a current game and I have a large mod list.  I know it's safe to update but I don't trust my mod list.  I was Struck by a wall spike trap and went down.  Stuck in bleedout mode.   The fix worked and I was able to get up.  I was stuck in place and unable to move.  Activated SLEN masturbation (needed too anyway to reduce arousal so it worked out).  I was able to move after that.  In case it can help.  

Papyrus.0.log

[Nymra]

23 minutes ago, TFor2 said:

Posting a papyrus log.  May not be useful as I updated during a current game and I have a large mod list.  I know it's safe to update but I don't trust my mod list.  I was Struck by a wall spike trap and went down.  Stuck in bleedout mode.   The fix worked and I was able to get up.  I was stuck in place and unable to move.  Activated SLEN masturbation (needed too anyway to reduce arousal so it worked out).  I was able to move after that.  In case it can help.  

Papyrus.0.log 597.04 kB · 0 downloads

 

ooooh, you might have accidently found the issue I was hunting for so long....

 

somehow this did not trigger the "Hit" Event (traps just suck in skyrim....)
and made the script stuck somehow.

 

I suggest relaoding an earlier stage and avoid the trap. 
Technically Naked Defeat should have started and is now "maybe" stuck in the state that for some ppl prevented it from starting again.

(disabling and enabling mod in MCM (including the save and reload game) usually fixed this.

 

This is now high priority for the next hotfix.  ty

[kantoboii]

On 9/3/2024 at 9:07 PM, kantoboii said:

Neat! That'd be fun. Yeah, in most other cases, it does. Setting SexLab's gender to male, and SLEN's forcing gender to male, usually sorts everything out. I understand if it's a lot to change up animations and the like, and maybe that's a longer-term thing to fix. But if there were an option to change JUST the flavor/story text based on SexLab's gender (or player's choice!) that'd be really cool - I can live with some of the animations being funny (because chances are, no one has made many male animations for a mod like this/ZAP! )

 

Edit: I take that back - the dialogue text that characters give is usually as if the player is female (even though I have an SL dialogue replacer), and the animations are sometimes picked for female players too. Doesn't seem quite as reliable as some of the other mods are at using whatever SLEN/SL "force" the player to be.

With respect to my previous thoughts on some gay options - I'm also finding that the bathing option uses female character animations, despite my having different ones for a male character installed (and overwriting Bathing of Skyrim itself) I think that it might be because the animations are built in to NaDe itself (with different filenames), from what I can see (and what little I can understand) in SSEEdit? Not a deal breaker by any means! But would be another cool option/toggle/optional patch overwrite if possible.

 

All of which to say that, if any gay/MM content is within reach on the horizon, I'd be happy to help troubleshoot/write/whatever some of it if you need another hand with testing.

Edited September 11, 2024 by kantoboii

[Nymra]

15 minutes ago, kantoboii said:

With respect to my previous thoughts on some gay options - I'm also finding that the bathing option uses female character animations, despite my having different ones for a male character installed (and overwriting Bathing of Skyrim itself) I think that it might be because the animations are built in to NaDe itself (with different filenames), from what I can see (and what little I can understand) in SSEEdit? Not a deal breaker by any means! But would be another cool option/toggle/optional patch overwrite if possible.

 

no need for SSEedit, the contrary. 
problem is I use a mix of animations from all over the mods that suit to bathing and there will be even more in the future.

I could not even make a full list here without having to dig for half an hour  

 

 

15 minutes ago, kantoboii said:

All of which to say that, if any gay/MM content is within reach on the horizon, I'd be happy to help troubleshoot/write/whatever some of it if you need another hand with testing.

 

not planned atm. sorry. while I will increase the FF content bit by bit, gay stuff is just not my kink and I will not invest much time in it. 
if I see options for it during FF development I will do so, but not anything beyond that. 

testing would still be done alot by myself, new features sometimes require up to 20 hours of scripting and testing until polished and that involes seeing the same stuff over and over

 

[kantoboii]

7 minutes ago, Nymra said:

 

no need for SSEedit, the contrary. 
problem is I use a mix of animations from all over the mods that suit to bathing and there will be even more in the future.

I could not even make a full list here without having to dig for half an hour  

 

 

 

not planned atm. sorry. while I will increase the FF content bit by bit, gay stuff is just not my kink and I will not invest much time in it. 
if I see options for it during FF development I will do so, but not anything beyond that. 

testing would still be done alot by myself, new features sometimes require up to 20 hours of scripting and testing until polished and that involes seeing the same stuff over and over

 

All understandable - that's why I was asking before where some of the flavor text is! I wouldn't mind trying to learn how to make a patch or some changes in something like SSEEdit, just need to know what to change. Maybe that's what you meant before when saying you'd see if there was a away to look into that. If so, my bad!

 

As for the animations, maybe I'll do a little tinkering and see if I can manage to find which are which and do some manual overwriting. All that aside, I'm still enjoying the mod and am happy it's being worked on (again)!

[Nymra]

4 minutes ago, kantoboii said:

All understandable - that's why I was asking before where some of the flavor text is! I wouldn't mind trying to learn how to make a patch or some changes in something like SSEEdit, just need to know what to change. Maybe that's what you meant before when saying you'd see if there was a away to look into that. If so, my bad!

 

ah, no, that part I was doing. Its already integrated. 
I added a new check for the player gender and changed some of the text.
I just did not get far to date, but always look out.
if you happen to make some observations which text is off, feel free to post them here, makes it easier for me to find.

 

 

4 minutes ago, kantoboii said:

As for the animations, maybe I'll do a little tinkering and see if I can manage to find which are which and do some manual overwriting. All that aside, I'm still enjoying the mod and am happy it's being worked on (again)!

 

[wssb2024]

Quick question: wigs

After being defeated, the top left corner reminds me that the preset wig is empty and tells me to look for it in the FAQ, but I didn't find anything about a wig ah¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Nymra said:

 

ooooh, you might have accidently found the issue I was hunting for so long....

 

somehow this did not trigger the "Hit" Event (traps just suck in skyrim....)
and made the script stuck somehow.

 

I suggest relaoding an earlier stage and avoid the trap. 
Technically Naked Defeat should have started and is now "maybe" stuck in the state that for some ppl prevented it from starting again.

(disabling and enabling mod in MCM (including the save and reload game) usually fixed this.

 

This is now high priority for the next hotfix.  ty

I continued the save and was defeated shortly after.  3 stages of defeat that all worked normally and then sold into slavery with Public Whore.  I agree that reloading an earlier save is the best practice but I wanted to see if it would work after the bug.  It seems to be fine.  I'm now finishing up public whore in Windhelm and back to Solstheim where I was sold and they stole all of my gear and money.  Revenge time with no armor and no weapons and level 13.  Hah.  So much fun your silly mod.  No, your wonderful mod.  Such a treasure.💘

[kantoboii]

16 minutes ago, Nymra said:

 

ah, no, that part I was doing. Its already integrated. 
I added a new check for the player gender and changed some of the text.

 

I just did not get far to date, but always look out.
if you happen to make some observations which text is off, feel free to post them here, makes it easier for me to find.

 

 

 

Ah, got it, got it! I'll keep an eye out and keep that in mind. I must not have noticed yet, or thought it was just updated wording in one of the patches! Thanks again!

[jbezorg]

6 hours ago, Nymra said:

 

no idea. in general I d say, use either DA or NADE, never both.

 

In pratice: No idea.
Naked Defeats Immortality is tied to a quest value in the ESP and I am not 100% sure how that interacts.

On one of the next updates this will be changed from ESP to Script based immortality. 
I HOPE that this will make handling this a bit easier in the future and increase compabitily with other "Death Outcome" mods.

I dont need it personally but still pursue this because it was part of the original concept of making Naked Defeat as compatible as possible.

 

Keep an eye on the patch notes, I ll highlight it (will also bring more bridge possibilities like PDA etc.) 

I think it's Skyrim just being Skyrim. 

As an alternative. Placing the player in a deferred kill state might be an option. The player will still go into bleedout but cannot die until EndDeferredKill is called and  if some mod does call it you'll immediately know.

https://ck.uesp.net/wiki/StartDeferredKill_-_Actor

[Nymra]

3 hours ago, wssb2024 said:

Quick question: wigs

After being defeated, the top left corner reminds me that the preset wig is empty and tells me to look for it in the FAQ, but I didn't find anything about a wig ah¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I think it says that you have not set alternate hair pieces in the MCM.

I ll double check if that warning appears even when you have set hair change chance to 0%. 

 

Go to MCM "Hairstyles" and maybe just write some of your favourite hairs into the lines. I think one should suffice tho. 

[Zaflis]

13 hours ago, Nymra said:

DDe is not a thing anyway, it is DD framework which usually is related to bondage items (which is sad to be honest). 
...

DDequip is required when you want Naked Defeat to interact closer with DDs.
Currently the feature is a bit buggy but will be updated soon (see roadmap)

DDE is commonly known as DD-Equip.

 

Also what we were probably expecting from DD integration the most is single random devices added now and then, that are kept after and in the scenes. As far as i know the only reason to use DDE is to equip whole premade sets. That's not what we're after right? DD framework itself has functions to equip devices on player, especially DD 5.2 that everyone uses (even on LE).

[Talesien]

2 hours ago, Zaflis said:

DDE is commonly known as DD-Equip.

 

Also what we were probably expecting from DD integration the most is single random devices added now and then, that are kept after and in the scenes. As far as i know the only reason to use DDE is to equip whole premade sets. That's not what we're after right? DD framework itself has functions to equip devices on player, especially DD 5.2 that everyone uses (even on LE).

I think what Nymra mostly wants is to remove the devices from the player before putting him into ZAZ furniture or playing a scene (because lets face it a yoke/armbinder/Straightjacket looks pretty ridiculous if you are in a pillory or on a cross, same goes for same chains, etc.) and re-apply those exact devices again afterwards (getting yourself "killed" should not be an easy way out of your devices). That's probably comparably easy with DDe, as it is, like you stated, meant for defining/equipping/removing entire sets. Appears to be more difficult with pure DD (if I had to guess, might be difficult to get exact info which devices are worn, but Nymra can prolly tell us why he can't easily use the inbuild DD function (aside from his distaste for them ^^).

Edited September 11, 2024 by Talesien

[lovalter]

15 hours ago, Nymra said:

It will maybe called Naked Struggle (which sumarizes my experience on dealing with DDs all the time...) and not only work directly with Naked Defeat AND devious devices but also offer new ways to Work with DDs (a one hotkey struggle feature and many more immersion improving stuff).... one of the many reasons I dont play with DDs are the pop ups and the constant requirement to open inventory (it would still require and extra slot tho). 

Sounds similar to Unforgiving Devices, check it out it's great

[Talesien]

10 minutes ago, lovalter said:

Sounds similar to Unforgiving Devices, check it out it's great

I'm pretty sure that's kinda the opposite of what he wants. The struggle part is prolly mostly aimed at his modding experience with DD anyway. ^^
Also, tastes differ it seems, if DD can be a PITA, adding unforgiving devices makes it a major PITA almost all the time (which admittedly is kinda the point of the mod).

Personally, I would prefer DD to work a bit more like Toys. Like, if you got a key, it opens the device, period. No fuss, no hour long animation, no crappy RNG that makes you break 5 keys in a row...

Edited September 11, 2024 by Talesien

[Zaflis]

2 hours ago, Talesien said:

I think what Nymra mostly wants is to remove the devices from the player before putting him into ZAZ furniture or playing a scene (because lets face it a yoke/armbinder/Straightjacket looks pretty ridiculous if you are in a pillory or on a cross, same goes for same chains, etc.) and re-apply those exact devices again afterwards (getting yourself "killed" should not be an easy way out of your devices). That's probably comparably easy with DDe, as it is, like you stated, 

DD-Contraptions would also solve that as it will do all that automatically as far as i am aware. Each furniture can define its own rules about worn devices too, considering the variety of furnitures is only limited by imagination. I can understand supporting ZAP still may be trickier.

[SHIIIZA117]

18 hours ago, ZenoSamaZ said:

Hi there, is anyone knows if nd is now compatible with baka defeat ? I like baka defeat but I have to admit ND seems to be a good mod (I've never tested btw....)

 

did you test it?  is it worth it to change to ND