Lupine00 Posted February 27, 2018 Posted February 27, 2018 7 hours ago, VirginMarie said: I've not seen corpses fly up to the ceiling. There is a bit of a "rag doll" effect that could be in conflict with something else you have. I'll address this by itself, as I had this happen a great deal. A short time after death while naked - there would be a bit of a delay - the corpse would suddenly re-clothe itself, twitch and float up. Most corpses floated up merely to knee height, some to head height. From time to time, one would fly up to the ceiling of a large cavern, lost forever (barring tcl). Only happened to corpses of people killed while worshipping Dibella, when they reverted to clothed. Apart from Foot Fetish retriggering rather quickly, this was the only thing I'd call a bug. Everything else worked promptly and reliably. What do I have that might cause this? That might mess with ragdoll? Here's my LO for this playthrough, sorted by recent version of LOOT: Spoiler Skyrim.esm Update.esm Dawnguard.esm HearthFires.esm Dragonborn.esm Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp WM Flora Fixes.esp SexLab.esm Schlongs of Skyrim - Core.esm ZaZAnimationPack.esm ApachiiHairFemales.esm ApachiiHair.esm HentaiPregnancy.esm Devious Devices - Assets.esm SexLabAroused.esm Devious Devices - Integration.esm Devious Devices - Expansion.esm hdtHighHeel.esm Invisibility Eyes Fix.esp RaceMenu.esp RaceMenuPlugin.esp SkyUI.esp IcePenguinWorldMap.esp NIOVHH.esp dD - Realistic Ragdoll Force - Realistic.esp XPMSE.esp SLAnimLoader.esp SLALAnimObj.esp SOS - Pubic Hair for Females Addon.esp SAP.esp Schlongs of Skyrim.esp SOS - Smurf Average Addon.esp SOS - VectorPlexus Regular Addon.esp SLA Monitor Widget.esp AMatterOfTime.esp SexLab Inflation Framework.esp UIExtensions.esp Shout Like a Virgin.esp BrandingDeviceOfDoom.esp SlaveTats.esp DW.esp MilkModNEW.esp MilkMod_MilkPumpsBasicB.esp MilkModNEW HF.esp MilkModNEW Sanbox.esp MilkModNEW ZaZ.esp JaxonzMCMKicker.esp Remodeled Armor - Underwear.esp Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dawnguard.esp Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dragonborn.esp Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer.esp SexLab_Solutions.esp SLPleasure.esp SexLab Eager NPCs.esp Tribal Tattoo Overlays.esp vlkAF_SexLife.esp RaceMenuMorphsUUNP.esp Osare Underwear.esp yurica_summerdress [HDT].esp SexistGuards.esp UNP Undies.esp KomAnimObjects.esp SLAL_AnimationsByLeito.esp FNIS.esp Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp Bashed Patch, 0.esp Some mods I may never have actually enabled in their MCM options, such as Eager NPCs: didn't use it in the end as SLAV offered quite enough sex for anyone.
VirginMarie Posted February 27, 2018 Author Posted February 27, 2018 5 hours ago, Lupine00 said: I appreciate the time taken to respond to my rambling commentary. Thanks very much for reading it. I know it takes time to write those responses, and I didn't really expect any. I was just saying my piece, and certainly not expecting anything to come of it. But I do believe those points have general relevance, and that I have some experience of the theory and practice of the topics of which I write, and so my comments were not made without consideration. However, they aren't arguments, or a position, merely something to digest, or pointers to a trail that might take you somewhere fresh. My take away from all your feedback, summarized, is... Don't repeat stuff to the point that it loses the initial entertainment value. It needs more content if you are going to repeat Don't assume people will adjust the MCM setting when they get bored with something that repeats (this feedback has also come from others) Provide a nekid player combat solution (equivalent to wearing armor), built into the mod to offset the combat style the mod induces. Nocturnal's robe is not enough This is valuable feed back. Hope it encompasses your main points. For #1 & #2 My next release plan includes MCM setting profiles. You can read those in the above post. I'm thinking of having dialogue that leads to these profiles being auto-changed, when you first meet Nocturnal. And now, from you, I'm thinking that could occur again later into the story. Instead of feeling like you are cheating, the mod's repetition could self adjust based on choice and point in the story, without you ever opening up the MCM menu. [Want to take a crack at writing the dialogue hehe? Nocturnal would basically need to ask you... do you want me to give you a fast and furious experience, or low key, or something in between.]. Maybe this occurs, for example, every 2nd time you report into Nocturnal. The profile thing is an alternative to new content to address repetition and frequency. I'd need another 1.5 years I think to address the level of new content it would take to satisfy your desires I'd also need someone skilled in story writing to go in and edit/tweak every single line of dialogue. Not likely going to happen because I don't have enough skill set to improve myself, my husband is even worse at writing (don't tell him I said that), and anyone who might volunteer would need a load of time to do that. I will still be continuing to slowly add more content. For example one specific place others have commented on as being too repetitive, is reporting in to Nocturnal. This cannot be turned off early in the story or the rest of the mod stops progressing. So I'm definitely looking at adding variety to that encounter and have some secret plans cooking up with mercplatypus to spice that part up. This might include some amputation themed and replacement with dwemer parts (another user's suggestion) as something totally optional. I will likely, eventually, expand the foot fetish quest. I might even learn texture stuff enough to improve the art assets, unless someone beats me to it. Shall see. The Pony Cart has potential to expand. Did you find you use it to take the maiden home (maiden retrieval quest)? Another person suggested that the random encounters with nocturnal (Pain is Pleasure, Pleasure Thyself, and Nocturnal is a Tease) could have more variety. I will be adding one called "Dirty Dancing" I think. It's these sort of specific suggestions that I'm very interested to hear about. Let me know if you end up thinking of any. For #2 Increasing armor magically could be cool if done in a Virgin style uniquely. Maybe I could expand on the Body Piercings. You could earn a magical armor bonus that comes from the piercings. Its in 3 parts so this would be 3 levels of armor. You would lose that bonus when they are ripped off of you, or you are not aroused enough for them to be visible. You'd be able to use MCM settings to control your chance of keeping those piercings on, but still always have the risk of losing it. I would not be able to tie this into armor perks, that's not feasible. Would something like this turn you on? How to work into the story? 5 hours ago, Lupine00 said: A short time after death while naked - there would be a bit of a delay - the corpse would suddenly re-clothe itself, twitch and float up. Apart from Foot Fetish retriggering rather quickly, this was the only thing I'd call a bug. Everything else worked promptly and reliably. What do I have that might cause this? That might mess with ragdoll? I think there's a good chance, turning off Realistic Ragdoll Force would stop it. If you do that, just do it as a test. Don't bake that into your save as removing a mod mid-play through will eventually corrupt your save (my guess is you already know). If you confirm this, I will try to recreate it, and see if I can prevent the conflict in a future release. I already have some ideas on how. For Foot Fetish starting too fast, please let me know if you end up recreating it. There is a random chance involved which can correctly trigger even on the first power hit after cool down, but the cool down setting should be in play and there's nothing random about that, only the fact that power hits can come from whipping. Note that the default setting intentionally gets your foot lost fairly quickly and is intended to be increased much higher once you don't want to see it repeat often (that's the premise of the defaults in all cases). This default could be too low and I will keep that in mind. 1
Lupine00 Posted February 28, 2018 Posted February 28, 2018 14 hours ago, VirginMarie said: Don't repeat stuff to the point that it loses the initial entertainment value. It needs more content if you are going to repeat Don't assume people will adjust the MCM setting when they get bored with something that repeats (this feedback has also come from others) Provide a nekid player combat solution (equivalent to wearing armor), built into the mod to offset the combat style the mod induces. Nocturnal's robe is not enough If you're going for the executive summary sure. I think I was trying to make a couple more points: 1) if you're offering primarily a toolkit of various customisable comedy mechanics oriented mostly around shouts and chastity devices, but with other disparate stuff, say it loud and clear on the front page, and explicitly set the player expectations. Don't assume they are insightful enough to infer that from a description of the specific features what the mod is really about. 2) comedy and narrative aren't mutually exclusive (as Dragonbreak or Brhuce Hammar demonstrate), and a bit of interesting narrative goes a long way in keeping people engaged in content that might sometimes be more content-extender than content. People will endure hours of unbelievably tedious mining at the start of CD, because it's full of hints and promises, and Slaverun pushes BDSM sex scenes to the point of absolute and total over-exposure burn-out tedium (I think it has well over 22 hours of actual sex scenes in a regular story-mode play through of 2.X), but people still sit through it - because they want to see how it ends up - and Slaverun's writing is a long way from subtle. Sure, those mods are profoundly different from each other, and from SLAV, but I still think they demonstrate that developing the narrative hooks a bit would lift engagement and broaden the overall appeal quite a bit. The future of SLAV sounds interesting. I wouldn't re-play the version of SLAV I have installed, but I would definitely be ready to give it another try when new features appear, whether they are what I think is needed, or something else entirely. Some mods take time to grow on you. Maybe in time, I will come around to the SLAV way of thinking? Finally, if you actually want it, I will write you any dialogue you like, and you can do what you want with it. 1
Lupine00 Posted February 28, 2018 Posted February 28, 2018 14 hours ago, VirginMarie said: I think there's a good chance, turning off Realistic Ragdoll Force would stop it. If you do that, just do it as a test. Don't bake that into your save as removing a mod mid-play through will eventually corrupt your save (my guess is you already know). If you confirm this, I will try to recreate it, and see if I can prevent the conflict in a future release. I already have some ideas on how. I will get back to you on this in the fullness of time.
VirginMarie Posted February 28, 2018 Author Posted February 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Lupine00 said: If you actually want it, I will write you any dialogue you like, and you can do what you want with it. I'd love to see what you'd come up with. Perhaps give it a try by taking the first scene... the first meeting with Nocturnal. Maybe run through that part in game and come up with an improved version so I can see what you'd do with it. or this... Quote If you're offering primarily a toolkit of various customisable comedy mechanics oriented mostly around shouts and chastity devices, but with other disparate stuff, say it loud and clear on the front page, and explicitly set the player expectations. Don't assume they are insightful enough to infer that from a description of the specific features what the mod is really about. I've struggled to describe what the mod is about. Maybe you could come up with a revised front page, or some part of it? You did not comment on the idea of Body Piercings giving armor. Am I to take that as "you don't like it"?
DonQuiWho Posted February 28, 2018 Posted February 28, 2018 2 hours ago, VirginMarie said: or this... I've struggled to describe what the mod is about. Maybe you could come up with a revised front page, or some part of it? If he wants something really concise, maybe I help? How about.... 'Get stitched up tight for shagging unwisely' ... or something similar?
RG9919 Posted February 28, 2018 Posted February 28, 2018 Mod is running almost perfectly fine but for some reason there's not a spank animation for thiefs, instead sexlab runs other animations with my character being dominant and that gets weird with male npcs... same when i shout and male characters use female masturbation animations. Any solution? already checked trouble shooting. ty (sorry for poor english)
Lupine00 Posted February 28, 2018 Posted February 28, 2018 4 hours ago, VirginMarie said: You did not comment on the idea of Body Piercings giving armor. Am I to take that as "you don't like it"? No. I thought it was a good idea, adds more SLAV to my suggestion. I'm just trying to keep my spam generation under control. It seems you really like the idea of armor that fails or functions intermittently. One thing, is playing first person, you can't tell if these things have come off or not. I found that was a problem with the Nocturnal robe. Oh, another thing that's quirky, is the mechanism of setting items in the MCM then hitting reset to re-equip... I thought it took the player out of the game, compared to simply swapping items in the inventory (which is not super-immersive to start with). And as I could mess with items in the inventory quite effectively, once I had keys; it just seemed to add complexity. I was never quite sure if I had to set the dibella harness from the MCM, or the nocturnal robe from the MCM, for them them to work properly. If you were looking for a way to get some MCM space back for other options, you could probably do away with that system and simply allow the player to obtain any of the items they've earned from some kind of wacky dispenser statue in the sanctuary. Otherwise, I guess some people probably like the convenience of it. On the topic of dialogue, I was struggling at first, to come up with any ideas that would improve the existing situation without making changes here or there to events or topic trees, but now I'm starting to have some ideas that wouldn't require that. But what is your concept for Nocturnal vs Dibella. How can they compete? They are different kinds of being, with different limitations in how they act. Is the Dragonborn a prize, a pawn, or a beneficiary, in their view? What is Nocturnal's real motivation? Where are the two forces on the whole end of existence thing? Are they trying to help with that? Or hinder? Or simply oblivious? These are questions I ask myself, and I have some answers, but do you have a care factor in this area? There were times I thought the real explanation had to be that the whole thing was orchestrated by Sheogorrath, and that he was masquerading as Nocturnal, and manipulating the Dibella priestesses. Also, are Biggs and Wedge essential? Wedge stalked me into a dungeon and seemed to get killed by an amped up necromancer while I was busy frigging myself back to life. I say seemed, because then Nocturnal killed the necro, and I got a cut scene, so I never saw what happened to Wedge... But I never saw him again. I guess I'm going to have to look through SLAV in the CK, and once I've done that, any mystery it might possibly have had will be gone I said I'd be a while with my response to the physics bug, because I accidentally hosed my SLAV profile last night. Copied it to make a new profile, then ended up altering the wrong one when I was flipping back and forth looking at load orders. I know what I have to do to restore it as it was, just need to get around to it.
VirginMarie Posted February 28, 2018 Author Posted February 28, 2018 3 hours ago, donkeywho said: If he wants something really concise, maybe I help? How about.... 'Get stitched up tight for shagging unwisely' ... or something similar? You are a smartarse That's a good start but you are going to need more than that my friend. 1 hour ago, RG9919 said: Mod is running almost perfectly fine but for some reason there's not a spank animation for thiefs, instead sexlab runs other animations with my character being dominant and that gets weird with male npcs... same when i shout and male characters use female masturbation animations. Any solution? already checked trouble shooting. ty (sorry for poor english) Something is installed wrong within sexlab. Since you are not the first to ask about this problem, I've added the solution to the Troubleshooting section. See Troubleshooting #23 Most masturbation scenes do not use sexlab. This mod plays those animations on it's own. It's normal that males will play some animations really intended for females, but I picked animations that I thought looked fine for either sex.
VirginMarie Posted February 28, 2018 Author Posted February 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Lupine00 said: No. I thought it was a good idea, adds more SLAV to my suggestion. I'm just trying to keep my spam generation under control. It seems you really like the idea of armor that fails or functions intermittently. One thing, is playing first person, you can't tell if these things have come off or not. I found that was a problem with the Nocturnal robe. Ok cool I will likely add that feature. What total armor value do you think makes sense? I'm not sure if Skyrim engine is going to allow me to make it dynamic so might need to be 1 size fits all. If so I'd take the total desired value, divide by 3, for each of the 3 parts. If it can be dynamic I'd give the user an MCM slider with min 0 and some max. It's not so much that I like armor falling off... it's that it needs to be devious, or kinky, or something different not available elsewhere. And also because it was requested by several. You can already use normal armor. Keep in mind with the piercings, you will be able to use other armor too (just not a complete set) if you change the default settings. If in first person, you still hear a "whuuuussh" sound when stuff falls off, or a scream in the case of the piercings. Sometimes the whuussh sound is canceled out by too many other sounds... that's the Skyrim engine doing that as it can't play too many sounds at once. I'm not sure how many use first person. I don't since it negates the significant amount of visuals at play. I don't test in first person view very much so user feed back for that view has resulted in some changes in the past. Quote Oh, another thing that's quirky, is the mechanism of setting items in the MCM then hitting reset to re-equip... I thought it took the player out of the game, compared to simply swapping items in the inventory (which is not super-immersive to start with). And as I could mess with items in the inventory quite effectively, once I had keys; it just seemed to add complexity. I was never quite sure if I had to set the dibella harness from the MCM, or the nocturnal robe from the MCM, for them them to work properly. If you were looking for a way to get some MCM space back for other options, you could probably do away with that system and simply allow the player to obtain any of the items they've earned from some kind of wacky dispenser statue in the sanctuary. Otherwise, I guess some people probably like the convenience of it. The MCM will determine what gets put on if Nocturnal or an event is doing it. If you have the item already you can Manipulate in inventory, or use the MCM. If you don't have the item yet, you need to acquire it using the MCM. A dispenser type deal would be more immersive and could be worked into the story, but its a significant change and would need to address somehow the "determine what gets put on if Nocturnal or an event is doing it". Quote On the topic of dialogue, I was struggling at first, to come up with any ideas that would improve the existing situation without making changes here or there to events or topic trees, but now I'm starting to have some ideas that wouldn't require that. Yes keeping the topic tress intact is important. Limited changes I'd not rule out but CK makes this very time consuming and cumbersome, There's also logic and script tied to these trees... a pile of it... so tree changes lead to very significant re-testing, while unchanged trees need very little testing. Quote But what is your concept for Nocturnal vs Dibella. How can they compete? They are different kinds of being, with different limitations in how they act. Is the Dragonborn a prize, a pawn, or a beneficiary, in their view? There were times I thought the real explanation had to be that the whole thing was orchestrated by Sheogorrath, and that he was masquerading as Nocturnal, and manipulating the Dibella priestesses. The background story started out very light and I did not know Skyrim lore very well when starting. @mercplatypus got involved with many of the ideas and story side of things. I'd invite him to jump in here if he's reading. Nocturnal and Dibella are bored and made a bet to see who could manipulate the dragonborn... a fight between virginity and lost virginity. They are playing a game. Nocturnal needs virgin sacrifices to maintain her powers, thus takes the "prevent lost virginity" side of the bet. Dibella believes in "spreading the love" and takes a much more passive approach to influencing the dragon born to lose virginity. Since they have too much time on their hands, they are toying with the dragonborn, and having fun, so the Dragonborn is both a prize and a pawn. I'd say Dibella sees it more along the prize way of thinking, and Nocturnal views her as a pawn. I think of Nocturnal as the devious evil one, and Dibella as polite and passive, but secretly a devious too. Dibella is never forcing you into lost virginity, but influencing, so for example she won't let you do "shrine love" with a chastity device on, and if you want the "surprise" at a impassioned waterfall, you are going to be tricked into losing virginity. The Order of the Lily, for example, do not force you into anything, where as Nocturnal is not giving any choices. Quote What is Nocturnal's real motivation? Where are the two forces on the whole end of existence thing? Are they trying to help with that? Or hinder? There were times I thought the real explanation had to be that the whole thing was orchestrated by Sheogorrath, and that he was masquerading as Nocturnal, and manipulating the Dibella priestesses. I think we have opportunity to add answers for these. Maybe it is Sheogorrath since there is indeed comedy and a game involved and he's the nut case in Skyrim. Quote Also, are Biggs and Wedge essential? All NPCs in this mod are invincible (or whatever that CK setting is called). Essential can still be killed. My NPCs cannot be.
Lupine00 Posted March 1, 2018 Posted March 1, 2018 16 hours ago, VirginMarie said: Ok cool I will likely add that feature. What total armor value do you think makes sense? I'm not sure if Skyrim engine is going to allow me to make it dynamic so might need to be 1 size fits all. If so I'd take the total desired value, divide by 3, for each of the 3 parts. If it can be dynamic I'd give the user an MCM slider with min 0 and some max. Specifically on armor, I don't think there is a straightforward way to make dynamic armor values. Most likely, you'd have to make a bunch of items with different values on them and swap them in and out. There is a spell effect that adds armor, and that could be replicated and modified to do the same thing, and you might find swapping that with other objects is a lighter weight operation because it doesn't have to check and change as many things internally. That also frees you from struggling with slots, but, ultimately, you need an item, with the right armor type, in each of the basic slots to get the perk bonus. You could reasonably put the minimum amount of armor on the slotted items and then manage the total armor value another way. I made a really simple little mod that gave harnesses armor, but I wasn't happy that the player could equip armor and a harness, so the harness had to be moved to slot 32 to stop that. I could have used a script to try and unequip any armor put in 32, but it is so much simpler just to reslot the harness - though the harness then has to have a body mesh in it, so that was another edit. There was (is) a crappy harness that doesn't lock and has almost no armor, and two better ones equivalent to steel and ebonite that do lock, and have chastity effect as per "vanilla" DD harness. Kind of the opposite of SLAV - you are locked into your armor. I waved away the nonsense of harnesses providing armor with some babble about enchantments in the item description. Anyway, I can't distribute it, tiny and trivial as it is, because it modifies and repackages two meshes from DD (one from assets and one from expansion). So now I'm bogged down making a harness mesh of my own so I can just use that instead. Having started that, there are more things I want to do with it (like an optional corset to match, and a version that cuts into the skin instead of floating over it), but it's slow work as I am rubbish at Blender, and it doesn't have the modifiers I would have used from Max, and I was never, by any means, a pro at Max, unless you're talking about the development API for it. Anyway, maybe I could get permission to use those meshes, or maybe the rights holders would just never respond, like BetterBecause. So I guess armor balancing is a problem I solved that particular way. I used the values from the vanilla pieces as my guide, the harnesses are just a little worse than real steel or ebonite, and the crappy one is lower than any other armor out there that isn't zero - but it's enough to class as wearing light armor for the bonus, and enough to avoid the no-armor-in-slot penalty you get from being naked.
Lupine00 Posted March 1, 2018 Posted March 1, 2018 16 hours ago, VirginMarie said: I think of Nocturnal as the devious evil one, and Dibella as polite and passive, but secretly a devious too. Dibella is never forcing you into lost virginity, but influencing, so for example she won't let you do "shrine love" with a chastity device on, and if you want the "surprise" at a impassioned waterfall, you are going to be tricked into losing virginity. The Order of the Lily, for example, do not force you into anything, where as Nocturnal is not giving any choices. I read this a few hours ago, and have been pondering it since. I kept reading devious as delicious. As written now, Nocturnal isn't particularly devious, her approach is simple blunt coercion, the only thing stopping it being Molag Baal-ish, is that the things she coerces you to do are mostly harmless. Dibella on the other hand is, at the moment more about persuasion and persistence, but there's a certain amount of sly manipulation. As such, she comes off more devious. She would seem fairly benign, but she is aware of the conflicts she's generating by pushing on the Dragonborn in contradiction to Nocturnal's wishes, so comes off less innocent than she might, due to that. For me, the key difference is that Nocturnal exists. She is a character that can show up, fight, talk to you, bully, cajole, plead, oppress, or reward in real time, directly, depending on your actions. Nocturnal has a direct impact in the world, but no willing servitors (that I saw). She keeps her "friends" in cages. Dibella barely exists. She's a voice that may be able to grant magical blessings, or for all we know, she doesn't even really do that, and the magical blessings are an indirect effect of some kind. However, she has worshippers, who do what she wants, and don't question for a moment whether it's right or wrong, because in their minds Dibella is the definition of rightness. And as far as we know, the worshippers aren't simply delusional and hearing their own voices - there's lore basis for Dibella being able to manifest more concretely in the past. Presumably, she may possess her priestesses, and may even be summonable as a real entity, in highly unusual circumstances. At least, it was narratively convenient for Bethesda, or a mod author Oddly enough, Dibella also seems to like cages. So, probably you want to retain the actuality of how the divines manifest and act rather than how you're describing your conception of them. If they were changed to act as you describe them, the personality of Nocturnal would be quite different I think, though Dibella wouldn't change much. The existing user base would probably balk at any dramatic personality changes, they are used to whimsical dominatrix Nocturnal. Narrative isn't just better lines, it's better lines with a purpose. Figure out that purpose, and the lines are a lot easier to write. To create a narrative, rather than some narrative, you need a story structure, and that means a beginning, a middle, and an end. There's currently a beginning, which is the part up until you get your keys (though this sort of gets annoyingly wound back by tallows). Then there's a lingering middle that goes on until you get bored of saving virgins, or have sexed every dragon mound, or whatever ... a fair amount of those tasks are like the collectables from a platformer, stuff for completists that don't feel entirely part of the "core". There's no real end, unless I didn't do enough to earn it (entirely possible, but may fall into the category of problems caused by TLDNR). Rather than suggesting to people that they can turn off tallows, I think it should be deferred until after you've made at least one more daedric buddy, so the player has a quest where they've got their keys, but they aren't in any new bondage, and they can enjoy not jangling all the time, for a bit. That would make the beginning phase better defined too. You could still turn it off, but if it is on, it should start a bit later. As for the end, that pretty much has to be created, from a mix of what's available, and probably some small additions. You can keep the "play forever" feel by allowing the player to retrigger the start of the mod via some task, after it's been completed. You could even add a "tier" system, where you get some minor ability as a completion reward, and it gets stronger if you complete the whole thing more than once. That gives the player something concrete to work for, besides the story hooks, and reasons to replay, even if somewhat flimsy ones. Probably, some of the quests should be kept separate from the story phases entirely. For example dragon mound sex could, and probably should be oblivious to completion state, or anything else. It pretty much stands alone as its own quest. Just like the altered standing stones (which you can trigger long before you meet Nocturnal) it's just how the world is in SLAV and doesn't need a deus ex machina to drive it (or even explain it). As an aside, it would be a small but neat functional addition to add a quest with a count of standing stones you've gained intimate knowledge of, and if you get all of them, something happens, who knows what? Some small unique content reward, like a giant standing stone pushes out of the ground (with a big smile on its face) for you to hump, and it gives a new and unique stone bonus, or something SLAV-style like that, but with the word "unique" added wherever possible! As for the ending, or endings, I'll write more tomorrow. I've got more to say about the beginning too.
VirginMarie Posted March 1, 2018 Author Posted March 1, 2018 Quote There is a spell effect that adds armor Yes is what I meant by if a way exists, I'd to it dynamically. I've just never tested to see if I can use the spell. The spell way is the only way I'd consider doing it dynamically. This would be best because then people can have it "as is" too (i.e. no armor bonus). Quote That also frees you from struggling with slots, but, ultimately, you need an item, with the right armor type, in each of the basic slots to get the perk bonus. You could reasonably put the minimum amount of armor on the slotted items and then manage the total armor value another way. I would not provide what's needed to work with perks. No way I'd use up all those slots. Instead those slots need to remain available for regular armor. The armor will fall of by default unless you disable. 2 hours ago, Lupine00 said: So, probably you want to retain the actuality of how the divines manifest and act rather than how you're describing your conception of them. If they were changed to act as you describe them, the personality of Nocturnal would be quite different I think, though Dibella wouldn't change much. The existing user base would probably balk at any dramatic personality changes, they are used to whimsical dominatrix Nocturnal. I want to retain the actuality. If I described my own conception as something meaningfully different, It's because I had it wrong. At this point I'm not seeing what would be different but I will let that come through when getting to details. Quote Rather than suggesting to people that they can turn off tallows, I think it should be deferred until after you've made at least one more daedric buddy, so the player has a quest where they've got their keys, but they aren't in any new bondage, and they can enjoy not jangling all the time, for a bit. That would make the beginning phase better defined too. You could still turn it off, but if it is on, it should start a bit later. I'd not suggest turning it off, as its part of the main story so you need to do it. There is currently an MCM option to delay it though. When Tales and Tallows was originally added, it was for Halloween, and we did not want to make the user wait long to get to it. Also the mod had less other quests going on. But now, it makes good sense to delay its start so I like that idea. Quote As for the end, that pretty much has to be created, from a mix of what's available, and probably some small additions. The end of the main story is when you gain the 3rd word for the Love Shout. This gives you the chance of instant death using the shout. To do that you must love enough shrines for Dibella (Shrine Love quest), and you must find the ingredient at a spit roast for Nocturnal (Bedeviled spit Roast quest), or alternatively, or in combo with spit roasts, love enough dragons to death (this was provided as an alternative for those who find the spit roast too extreme). Quote You can keep the "play forever" feel by allowing the player to retrigger the start of the mod via some task, after it's been completed. I don't think that's a good idea. There's enough reasons to sandbox (listed below) Quote You could even add a "tier" system, where you get some minor ability as a completion reward, and it gets stronger if you complete the whole thing more than once. That gives the player something concrete to work for, besides the story hooks, and reasons to replay, even if somewhat flimsy ones. There's already lots of reasons to continue. Regain your virginity (and lose it, and regain it again, and again) Increase your fire resist from more spit roasts Get walking on water again Get the blessing from loving shrines Complete all the shrines of the nine divines, to gain access to the blessing in the temple Love enough word walls to gain the Damage Armor Ability (part of your Thu'um of Strip). To find more word walls you can gain locations from dragon mounds Increase frost resistance by activating more Nocturnal statues Retrieve enough maidens to earn the ability to return home from any tavern (this uses the enchanted bar stool and chandelier) Activate enough Nocturnal Statues to earn the enchanted version of the Anal Soul Gem such that you can power up enchanted weapons with it. Note that there are "secret" Nocturnal statue locations that you can discover (no map marker provided) Get the Asphyxiation blessing from the Dibella statues, and earn the potion ability (requires also that you have spanked enough thieves) Earn the ability to make your own Standing Stone potion by loving all the standing stones Get the Enchanted version of the Anal Skelton key so you can use to open locks I'm likely missing something. These are all listed on the main page. Quote Probably, some of the quests should be kept separate from the story phases entirely. For example dragon mound sex could, and probably should be oblivious to completion state, or anything else. It pretty much stands alone as its own quest. Just like the altered standing stones (which you can trigger long before you meet Nocturnal) it's just how the world is in SLAV and doesn't need a deus ex machina to drive it (or even explain it). Yup well most of the quests/rewards I listed above at like this. But some have ties into the main story. Quote As an aside, it would be a small but neat functional addition to add a quest with a count of standing stones you've gained intimate knowledge of, and if you get all of them, something happens, who knows what? Some small unique content reward, like a giant standing stone pushes out of the ground (with a big smile on its face) for you to hump, and it gives a new and unique stone bonus, or something SLAV-style like that, but with the word "unique" added wherever possible! Standing stones already have a quest/count. You earn the ability to make your own standing stone potions by loving them all. Quote As for the ending, or endings, I'll write more tomorrow. I've got more to say about the beginning too. Look forward to it
sheolman Posted March 1, 2018 Posted March 1, 2018 On 2017/12/29 at 1:53 AM, VirginMarie said: Glad you are loving it. I think anal shout is enough Nobody has asked this question before you are the first. The only time this mod drains stamina is during whipping. This mod does not touch your stamina during the rebirth. I don't know what could cause it, maybe another mod? Try using the "sexchange" console command (change then change back again) to clear it. I have no idea if that will work but sexchange tends to reset everything about your character. Well, i was trying translated it to chinese，allmost done. Do you have any suggestion? PS： My question have soluted. But I found a random error，caucse by some HDT skeletons "beads_shallow X". rename it a special name different of other mods can help.
Lupine00 Posted March 1, 2018 Posted March 1, 2018 2 hours ago, VirginMarie said: Yup well most of the quests/rewards I listed above at like this. But some have ties into the main story. Ah, there's already a reward for loving all stones... I had a feeling I'd seen that somewhere. I was pretty close to getting the third word, just spit roasts to do, and they seemed to be dragging me through a lot of dungeons I was somewhat bored of from past plays. What I'm getting at, is there should be a clearer distinction between what is "main story" and what is sandbox. I'll explain better in due course. I didn't like the anal skeleton key idea, stopped short one step of getting it. I put all that effort into pick locks skill then... Or does it not totally invalidate pick locks skill?
VirginMarie Posted March 1, 2018 Author Posted March 1, 2018 4 hours ago, sheolman said: Well, i was trying translated it to chinese，allmost done. Do you have any suggestion? PS： My question have soluted. But I found a random error，caucse by some HDT skeletons "beads_shallow X". rename it a special name different of other mods can help. I do not understand. Very lost.
VirginMarie Posted March 1, 2018 Author Posted March 1, 2018 2 hours ago, Lupine00 said: Ah, there's already a reward for loving all stones... I had a feeling I'd seen that somewhere. I was pretty close to getting the third word, just spit roasts to do, and they seemed to be dragging me through a lot of dungeons I was somewhat bored of from past plays. A player like you needs a different MCM profile with a lower setting on number of spit roasts that must be completed. Hehe just me thinking more about how such a feature could really help. 2 hours ago, Lupine00 said: What I'm getting at, is there should be a clearer distinction between what is "main story" and what is sandbox. I'll explain better in due course. Totally agree. I know that right now with many things in parallel, people get lost on what they need to complete if they would like to get to the "end". Putting something as simple as a word within the quest names could help... "Main" / "Side", but that's not very immersive. 2 hours ago, Lupine00 said: I didn't like the anal skeleton key idea, stopped short one step of getting it. I put all that effort into pick locks skill then... Or does it not totally invalidate pick locks skill? Indeed the lockpick skill gets negated if you use the Anal Skeleton key. But that's kind-of the point. This is an alternative. You did different work to earn it. From a story point of view, the Skeleton Key is very "key" for a Nocturnal theme. It uses a custom animation made just for this mod, done by FunnyBiz.
sheolman Posted March 2, 2018 Posted March 2, 2018 11 hours ago, VirginMarie said: I do not understand. Very lost. HA~~~ I mean...a chinese Version for Shout Like A Virgin 6.5b so, I ask you for a permision.....what are you thinking about?
VirginMarie Posted March 2, 2018 Author Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, sheolman said: HA~~~ I mean...a chinese Version for Shout Like A Virgin 6.5b so, I ask you for a permision.....what are you thinking about? Yes I give you permission, if you agree to these... You can NOT incorporate any of my code in any for-profit project (donations are fine as long as they are strictly voluntary) You can NOT use any of my code in a closed source project You CAN otherwise use my code for your own projects as long as you include all source code with your distribution and allow others to use your own code in a similar fashion, and give credit with link
sheolman Posted March 2, 2018 Posted March 2, 2018 1 hour ago, VirginMarie said: Yes I give you permission, if you agree to these... You can NOT incorporate any of my code in any for-profit project (donations are fine as long as they are strictly voluntary) You can NOT use any of my code in a closed source project You CAN otherwise use my code for your own projects as long as you include all source code with your distribution and allow others to use your own code in a similar fashion, and give credit with link Ok. I will give you a link when I am finished.
Lupine00 Posted March 2, 2018 Posted March 2, 2018 17 hours ago, VirginMarie said: A player like you needs a different MCM profile with a lower setting on number of spit roasts that must be completed. Hehe just me thinking more about how such a feature could really help. Quite possibly. Or a different way of looking at this kind of thing, a dialog line where you indicate your preference... Nocturnal appears, bored, puts you in some Zap chains and whips you: "Ah, my favorite pet, Dragonslut... No, Dragonslave... Whatever your name is... Why have you summoned me?" PC dialog options: Please help. I've lost all my keys. Could I get some more? This is your altar? Sorry. I was trying to pick a mushroom and accidentally worshipped you. This spit-roasts thing is taking forever. Can't we just use Nord Mead as the ingredient? It always works for me. Just called to say, I'm really enjoying shouting at roasting spits. I'm so glad you gave me that task. Player selects "boring spit roasts"... Nocturnal says, "No you cannot, not even if you beg and plead. This is a very special and magical ingredient, and assailing cooking equipment with your powerful shouts is the only way to get it, apart from lethal dragonsex. You can try that instead if you like, but I've got a hunch that the next spit you try will be the one. You can do it. Just one more." or player selects "spit roasts are fun"... Nocturnal says, "When you put it like that... If you like it so much, I could always send you to shout at spits that I know don't have the ingredient. No. That would be ridiculous. I'd never do that. The fate of the world depends on your vocal prowess. I definitely wouldn't waste your time on a futile quest for an item you don't even really need." Or something like that... Basically, topics, not MCMs. It can't feel like cheating if it's IMMERSIVE, can it? Can it?
Lupine00 Posted March 2, 2018 Posted March 2, 2018 17 hours ago, VirginMarie said: Indeed the lockpick skill gets negated if you use the Anal Skeleton key. But that's kind-of the point. This is an alternative. You did different work to earn it. From a story point of view, the Skeleton Key is very "key" for a Nocturnal theme. It uses a custom animation made just for this mod, done by FunnyBiz. If only you'd said that before, I would have got it just to see the FB anim. Does she stab the key to death, then rape its eye socket with a penis made of metal death? I guess there are some people who totally hate lock picking, and others would would say "ANAL SKELETON KEY, what more reason do you need?" But I like lock picking. Maybe a choice of reward would be nice. Key, or anal blacklight? It's a lantern, but it aids stealth! Or maybe not. The more I think about "how SLAV would do it" the more the answer is simply "how SLAV did it."
Lupine00 Posted March 2, 2018 Posted March 2, 2018 Well, one thing I wanted to write down, for my own understanding, was a pair of lists, one with core quests, and one with non-core quests. As you very helpfully provided a list of activities, I'll repeat it again here: (N) Regain your virginity (and lose it, and regain it again, and again) - (I don't feel this is a quest in itself, but it is an event. The quest is earning the ability to do it at all). (N) Increase your fire resist from more spit roasts - (sidequest) (D) Get walking on water again - (trivially repeatable events aren't really quests, even if technically they are) (D) Get the blessing from loving shrines - (not really a quest, but part of one) (D) Complete all the shrines of the nine divines, to gain access to the blessing in the temple - (a major quest, let's call it CORE because it is required for the end). (-) Love enough word walls to gain the Damage Armor Ability (part of your Thu'um of Strip). To find more word walls you can gain locations from dragon mounds - (sidequest) (N) Increase frost resistance by activating more Nocturnal statues - (sidequest) Retrieve (do you mean save? or is there a maiden capture quest too?) enough maidens to earn the ability to return home from any tavern (this uses the enchanted bar stool and chandelier) - (convenient and sexy as this power is, that it is the reward for saving all those maidens is a surprise) - (sidequest) but feels like it deserves more importance, because unlike other actions, it has an unselfish moral component (N) Activate enough Nocturnal Statues to earn the enchanted version of the Anal Soul Gem such that you can power up enchanted weapons with it. Note that there are "secret" Nocturnal statue locations that you can discover (no map marker provided) (I found one) - (sidequest) (D) Get the Asphyxiation blessing from the Dibella statues, and earn the potion ability (requires also that you have spanked enough thieves) - (sidequest) (-) Earn the ability to make your own Standing Stone potion by loving all the standing stones - (sidequest) (N) Suck up to enough daedra to get the Enchanted version of the Anal Skelton key so you can use to open locks - (sidequest) (N) Fart at dozens of spit roasts hidden away inside long and interesting dungeons, mostly filled with draugr - (CORE) (-) Foot Fetish - lose your foot, then murder a beast, lose both of them and gain hooves, have hot furry love, and then get your feet back again, in a scene that should definitely be randomly different somehow each time it plays out - (sidequest) + Learn the third word of the Thu'um of Lu'urve - do all shrines, and all roasts (or dragonsex) (CORE) - and THE END Hmm, no way around it, I actually have to go and play through all this stuff to the bitter end. Might turn some counts down to hurry it up a bit. Damn, that's going to put a damper on the gritty, horrific, feeble mage, Things in the Dark play-through I've started. Might also turn off some harness mechanics so I can just plow through everything in heavy armor and 2H. Easy mode. So when you look at that list, it's mostly green sidequest stuff. But there is a chunk of core stuff: (1) suck up to enough daedra enough to get your keys and unlock virgin rebirths (2) hump every shrine of the NINE not EIGHT but NINE divines. Heretic!!! (3) fart at several spit roasts until one folds and hands over the secret blend of herbs and spices / alternatively sex dragons until the old codgers die of heart attacks (4) profit! Sorry (4) should be step (3). I might be being a pest, but what about if you made this instead: FIRST, you MUST suck up to enough daedra enough to get your keys and unlock virgin rebirths SECONDLY, complete ANY TWO of the quests below: (a) hump every shrine of the NINE not EIGHT but NINE divines. Heretic!!! (pro Dibella) (b) fart at several spit roasts until one folds and hands over the secret blend of herbs and spices (pro Nocturnal) (c) sex dragons until the old codgers die of heart attacks (pro Nocturnal - well, not really, not at all, oh well) (d) rescue a dozen maidens (note number of maidens in a dozen may differ from value advertised) (pro Dibella) This makes rescuing maidens more worthwhile, and gives you balanced options. You can pick all pro-Dibella, all pro-Nocturnal, or one of each. Now you may not agree that dragonsex is pro-Nocturnal, but let's pretend. The goal is to give the player a way to pick a pro Nocturnal or pro Dibella, or neutral ending, without actually adding any new things. You could add an actual pro-Nocturnal quest, or optionally, substitute in endless fucking raven perching that fun statue quest. Ending you say? What is this ending? I ain't writing no ending! The practical ending is you get the third word. The narrative ending is that there is a scene with Nocturnal and Dibella, speaking through some appropriately hilarious mouthpiece, bore the player with some exposition, then let the player say a few choice words, as the only satisfaction they'll ever get for being the pawn of these jackasses. That's new, you'd have to add that. But you can't really have an ending without making some kind of ending, so there's no way around that. Unless you don't have an ending, but then you don't really have a story. See where I'm headed with this. And then my argument ate its own tail.
VirginMarie Posted March 2, 2018 Author Posted March 2, 2018 3 hours ago, Lupine00 said: Well, one thing I wanted to write down, for my own understanding, was a pair of lists, one with core quests, and one with non-core quests. As you very helpfully provided a list of activities, I'll repeat it again here: I'm going to invite you to a private thread to continue these plans there since its getting to be too much here. Ill reply to your above 3 posts there. I will also invite mercplatypus as he's helped with this this sort of thing lots in the past and is actively helping on a new feature now. He's not got much time but would like to contribute a little bit.
tuxagent7 Posted March 3, 2018 Posted March 3, 2018 8 minutes ago, AkiKay said: Hello Virgin Marie and others, so after all this Time trying to figure out why im dying in Twilight Sepulcher [The Location Noctural teleports you after "A Daedras best friend".] i found something. And it seems to be some kind of spell forced on me once i enter the Room with 2 Slaves near a Cage and a lot of shrines. None of my Mods are causing this and theres no way to get rid of it except using "tcl". Theres a lot of problems i managed to figure out myself but im really stuck here. Do you or someone have any Idea why this is happening ? -Aki It's like a little maze, if you go in the wrong path then you will lose health, you must try and find the path where you are safe. It's like toxic smoke or something. It's part of the game
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