Naturalistic HDT

[galgat]

On 4/3/2018 at 2:52 PM, 27X said:

Same as the last time you complained about this, it's not a mod, it's your settings and your refusal to change them.

 

Mempatch.

 

settings thereof.

 

Maybe you should get around to finally researching them.

I don't think anyone ever mentioned any settings I should change ??  Also I never thought it was a complaint, I was just asking what I needed to do to help with my Problem, and hoping maybe someone Else had maybe had this problem, and might be able to help...

 

at least I quoted you, so I would not seem rude, by belittling someone, and not letting them know about it.

 

  I just thought this was the place to ask about it ?

[Kluze]

I hope to see Beast HDT for Skeever, rabbit, etc. Do you have plan to create it?

[Reesewow]

52 minutes ago, Kluze said:

I hope to see Beast HDT for Skeever, rabbit, etc. Do you have plan to create it?

From the front page:

 

Quote

Important news:

I quit modding Skyrim, so please refrain from asking me to add some feature or improve something that's already included.

If you want to add that one missing feature that makes all the difference in your opinion or if you want to improve this mod, then go ahead, do whatever you want with it. 

Just give credit where it's due, everything else is up to you.

Plus skeevers are already HDT enabled.

[Fineness]

Works well with all in one hdt animated pussy but there is a texture issue, how to fix it ?

 

[tanuhk]

collisions and all the meshes work lovely, until I get to the Beast HDT...most work fine, but I can't seem to get the spiders to open the vagina, the Chaurus also barely open thye vagina at all.
I recently updated both MNC SLAL and got the newest HDT Beasts, I have it set so that Beast HDT overwrites MNC, so I am unsure why spider collisions aren't working at all.

[jimmywon34]

On ‎3‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 4:19 PM, Bazinga said:

Well, jopie and I did some experiments but both of us lost interest in modding this game before we got anywhere with that.

And while my mod is compatible with his (there's an option in the installer) the collisions are probably not that great with his penis xmls.

Wait a sec.

...

Try using these instead of floppysos_5.xml and floppysos_6.xml

floppysos_5.xml

floppysos_6.xml

 

And please tell me if it works and if collisions are better than with the original files. I might add it to the download section then.

I actually did run into a problem with these xml's I thought i'd let you know. the vagina on females is now spread apart and permanently open even outside of sex. i'm not even sure how that's possible with just some xml's for the penis but yea it's affecting the females. I hope I can explain it correctly but yea the vagina is now gaping open when females are not even having sex and nothing is colliding with it. but yea the collisions do work better when you are actually having sex with these xml's so kinda a shame but outside of sex noticed that weird issue.

[galgat]

9 hours ago, AthenaESIV said:

Anyone have Just For Fun / XML settings for flat chest / small breast with little bouncing at all? Thanks!

   That would be a nice setting, maybe not totally flat, but just a little perk, and not deformed, Every time I try for that I get deformities I don't want. 

 

  I remember in Oblivion having some body's that were like that, with just perky  areola , and nipples, they were a nice change sometime's.  Any one that ever had to deal with Big Boobies would not want them, I can assure you.. anyway, and athletic build like that with and ample bottom would be nice.

 

  I do try for something like that in most of my Presets

[jp314]

did anyone ever manage to add collisions to BDIC - SIC?

[Neeb! Neeb! Neeb!]

Can someone help me? I can't get the pussy to open or bellies to bulge for Trolls/Giants/HOrses. But human anims and collision works. What did I do wrong?

[Bazinga]

Ingredients needed for collisions with giants, trolls and horses:

1. Naturalistic HDT or other female HDT PE physics set with collision group 7 allocated to the vagina loading after all other mods that add the same files (flash and plus sign in Mod Organizer, dunno how to check in NMM)

2. Up to date MNC (follow the installation guide from MNC, you need other stuff too, like Creature Framework), with its files only overwritten by ...

3. Beast HDT 0.64, loading after MNC and XPMSE and also overwriting everything else and not getting overwritten by anything (except for my edited version of the Convenient Horses patch in case you use that)

4. Make sure that 'Sexlab Nude Creatures' is selected for all the options in the 'Creature Framework' MCM under 'Creatures'. Maybe use the 'Re-register all mods' option if you didn't try that already.

 

If it still doesn't work report back and please add a few more details this time.

[Neeb! Neeb! Neeb!]

3 hours ago, Bazinga said:

Ingredients needed for collisions with giants, trolls and horses:

1. Naturalistic HDT or other female HDT PE physics set with collision group 7 allocated to the vagina loading after all other mods that add the same files (flash and plus sign in Mod Organizer, dunno how to check in NMM)

2. Up to date MNC (follow the installation guide from MNC, you need other stuff too, like Creature Framework), with its files only overwritten by ...

3. Beast HDT 0.64, loading after MNC and XPMSE and also overwriting everything else and not getting overwritten by anything (except for my edited version of the Convenient Horses patch in case you use that)

4. Make sure that 'Sexlab Nude Creatures' is selected for all the options in the 'Creature Framework' MCM under 'Creatures'. Maybe use the 'Re-register all mods' option if you didn't try that already.

 

If it still doesn't work report back and please add a few more details this time.

When you say collison group 7 allocated to the vagina, does that mean having the proper xmls for that group attached to the mesh?

 

[Bazinga]

Nah, I don't think we're talking about the same thing. The collision groups that I mean are entries inside the xml, telling the mesh what other meshes (or rather bones) to collide with.

And that's not even entirely correct but this stuff is too hard to explain briefly.

If you don't know what I mean then just use my Naturalistic HDT mod, that should work well together with Beast HDT.

[Neeb! Neeb! Neeb!]

39 minutes ago, Bazinga said:

Nah, I don't think we're talking about the same thing. The collision groups that I mean are entries inside the xml, telling the mesh what other meshes (or rather bones) to collide with.

And that's not even entirely correct but this stuff is too hard to explain briefly.

If you don't know what I mean then just use my Naturalistic HDT mod, that should work well together with Beast HDT.

Got it to work, you mod wasn't installed last for me so I had things overwritten. Such a silly mistake on my part. Thank you for answering, I appreciate your help

[SeveN085]

@Bazinga Hey man, need some help about editing butt bounce during collisions. I read few tutorials about JFF here, but couldn't really understand which one should I edit and even in game after editing and testing few values, I could not really tell a difference. Would be nice if you could just straight up list which values do I need to edit, for visually more butt bounce during animations. Note that im not talking about bounce duration or speed, becaues I think i know which ones are controlling it now after reading those tutorials, but I couldn't find answer for which values controls the strength of the bounce.

[Bazinga]

So you're an ass man you say? No problemo, I've got you covered.

The Time Factor in the rigidbody settings for NPC L and R Butt bones influences a lot more than you might expect. Try increasing that value back to 1.

And if by strength you mean how far the mesh moves then increasing the Linear Min/Max Limit settings is what you're looking for. The local coordinate orientation is the same as the global one (just checked it in Nifscope) meaning that the X direction is right/left, Y is forward/back and Z is up/down.

Better keep the values symmetrical around 0, like Linear Min Limit X = -5 and Linear Max Limit X = 5.

Maybe test different Spring Constant values for the Linear Motor settings too (try a smaller value for Z first). But you said you knew what influences duration and speed so I guess I don't need to tell you about that.

 

Keep in mind that how much swing and bounce you see also depends on the animations used. Some might give rather disappointing effects. It might just not be one that emphasizes the butt much or maybe the animator didn't do the twist (read: was actually too lazy to properly animate the skeleton ... but the animation also shouldn't look that good then).

[gm207]

If I change the physics to another I prefer, would the collision still apply? 

[SeveN085]

10 hours ago, Bazinga said:

So you're an ass man you say? No problemo, I've got you covered.

The Time Factor in the rigidbody settings for NPC L and R Butt bones influences a lot more than you might expect. Try increasing that value back to 1.

And if by strength you mean how far the mesh moves then increasing the Linear Min/Max Limit settings is what you're looking for. The local coordinate orientation is the same as the global one (just checked it in Nifscope) meaning that the X direction is right/left, Y is forward/back and Z is up/down.

Better keep the values symmetrical around 0, like Linear Min Limit X = -5 and Linear Max Limit X = 5.

Maybe test different Spring Constant values for the Linear Motor settings too (try a smaller value for Z first). But you said you knew what influences duration and speed so I guess I don't need to tell you about that.

 

Keep in mind that how much swing and bounce you see also depends on the animations used. Some might give rather disappointing effects. It might just not be one that emphasizes the butt much or maybe the animator didn't do the twist (read: was actually too lazy to properly animate the skeleton ... but the animation also shouldn't look that good then).

Amazing, going to test those settings deeply and thoroughly . Thank you as always.

[Bazinga]

7 hours ago, gm207 said:

If I change the physics to another I prefer, would the collision still apply? 

You mean other xml files? Nope, sorry. If it's the same mesh/bone then it's in the same file.

You also might have to to tweak the group ID and 'no collide with' settings of the xmls a little (using JFF) if you mix xmls from different sources. Maybe you're lucky and they are compatible out of the box, but that's not very likely.

 

xmls from my set that include movement physics instead of just passive collision shapes:

hdtPhysicsExtensionsDefaultBBP.xml - female breast, butt and belly movement ; plus collisions for all of them

hdtm.xml and its modifications for different schlongs (like hdtm_smurf.xml) - testicle movement ; no collisions for the balls but for the schlong

hdtvagina.xml - vagina opens during penetration ; plus collisions for it of course

 

The hdtfingers.xml and the strapon.xml are purely passive, nothing in them moves itself, except for the basic movement from animations but that's not HDT-related. And I didn't add anything moving to the Beast HDT xmls and the Sextoys xmls.

[billypnats]

Hi Bazinga, could you suggest any ways to have creature HDT mesh interact better with the belly? There are some animations where the creature junk clips out of the belly rather than having the female belly stretch over it . I remember there being a  modified skeleton (?) that moved the belly bone lower (can't recall where I found it but I think you might have made it?), I'm not sure if this could ever fix this issue. Could you pleas advise? Thanks

[Bazinga]

Nah, I never messed with the human XPMSE skeletons, didn't want to overwrite them because they always got updated far more frequently than my mods.

 

Also I doubt that editing the skeleton helps that much (it's of course helpful if you move the bone as close as possible to the mesh that's weighted for it and then finetune the xml accordingly, so there are no 'blind spots' and the mesh won't stretch in the wrong direction), it mostly depends on how you set up the xml.

And there I had to find a compromise between a satisfying amount of stretching and the normal belly movement looking natural.

 

What you could try is opening my hdtPhysicsExtensionsDefaultBBP.xml with JFF and under Constraints -> 'NPC Belly, HDT Belly' increase the linear Y limits. They are at -1 for Linear Min Limit Y and 3 for Linear Max Limit Y atm. Now keep the min limit at -1 and increase the max limit to 5. Maybe also increase 'Linear Motor Y' (the field to the right of the hkpSpringDamperConstraintMotor field) -> spring constant (500 or so instead of 300) and if it bounces back and forth too much on running animations afterwards also increase the spring damping.

But that probably still won't solve your problem, it's just the only thing I can think of atm to alleviate it from the HDT physics side.

 

Another thing you could try is increasing the weight paints for the NPC Belly bone on the female body mesh that you're using. Looks more promising to me and I did it myself when I edited the UUNP body (my NBB Chinese and Repaint presets already have increased belly weight paint) ... but don't overdo it, or the belly will stretch in ridiculous ways. And if you're doing it with Outfit Studio then use a brush with a low focus and not too low spacing value (also activate the 'X mirror' option).

 

Or try this here, NBB Chinese UUNP preset for Bodyslide, overwrite my mod with this and hope for the best  (don't worry, took me just a few minutes to edit)

NBB Chinese UUNP weight paint increase.7z

 

If you don't use the Chinese UUNP body then just copy the NPC Belly weight paint over to whatever preset you are using.

Start Bodyslide, load the target body mesh as outfit and the one I just provided as reference. Now switch to the bones tab and select the NPC Belly bone. Then in the shape menu select 'Copy selected weight paints'. Use the default settings to copy the paint. Then 'Export to NIF'.

 

 

If you really want to edit the skeleton (because the NPC belly bone could indeed be placed a little further forward and a bit lower) then you'd also have to update the body mesh (so the bone gets the same coordinates there and the mesh stays where it was before) and my hdtPhysicsExtensionsDefaultBBP.xml

But that's more complicated and probably involves deleting the NPC Belly bone from the body mesh (and then copying it back in from the updated skeleton and reapplying the weight paint) in Outfit Studio.

Only editing the skeleton won't achieve anything.

[billypnats]

Thank you for your details response. Will try this out 

[SeveN085]

On 3.05.2018 at 1:52 AM, Bazinga said:

So you're an ass man you say? No problemo, I've got you covered.

The Time Factor in the rigidbody settings for NPC L and R Butt bones influences a lot more than you might expect. Try increasing that value back to 1.

And if by strength you mean how far the mesh moves then increasing the Linear Min/Max Limit settings is what you're looking for. The local coordinate orientation is the same as the global one (just checked it in Nifscope) meaning that the X direction is right/left, Y is forward/back and Z is up/down.

Better keep the values symmetrical around 0, like Linear Min Limit X = -5 and Linear Max Limit X = 5.

Maybe test different Spring Constant values for the Linear Motor settings too (try a smaller value for Z first). But you said you knew what influences duration and speed so I guess I don't need to tell you about that.

 

Keep in mind that how much swing and bounce you see also depends on the animations used. Some might give rather disappointing effects. It might just not be one that emphasizes the butt much or maybe the animator didn't do the twist (read: was actually too lazy to properly animate the skeleton ... but the animation also shouldn't look that good then).

So i've got kind of satisfying effect, but i've been wondering about shape collisions. For example preset made by @btasqan  https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/77445/ is using capsule shape for butt, instead of "ConverxTransformShape". What's your opinion on different collisions shapes?

[Bazinga]

Well, that's complicated. I experimented a bit and just tried a few of the shapes.

ConvexTransformShape for example could be a sphere that's stretched along one or 2 axes (pancake, oval, whatever) to better match the mesh shape. It could also have an offset from the bone that it's tied to, because using the joint settings in the constraints for that doesn't work. The joint offset also moves the bone and therefore the mesh, moving the collision shape itself doesn't.

And there's a difference between using ConvexTransformShape and ConvexTranslateShape even when you're sticking to the basic shapes as child shape (so no ovals etc). Something about the inertia matrix being different and creating different bounce effects. I think ConvexTranslateShape creates much more inertia so the constraints need to be stronger too unless you want slower bouncing but more sway, which I did for the breasts.

Never really understood why they don't result in the same inertia values if you create the same shape (like a sphere with an offset but no deformation) but there are a few mysterious things in HDT PE, and I stopped wondering a while ago.

 

So what I basically did was looking at the mesh in Nifscope and then measuring the size of the breast, butt cheek or other things I made collisions for. And then I just tried to find an easy to create and still fitting shape and center for that shape.

So the breasts get a sphere shape of course (half of it inside the body where it doesn't matter), but with an offset to the bone because the NPC Breast bones are buried too far inside the body. Also I needed to move both breast collision boxes a little closer to each other to create better results for tit jobs.

For other things I used other shapes.

The butt also got an offset (+1 for Y and -5 for Z, both butt cheeks) because the bone isn't on the mesh. Then I wanted the collision box to basically follow the butt crack on either side, without stretching out in X direction (left-right) too much. I guess a simple capsule shape in Z direction might have worked too, but you definitely need that offset or else the collision box has to be increased in size unnecessarily.

 

What kind of shape you prefer also depends on what you want from that collision box of course. I only wanted the butt to bounce a little (more firm than the breasts though because ... well I like it that way ^^) and have collisions on anal animations. So I didn't make it exactly ass-shaped, because that only created issues (like the ass getting an ugly dent with hands nearby).

 

Sadly HDT PE is rather basic when it comes to collision detection. It's only bones with collision boxes attached that move and collide with each other. And then the meshes that are painted for them move according to the weight paint. There's no way to get little dents where a finger touches a boob or something like that. The breast moves as a whole or it doesn't move at all.

Well, better than nothing I guess.

[SeveN085]

2 hours ago, Bazinga said:

Well, that's complicated. I experimented a bit and just tried a few of the shapes.

ConvexTransformShape for example could be a sphere that's stretched along one or 2 axes (pancake, oval, whatever) to better match the mesh shape. It could also have an offset from the bone that it's tied to, because using the joint settings in the constraints for that doesn't work. The joint offset also moves the bone and therefore the mesh, moving the collision shape itself doesn't.

And there's a difference between using ConvexTransformShape and ConvexTranslateShape even when you're sticking to the basic shapes as child shape (so no ovals etc). Something about the inertia matrix being different and creating different bounce effects. I think ConvexTranslateShape creates much more inertia so the constraints need to be stronger too unless you want slower bouncing but more sway, which I did for the breasts.

Never really understood why they don't result in the same inertia values if you create the same shape (like a sphere with an offset but no deformation) but there are a few mysterious things in HDT PE, and I stopped wondering a while ago.

 

So what I basically did was looking at the mesh in Nifscope and then measuring the size of the breast, butt cheek or other things I made collisions for. And then I just tried to find an easy to create and still fitting shape and center for that shape.

So the breasts get a sphere shape of course (half of it inside the body where it doesn't matter), but with an offset to the bone because the NPC Breast bones are buried too far inside the body. Also I needed to move both breast collision boxes a little closer to each other to create better results for tit jobs.

For other things I used other shapes.

The butt also got an offset (+1 for Y and -5 for Z, both butt cheeks) because the bone isn't on the mesh. Then I wanted the collision box to basically follow the butt crack on either side, without stretching out in X direction (left-right) too much. I guess a simple capsule shape in Z direction might have worked too, but you definitely need that offset or else the collision box has to be increased in size unnecessarily.

 

What kind of shape you prefer also depends on what you want from that collision box of course. I only wanted the butt to bounce a little (more firm than the breasts though because ... well I like it that way ^^) and have collisions on anal animations. So I didn't make it exactly ass-shaped, because that only created issues (like the ass getting an ugly dent with hands nearby).

 

Sadly HDT PE is rather basic when it comes to collision detection. It's only bones with collision boxes attached that move and collide with each other. And then the meshes that are painted for them move according to the weight paint. There's no way to get little dents where a finger touches a boob or something like that. The breast moves as a whole or it doesn't move at all.

Well, better than nothing I guess.

Thank you for detailed answer as always.

[ilion]

Bazinga if you see this can you help a guy out? How can you edit the vagina xml to make its radius bigger to accommodate bigger schlongs? Using JFF  right now and experimenting, but cant seem to make any difference.