A little warning to mod creators of non adult mods....

[Kofina]

They removed the censored ratings and this is what the debut pack's rating looks like now... lol

[D_ManXX2]

There is 1 vital point that needs addressed though. Semi working mods. like alpha beta type mods. How is the community going to pay for something that is not finished/working product ? you can't be a tester and customer at the same time.

 

Also more time is required to have the mods working before refund is expired. you can never play a mod in 24 hours to see if everything alright in your game. mostly it will take weeks before you can say if something was even broken.

[GrimReaper]

 you can't be a tester and customer at the same time.

 

 

 

 

It's what every publisher has been doing the last decade.

[bjornk]

There are people who actually pay to do just that (see early access games).  So, perhaps this may even open the doors to early access mods?

[bob11]

 

 

Personally I dont mind paid Mods going up on the Steam Work Shop , as long as there are alternative sites Like the Nexus / LL with free mods etc.

Seeing how easy it is to pirate skyrim mod, DRMfication of mod on fallout 4 and tes6 is inevitable if this "experiment" succeed. Steam workshop will be the only place to download and distribute paid and free mods legally. Beth will do anything to get more money.

 

It doesn't matter in the end , if Beth does that ( restrict mods to Steam ), the consumer can refuse not to purchase said game or mod , sure people will go the " treasure Island "  route , but thats just the way it is .

 

 

 

 

That video is just disappointing.  He answers most valid point with "I don't care, not my problem".  For someone like Gopher who gets huge support from the established community in Patreon, that's an all new low.

[nutluck]

 

That video is just disappointing.  He answers most valid point with "I don't care, not my problem".  For someone like Gopher who gets huge support from the established community in Patreon, that's an all new low.

 

Um huge support on Patreon? He has almost 300k subscribers on youtube, yet has less than 700 people donating on Patreon. That is like 0.2% of his subscribers support him on Patreon, I wouldn't call that huge.

 

As for low or not everyone has their opinion on this, he has done several video's and podcasts on it. He even recently did a open letter to valve telling them how they screwed up and how they should have done it.

[bjornk]

The thing is, if Steam can sell mods by giving a cut to Bethesda, then anybody can do the same, including Nexus and other mod sites. They may even attract more modders by giving them a larger cut from the sales. Steam won't be able to stop it unless it wants to face lawsuits for practicing monopoly.

 

[Buddy Christ]

Let's list some names.

 

People who gained lot of respect in my books. Really deserve to be praised.

 

-Fore, who said NO and NO

 

-DarkRider. TESA has been invited by Valve as service provider just like Nexus, except he didn't accepted the offer.

HERE

 

"To be a service provider a site has to get the invite. We had an invite, we did not accept, and would not accept because paid mods violate the tenets of our site.

As I said, we respect a modder's right to choose, but our choice for TESA is to remain free. That is our official stance."

 

See Nexus? For someone with balls and real love for modding wasn't that difficult to say NO to be a provider and take part at all in this shit.

 

-Emma on Bethesda Forum. HER POST is priceless.

 

-nerdofpray the Bethesda Beggar mod must be supported

 

 

 

And now the biggest jerks I've seen so far:

 

-Xilverbulet  of Midas Money putting pop-ups "buy my mod" in the free mod, biggest jerk move that clearly picture the character.

HERE

-Frozunswaidon acting like a jerk not granting permissions while he was seeking permissions to sell his mods. "What do I win?" A big FUCK.

HERE

-The SkyUI guy , just squalid.

 "they are used to it, they would want to rip my head off if I tried to take it away"

So you let the outdated version around otherwise we would think that you are a complete jerk… Why would we have to think that?

-All the bunch on workshop waiting for some fool to pay for their shit. To all of you a BIG middle finger! Won't see a dime from me, EVER.

 

 

If anyone has some other names, please list them.

 

I would like to add the SKSE team to the people who gained a huge amount of respect for not being a Service Provider, as I understood the posting on their website: 

 

3. We will not receive any partial payment from those sales.

 

And after reading this thread to the end:

Caliente for the statement

 

So, some information about the recent developments in modding.

- No file contained in the BodySlide and CBBE archives are to be sold for monetary gain anywhere.

- Outfits including the CBBE body are not to be sold.

[Darkwisdom]

At least we can still get CBBE outfits for free then. Since they rely on the body which Caliente is insisting is free and outfits can't be sold for payment, we still have some hope there. 

 

I care more about outfits than anything else. Weapons are sure to be sold for ridiculous prices, especially if bethesda is endorsing certain works. Sky Ui really disappoints me and it's just incredibly disappointing that so many people betray the community when some money is dangled in front of them. Isoku said he'll put his current versions on nexus - only after getting some 'pocket money' on the workshop. I don't like sell-outs. I've lost jobs and quit jobs because the client wants to pay less or my co-workers wanted more for the project, I don't like people who want more for doing the same thing they've always done. It's not like these modders are going to be giving us more mod for our money either, they'll be the same SkyUI and Wet and Cold - with a pricetag. 

 

I don't care I have a lesser experience because of this, I will never pay for a mod, unless it is something that special - like falskar. But even Falskar's author has said it will be forever free. Same as with t3and0 and insists his will be free forever. 

 

I appreciate donations for authors - that is a good thing. If you love the mod and can't play without it then a couple of quid is fair enough, but charging £3.50 for a suit of armour is just abysmal. 

 

It's just a shame we'll most likely see a rise in piracy of mods now. 

 

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/gabe-newell-says-valve-will-dump-paid-mods-if-they/1100-6426893/

 

Gabe has already said that if it's bad for gamers, valve will ditch the paid modding service. The backlash has already started to work - people will not buy mods because modding is sharing. I dislike people who expect modders to do this and that; they do so because they like to or because they want to give to the community. I never expect modders to do anything - I'm just happy for the next awesome release, no matter when it comes. 

[windpl]

The thing is, if Steam can sell mods by giving a cut to Bethesda, then anybody can do the same, including Nexus and other mod sites. They may even attract more modders by giving them a larger cut from the sales. Steam won't be able to stop it unless it wants to face lawsuits for practicing monopoly.

 

Next come esp/esm encryption and going through workshop to decrypt them. Bye bye adult/free mods.

 

And about refunds, don't make me laugh. Do you still believe that they do it in good faith?

http://www.nextpowerup.com/news/19314/valve-effectively-gets-rid-of-eu-steam-refunds/

[Ark of Truth]

 

And about refunds, don't make me laugh. Do you still believe that they do it in good faith?

http://www.nextpowerup.com/news/19314/valve-effectively-gets-rid-of-eu-steam-refunds/

 

 

Well it the UK you have 14 days to return a product even if you have already used it when it comes to digital content. In order for Valve to trade in the EU it has to obey EU law. Valve's statement would never hold up.

[windpl]

 

 

And about refunds, don't make me laugh. Do you still believe that they do it in good faith?

http://www.nextpowerup.com/news/19314/valve-effectively-gets-rid-of-eu-steam-refunds/

 

 

Well it the UK you have 14 days to return a product even if you have already used it when it comes to digital content. In order for Valve to trade in the EU it has to obey EU law. Valve's statement would never hold up.

 

 

They had this policy for ages. And EU did nothing with it. Oh wait they did something, they took their tax cut for every EU citizen sell.

[LidiaSun]

Honestly I don't really think this will go on for very long. There's legal issues with the tools used to create mods (most companies like autodesk require you to pay for their software if you are using it for commercial purposes), so either beth/valve have a few files cased against them or if they were smart enough the mod author is going to take all the blame. Whatever happens, even if beth/valve made sure they are completely safe, if a mod author has to pay a bazillion bucks because he or she didn't know about all the legal issues, other mod authors are less inclined to upload paid mods because obviously nobody wants to deal with corporate lawsuits - especially since valve and beth gladly take 75% of your income you make off of mods, but won't provide any support whatsoever if their new project got you into a big mess that might ruin you financially. Or, if beth and valve aren't completely safe, then they will have to pay for every mod they sell that was made illegally, i.e. without the licenses that are required to make a commercial product. That's that. But for the people who say that paying for mods might be a good thing if it is done right, you're wrong. Here's why:

 

 

Modding works because it's free. If there is money involved, people won't share their assets and knowledge. Think about all dependancies most mods have. You can't do that when you have to pay money for the mod itself and for the mods that are required to run your mod in the first place. It kills diversity. Think about what would've happened if UNP was a mod you had to pay for. Do you really think the author would have allowed all the new textures and mesh edits for his mod? No, he wouldn't have, because he would lose money that way. Everything that uses UNP as a base is an opportunity for the author of UNP to gain additional dosh. Money kills creativity. Suddenly it's not about what you want to do, it's about what sells and what doesn't. So with all that taken into account, paid modding will be like the micro transactions you have in F2P games today. Simple and mostly cosmetic additions with no real depth. Because to build something with great depth, you need to access the ressources and knowledge of other people. Say Fallout 4 hits the shelves, with paid mods and all that. People struggle in the beginning as always with many things, trying to get new things into the game - and then someone figures out how to do what many people are trying to figure out. Guess what happens next? He's going to keep it for himself and uploads paid mods to the workshop. Bags of cash guarenteed because the first mods that do new things are the ones that get downloaded like mad. Even very shitty body replacers get downloaded if they are the first to appear. The process of understanding how the modkit and the game works will be mostly halted, because every tiny bit of knowledge that you have but others don't have is an advantage you can turn into real cash.

 

 

And not just that, people can also just steal mods from all over the place and upload them as paid mods to get money. Valve is a lazy shit when it comes to regulating steam issues and they don't care because they get money either way. They get 75% no matter what.

 

Bravo and Bravo again !!!! I am so happy because I agree with so many people, it is nice when you arrive like a comet in a forum - site and you realize that many people think the same way...

 

[Darkwisdom]

CD project of witcher development give away the games very resources for modding and would never put up with paid mods. They are a company for public service - if this paid modding crap goes on maybe everyone should jump ship to the witcher to mod. 

[Nepro]

Valve CEO on "steam and MODS"

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/33uplp/mods_and_steam/

 

Little lair fucking prick horse arse.

[windpl]

Valve CEO on "steam and MODS"

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/33uplp/mods_and_steam/

 

Little lair fucking prick horse arse.

 

Old news

Here is nice summary.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2914647/days-later-steam-community-is-still-in-an-uproar-over-paid-mods-debacle.html

 

Btw I wonder that anyone of this paid moders realise that they need to sell stuff for like 400$ before they see any moneys. (you have to take tax in)

[Nepro]

 

Valve CEO on "steam and MODS"

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/33uplp/mods_and_steam/

 

Little lair fucking prick horse arse.

 

Old news

Here is nice summary.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2914647/days-later-steam-community-is-still-in-an-uproar-over-paid-mods-debacle.html

 

Btw I wonder that anyone of this paid moders realise that they need to sell stuff for like 400$ before they see any moneys. (you have to take tax in)

 

 

I hope the modders will realize the obstacles and won't put up with exploitation Valve and Bethseda got in store for them.

 

[Darkwisdom]

I've had a good read of that reddit and thought about the key failings to this:

 

My problem right now is there is no quality control. How will steam deal with a mod that requires Sky UI's newest version? - a paid mod or soon to be. It's those kinds of compatibilities and quality control failings that make this a terrible idea. 

 

There's nothing to stop opportunists overcharging or even stealing mods from the nexus and reuploading them.

 

Piracy is already a thing - all of the paid mods have already been torrented. 

 

Possible DRM for modding. New games will limit the availability of mods to the workshop only.

 

Censoring that means nudity or graphic depictions or just something valve/beth doesn't like will just be pulled.

 

Support issues won't be handled properly. 

 

New games won't be very moddable because of selfish modders keeping the tricks of the trade to themselves so they can potentially monopolise the market. 

 

This won't stick and Gabe as well as Valve will pull it, claiming to be the heroes of the platform for seeing sense. 

 

Game developers want a cut from a mod that people have already bought the game for - greed in it's lowest form. 

[sunder02]

damn....

[Ashkandii]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=431467621

 

Mods like these are blowing up harder then Activision's Credit Card,

Wonder if Valve/Bethesda actually listen.

I just find it amusing that Valve did this to increase the quality of the mods but it seems people are getting pissed because people like Isoku is releasing an updated version of his free mod on Nexus and the fact that this mod is what? 4-5$ and all it adds is a system that makes NPCs put on certain amount of clothes in the certain amount of weather? Not to say the mod is bad or anything but thats its main function and i have no idea who would want to pay 5$ for a function that only effects what NPCs look like (minus the raid/snow blur option).

[nonusnomeni]

 

 

And about refunds, don't make me laugh. Do you still believe that they do it in good faith?

http://www.nextpowerup.com/news/19314/valve-effectively-gets-rid-of-eu-steam-refunds/

 

 

Well it the UK you have 14 days to return a product even if you have already used it when it comes to digital content. In order for Valve to trade in the EU it has to obey EU law. Valve's statement would never hold up.

 

not for long

here comes...tada... 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/what-is-obama-up-to-with-his-tpp-and-ttip-what-will-remain-of-local-national-governments/5445327

[Derpakiin]

Soon™

[D_ManXX2]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=432001673&searchtext=

 

This valve dude.

[Vacaliga]

 

Jeees this is still going?

 

Valve and Beth tried something, people didn't like it so it didn't work out, end of story.

 

I mean really what have changed? Other than a few imo brilliant mod authors getting deathtreaths for trying to take their hobby to the next logical step, i don't seem to see much change.

 

And speaking of that, I started my current career on a hobby level. doing stuff for free, favors here and there, later i was able to make some extra money of it and ultimately turn it into my fulltime job in my own business. i guess i should just eat a bullet right now since it would seem i have committed not only one but two deadly sins, one making a profit from my hobby and two making a business with the goal to make more money. I wonder where the line is between being a business and being an evil greedy business?

 

And if it's really such a bad thing it will resolve itself all on its own without the need for an army of internet pitchforks, like the saying against censorship goes: Let the person speak and if his words are truly wicked they will in turn insure his his downfall. and if Valves plan is to fuck its customers it don't really matter if the customer bitches about it, but if the customer is not there to be fucked Valve can only fuck themselves.

 

But but but they owe it to there fans to not be evil and stuff cause we made them what they are blablabla. Alright let's get this straight Valve, Beth, Blizzard, Rockstar, Lord Gabe who ever you like to call god in this matter owes you jack shit, just as you don't owe them anything, they made a product, you bought the product or you didnt, end of transaction something for something etc. If you choose to be a fan and praise them that's all on you.

 

Picture this if you will: I have been getting milk from a milkman for many years and i have been happy with that milk i have recommended it to friends and family, but one day the milkman decides he going to sell his milk to the company Mighty Milks, because they liked his milk and they want take part of that by offering to bring him into their fold, but now i have to buy my milk at the store instead. but wait how could he do this me? so i confront him yelling SHAME ON YOU! as your loyal customer you owe it to me to continue doing things they way i want you too, because you owe me everything mr milky man! terrified by this outburst the milkman calls his wife and tells her that they might need to cancel the vacation they both so badly needed after years of hard work, but my outburst had done its damage, and the milkman had face that he was never going to fulfill his dream of getting his own cows and plants to produce the milk he really wanted to make while being able to provide for his family.

Clearly the milkman is a jackass here, but really the true villains where those bastards over at Mighty Milk trying to enable him to make money of his product to mutual benefits for them.

 

Moral of the story is: Just because you are a user, consumer and or fan of something or someone does mean that they are now in debt to you in any way, and if you don't like what they are doing now in compare what they used to do. don't use or buy there product, and if you really want what they used to do so bad, go get your own cow and make your own freaking milk, don't know how to make milk?

 

Well learn! 

 

 

Sorry if that got a bit ranty, like many others i was shall we say sceptical of this at first and had a lot of questions in my mind, but seeing how the community have responded to this made me cry a little. 

 

Where to start..

 

#1 You need to understand that this isn't about businesses owing anyone anything. This is about good and bad business. What Valve is doing right now is terrible business. 

 

If you treat your customers like shit, you may not see your business fall in the short term, but it will bite you in the ass later. Customers are what make a corporation, Valve, Bethesda, Rockstar, everybody.

 

Without customers, these corporations/companies would be nothing.

 

 

#2 No-one is saying anything is wrong with someone receiving money for doing what they like doing. The problem is that people are becoming blinded by money. Money is a means, nothing more, that is all it is. 

 

 

#3 Valve has taken this approach in a terrible way. It doesn't even help that the CEO of the company clearly does not care, but this has been obvious before anyway.

 

 

 

 

Truly, if you ran a company I would have nothing to do with it, because your attitude to how other people feel is absolutely horrendous. 

 

 

#1 Okay so Valve made a bad call and they will likely take a fall for it, i believe i made that point already, what i was trying to address was that people are acting as if betrayed, like all their toys were suddenly taken away. Company's making bad decisions sometimes is hardly anything new and yeah i agree it sucks when strikes close to home, but let's not turn a firecracker into a nuclear bomb.

 

The market will sort it all on it own by not buying the product, this angry mob mentality is unnecessary.

 

#2  "No-one is saying anything is wrong with someone receiving money for doing what they like doing. The problem is that people are becoming blinded by money. Money is a means, nothing more, that is all it is."

 

So the action is not wrong but the result of it is? Money can make people do some weird stuff again nothing new, but it will sort itself out by people not buying what is being offered, no matter if its valve or a mod author trying to sell.

 

 

Look you are upset i get it and am sorry if i hurt your feelings and ask that you believe me in saying it was not my intention and i don't believe it was Valves either.  but the mental picture i get from this is a bunch of kids sitting on playground complaining that someone build another playground next to them with less features and an entry fee, but instead of playing and enjoying themselves they will not rest until the other playground is torn down.

 

And just so we are clear, just because i don't agree with you don't mean that i'm against you or saying Valve made a good call, in fact i agree with most people in saying Valve made a bad business decision.

 

Money may corrupt but so can angry feelings.   

[Vykroft]

I think that the main problem here is not being paid for your "original" work.. is being paid for stealing someone else work, or someone else knowledge... for being lazy and ask for help in the forum just to release something with a price, like this guy... 

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=433039950

 

http://www.loverslab.com/files/file/1010-efeebr-eyes-for-everyone-except-beast-races/

 

And you can see a lot more of his/her post asking for help. Does anyone of those member ask for money when they post solution for his/her doubts? no... is all about sharing without asking anything in return..